84 réponses à ce sujet

[Malanek]

I don't mind some ties to the old trilogy but I'm not sure this is the way to go.

 

Firstly the point of making ties is to tug on the nostalgia strings. Make the players comfortable, put in something that they instantly relate to. The problem with this is that the 'Innusannon' are just too obscure. I doubt 95% of the players would get the reference.

 

Secondly, and most importantly, it is the implications of having that technology even more common. Crossing between galaxies should imo be uncontrollable (I would prefer getting to Andromeda via an uncontrollable wormhole). At the very least it should be really, really hard, almost impossible. If the writers don't make it that way it begs the question why the reapers never went. And if you come up with 'they weren't programmed to' answer, then why under synthesis or control aren't they coming over. Or any other advanced species come the other way etc Going to Andromeda largely seems to be to avoid the effects of the ME3 ending, so it is important to keep the galaxies almost completely separate, not make technology to cross over quite achievable.

[Drone223]

And if it was so easy to build a ship that could traverse galaxies, the Reapers never would have completed a single harvest.

Not to mention it would be inconsistent with the limitations of the technology since the lore clearly states that FTL drives are limited to short range jumps at best.

[wright1978]

We certainly could be the only ones to have managed creating an ark ship. We're the only cycle that got any warning the Reapers were coming. Every other cycle was caught by surprise with the Citadel Relay trap.

Yeah agree we were only ones to be warned, we were the only ones to have broken the relay trap.
That gave us years to study and develop an ark, it also meant that if we wanted to deploy it we could still use the mass effect network to get to a free launch point.

[Drone223]

We certainly could be the only ones to have managed creating an ark ship. We're the only cycle that got any warning the Reapers were coming. Every other cycle was caught by surprise with the Citadel Relay trap.

There is no feasible way such a project could be completed in 2-3 years due to the scale and logistics of such a project. It would take decades if not centuries to complete since there can be no room for error given the project's nature. Then there's the council who basically choose to do nothing with the warnings.

[Master Warder Z_]

There is no feasible way such a project could be completed in 2-3 years due to the scale and logistics of such a project. It would take decades if not centuries to complete since there can be no room for error given the project's nature. Then there's the council who basically choose to do nothing with the warnings.

 

It would be feasible if it was just a human initiative. Given they have the resources, wealth and time to actually put something together in secret.

 

But given there are aliens...well yeah, it does sort of fall flat.

[Drone223]

It would be feasible if it was just a human initiative. Given they have the resources, wealth and time to actually put something together in secret.

 

That's ridiculous there is no way that an ark project can be done by humanity alone (or any individual species for that matter) since they have the smallest economy out of all the council species. An ark ship would be on a scale similar to the crucible which will require multiple species to contribute.

[Giantdeathrobot]

And as the Council demonstrated, that warning was almost completely disregarded.

 

Is it possible that the Ark was actually the Council's response? Believeing that resistance against the Reapers was futile, they decided to engineer the ship using Sovereign's drive core or somesuch, allowing intergalactic travel.

 

Of course, the gaping hole in that story is why we never hear anything of it duing ME3. They could handwave it by saying the Council wanted to keep it very hush-hush so that the ship wouldn't be intercepted by Reapers, I suppose. If the invaders don't know about the ship, they are highly unlikely to be able to stop it from going to Andromeda.

 

I really don't know how Bioware will handle this. If the Ark leaves during the time of the original trilogy, it seems bewildering that we have the ressources and secrecy to finish the project, especially that fast. If it leaves after the invasion, coming up with a credible motive to actually go to Andromeda would be hard, and there's the issue of Synthesis; while they can avoid talking too much about Destroy or Control, Synthesis rewrites all live in the galaxy, Andromeda simply cannot account for that unless some weapons-grade retconium is used.

[wright1978]

Is it possible that the Ark was actually the Council's response? Believeing that resistance against the Reapers was futile, they decided to engineer the ship using Sovereign's drive core or somesuch, allowing intergalactic travel.
 
Of course, the gaping hole in that story is why we never hear anything of it duing ME3. They could handwave it by saying the Council wanted to keep it very hush-hush so that the ship wouldn't be intercepted by Reapers, I suppose. If the invaders don't know about the ship, they are highly unlikely to be able to stop it from going to Andromeda.
 

That's the great advantage of theory, that of course we wouldn't hear about it, shep is the tip of the spear in regards the military response. That's the last person you want to give Intel on a top secret contingency plan for an ark. If they get captured/indoctrinated they can't rat it out.

Also don't agree that it is impossible to create an ark in the several years. The black ark theory suggestions of retrofitting/designing based off a collector vessel, the cryogenic technologies are clearly in evidence via the protheans with vigil at ilos/Javik to piggyback off of.

[Master Warder Z_]

That's ridiculous there is no way that an ark project can be done by humanity alone (or any individual species for that matter) since they have the smallest economy out of all the council species. An ark ship would be on a scale similar to the crucible which will require multiple species to contribute.

 

Not when its solely for a human population, in the tens of thousands.

 

It would be akin to producing a dreadnought.

 

Just in secret, you don't need to house half a dozen species or more, you need to stock foods for differing DNA and RNA, you don't need clean rooms for all the differing possible contaminants, in truth it would be pretty damn easy to do. It's just a matter of time, and resources, the crux of the issue is though, that given you have going to have a population made up of differing species, the time frame, cost and resource requirements leap dramatically, that's where I find issue with the entire concept, this isn't akin to building a singular space colony its akin to building a portable planetoid that can move, it goes from being a Star Destroyer sized project in scope to a Death Star.

[Iakus]

Not when its solely for a human population, in the tens of thousands.

 

It would be akin to producing a dreadnought.

 

Just in secret, you don't need to house half a dozen species or more, you need to stock foods for differing DNA and RNA, you don't need clean rooms for all the differing possible contaminants, in truth it would be pretty damn easy to do. It's just a matter of time, and resources, the crux of the issue is though, that given you have going to have a population made up of differing species, the time frame, cost and resource requirements leap dramatically, that's where I find issue with the entire concept, this isn't akin to building a singular space colony its akin to building a portable planetoid that can move, it goes from being a Star Destroyer sized project in scope to a Death Star.

Different, potentially hostile species at that.

 

Krogan are coming along, think they'll be willing to snuggle up with any turians or salarians that are along?

 

batarians

quarians

vorcha

geth

 

If any of them come along, things can get complicated real quick.

[Master Warder Z_]

Different, potentially hostile species at that.

 

Krogan are coming along, think they'll be willing to snuggle up with any turians or salarians that are along?

 

batarians

quarians

vorcha

geth

 

If any of them come along, things can get complicated real quick.

 

I am reminded of the Batarian Preacher on Omega now.

[Drone223]

Not when its solely for a human population, in the tens of thousands.

 

It would be akin to producing a dreadnought.

 

Just in secret, you don't need to house half a dozen species or more, you need to stock foods for differing DNA and RNA, you don't need clean rooms for all the differing possible contaminants, in truth it would be pretty damn easy to do. It's just a matter of time, and resources, the crux of the issue is though, that given you have going to have a population made up of differing species, the time frame, cost and resource requirements leap dramatically, that's where I find issue with the entire concept, this isn't akin to building a singular space colony its akin to building a portable planetoid that can move, it goes from being a Star Destroyer sized project in scope to a Death Star.

 

Your underestimating the scale and logistical requirements of the project the ship seen in the N7 day trailer is way larger than a dreadnought so its differently going to be a large scale project akin to the crucible.

 

1. They first have to gather enough resources to build an ark and develop an FTL drive capable of intergalactic travel.

2. Build the actual ark itself and make sure the FTL drive actually works.

3. Gather enough individuals from the many different species to sustain a viable population.

4. Get the necessary resources to set up new colonies for the various different species.

5. Have enough food to meet the needed nutrient requirements of each individual species.

6. Get to Andromeda without the ship breaking down.

 

The list could go on....

 

So its quite obvious that there is no feasible way that an ark project would be similar to building a dreadnought. Add to that there can be no room for error since even the smallest mistake in during the planing and preparation can doom the whole project before it even starts. To make things worse they have no means of defending themselves if they encounter a hostile space faring species since they won't have much of a military force and they can't really on the good will of others to save them.

[Anacronian Stryx]

While the Innusannon being the Remnant might be neat it would also help diminish the scope of the ME universe further so i hope not that is the case.

[capn233]

Your underestimating the scale and logistical requirements of the project the ship seen in the N7 day trailer is way larger than a dreadnought so its differently going to be a large scale project akin to the crucible....

Getting the materials is probably a simpler task than designing a propulsion system better than any Reaper tech or mass relays.

 

Will be interesting to see how this is explained, since it would probably be more logical if the Ark was actually something developed post war.

[Master Warder Z_]

Your underestimating the scale and logistical requirements of the project the ship seen in the N7 day trailer is way larger than a dreadnought so its differently going to be a large scale project akin to the crucible.

 

1. They first have to gather enough resources to build an ark and develop an FTL drive capable of intergalactic travel.

2. Build the actual ark itself and make sure the FTL drive actually works.

3. Gather enough individuals from the many different species to sustain a viable population.

4. Get the necessary resources to set up new colonies for the various different species.

5. Have enough food to meet the needed nutrient requirements of each individual species.

6. Get to Andromeda without the ship breaking down.

 

The list could go on....

 

So its quite obvious that there is no feasible way that an ark project would be similar to building a dreadnought. Add to that there can be no room for error since even the smallest mistake in during the planing and preparation can doom the whole project before it even starts. To make things worse they have no means of defending themselves if they encounter a hostile space faring species since they won't have much of a military force and they can't really on the good will of others to save them.

 

Did you even read the rebuttal to your little post?

 

It seems like you didn't and just wanted to go on a tangent.

[Demondragon24]

Did you even read the rebuttal to your little post?

 

It seems like you didn't and just wanted to go on a tangent.

 

I agree that the ark could have been built in secret and if so it would probably have been Cerberus. My thought is that the illusive man would have tried to hedge his bets as soon as the reaper threat was identified to protect humanity. In other words, build an ark to save some humans off in another galaxy while also trying to find a way to save those left behind if possible. The other cycles had no warning and building an ark would be wasting resources at that point. But since we had advanced notice they basically had at least two years to develop the new drive while building the ship, and that's assuming they didn't have the idea of leaving and settling in a new galaxy before the reapers came into view. 

 

More then likely if that theory were true and Cerberus tried that they probably either failed to launch due to the reapers, ran out of time when they were indoctrinated, or abandoned the project when the reapers showed and the project would then been found in their records after the war. 

[Altair_ShepardN7]

Plot twist: the Leviathan are actually from Andromeda and the Reapers and their harvest is a reality show. 

[DaemionMoadrin]

Why do you guys always want to come back to the Reaper mess? We had three games of it, it's time for something new, something better.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Getting the materials is probably a simpler task than designing a propulsion system better than any Reaper tech or mass relays.

 

Will be interesting to see how this is explained, since it would probably be more logical if the Ark was actually something developed post war.

The only way that makes sense to me other than a Deus Ex Machina would be that instead of designing a core that surpasses Reaper tech, they instead just use Reaper tech, from either a Reaper ship like the Troop Transports and Harvesters, a Collector ship, or maybe even from an actual Reaper.

 

But yeah, if the ship was made after the Reaper War they have all the time in the world to design and build one. 

[Demondragon24]

Why do you guys always want to come back to the Reaper mess? We had three games of it, it's time for something new, something better.

 

It is bit of beating a dead horse and I hope alot of it actually gets nip in the bud at e3 instead of having to wait til it comes out.

[DaemionMoadrin]

The only way that makes sense to me other than a Deus Ex Machina would be that instead of designing a core that surpasses Reaper tech, they instead just use Reaper tech, from either a Reaper ship like the Troop Transports and Harvesters, a Collector ship, or maybe even from an actual Reaper.

 

But yeah, if the ship was made after the Reaper War they have all the time in the world to design and build one. 

 

It can't be a Deus Ex Machina if it is used to establish the story. Please do not use words that you don't understand.

 

"After the Reaper War" is not going to happen, as has been pointed out hundreds of times already, because then BioWare would have to acknowledge the ME3 endings. Either by making a single one canon (and pissing off the majority of their fans) or by writing three different versions and ignoring the Refusal option.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Why do you guys always want to come back to the Reaper mess? We had three games of it, it's time for something new, something better.

Because the Reapers were a huge part of why the Mass Effect universe is the way it is. Even if the Reapers won't be in the future games, their impact and legacy would remain. You can't just get rid of that or else the entire franchise would fundamentally change. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

It can't be a Deus Ex Machina if it is used to establish the story. Please do not use words that you don't understand.

I understand what the term means.

 

Deus Ex Machina: a character or thing that suddenly enters the story in a novel, play, movie, etc., and solves a problem that had previously seemed impossible to solve. 

 

The problem is travelling to another galaxy, since the lore of the franchise has it that we can't do it with our tech during the events of the Shepard Trilogy. Something suddenly showing up to make it possible solves that previously impossible to solve problem, thus is a Deus Ex Machina. 

 

 

"After the Reaper War" is not going to happen, as has been pointed out hundreds of times already, because then BioWare would have to acknowledge the ME3 endings. Either by making a single one canon (and pissing off the majority of their fans) or by writing three different versions and ignoring the Refusal option.

I have yet to see Bioware state such a thing.

[capn233]

"After the Reaper War" is not going to happen, as has been pointed out hundreds of times already, because then BioWare would have to acknowledge the ME3 endings.

 

Perhaps, but that doesn't mean that the development of the ship makes more sense.  Engineering a new propulsion paradigm in that short of time is almost certainly going to involve some "handwaving" of the explanation, if you don't like deus ex machina.

[DaemionMoadrin]

Perhaps, but that doesn't mean that the development of the ship makes more sense.  Engineering a new propulsion paradigm in that short of time is almost certainly going to involve some "handwaving" of the explanation, if you don't like deus ex machina.

 

I agree.

 

Deus Ex Machina is a plot device that saves a hopeless situation, it's used as resolution for the climax, not as intro.