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[Sifr]

Hi.  Just wanted to fill in some gaps in my knowledge regarding the world of Dragon Age.  First, my assumption since hearing of David Gaider is that he's the JRR Tolkien of the Dragon Age series.  Is that correct or is Dragon Age more of a creation by committee?  So far, I've done all three games (but not the DLC for DAI yet).  I've not read any of the books (are there just two of them?) though I have done some of the comics.  Have there been competing visions for Dragon Age that may have driven David Gaider away?  Any controversies of interest to Dragon Age fans?  Generally, I get the idea from this thread that while most are fans of David, some aren't as sad to see him go.  Just curious as to why that is.

 

David Gaider was the Lead Writer for Dragon Age, but he wasn't the one who came up with the concept. His foreword in World of Thedas Vol 1 even mentions that James Ohlen (the original Lead Designer for Origins) spoke to him about the idea for a fantasy project that a couple of people were floating around that would eventually morph into DAO.

 

From what I can gather, a lot of the lore was creation by committee. For example, Brent Knowles apparently worked on the Darkspawn, while Jennifer Hepler was responsible for so of the lore regarding Orzammar she was affectionately dubbed "Queen of the Dwarves" by the writing staff.

 

There's currently five novels, of which Gaider wrote the first three (Stolen Throne, The Calling and Asunder), Patrick Weekes wrote Masked Empire, and Liane Merciel wrote Last Flight. Since he left the Dragon Age project in March of 2015, Patrick Weekes has taken over his duties as the new Lead Writer.

 

I don't know of any controversies or anything that lead to Gaider leaving, I suspect it was more a case of him being feeling a little burned out after writing three novels, three games and spending over a decade playing in only one sandbox, that he simply wanted to explore new creative ideas outside of DA. It's not that people aren't sad to see him leave Bioware, but more because he's not been involved with DA since around this time last year so people had have time to adjust to Weekes now having his old chair.

 

Personally I wish him well, been a big fan of his writing and his characters and look forward to see what he does at Beamdog.

[Amirit]

PoE, D:OS, Torment: Tides of Numenera - it's a time of isometric renaissance. And DG with his talent and experience could create another wonder in the genre. Hope he will!

[berelinde]

I remember reading somewhere that Beamdog is looking at expanding into 3D games. I'm kinda hoping that's true. As much as I loved BG back in the day, I'm not sure I can go back to an isometric view... or to a system where "character cutomization" involved selecting whether you wanted your character's head to be brown, grey, or yellow. The hairstyles are about the same, though.

[Deanna Troy]

For now I would say the worst of two worlds. As I said before Gaider's ego hinders players choice and characters building in favor of his "epic" (lol) storytelling and character writing which is the only good thing in "nonAAA/ugly/oldlike graphics" RPGs.

HOWEVER, I am not stating games will suck under his shadow, it is possible that the team saves the game and possibly even Gaiders soul. The only real true god able to save people's soul without failing is Obsidian but Beamdog is strong enough to have a 50% chance at this. Bioware of course is the mother corrupter, makes satan look like a cute pink puppy dog who is engaged in saving children.

[Biotic Apostate]

Wow. That's a lot of anger in one post.

[MaxQuartiroli]

Quite honestly, I would probably prefer a new game with those developers than a rehashed BG sequel/sidequel whatever. If they can make the game fresh and unique, great. I feel that Forgotten Realms is fairly basic of a setting, though, kind of the default fantasy setting. I like the world building Gaider and co. could do and would love to see them work on developing a new IP. But I'll probably buy anything they make.

 

Yeah I would hope that the new game is the spirit of BG, like DA, but not a continuation of the BG story. Let the Bhaalspawn saga rest.

 

That's why the cancelled BG3 from a few years ago about the black hound was so confusing. It was an RPG set in Forgotten Realms, but had nothing to do with the Bhaalspawn. It seemed to be riding the name recognition of the brand.

 

I totally agree with you here. BG is and will remain my favorite game ever. It was great and magnificent and Beamdog did a good job in revamping it with the Enhanced Editions of both games. But I feel like that story is long gone, with ToB providing an ending which was more than fullfilling. no matter what your final choice could be.

 

Therefore I hope that now they let BG rest and come out with a new original story.

[Hrungr]

From The Edmonton Journal:

http://edmontonjourn...-studio-beamdog

 

“It’s like a journey into the past, but Beamdog has a lot of plans so I don’t think I’m retreading old ground necessarily,” he said. “But even then, those are fond memories for me. Baldur’s Gate II was the first game I’ve ever worked on. I was kind of thrown into it and now it’s 17 years later… It feels very invigorating to shake things up and try something new.”

[vbibbi]

From The Edmonton Journal:

http://edmontonjourn...-studio-beamdog

 

“It’s like a journey into the past, but Beamdog has a lot of plans so I don’t think I’m retreading old ground necessarily,” he said. “But even then, those are fond memories for me. Baldur’s Gate II was the first game I’ve ever worked on. I was kind of thrown into it and now it’s 17 years later… It feels very invigorating to shake things up and try something new.”

"Gaider also created and wrote BioWare’s first recognized gay character, Dorian, a mage in Dragon Age: Inquisition."

 

Glad the journalist has the facts right.

[Biotic Apostate]

"Gaider also created and wrote BioWare’s first recognized gay character, Dorian, a mage in Dragon Age: Inquisition."

 

Glad the journalist has the facts right.

Hey I saw some gaming websites get that wrong, so I think we can cut them some slack. Especially since they are a general news website, they got all the games right, and didn't write "Dragon's Age" or "Bamdog."

[azarhal]

I remember reading somewhere that Beamdog is looking at expanding into 3D games. I'm kinda hoping that's true. As much as I loved BG back in the day, I'm not sure I can go back to an isometric view... or to a system where "character cutomization" involved selecting whether you wanted your character's head to be brown, grey, or yellow. The hairstyles are about the same, though.

 

Using a 3D engine has nothing to do with the perspective used in the game. Pillars of Eternity (3D backgrounds are converted to 2D and painted over), Wasteland 2 and Divinity Original Sin are all 3D games and isometric.

[vbibbi]

Hey I saw some gaming websites get that wrong, so I think we can cut them some slack. Especially since they are a general news website, they got all the games right, and didn't write "Dragon's Age" or "Bamdog."

Mutters about journalistic integrity and you kids...

[Morroian]

HOWEVER, I am not stating games will suck under his shadow, it is possible that the team saves the game and possibly even Gaiders soul. The only real true god able to save people's soul without failing is Obsidian 

 

With Chris Avellone's departure and the way it happened my regard for Obsidian has fallen somewhat.

[Mr Fixit]

With Chris Avellone's departure and the way it happened my regard for Obsidian has fallen somewhat.

 

I'm not in the loop on Avellone. Why did he leave Obsidian?

[Pokemario]

"Gaider also created and wrote BioWare’s first recognized gay character, Dorian, a mage in Dragon Age: Inquisition."

 

Glad the journalist has the facts right.

 

Cortez doesn't count...?

[Sifr]

"Gaider also created and wrote BioWare’s first recognized gay character, Dorian, a mage in Dragon Age: Inquisition."

 

Glad the journalist has the facts right.

 

Welp, someone's not getting a discount at Wade and Herren's shop it seems... 

 

(Although I guess that using the phrase "recognised" just means "explicitly stated". Still was pretty obvious those two were meant to have been a couple in Origins, much like Ashaad and Seamus' relationship in DA2, since none of the characters seemed too oblivious to it. And what's with forgetting Cortez in ME3, who's husband had died. And do Sera and Traynor not count because they are lesbians?)

 

I'm not in the loop on Avellone. Why did he leave Obsidian?

 

Yeah, what happened that made Avellone leave?

[Andraste_Reborn]

The funny part is that Gaider did create BioWare's first gay character ... only it was Juhani back in KotOR.

 

If we're taking 'gay' to mean 'gay man' and not 'lesbian' and also 'explicitly declared' then Cortez gets the crown.

[Morroian]

I'm not in the loop on Avellone. Why did he leave Obsidian?

 

There were reportedly disagreements with Sawyer over PoE which ended with Avellones characters (Durance and Grieving Mother) being changed a lot in ways that Avellone didn't agree with. And Feargus Urquhart's press release on him leaving was lukewarm.

[Andraste_Reborn]

Avellone has also made some decidedly unflattering remarks about PoE since leaving Obsidian. There's a whole thread about it on the Obsidian forums.

 

I was actually more worried about him leaving before he said he had little impact on the game. I like PoE a lot, so I'm glad that Avellone not being on board for the (probable) sequel is unlikely to have much of an effect. I also realized upon playing the game again that Durance and Grieving Mother were two of my least favourite companions - they're interesting the first time through as you uncover the mysteries surrounding their backstories, but after you know everything they just feel unnecessarily verbose compared to everyone else in the game. I have taken to hiring a Priest at the first inn instead.

 

It feels to me as if Avellone was out of tune with what PoE became. This is a shame, but maybe it's best for everyone that he's working on other things now.

[Sifr]

The funny part is that Gaider did create BioWare's first gay character ... only it was Juhani back in KotOR.

 

If we're taking 'gay' to mean 'gay man' and not 'lesbian' and also 'explicitly declared' then Cortez gets the crown.

 

I totally forgot Juhani in KOTOR! It does irk me that LucasArts made them nix the romance, forcing them to keep it all subtextual.

[Yggdrasil]

It cracks me up that this major life and career change basically entails David Gaider walking across the street in a small Canadian city and most likely working on the sequel to the project that he began his career with.  If I saw that as a plot to a movie or book, I'd say that it relied too much on coincidence and pushed the bounds of believability.

[BSpud]

There were reportedly disagreements with Sawyer over PoE which ended with Avellones characters (Durance and Grieving Mother) being changed a lot in ways that Avellone didn't agree with. And Feargus Urquhart's press release on him leaving was lukewarm.

 

Damn, I didn't know they had a falling out (no pun intended). That blows.

[vbibbi]

Cortez doesn't count...?

Cortez, and Traynor, and Juhani, as others have pointed out.

 

Welp, someone's not getting a discount at Wade and Herren's shop it seems... 

 

(Although I guess that using the phrase "recognised" just means "explicitly stated". Still was pretty obvious those two were meant to have been a couple in Origins, much like Ashaad and Seamus' relationship in DA2, since none of the characters seemed too oblivious to it. And what's with forgetting Cortez in ME3, who's husband had died. And do Sera and Traynor not count because they are lesbians?)

 

 

Yeah, what happened that made Avellone leave?

Yeah it's too bad so many of the queer people in games are subtext rather than "recognized" but that's not Bio's fault, IMO.

[Biotic Apostate]

Cortez, and Traynor, and Juhani, as others have pointed out.

 

Yeah it's too bad so many of the queer people in games are subtext rather than "recognized" but that's not Bio's fault, IMO.

They have a bit responsibility here, but they are getting better. Herren and Wade, Zevran and Teliesen are very minutely hinted, Ashaad and Seamus are heavily implied, and Celene and Briala, Bull and Dorian, Sera and Dagna - all are pretty much in the open. Hell, I thought I was reading too much into Teliesen, until it was confirmed. Though why everyone forgets about Cortez or Traynor is a mystery to me.

[Nefla]

They have a bit responsibility here, but they are getting better. Herren and Wade, Zevran and Teliesen are very minutely hinted, Ashaad and Seamus are heavily implied, and Celene and Briala, Bull and Dorian, Sera and Dagna - all are pretty much in the open. Hell, I thought I was reading too much into Teliesen, until it was confirmed. Though why everyone forgets about Cortez or Traynor is a mystery to me.

Zevran talks a few times about various men he's slept with and will flirt with a male warden and Leliana is similar both are romanceable by the same gender, Liara can have a romance with a female Shepard and so on but for some reason bisexual characters don't count.

[Biotic Apostate]

Zevran talks a few times about various men he's slept with and will flirt with a male warden and Leliana is similar both are romanceable by the same gender, Liara can have a romance with a female Shepard and so on but for some reason bisexual characters don't count.

Oh I know they are, but Zevran pretty much says it in your face he prefers women (even in a romance). I guess Dorian is such a big deal, since gay romances and characters got the short end of the stick for so long. You mentioned Liara - male gay romances were absent from ME 1 and 2. Juhani, the first lesbian character, was included in a 2003 game. We had to wait until 2012 for a gay character, and 2014 for a gay companion. And bi romances were included even in Jade Empire in 2005. So many BW games had bisexual characters, it's not really newsworthy anymore.