345 réponses à ce sujet

[Iakus]

What's the actual evidence for this fantasy of human power pre-treaty? It's not supported by anything in the Codex, or anyplace else that I've seen.

I'm still not clear on what you mean by "decisive" there. Turian political will to fight doesn't seem to have been reduced. They didn't lose more than a fraction of their strength. What was decided?

 

My understanding is human innovation in warfare wasn't dreadnoughts but fighter carriers, which gets around any dreadnought limitations.

 

And yeah, it's doubtful humanity at the time met more than a fraction of turian military might.  What made the fight so startling was how close to matching the turians technologically they were.

[AlanC9]

Oh, yeah. Like the Zulus, we were punching way above our weight there.

[katamuro]

I suppose not, but then wouldn't it then fall into the realm or classical or historical fantasy?

 

.-. Like I said...it makes no sense to me, but probably its just me.

 

Well first there is your run of the mill normal fantasy which is usually set in the sort of middle ages-renaissance period but could be stretched as early as ancient times but usually ending before the industrial revolution. 

Urban fantasy usually happens either in modern times or in the cities so usually after industrial revolution. However there is also a genre that can happen in the same timeframe, that is horror. Horror would usually have similar elements, that is paranormal or supernatural world, demons, fae or whatever but where urban fantasy usually involves the main character fighting the "weird" in the horror the main character is usually not as in control, more helpless. 

Urban fantasy heavily relies on the fantastical living side by side with mundane, where "normal" people don't know that supernatural things exist and so we get to see that side of the world through the eyes and experiences of the main character which usually starts out pretty close to normal but gains in time more and more power, influence and knowledge of the supernatural. 

[Master Warder Z_]

What's the actual evidence for this fantasy of human power pre-treaty? It's not supported by anything in the Codex, or anyplace else that I've seen.

 

Background info and scenes in Evolution, the background of a lot of the later volume is the battle of Shanxi, and you do see the scene where the Second Fleet arrives, you see them engage with the Turians, and you eventually see their defeat.

 

.-. I mean all it really did was just expand upon the old ME1 codex of the first contact war but to me it did paint that Humanity won a victory that day, and I mark it as decisive as it lowered the Turian dreadnought number by one. Perhaps it would be more compelling if we had a set number of those at the time period, but I bet its less then fifteen.

[AlanC9]

So If I actually did look into this, I wouldn't find one case of someone forgetting to lift flaps or to raise the landing gear once you reach the needed to speed to become airborne and then hydroplaning all over the runway?

Point to you here. One F-22 crash was apparently caused by the pilot blacking out during a high-G maneuver. Another is in dispute; USAF says pilot error, DoD says not. (Though I've heard it said that the former case was also an oxygen system malfunction, that's not the official ruling.)

It did end both careers, but that's because both pilots died.

[DaemionMoadrin]

My understanding is human innovation in warfare wasn't dreadnoughts but fighter carriers, which gets around any dreadnought limitations.

 

And yeah, it's doubtful humanity at the time met more than a fraction of turian military might.  What made the fight so startling was how close to matching the turians technologically they were.

 

Even with the Mars Archives giving us a comparable technology, we simply didn't have the time to actually build much of it. The Prothean technology was discovered in 2148, the First Contact War started 9 years later.

Unless the Protheans left information about the other species in their archives (which has never been mentioned to my knowledge), then I don't know why Humanity was motivated to build a massive fleet for their defense.

There's a short scene in the Citadel Archives, showing turian soldiers interrogating a human prisoner at Shanxi, commenting that his rifle was primitive. What I took from the scene is that the universal translator must be the most fantastic piece of tech in the known universe and everyone, even poor slobs in the slums of Omega, can afford one.

 

Even better... despite the very short time Humanity didn't just build a massive fleet, they had so much spare material that Cerberus managed to secretly build a couple cruisers for themselves without anyone noticing.

 

It's a miracle that the other species can hold their own against the industrial power of the humans. Without the Reaper invasion, humans would have taken over the entire galaxy within a few centuries.

 

Or maybe the writers were more enthusiastic than logical.

[AlanC9]

Background info and scenes in Evolution, the background of a lot of the later volume is the battle of Shanxi, and you do see the scene where the Second Fleet arrives, you see them engage with the Turians, and you eventually see their defeat.

Thanks.

.-. I mean all it really did was just expand upon the old ME1 codex of the first contact war but to me it did paint that Humanity won a victory that day, and I mark it as decisive as it lowered the Turian dreadnought number by one. Perhaps it would be more compelling if we had a set number of those at the time period, but I bet its less then fifteen.

It sounds to me like this is really a semantic argument over what counts as "decisive."

[Iakus]

Even with the Mars Archives giving us a comparable technology, we simply didn't have the time to actually build much of it. The Prothean technology was discovered in 2148, the First Contact War started 9 years later.

Unless the Protheans left information about the other species in their archives (which has never been mentioned to my knowledge), then I don't know why Humanity was motivated to build a massive fleet for their defense.

There's a short scene in the Citadel Archives, showing turian soldiers interrogating a human prisoner at Shanxi, commenting that his rifle was primitive. What I took from the scene is that the universal translator must be the most fantastic piece of tech in the known universe and everyone, even poor slobs in the slums of Omega, can afford one.

 

Even better... despite the very short time Humanity didn't just build a massive fleet, they had so much spare material that Cerberus managed to secretly build a couple cruisers for themselves without anyone noticing.

 

It's a miracle that the other species can hold their own against the industrial power of the humans. Without the Reaper invasion, humans would have taken over the entire galaxy within a few centuries.

 

Or maybe the writers were more enthusiastic than logical.

Oh, the humans had no idea what alien species were out there.  When the First Contact War started, they thought they might be fighting Protheans, since that was the only race they knew about.

 

And yes, everyone in the galaxy speaks the same language.  All that remains now is to see if that extends to Andromeda, or if we need babelfish 

 

How many cruisers did Cerberus have?

 

Liara destroyed one by ramming it with her Shadow Broker ship

Aria stole another one

One gets shot down over Tuchanka

At least one other was guarding Omega (almost certainly more)

One attacked Grissom Academy

Those are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head

And there were still enough forces to require Hackett to mobilize a considerable force to take Kronos Station.  

 

It's the Star Forge, I'm telling you.  TIM is a Sith Lord and used the Star Forge to build himself a fleet!

[Sylvius the Mad]

If you played ME3 then you didn't abandon the franchise.

I played it just recently to see why everyone hated the ending so much.

I didn't see what was wrong with the ending that wasn't wrong with the whole game.

[straykat]

I played it just recently to see why everyone hated the ending so much.

I didn't see what was wrong with the ending that wasn't wrong with the whole game.

 

We can agree on that. I wasn't enjoying myself much before the end. If anything, I welcomed it.

[DaemionMoadrin]

I played it just recently to see why everyone hated the ending so much.

I didn't see what was wrong with the ending that wasn't wrong with the whole game.

 

Agreed. The ending was just the cherry on top of the entire mess. There is so much wrong with ME, I'm still surprised at myself for liking it.

[in it for the lolz]

Agreed. The ending was just the cherry on top of the entire mess. There is so much wrong with ME, I'm still surprised at myself for liking it.

Wait, people still like ME?!

[NM_Che56]

For Xbox One backward compatibility, Mass Effect 3 is more requested than Mass Effect 2.  This suggests that outside of certain realms of Mass Effect nerdom, most people really didn't give a crap about the fuss over the endings.
 
https://xbox.uservoi...s-compatibility
 
ME3 = 68,910 votes
ME2 = 58,959 votes

[Sylvius the Mad]

Agreed. The ending was just the cherry on top of the entire mess. There is so much wrong with ME, I'm still surprised at myself for liking it.

While I found it occasionally frustrating to play (particularly the dialogue wheel), I did enjoy the first ME game.

I hope Andromeda is more like that, and less like ME2 and ME3.

[straykat]

For Xbox One backward compatibility, Mass Effect 3 is more requested than Mass Effect 2.  This suggests that outside of certain realms of Mass Effect nerdom, that most people really didn't give a crap about the fuss over the endings.
 
https://xbox.uservoi...s-compatibility
 
ME3 = 68,910 votes
ME2 = 58,959 votes

 

Probably because of multiplayer... maybe.

 

They're the only people who truly love the game, if you think about it.

[rocklikeafool]

It's big minus almost ruined the whole series imo.

No, it didn't.

 

 

 

The ending deserves every bit of hate and mud slinging it has gotten, every single bit.  It also totally over shadowed some of the great parts of ME3.

No, it really didn't overshadow anything. It wrapped all it up in a nice package, just not the package you thought it should have. The main reason people like you complain is because you're a special cupcake who cant' stand that it forced you to make a few logical choices.

 

 

 

Do I think it will have a major major impact on future sales?  Probably not but it was like cheating the emission data on a eco friendly diesel car.  Once it happens you never look at the car or company the same.

LOL, what a bad comparison.

[NM_Che56]

Probably because of multiplayer... maybe.

 

They're the only people who truly love the game, if you think about it.

 

Maybe, maybe not.  

[Master Warder Z_]

Oh, the humans had no idea what alien species were out there.  When the First Contact War started, they thought they might be fighting Protheans, since that was the only race they knew about.

 

And yes, everyone in the galaxy speaks the same language.  All that remains now is to see if that extends to Andromeda, or if we need babelfish 

 

How many cruisers did Cerberus have?

 

Liara destroyed one by ramming it with her Shadow Broker ship

Aria stole another one

One gets shot down over Tuchanka

At least one other was guarding Omega (almost certainly more)

One attacked Grissom Academy

Those are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head

And there were still enough forces to require Hackett to mobilize a considerable force to take Kronos Station.  

 

It's the Star Forge, I'm telling you.  TIM is a Sith Lord and used the Star Forge to build himself a fleet!

 

Actually the vessel at Omega was a dreadnought, at least according to its size as it was comparable to a Alliance Everest class dreadnought.

 

I've seen stills were the vessels were placed against each other and their sizes are comparable, its far larger then any cruiser.

[rocklikeafool]

 

I really don't understand when people make threads like this

ME3 was in no way a failure or bad game in ANY way. Seriously you hate the ending but so what? Saying the ME3 is bad is just hilarious

It comes to down the whole "it wasn't what I wanted" mentality. People somehow feel this need to have things their way.

Well, guess what, folks?! If you want it all YOUR way, you should design your own damn game. BUT, assuming you even get anyone to play your game, don't be surprised if not everyone likes your way of doing it.

[straykat]

 

 

It comes to down the whole "it wasn't what I wanted" mentality. People somehow feel this need to have things their way.

Well, guess what, folks?! If you want it all YOUR way, you should design your own damn game. BUT, assuming you even get anyone to play your game, don't be surprised if not everyone likes your way of doing it.

 

 

To me, it was more like "I just want some of what you gave me before". Specifically, more ME2 crew.

 

It's not like I pulled things out of my ass. I wanted more of their ideas. Not mine.

 

As for the end, whatever. That's what we get when we scavenge things. This was never going to be about inventive/creative sci-fi. It's more like fantasy, where you have to reckon with the past.

[DaemionMoadrin]

While I found it occasionally frustrating to play (particularly the dialogue wheel), I did enjoy the first ME game.

I hope Andromeda is more like that, and less like ME2 and ME3.

 

I meant the entire trilogy, not just the first game.

 

It isn't even about gameplay issues as much as it is about plotholes, nonsense science and retcons. For all its awesomeness, it's really quite stupid.

 

I don't even expect devs to hire a scientific advisor but can't they just google things before they base their plot on it?

[straykat]

This story is going to run into the same problem as the last one btw..

 

This whole idea of borrowing tech and "Remnants" and ****. It's the same thing.

 

 

I feel like getting political with this.. I don't think Bioware has any fascination with industriousness or work ethic or inventiveness. And most of all, independence. Which is what most sci-fi is about. Human potential. Bioware likes to portray people who can't move forward in life unless they're provided solutions from on high. And then it bites you in the ass.

 

Whether that's not popular or not though, I don't know. A lot of people like this kind of thing.

[CronoDragoon]

Andromeda will be a hit both because of and in spite of ME3. ME3 did many things right that both pleased series fans as well as bringing in new blood (primarily through multiplayer) while also pissing off a minority of the core fanbase (who nevertheless will likely buy Andromeda anyway).

This story is going to run into the same problem as the last one btw..

This whole idea of borrowing tech and "Remnants" and ****. It's the same thing.


I feel like getting political with this.. I don't think Bioware has any fascination with industriousness or work ethic or inventiveness. And most of all, independence. Which is what most sci-fi is about. Human potential. Bioware likes to portray people who can't move forward in life unless they're provided solutions from on high. And then it bites you in the ass.

Whether that's not popular or not though, I don't know. A lot of people like this kind of thing.

Mass Effect is space opera, which is another way of saying space fantasy. And fantasy will always be more interested in what is old and forgotten than what is novel. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, of course, because I think it's an effective way to demonstrate just how goddamn old the universe is, which is a good topic for a space story.

[Master Warder Z_]

This story is going to run into the same problem as the last one btw..

 

This whole idea of borrowing tech and "Remnants" and ****. It's the same thing.

 

 

I feel like getting political with this.. I don't think Bioware has any fascination with industriousness or work ethic or inventiveness. And most of all, independence. Which is what most sci-fi is about. Human potential. Bioware likes to portray people who can't move forward in life unless they're provided solutions from on high. And then it bites you in the ass.

 

That was why I sort of liked Cerberus in ME2, they were pushing boundaries, they were inventing or co-opting technology to achieve amazing things.

 

It goes beyond their message overall being pleasing to me, it comes down to the fact, they will invent, build, create, and that is why they have wonders that the galaxy at large think impossible.

[straykat]

That was why I sort of liked Cerberus in ME2, they were pushing boundaries, they were inventing or co-opting technology to achieve amazing things.

 

It goes beyond their message overall being pleasing to me, it comes down to the fact, they will invent, build, create, and that is why they have wonders that the galaxy at large think impossible.

 

Yeah, but in the end, they were the ultimate scavengers. Kai Leng and TIM couldn't even see a path of evolution for humanity except through Reaper tech. Which is the opposite of inventiveness. While TIM lost faith in Shepard's "it factor", if you will.

 

Same problem with the Geth too.