457 réponses à ce sujet

[Gothfather]

What your evidence shows is that Leviathan is a species from the Milky Way and that Leviathan perceived their problem regarding tribute as galactic in scale (i.e. within the limits of their empire) and created the Catalyst AI to solve this problem.  It also shows somewhat that the Catalyst saw the problem as being limited to the Milky Way galaxy.  However, what is known also is that the Reaper do leave the Millky Way galaxy between cycles (i.e. they go into dark space, which is clearly defined in the codex as being space outside the galaxy).  We also know from Sovereign that they are 'legion" (innumerable) and that they are "each a nation" unto themselves.  This clearly shows that each Reaper is "self-aware."... and EDI's example (in ME3) shows us that a self-aware AI can alter it's own programming.  The progression of the Geth and EDI also shows that what was originally created as a simple VI can also "learn" enough become self-aware.  In ME3, EDI mentions that it was difficult becoming self-aware while under Shepard's attack in ME1 (and this is before TIM tampered with her and installed Reaper code).

 

In addition, the "each a nation" line combined with the revelation that they are each created by "absorbing the essence" of a unique civilization is an indication that they may tend towards having different ideas and opinions based on whatever civilization they were created from.  They may also feel as though they are somewhat self-governing - since a individual government is largely what defines the concept of a "nation."

 

While the Catalyst clearly indicates that it has control over the Reapers, that control appears to be only on a galactic level.  This does not preclude a number of Reapers "going rogue" while in dark space and leaving the influence of the Catalyst.  We also know that the range of the Crucible appears to be limited to the Milky Way galaxy (since we are now assuming that any ARK that left Milky Way prior to the end of the Reaper War would contain humans and other organic Milky Way species that are unaffected by whatever choice Shepard makes).  If the power of the Crucible is limited to the Milky Way Galaxy or even just loses strength over distance in dark space... then there is nothing to say that Reapers could not survive, be left unaltered or be left uncontrolled by the firing of the Crucible at the end of the Reaper War.

 

This opens up a range of possibilities... including Rogue Reapers coming to their own unique solution to the problem that "tribute does not flow from a dead race" and that synthetics will inevitably rebel against their organic creators.  Heck, they could even become our allies in Andromeda... and wouldn't that be an interesting twist?

 

There isn't a single piece of evidence that supports your position it is all supposition. There isn't anything that even suggest the reapers are extra galactic, there isn't any evidence that suggests that the control of the catalyst isn't total. Where is the evidence? The reapers might fart mushrooms being part organic and animal life farts and mushrooms exist so obviously Reapers fart mushrooms. Find one piece of evidence that says that isn't true. You can't. But lack of evidence isn't evidence. Simply because no single piece of ME lore specifically disproves reapers farting mushrooms doesn't magically make my theory viable or based in anything but conjecture. All the extra galactic camp can do is say well there isn't any evidence that disproves it. PFFFT that isn't how reasoned thought works you don't say well their isn't any evidence against my theory ergo its true. You must provide evidence to SUPPORT your actual claim. I have done so for my claim. I never claimed it proves my position only that evidence corroborates my position.

 

There is in fact evidence that refutes your notion that the catalysis doesn't control all reapers, that it is limited.

 

https://youtu.be/yx_smmq_3AE?t=2m44s

 

"In as much as you are just an animal. I embody the collective intelligence of ALL reapers." All is an adverb used for emphasis there is NO room for ambiguity here ALL has a very specific meany without any caveats included in the statement. ALL cats are black. Means something very different from All cat in my house are black. And it isn't the expectation with all that you are making a limited statement without the sentence including said limitations. If I said 'all cats are black,' no one thinks yes that statement is correct because we have an expectation that all is limited. No we see that statement and go FALSE automatically because we know that not ALL cats are black.

 

This statement alone completely contradicts the notion that reapers are autonomous we can infer that they are not because the catalysis is their intelligence it embodies it. Your whole theory starts to crumple in two areas one the notion that reapers are autonomous and that there are limits on the catalysis control. We actually have evidence that completely and specifically with regards to the reapers discredits this.

 

We further see evidence of how the reapers are NOT autonomous when Shepard asks about the reapers.

 

https://youtu.be/yx_smmq_3AE?t=4m18s

 

When talking about the reapers and the conflict with current organics it repeatedly uses the pronoun WE.

 

Shepard asks Will the reapers be destroyed and we get a definitive 'Yes, but the peace won't last.' Again no caveats no conditions on the reapers being destroyed, the reapers are destroyed.

 

With control again there are no caveats. Shepard asks "But the reapers will obey me?" Child:"Yes. We will be yours to control and direct as you see fit"

 

https://youtu.be/yx_smmq_3AE?t=9m33s

 

If we can control all reapers or kill all reapers and the crucibles energy is seen to transmitted through the mass relay system to do its work. There can be NO reapers outside the galaxy according to the lore because there were NO caveats to control or destruction.

 

NOTHING in the endings or the Leviathan conversation support the reapers being extra galactic. NOTHING. In fact multiple times we see that the entire scope of the reapers is LIMITED to this galaxy only. The one example of the reapers leaving our galaxy is to Specifically hibernate. So if you rely on the codex as evidence then we have to accept all of it and that clearly shows that the reapers do NOT spend their time in other galaxies  between cycles they hibernate.

 

Again i ask as I have ask countless times provide me with just ONE piece of evidence that the reapers are out an about in other galaxies. There simply isn't any yet time and time again i can show how the problem that created the catalysis itself was galactic, that the creators of the catalysis we confined to this galaxy and when the catalysis itself went searching for a solution IT LIMITED itself to just this galaxy.

 

It is clear to me that people simply REFUSE to accept any evidence that doesn't fit their own private beliefs. They ignore the multiple examples of the limitation of the reapers because they are too arrogant to accept their pet theory is not supported by the evidence and justify it by claiming well nothing specifically says it isn't correct. yeah just like nothing specifically states reapers don't fart mushrooms. Peoples intellectual power is truly on display here.

[Squinterific]

The Reapers can, but they don't care about other galaxies. They're programmed to care about the Milky Way.

 

Leviathans could have certainly made their way there. If they did, they're probably very rare, since their civilization was almost wiped out by the Reapers.

[Gothfather]

That's what I thought - the original programmed objective was to protect life within the Milky Way, specifically.

 

It's just strange that, considering the huge scope of the trilogy and how 'advanced and incomprehensible' the reapers were supposed to be, they wouldn't ever question that peculiar facet of the objective, when they had already stretched principle enough to think in advance about protecting organic life via wiping out only the higher layers of evolved civilizations because it could be permanently eradicated for good otherwise. If they can think with the kind of foresight to envision that, then I would presume they can envision a scenario in which races from other galaxies evolve and advance unchecked to the point they can travel between galaxies and wreak havoc on this one.

 

They don't wipe out life. They reform it into a reaper. Reapers are not machines they are cyborgs. The harvests are so named because they are literately harvesting tribute for the leviathans.

 

I clearly show what the actual problem the catalysis is created to solve and viewing what harvest is and why it is so name makes it clear that the cycles are the ultimate manifestation of the leviathan tribute system nothing more nothing less.

 

The below link will go step by step how it works and once you understand this everything the reapers do makes sense and so does the comments of the catalysis when it says that the help life to 'ascend' during the conversation at the end of me3. Doesn't save teh endings but at least they makes sense post leviathan.

https://forum.biowar...9#entry20047711

[Sartoz]

The Reapers can, but they don't care about other galaxies. They're programmed to care about the Milky Way.

 

Leviathans could have certainly made their way there. If they did, they're probably very rare, since their civilization was almost wiped out by the Reapers.

                                                                                    <<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>

 

I believe the Reapers are akin to a hive mind. The Catalyst controls ALL and that they have no individual free will.

[Iakus]

This doesn't follow. The Catalyst follows a bizarre set of logic, but we can't extrapolate from that what the Catalyst would (or wouldn't) do, like deciding to venture out beyond the Milky Way. That's what inherently makes the Catalyst such a bizarre entity.

 

Perfect example: he openly gives the keys to shutting him down via Destroy, even while acknowledging that it's a non-solution to his idiotic Organic-Synthetic conflict or his absolute failure to immediately grab the Citadel and shutting down the relay network, which the Reapers seem able to do at their leisure after Cronos Station.  

 

We would have to start with the above scenarios if we're really going to get into the meat of why the Reapers have to be in Andromeda. 

We can extrapolate based on its purpose "Preserve life at all costs" and that intergalactic travel is in fact possible.

 

Now they could always say "The Reapers stuck around the Milky Way" because they simply don't want to deal with the Reapers anymore.  I certainly won't be surprised if this is the case.  But the fact is, barring some trick to intergalactic travel we are not aware of yet, there is absolutely no reason the Reapers to hold back.  And in fact compelling reasons to actually go.

[In Exile]

We can extrapolate based on its purpose "Preserve life at all costs" and that intergalactic travel is in fact possible.

 

Now they could always say "The Reapers stuck around the Milky Way" because they simply don't want to deal with the Reapers anymore.  I certainly won't be surprised if this is the case.  But the fact is, barring some trick to intergalactic travel we are not aware of yet, there is absolutely no reason the Reapers to hold back.  And in fact compelling reasons to actually go.

 

We can't extrapolate that at all. From "Preserve life at all costs" it gets "exterminate sapient life in the most torturous and horrific ways." There is absolutely reason for the Reapers to engage in any of the nonsensical behaviour they engage in.

[Gothfather]

@straykat:  Why would they?  They're not biological.  They exist "forever".  They need only stop and "store" biologicals because of their programming.  Because - let's be serious... if the Catalyst was capable of human thought do you think it would not have seen the terrible flaws in its programming after a few hundred cycles? 

 

Honestly - I believe logic engines would come to the conclusions humans seem incapable of.  The universe is vast and you (we, it, they, whatever) are not important as an individual.  If anything about us is important - it is that we are participating in "life" - so is phytoplankton (and is actually far more important for life in general)

 

Policing "galaxies" is well beyond the boundaries of preposterous as far as stories goes... policing "the universe" would be a futile effort and I don't see any logic engine being stupid enough to think it's a worthwhile goal.  We know - through the story - they ARE capable of policing the galaxy (regardless of how insane that is) - but even so, they're failing more and more each cycle. 

 

The Catalyst should have known this inevitability was coming - and it probably would have - if it were anything more than a fancy program.  As it was - the Catalyst was incapable of anything like original thought - synthesis likely strained the boundaries of its programming - a glitch it cobbled together (and also an ode to transhumanism)

 

Personally - I believe true AIs that could think for themselves - would tend toward fatalism.  Only something programmed for "awe and wonder" would act like a human.  Humans act that way because we are moved by WAY more than just logic.  We're an irrational creature capable of moments of reason. 

 

The one thing I applaud in their depiction of the Catalyst?  How supremely incompetent it was over millions of years.  Completely unwilling - or incapable - of any real significant change to its programming. 

I agree.

 

With the advent of the extended cuts and the Leviathan DLC the catalysis is remarkably consistent and "logical" within the confines of its mandate. The leviathans are tired of the unstable nature of their tribute system with their servitor races destroying themselves through their AI creations.  The catalysis see that 'chaos' is part of the root problem, that chaos being primarily but not limited the organic vs. synthetic conflict but it also sees the the organic nature of the Leviathans is part of the problem not perhaps in how many people might think in that they are organic ergo they could or will create other machines themselves and so on. No I don't believe that was what the catalysis is referring. Organic life is ever changing it evolves and it also dies off. the Leviathans want stable tribute payments, Their own biology is a weak link to this stability should they die or evolve differently. Hence not realising they are part of the long term threat to stable tribute systems. Now any organic mind would conclude well at this point the tribute system becomes insignificant so don't factor this into the equation. But the machine has one mandate to solve the problem that tribute does not flow from a dead race so it doesn't exclude this factor for its solution. So it concludes after searching the galaxy that it need to create harbinger the "head" reaper. This head reaper then receives as tribute every subsequent reaper which is a societies' entire, material, genetic, culture and historic assets given to harbinger in reaper form.

 

This reasoning is remarkably consistent going from vanilla to extended cuts to the leviathan DLC. It doesn't contradict itself and things that we thought didn't make sense actually fit quite tightly into the internal logic of what the catalysis is, who created it and what it ultimately does to solve the problem. Sadly not all the pieces were available to gleam at launch and people simply wont look past the surface in most cases so they think its just stupid.

[Il Divo]

We can extrapolate based on its purpose "Preserve life at all costs" and that intergalactic travel is in fact possible.

 

Now they could always say "The Reapers stuck around the Milky Way" because they simply don't want to deal with the Reapers anymore.  I certainly won't be surprised if this is the case.  But the fact is, barring some trick to intergalactic travel we are not aware of yet, there is absolutely no reason the Reapers to hold back.  And in fact compelling reasons to actually go.

 

In Exile hit on this before me, but if we're going to play a game where we extrapolate what the Catalyst intends:

 

"Preserve life at all costs", completely against the Leviathan's intentions, turned into "commit complete genocide of every space-faring species". 

 

At that stage, I wouldn't put much stock in "Preserve life at all costs" means "The Catalyst decided to reach out to intergalactic travel". 

[Gothfather]

We can extrapolate based on its purpose "Preserve life at all costs" and that intergalactic travel is in fact possible.

 

Now they could always say "The Reapers stuck around the Milky Way" because they simply don't want to deal with the Reapers anymore.  I certainly won't be surprised if this is the case.  But the fact is, barring some trick to intergalactic travel we are not aware of yet, there is absolutely no reason the Reapers to hold back.  And in fact compelling reasons to actually go.

i love how you keep going back to "preserve life at all costs," but continue to misquote it. It really is rather sad its like you know you have lost so you just repeat this one phrase like a mantra with no intellectual rigour behind it just 'religious' dogma.

 

The full quote is. https://youtu.be/lEqlG6bhZ80?t=2m33s

 

"Over time, the species created machines that then destroyed them. TRIBUTE does not flow from a dead race. To solve this problem, we created an intelligence with the mandate to preserve life at any cost." No one with any intellectual integrity, but I mean you clearly have none because you have continuously ignore this FULL Quote and won't even quote the full sentence, can read this and think Yep the reapers are created to preserve life. It is utter crap. They are created to solve the problem of tribute doesn't flow from a dead race. The preservation of life isn't to preserve it for it's own sake it is to keep tribute flowing.  I mean for frak sake the sentence clearly tells you this. But OH NO you just misquote the fraking thing to maintain your bullsh!t. This alone shows the scope of the reapers it is galatic because the tribute system was never extra galatic and the reapers are designed to do one thing and that is to solve the issue that tribute does not flow from a dead race.

 

This explains why reapers view what they do as HARVESTING and not destruction, killing or war because they return each cycle to get tribute for harbinger the reaper-leviathan and thus ensuring that tribute continues to flow. life means very little in the grand scheme of things, tribute is king.

 

I will again link my previous post which is widely ignored by your camp as to teh various points where we CLEARLY see the reapers are galatic is scope. https://forum.biowar...9#entry20047711 See? This is what EVIDENCE is.

 

But again I will ask for EVIDENCE for your position.

 

Why do I get the feeling that despite what anyone says, not matter what cited evidence is provided, Iakus will never admit he's mistaken? Why do I get the feeling he simply views facts as having no weight at all they are just talking points of the other side? There is no intellectual integrity within him period.

[Cloninator]

tldr;

 

Reapers came to Andromeda eons ago and got their butts kicked by something that is either more powerful, or just happened to have the perfect defense against them.  Reaper kryptonite.  Reapers don't come around no mo'.  The end.

 

Next.

[Sifr]

In Exile hit on this before me, but if we're going to play a game where we extrapolate what the Catalyst intends:

 

"Preserve life at all costs", completely against the Leviathan's intentions, turned into "commit complete genocide of every space-faring species". 

 

At that stage, I wouldn't put much stock in "Preserve life at all costs" means "The Catalyst decided to reach out to intergalactic travel". 

 

Yeah, if the Reapers were following their actual intended purpose, they'd be more akin to the Encyclopods from the Futurama movie "Into the Wild Green Yonder", who only show up to take a sample of endangered species, but otherwise leave everyone completely alone.

 

The Reapers seemed to have twisted "preserving all life" to mean that they should grind up people and store them in a Reaper shell, so that they will never be in danger of being wiped out in the future by their own creations. Kind of missing the entire friggin' point there.

[KaiserShep]

This explains why reapers view what they do as HARVESTING and not destruction, killing or war because they return each cycle to get tribute for harbinger the reaper-leviathan and thus ensuring that tribute continues to flow. life means very little in the grand scheme of things, tribute is king.

 

 

I dunno. Seems kinda daft, especially when you consider that here and there, the reapers may just bombard a planet entirely and not really bother to take anyone first, like Bekenstein. 

[straykat]

i love how you keep going back to "preserve life at all costs," but continue to misquote it. It really is rather sad its like you know you have lost so you just repeat this one phrase like a mantra with no intellectual rigour behind it just 'religious' dogma.

 

The full quote is. https://youtu.be/lEqlG6bhZ80?t=2m33s

 

"Over time, the species created machines that then destroyed them. TRIBUTE does not flow from a dead race. To solve this problem, we created an intelligence with the mandate to preserve life at any cost." No one with any intellectual integrity, but I mean you clearly have none because you have continuously ignore this FULL Quote and won't even quote the full sentence, can read this and think Yep the reapers are created to preserve life. It is utter crap. They are created to solve the problem of tribute doesn't flow from a dead race. The preservation of life isn't to preserve it for it's own sake it is to keep tribute flowing.  I mean for frak sake the sentence clearly tells you this. But OH NO you just misquote the fraking thing to maintain your bullsh!t. This alone shows the scope of the reapers it is galatic because the tribute system was never extra galatic and the reapers are designed to do one thing and that is to solve the issue that tribute does not flow from a dead race.

 

This explains why reapers view what they do as HARVESTING and not destruction, killing or war because they return each cycle to get tribute for harbinger the reaper-leviathan and thus ensuring that tribute continues to flow. life means very little in the grand scheme of things, tribute is king.

 

I will again link my previous post which is widely ignored by your camp as to teh various points where we CLEARLY see the reapers are galatic is scope. https://forum.biowar...9#entry20047711 See? This is what EVIDENCE is.

 

But again I will ask for EVIDENCE for your position.

 

Why do I get the feeling that despite what anyone says, not matter what cited evidence is provided, Iakus will never admit he's mistaken? Why do I get the feeling he simply views facts as having no weight at all they are just talking points of the other side? There is no intellectual integrity within him period.

 

 

I think the tribute idea was only Leviathan's initial reason. An AI could supercede it. An AI thinks for itself. Even modern AI in silly things like games is developed to find their own pathways.

 

They killed off Leviathan, after all. They don't care about Leviathan's needs anymore. Or can you explain how they do? 

[Medhia_Nox]

I would have preferred that their "preserve life at any cost" mandate actually speak to biology instead of sapience.

 

Biodiversity is critical to the health and success of any ecosystem.  If humans are used as a baseline for sapience (and at this point they must be) - then we know that sapience destroys biodiversity by its very nature.

 

86% of the apple varieties on planet earth have been destroyed by humanity so that we can have an apple we consider perfect.

 

This creates huge problems when - like the banana - a strain of disease develops that attacks our hyper-specialized banana strain.  It is now believed the banana we regularly eat in stores will be extinct because of our destruction of the biodiversity of this food source.

 

This is suicidal behavior. 

 

By 2050 - it is believed that between 30 and 50 percent of ALL THE WORLDS ANIMALS - will be extinct.  The sixth major extinction event our world is experiencing is directly because of us. 

 

Had the Reapers spoken to this - inorganic life having reverence for "life" and the need to battle sapient species for the sake of "life in general" - I would have found the ME story of the Reapers FAR more compelling and the decision far more complex than "Reaper's bad".  In the end - we would have been the villains of that story and the Reapers would have been striving to "protect life at any cost". 

 

What we got... was some weird "Elder Gods" mythos that - for me - did not turn out well (and they're repeating on a certain level in DA)

[themikefest]

If it's too stupid, then I obviously picked the right choice. Destroy! Hell yeah!

I do as well. Destroy all the time

[AngryFrozenWater]

I do as well. Destroy all the time

Agreed. Destruction makes the most sense.

 

Even the husks are kept alive in control and synthesis. Wouldn't the banshees make great babysitters?

[Reorte]

<<<<<<<<<<(0)>>>>>>>>>>
 
I believe the Reapers are akin to a hive mind. The Catalyst controls ALL and that they have no individual free will.

They show some individuality. Sovereign, Harbinger, and the Rannoch Reaper all seem a little different to each other (and IIRC the Rannoch Reaper mentioned Harbinger speaking of Shepard, which doesn't sound quite hive-minded). Inside each individual Reaper you have a hive mind (see Legion's explanation).

[Laughing_Man]

...

 

Had the Reapers spoken to this - inorganic life having reverence for "life" and the need to battle sapient species for the sake of "life in general" - I would have found the ME story of the Reapers FAR more compelling and the decision far more complex than "Reaper's bad".  In the end - we would have been the villains of that story and the Reapers would have been striving to "protect life at any cost". 

 

...

 

Therefore making the ME story into a wet-dream simulator for the budding Eco-terrorist?

 

There's nothing wrong with wanting to protect nature, but if it comes to the survival of humans vs. the survival of something else, I'm certainly not

going to choose the "paragon of nature" option that allows the Reapers to annihilate all sapient life so nature can go on without disturbance.

 

Nature is important, it's even cute and fuzzy in some cases, but I don't see why it is inherently more important than sapient life.

[Sifr]

They show some individuality. Sovereign, Harbinger, and the Rannoch Reaper all seem a little different to each other (and IIRC the Rannoch Reaper mentioned Harbinger speaking of Shepard, which doesn't sound quite hive-minded). Inside each individual Reaper you have a hive mind (see Legion's explanation).

 

Yeah, it seems that the Reapers are a hive mind within each shell, but each a separate entity in their own right, who happen to follow the same goal.

 

Harbinger is the oldest of the Reapers and seems to display far more individuality, an enjoyment of his favourite pets (Collectors) and a preoccupation with Shepard in particular. He similarly seems to have more of a sense of subtlety and caution than Sovereign (Nazara), keeping himself out of the fray unless necessary and instead using his troops to carry out his will.

 

It makes me wonder if Harbinger's enjoyment of transforming species into husks to serve him, might have derived from his being created from the Leviathans, who bent other species to serve them in a similar manner? Would be intriguing if each Reaper retains some kind of unique "personality" quirks and traits, that reflect the species they are derived from?

[Gothfather]

I think the tribute idea was only Leviathan's initial reason. An AI could supercede it. An AI thinks for itself. Even modern AI in silly things like games is developed to find their own pathways.

 

They killed off Leviathan, after all. They don't care about Leviathan's needs anymore. Or can you explain how they do? 

 

Except that we get confirmations that the Ai did NOT supersede it.

https://youtu.be/lEqlG6bhZ80?t=3m51s

 

Shepard: "And now we all pay the price for your mistake."

Leviathan: "There was NO mistake. It STILL serves its purpose."

 

i swear people don't actually bother to educated themselves on the actual game footage of the things they argue about. So you tell me HOW did it supersede its programming when it STILL serves its purpose there was no mistake in what they asked for and what they got? How do people craft these crazy theories when the fraking evidence that contradicts them is so readily available?  Hell if people just bothered to use the links I provide they could watch the source material themselves and SEE and HEAR it for themselves.

 

Yes I can explain how they do I have been showing over this entire thread how they do. It just takes people READING.

 

https://forum.biowar...9#entry20047711

 

READ THE WHOLE POST of the above link and you will see quite clearly how the reapers are doing exactly what they were programmed to do. A link for this very thread. A link with video citation as well so you can see the very part in the game that confirms all of what I am saying.

[Sifr]

To be fair, the Leviathans are arrogant enough that they'd never admit to making a mistake.

 

They seem the type of folks who might shoot unwittingly their own foot off and insist that the act was "all according to plan", which is essentially what the Catalyst is. That is such a level of denial over your own screw ups that is actually quite admirable, all things considered.

[straykat]

Except that we get confirmations that the Ai did NOT supersede it.

https://youtu.be/lEqlG6bhZ80?t=3m51s

 

Shepard: "And now we all pay the price for your mistake."

Leviathan: "There was NO mistake. It STILL serves its purpose."

 

i swear people don't actually bother to educated themselves on the actual game footage of the things they argue about. So you tell me HOW did it supersede its programming when it STILL serves its purpose there was no mistake in what they asked for and what they got? How do people craft these crazy theories when the fraking evidence that contradicts them is so readily available?  Hell if people just bothered to use the links I provide they could watch the source material themselves and SEE and HEAR it for themselves.

 

Yes I can explain how they do I have been showing over this entire thread how they do. It just takes people READING.

 

https://forum.biowar...9#entry20047711

 

READ THE WHOLE POST of the above link and you will see quite clearly how the reapers are doing exactly what they were programmed to do. A link for this very thread. A link with video citation as well so you can see the very part in the game that confirms all of what I am saying.

 

Why are you so ornery? You're even going ALL CAPS. No wait... BOLD and ALL CAPS. I asked you a question and you go on a rant. I think you have technical expertise, but your delivery sucks.

 

I'm not going to listen to you for the hell of it.

[Gothfather]

I dunno. Seems kinda daft, especially when you consider that here and there, the reapers may just bombard a planet entirely and not really bother to take anyone first, like Bekenstein. 

 

Because you are looking at the 'preserve life' as encompassing individual life. That ISN'T what the reapers are designed to do, they are designed to create a tribute system that is not disrupted by species' extinction. They do this by the harvest, the species survive in reaper form they are under the command of the Leviathan-reaper. It collects the species' material 'wealth,' technological 'wealth,' cultural 'wealth,' and genetic 'wealth' in the process and all of this goes to create more lesser reapers like destroyers and troop ships and husks along with the Actual "full" reaper.

 

The reapers don't care about the micro scale they care about the macro scale and so a single planet a single life isn't important the whole is what is important not the 'microscopic' bits that make up the whole.

[Gothfather]

Why are you so ornery? You're even going ALL CAPS. No wait... BOLD and ALL CAPS. I asked you a question and you go on a rant. I think you have technical expertise, but your delivery sucks.

 

I'm not going to listen to you for the hell of it.

Aww facts are so mean. boo hoo for you. It is typical of the childish 'opinion age' that I don't like you so I'm not going to listen to your facts. lol boo hoo i didn't coddle you. Being wilfully ignorant doesn't hurt anyone else but yourself.

 

The amazing thing is that had you actually clicked on the links to the post you quoted of mine all your questions would have been answered so why so ornery? because you were too fraking lazy for actually read the post and obtain the knowledge before you tried to join the conversation. I don't reward foolishness.

[Gothfather]

To be fair, the Leviathans are arrogant enough that they'd never admit to making a mistake.

 

They seem the type of folks who might shoot unwittingly their own foot off and insist that the act was "all according to plan", which is essentially what the Catalyst is. That is such a level of denial over your own screw ups that is actually quite admirable, all things considered.

 

And yet the catalysis confirms the same thing it is doing what it was programmed to do.

 

https://youtu.be/yx_smmq_3AE?t=4m24s

 

"Child: Reapers harvest all life--organic and synthetic--preserving them before they are forever lost to this conflict.

 

Shepard: We're at ware with the Reapers right now!

 

Child: You maybe in conflict with the Reapers, but they are not interested in war.

 

Shepard: I find that hard to believe.

 

Child: When fire burns, is it at war? Is it in conflict? Or is it simply doing what it is created to do? We are no different. We harvest your bodies, your knowledge, your creations. We preserve it to be reborn in the form of a new Reaper."

 

So we are not just talking one single source and saying see! we have two confirmed sources that confirm each other. So while one might suspect either source individually they confirm each others' story from their own perspectives,

 

In terms of what the game ACTUALLY states about why the catalysis and reapers are formed and what the purpose is behind the cycles things are remarkably consistent. Yes it is flawed but that is the whole point this is the logical extreme of the flawed request. And the catalysis realizes this it understands now that the reapers can no longer serve as a solution because of the crucible which it has tried to destroy over several cycles now. so it once again is searching for a new solution and for dramatic effect Shepard is the person whom it looks to for guidance.