538 réponses à ce sujet

[tesla21]

Sovereign speech was fine. If Bioware hadn't completely fucked over what the Reapers are with the whole star brat deal that is. They should've stayed in the dark and not be defeated, not even directly engaged on in a fight like it happened, even if at disadvantage. How would the trilogy have played out instead? I don't have a clue! But don't blame Mass Effect 1 for the writers not knowing where the hell to take the plot in ME2 and 3. The Reapers were supposed to be actually overwhelmingly above any other life forms, and they writers apparently weren't able to hold to the idea and had to basically spoon fed the victory to organics by giving the Reapers downs through 3.

 

But complaining that Sovereign was made out to be some beyond comprehension entity might as well be complaining that Dragon Age has magic, it's a design choice and one that plenty of people might like or dislike. What did you expect, Soveign used to be a fine gentleman but then he had a traumatic experience, acumulating anger through the years turning into he turned himself into a weapon and swore to end organic life, but deep inside he just wanted to be loved. What a deep and moving character that sovereign dude. It's not like Sovereigns speech is the first time a villain or a character unnecessarily gives information to the player, that's basically the most common trope in games, shows and movies when introducing unknown things to the viewer.

 

And it honestly whether there was any reason for it to reveal something or not, it virtually changes nothing, no amount of preparation of knowledge was really relevant against the Reapers, it took the "I win button" and Reapers refusing to just go and take over the Citadel and let Shepard get to the catalyst, etc, etc. Nor we could really claim there was or wasn't a reason for Reapers to act in such a way. The Reapers may be "beyond comprehension" but they obviously can't be literally perfect. The whole thing really boils down again to ME3 crapping on the Reapers making them just starbrat's fancy toys.

[Khrystyn]

I've written in this thread before about being able to go covert during a tactical op, so that the protag's actions do not have to necessarily use weapons, skills or powers in order to advance through the assignment/mission. Previously, I wrote about using cover and alternate pathways to avoid fights and saving your limited ammo until you really need to use it.

 

This time, I'm wondering what others think about being able to use cover to gather intel, like overhearing a conversation, tracking enemy movements and footsteps, knocking out a guard, and looking for clues or tell-tale signs? We've already used a data terminal inside a facility for collecting information, but what about picking up evidence on the ground, such as when we follow a path?  It is in a sense using strategy during a tactical op, but I want ME:A to remain a role-playing game.

 

Remember when we landed on Eden Prime. Ahead and to the right of the open field was a shallow swamp with a crate at the far right end. What if, instead, there was a stand of tall grass reeds that we could use to covertly observe a situation lying ahead?  Yes, we typically use medium to tall rocks as cover to peer around corners.  I think it would be nice to have (in few locations) some variety in the types of 'natural' cover spots we could use. I assume games like Battlefield allow players to use a variety of cover 'types', and I know nothing about DA:I or any other combat-involved games either. Examples might be trees (forests) and tall reeds.

 

What types of 'natural cover' areas would make sense to incorporate into an ME game?

[Lady Artifice]

I've written in this thread before about being able to go covert during a tactical op, so that the protag's actions do not have to necessarily use weapons, skills or powers in order to advance through the assignment/mission. Previously, I wrote about using cover and alternate pathways to avoid fights and saving your limited ammo until you really need to use it.

 

This time, I'm wondering what others think about being able to use cover to gather intel, like overhearing a conversation, tracking enemy movements and footsteps, knocking out a guard, and looking for clues or tell-tale signs? We've already used a data terminal inside a facility for collecting information, but what about picking up evidence on the ground, such as when we follow a path?  It is in a sense using strategy during a tactical op, but I want ME:A to remain a role-playing game.

 

Remember when we landed on Eden Prime. Ahead and to the right of the open field was a shallow swamp with a crate at the far right end. What if, instead, there was a stand of tall grass reeds that we could use to covertly observe a situation lying ahead?  Yes, we typically use medium to tall rocks as cover to peer around corners.  I think it would be nice to have (in few locations) some variety in the types of 'natural' cover spots we could use. I assume games like Battlefield allow players to use a variety of cover 'types', and I know nothing about DA:I or any other combat-involved games either. Examples might be trees (forests) and tall reeds.

 

What types of 'natural cover' areas would make sense to incorporate into an ME game?

 

As far as I'm concerned, more is better when it comes to possible stealth based combat. The only problem being that they would need to overhaul the usual Mass Effect level design in order to do so. I'm not counting on anything like that happening, but if it were even on the table, I think the best game to look to for an example of how to do it well is Batman: Arkham City. 

[Robert Cousland]

Would it be too much to ask for an alien race that have tails?

[Lady Artifice]

When it comes to aliens with tails, I have a hard time shaking an image of the blue elven cat people from Avatar. 

[Robert Cousland]

When it comes to aliens with tails, I have a hard time shaking an image of the blue elven cat people from Avatar. 

How about the Draenei from World of Warcraft?

 

 

[Khrystyn]

Would it be too much to ask for an anien race that have tails?

 

Robert, do you think an alien's tail should be purely for appearance, or have a particular function such as a prehensile tail?

[Mdizzletr0n]

I've written in this thread before about being able to go covert during a tactical op, so that the protag's actions do not have to necessarily use weapons, skills or powers in order to advance through the assignment/mission. Previously, I wrote about using cover and alternate pathways to avoid fights and saving your limited ammo until you really need to use it.
 
This time, I'm wondering what others think about being able to use cover to gather intel, like overhearing a conversation, tracking enemy movements and footsteps, knocking out a guard, and looking for clues or tell-tale signs? We've already used a data terminal inside a facility for collecting information, but what about picking up evidence on the ground, such as when we follow a path?  It is in a sense using strategy during a tactical op, but I want ME:A to remain a role-playing game.
 
Remember when we landed on Eden Prime. Ahead and to the right of the open field was a shallow swamp with a crate at the far right end. What if, instead, there was a stand of tall grass reeds that we could use to covertly observe a situation lying ahead?  Yes, we typically use medium to tall rocks as cover to peer around corners.  I think it would be nice to have (in few locations) some variety in the types of 'natural' cover spots we could use. I assume games like Battlefield allow players to use a variety of cover 'types', and I know nothing about DA:I or any other combat-involved games either. Examples might be trees (forests) and tall reeds.
 
What types of 'natural cover' areas would make sense to incorporate into an ME game?

I'd love to see something like this. However, every iteration of ME has played faster than the last (and i hate that). I feel that BW will keep on the current trajectory. Especially, if they'really using ME3 as a base.

[Robert Cousland]

Robert, do you think an alien's tail should be purely for appearance, or have a particular function such as a prehensile tail?

 

Either or, I just really like tails on aliens.

[GDICanuck]

Crafting/Omni-fabricating.

[DaemionMoadrin]

Crafting/Omni-fabricating.

 

You want to spend additional time crafting gear instead of experiencing story content?

[GDICanuck]

You want to spend additional time crafting gear instead of experiencing story content?

I think it would be pretty nifty to be able to make an ops pack in the field with some omnigel. Think alien isolation crafting.

And I think it would add more to the game then the 50 Shades of grey domination romances some people have demanded on this forum.

[Chealec]

Robert, do you think an alien's tail should be purely for appearance, or have a particular function such as a prehensile tail?

 

 

[Khrystyn]

.... more is better when it comes to possible stealth-based combat. The only problem being that they would need to overhaul the usual Mass Effect level design in order to do so.

 

Why would BW need to overhaul the ME level design if they build covert activities into missions and assignments into Andromeda in the first place, or allow covert activities as an alternate means to complete them?

 

I have assumed that a mission or assignment 'area' that allows for more alternate ways to reach a way-point is basically needed to allow for more covert activities, such as circling around an enemy's position to move on (avoid the conflict), or take out a guard from behind as opposed to fighting it head-on. ME-1 and -2 seem very linear to me; I'm always having to fight through a funnel to reach my objectives. My hope for Andromeda's way-finding is that alternate paths could include moving through different hazards if we choose to avoid a fight (to save ammo, for example). An alternate path could involve going through a minefield or quicksand, keeping one's balance walking on a narrow path on the sheer edge of a vertical rock face, etc. The availability of alternate pathways seem to me to be a perfect way to use the expanded areas that BW has claimed Andromeda will have.

 

I don't want to run around with nothing to do if I want to avoid shooting for tactical reasons. This is why I've also thought that eavesdropping on alien conversations and observing enemy activities would be interesting to me; I don't want to have to be always shooting to make my way forward. I could pick up useful intel, find resources, meet some interesting characters, etc., that would be alternatives to armed conflict - simply another way to role-play my PC. Covert tactics for a mission could involve entering and leaving a facility or camp without being detected as an option. Or, the entire mission or assignment could be based on acting covertly and achieve the goals without firing a single shot.

[von uber]

By level design I assume she means the way future civilisations are dependant on a series of waist high boxes laid parallel to each other.

[Eckswhyzed]

This is why I've also thought that eavesdropping on alien conversations and observing enemy activities would be interesting to me; I don't want to have to be always shooting to make my way forward. I could pick up useful intel, find resources, meet some interesting characters, etc., that would be alternatives to armed conflict - simply another way to role-play my PC. Covert tactics for a mission could involve entering and leaving a facility or camp without being detected as an option. Or, the entire mission or assignment could be based on acting covertly and achieve the goals without firing a single shot.

As much I dislike parts of the first Mass Effect game, it has one of the best levels in the series - Noveria and the mission to get to Peak 15. A smattering of combat, multiple ways to achieve your objective; from the lawful to the evil and all mixed together with a good dose of the cyberpunk with powerful corporations and shady dealings. The only thing it's missing is a good stealth section, and I would so dearly love to have that sort of mission in ME:A.

I don't think that sort of mission with multiple ways to achieve your objective was ever repeated again in the entire series. What I'm a little worried about is how this is going to play into the open world aspect - though if done right, I'm imagining we would be dropped into a zone, given an objective and maybe a few hints, and then left to explore and figure out how to do it.

[DaemionMoadrin]

I think it would be pretty nifty to be able to make an ops pack in the field with some omnigel. Think alien isolation crafting.

And I think it would add more to the game then the 50 Shades of grey domination romances some people have demanded on this forum.

 

The problem is, DA:I had crafting... MMO style. Meaning it was a huge timesink. With additional nonsense like savescumming protection, limited resources and not enough different designs.

 

I'm not saying it's a deal breaker but crafting like that is definite negative point for the game.

 

As to the stealth discussion and alternative ways to resolve quests... I believe the original Deus Ex and Deus Ex: Human Revolution did it quite well.

[iM3GTR]

Would it be too much to ask for an alien race that have tails?

Space-hamster.

[Khrystyn]

.... one of the best levels in the [ME-1] series [was] Noveria and the mission to get to Peak 15. The only thing it's missing is a good stealth section, and I would so dearly love to have that sort of mission in ME:A.  What I'm a little worried about is how this is going to play into the open world aspect - .... I'm imagining we would be dropped into a zone, given an objective and maybe a few hints, and then left to explore and figure out how to do it.

 

Exactly.

 

I think it's critical that we be able to find clues, evidence, tracks, etc., or we'll become lost in a more open world. There's no way that I'd want to go back to stumbling around planets like we did in ME-1 for finding clueless 'points of Interest', searching blindly to find escape pods, turian insignias, minerals, etc.

 

I'd like to find clues that are sometimes much more than random data pads. Sha'ira's prothean trinket was a good example of a clue that could have had greater utility to bringing down Saren - like activating Vigil. Liara could have done her 'Embrace the Goddess' routine with the trinket to discover even more visual fragments that helped the mission to head in the right direction. Yet, I would have screamed bloody murder, however, if I got to Vigil and only then realized that I should have not returned to Shai'ra (on the Citadel) until after completing Citadel: Xeltan Convinced, and thus missed her prothean trinket.

 

To go covert I think we'd need to gather some intel, recognize alternate paths to the objective (perhaps through a conversation with an alien?), and let us decide how we want to get there. If we choose to avoid conflict, or if being covert is the mission's primary strategy, I'd like to be able to navigate through or around hazards, to make it interesting. Getting past patrols and encampments should require some timing (not timed) to avoid being spotted. Zaeed's loyalty mission gave us two navigation options to get through the refinery, and these options resulted in two different outcomes: the refinery's workers were either saved or allowed to die. I liked that on Eden Prime (ME-1) we had a series of conversations (Ashley, Dr. Warren and Manuel, Cole, and Powell) to aid us in getting to the beacon, but except for gaining a few morality and squad points only Ashley's and dock worker Powell's info came closest to being necessary and helpful. Dr. Warren and Cole offered little info of value; now I bypass them every time.

 

Greater development effort should go towards mission quality and navigation options. Having multiple routes we can follow during a mission will allow us to replay each mission with 2-4 different game-play experiences to reach our objective(s). Let us see far more of the mission world's variable terrain and vistas following optional routes instead of going back through the same funnel of enemies every time we replay it. Instead of searching 101 planets for 4-5 items located all over the place, I'd rather see the development effort go towards making fewer planetary assignments (or asteroids, space stations, hidden planets) that are far more richer in terms of  visuals, things to do, and options to complete them. 

[Malthier]

a game where storage crates aren't the main option for taking cover would be great.

[DaemionMoadrin]

a game where storage crates aren't the main option for taking cover would be great.

 

ME 1 allowed you to crouch, we could go a step further and go fully prone to take cover.

 

SW:TOR has a cover mechanic where the character rolls behind the nearest object or if none is available (most of the time), they crouch behind a small force field (which can be enlarged for more protection with the right abilities).

[themikefest]

ME 1 allowed you to crouch, we could go a step further and go fully prone to take cover..

That would be fine. Low crawl from one spot to another without alerting the enemy of your position

[Lady Artifice]

How about the Draenei from World of Warcraft?

 

 

 

In my opinion, the male looks a lot weirder than the female. Also, with the blueness and hooves, they remind me a little of Andalites.

 

Why would BW need to overhaul the ME level design if they build covert activities into missions and assignments into Andromeda in the first place, or allow covert activities as an alternate means to complete them?

 

Specifically, I'm just thinking of the means by which concealment would be maintained in a covert op. In ME, the only situation that really says "covert" to me is Kasumi's mission, and the covert part didn't really last for very long.

 

And like uber said, waist high boxes tend to serve as the default cover choice in an indoor ME combat sequence. Ideally, I'd like covert to mean that we have an option between bending behind something like a crate, standing atop something like a beam, or lurking inside something like an air duct.

[Khrystyn]

...And the ones you think we should [have in Andromeda]. This is for those things which you believe would fit the lore and benefit the story, and that would be completely new.

 

I’d like to hear what some of you think about these ideas. Perhaps these have been mentioned by others already.

 

First Idea: Squadmate communication during combat.

 

In Andromeda, let’s see some communication and interaction between the PC and the squadmates during combat, where they aren't just trash-talking the enemy or saying "I'm on it." For an ME example, Jack heads off during combat to another position but gets into trouble and is pinned down or in danger of being overrun. She says, "Shepard, I'm in trouble! Can you get  you *ss over here!?!"  Shepard has several response choices: A. Move to support her; B. Send the other NPC to her assistance; or C. Let her get wounded and you'll apply medi-gel later. Just something where our NPC squadmates are telling our protag something that could change our tactical plan during combat. I think it adds another way to role play and make us think a bit more about our options during the heat of combat. I suggest a dialog wheel pop-up that gives us the three choices: A. "Hold on... I'm coming. "; B. "I'm sending ___ your way"; C. "I can't. I'll give you some cover fire!" None of these options offer any morality points, but your decision would result in a different conversation when you two meet back on the ship or hop into the mako.

 

Second Idea: Medi-gel is applied differently.

 

In order to apply medi-gel, you have to get close to (near) the NPC to apply it - not from 50 ft. away. If you can't reach them because of the fierce combat difficulty you are in, you'll have to wait until you can safely get over to them to apply the medi-gel. A count-down timer begins as to their condition. If time expires, they will die, and this is a critical mission failure; you must replay from your last save. Perhaps the application of medi-gel always restores full health, but it takes some time for it to work rather than instantaneously; kinda like the time delay it took when diffusing the bombs on Eden Prime (ME-1) while under fire. You wouldn't necessarily have to stay with the recovering NPC, but their return to the fight is delayed a bit. When the Medi-gel gets upgrades, these will decrease the delay time so the NPC can get back into the fight more quickly (it becomes more effective).

 

Third Idea: Our NPCs or alien friends discover things for us.

 

After combat, one of our NPC's says, "Looky what I found over here! You better see this!"  This way we don't have to find every crate all by ourselves, and our NPCs have something to do once in a while. Or, the NPC finds something special that we would have overlooked. In Andromeda, would we really know what to look for? Our unfamiliarity with the area means we might not recognize something as important. Our alien companions find things that we would have overlooked. Important clues, perhaps? A special trinket?

[Lady Artifice]

I’d like to hear what some of you think about these ideas. Perhaps these have been mentioned by others already.

 

First Idea: Squadmate communication during combat.

 

In Andromeda, let’s see some communication and interaction between the PC and the squadmates during combat, where they aren't just trash-talking the enemy or saying "I'm on it." For an ME example, Jack heads off during combat to another position but gets into trouble and is pinned down or in danger of being overrun. She says, "Shepard, I'm in trouble! Can you get  you *ss over here!?!"  Shepard has several response choices: A. Move to support her; B. Send the other NPC to her assistance; or C. Let her get wounded and you'll apply medi-gel later. Just something where our NPC squadmates are telling our protag something that could change our tactical plan during combat. I think it adds another way to role play and make us think a bit more about our options during the heat of combat. I suggest a dialog wheel pop-up that gives us the three choices: A. "Hold on... I'm coming. "; B. "I'm sending ___ your way"; C. "I can't. I'll give you some cover fire!" None of these options offer any morality points, but your decision would result in a different conversation when you two meet back on the ship or hop into the mako.

 

Second Idea: Medi-gel is applied differently.

 

In order to apply medi-gel, you have to get close to (near) the NPC to apply it - not from 50 ft. away. If you can't reach them because of the fierce combat difficulty you are in, you'll have to wait until you can safely get over to them to apply the medi-gel. A count-down timer begins as to their condition. If time expires, they will die, and this is a critical mission failure; you must replay from your last save. Perhaps the application of medi-gel always restores full health, but it takes some time for it to work rather than instantaneously; kinda like the time delay it took when diffusing the bombs on Eden Prime (ME-1) while under fire. You wouldn't necessarily have to stay with the recovering NPC, but their return to the fight is delayed a bit. When the Medi-gel gets upgrades, these will decrease the delay time so the NPC can get back into the fight more quickly (it becomes more effective).

 

Third Idea: Our NPCs or alien friends discover things for us.

 

After combat, one of our NPC's says, "Looky what I found over here! You better see this!"  This way we don't have to find every crate all by ourselves, and our NPCs have something to do once in a while. Or, the NPC finds something special that we would have overlooked. In Andromeda, would we really know what to look for? Our unfamiliarity with the area means we might not recognize something as important. Our alien companions find things that we would have overlooked. Important clues, perhaps? A special trinket?

 

 

For the first, it sounds like it might be tricky for them to implement, especially when it comes to a company like Bioware that has a habit of using a single button for too many different actions. I'm not opposed to the idea, exactly, I'm just wary of the pitfalls it could present. 

 

For the second, I'm not sure. I like the idea of needing to be close to a teammate in order to apply medi-gel, but I'm conflicted about the idea of a critical mission failure for when just one member of the team goes down. I think I might prefer it if they worked in something that actually meant that we didn't get critical failure until everyone goes down (slightly like in DA), but it become significantly harder to stay alive when you lose a teammate. 

 

For the third, I like it. I always support as many companion reactions to our environment and actions as they can reasonably work into the game.