144 réponses à ce sujet

[Abyss108]

Redcliffe looked like Redcliffe to me... Of course it looks a bit different, its been ten years since we've been there and we are in a completely new graphics engine. I'd rather they improve the way places look when they can, not stick to a 8 year old design.

[thats1evildude]

Redcliffe WAS razed by the darkspawn.

[Bob Walker]

Not a good idea at all.

[correctamundo]

No.

 

TL;DR: NO!!!

[AshenSugar]

Personally I'd say that the Dragon Age lore and universe has more in common with the Wheel of Time series than Tolkien, aside from the obvious, broad-brush approach of Elves, Dwarves etc.

 

In any case, no if doesn't need a reboot; as others have said, you are talking about an entirely new game. If they were going to do that, then surely it would be better to truly create a new game universe, and call it something else?

[thebigbad1013]

So...you're talking about making Dragon Age a completely different game/franchise by abandoning everything that the game is in favor of...something else? No thanks. I quite like this franchise and I would hate it if they just up and decided to wipe the slate clean.

[AnimalBoy]

I'd rather prefer them to create entire new franchise - with no dwarves nor elves, not based on medieval Europe, no magic or at least absolutely different approach on it, and saving the world. 

 

No dwarves?

No Elves?

No medieval Europe?

No Magic?

 

It's called Mass Effect.

[AnimalBoy]

No they shouldn't.

[AFA]

DAI is the only generic High Fantasy of the series. Hell, DA2 flirted with Low Fantasy.

 

Not a fan of the shift in tone from the first two games. Part of that was chasing Skyrim money. Game of Thrones making ASOIAF popular also interfered with the writers borrowing from that series as much.

[vbibbi]

It wouldn't be so bad if they would nail down the Dragon Age universe. But with each new game continuity is thrown out the window. Just look at the Qunari and how they change drastically in each game or the elves. I remember when I stumbled into Redcliffe in Inquisition. One of my party members had to tell me I was standing in Redcliffe because I had no clue; the scenery looked absolutely nothing like it did in Origins. I thought that was pretty bad. There are many moments like this in the Dragon Age games that take me out of the experience and it feels like Bioware still hasn't nailed down the fundamentals that make up this game. They don't seem to have this problem with Mass Effect though.

I will say that I wish DAI Redcliffe had the same basic structure as DAO's version. Yes, the Blight destroyed it, but the actual landscape changed between games. If the Chantry was rebuilt on the site of the original one, then where is the hill above the Chantry that held the tavern? I don't need the buildings to stand directly on top of their former locations, but I wanted the landscape to be easily recognizable. As it is, there are no actual red cliffs visible, and I'm not sure how we get to the rebuilt castle, as there's no visible path to it. I would think the path would be through the village.

 

Exactly. The entire point of the setting is to take all the traditional fantasy tropes and do something a bit different with them. The downtrodden elves of Thedas are a twist on Tolkein, and so is the cutthroat dwarf Empire in potentially terminal decline. So are the 'orcs' who might look monstrous to humans, but who have a culture of their own and are no more inherently evil than the rest of the world's inhabitants. (This is going to be doubly true if the suspicion about the Qunari being magically-altered elves with dragon blood turns out to be true, given that Tolkein's orcs were corrupted elves.) Meanwhile, the common attitudes towards mages as either Übermenschen or dangerous pariahs is largely inspired by David Gaider's speculation about how D&D-style magic users would actually be treated in societies that made sense.

 

Personally, I find the Dragon Age lore a lot more interesting than TES, but it's largely a matter of personal taste.

I see the darkspawn as analogue to orcs rather than the Qunari. Qunari are unique from other modern fantasy, and probably the most creative aspect of the DA setting. I don't think there are many Western game settings with a philosophical religion/culture rather than the standard Crystal Dragon Jesus religion or pantheistic religion.

 

Redcliffe looked like Redcliffe to me... Of course it looks a bit different, its been ten years since we've been there and we are in a completely new graphics engine. I'd rather they improve the way places look when they can, not stick to a 8 year old design.

If I hadn't known that the village was Redcliffe when I played DAI, I would not have assumed it was the same village as the original we saw. It's not the graphical change as much as the layout of the buildings and landscape.

[Riven326]

That just proves that what Sten told you in DA:O was right.

I think what it proves is Bioware doesn't really know or cannot decide on what the Qunari should look like.

 

Redcliffe looked like Redcliffe to me... Of course it looks a bit different, its been ten years since we've been there and we are in a completely new graphics engine. I'd rather they improve the way places look when they can, not stick to a 8 year old design.

 

They don't look anything alike. Aside from the obvious color and visual differences, the landscape itself is drastically changed.

[Deanna Troy]

Rebooted, hell no, because it would be rebooted into something at least as awful as Inquisition, there is no "good reboot", since 2009 things only get worse.
So since I know it would become something even more awful than Inquisition I just wanted an HD version of Origins... which a mod in progress on nexusmods and reshade already give me (Bioware version either would be worse than the mod or would be in a awesome new engine like Frostbite that clearly cost the game 99% of what I liked in DAOrigins).
So, while I would love a reboot since I hated the direction game took anything Bioware made now would be somewhere between 2x worse than Inquisition (it is like saying 300x times the speed of light when it comes to speed) or even worse beyond anything I could express with numbers and words.
Now if they "sold Dragon Age" to Obsidian or InXile, or even less awesome and less perfect companies like Bethsda or CD Projekt Red, then there would be some point in rebooting.
But now, back to reality, the franchise is dead and gone, failed and beyond redemption and it is pretty obvious Bioware wont do anything to save it they will only improve the franchise's lack of identity to get more sales. Having any hope on Dragon Age, any hope at all, even with extended material like comics and books is like hoping Hitler will resurrect with an army of angels to take over the earth and help human kind colonize new planets with the power of saint Bahamuth the Knight of the Rounf Table of Ramuh the great demonical Lord of the Titanic Dwarf Colossus, son of Xarles Chavier and the Caviar of Cazavirus.

[AlanC9]

I don't need the buildings to stand directly on top of their former locations, but I wanted the landscape to be easily recognizable. As it is, there are no actual red cliffs visible, and I'm not sure how we get to the rebuilt castle, as there's no visible path to it. I would think the path would be through the village.

I believe you can see the path to the castle, but it crosses a destroyed bridge. Don't ask me how we get there for IHW.

[Abyss108]

I think what it proves is Bioware doesn't really know or cannot decide on what the Qunari should look like.

 

 

They don't look anything alike. Aside from the obvious color and visual differences, the landscape itself is drastically changed.

 

Yes, because they could improve the landscape in the new Frostbite engine. It has the same mountain path down, the same windmills, the same castle. All the most immediately noticeable features that I think of when I remember the place. I don't want the same simplified environment we had 8 years ago due to technological limitations, I want it improved to match the environment in the new game whilst still retaining the features that made it stand out. It did that.

[AlanC9]

I think what it proves is Bioware doesn't really know or cannot decide on what the Qunari should look like.

Oh, you're just talking about the appearances? Well, in the case of DA:O, the engine couldn't handle the original concept art, which was much more like the DA2/DAI version.

As for the difference between DA2 qunari and DAI qunari, that's just a particular case of a general shift in art direction, isn't it?

[AlanC9]

Yes, because they could improve the landscape in the new Frostbite engine. It has the same mountain path down, the same windmills, the same castle. All the most immediately noticeable features that I think of when I remember the place. I don't want the same simplified environment we had 8 years ago due to technological limitations, I want it improved to match the environment in the new game whilst still retaining the features that made it stand out. It did that.

However, they do have a point that the basic terrain is differently shaped, and things are in different places.

Didn't bother me any more than it did in, say, the Ultima games. but YMMV.

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Rebooted? No. Brought back in line with what made DA:O so great? Yes.

[Riven326]

Oh, you're just talking about the appearances? Well, in the case of DA:O, the engine couldn't handle the original concept art, which was much more like the DA2/DAI version.

As for the difference between DA2 qunari and DAI qunari, that's just a particular case of a general shift in art direction, isn't it?

I don't think so. Given that the elves were also given a serious make over in DA2, and then reverted back to a more Origins-like appearance for Inquisition, leads me to believe Bioware doesn't have a vision for Dragon Age like they do for Mass Effect. All three Mass Effect games have artistic continuity while still having a certain artistic flavor to each game. There's nothing wrong with sequels having a different flavor, but when you start changing things that appear to be established in a very drastic way, it's going to disrupt continuity.

The Dragon Age games have little to no artistic continuity across all three games and don't even look like they're set in the same continent. Which is funny given how much Skyrim (and it's monumental sales first and foremost) influenced the development of Inquisition. It doesn't matter if you're playing Morrowind, Oblivion, or Skyrim, all three games manage to have their own flavor, which is based on the location where they take place, and still manage to have an art style that flows beautifuly over all three games. You can always tell that you're in a part of Tamriel.

[Marshal Moriarty]

I think Bioware could do themselves a power of good by abandoning all their ongoing series *for now* and letting them rest a bit. A new IP would be a much better way to reinvigorate old fans and welcome new fans into the fold. It gives the writers something new to focus on, and should help to clear their minds because they won;t have to be worrying about continuity and what the fans will think if they don't include this character or that plot thread, whilst also giving them an important goal they must succeed at (i.e selling a completely new idea).

 

Its a new gen. When last gen started, we didn't have Mass Effect or Dragon Age. It would be pretty sad if by the end of this gen (which is still years off of course), we still only had DA and ME. You may say there is plenty of time yet, but the next game is ME again. Frankly I'll believe in a new IP from Bioware when I see it.

[Andraste_Reborn]

Frankly I'll believe in a new IP from Bioware when I see it.

 

... so what is that you think Mary Kirby, Sheryl Chee, Brianne Battye, Sylvia Feketekuty, Jay Watamaniuk and all the other devs currently working on the New IP spend their work days doing?

 

I mean, games do get cancelled - it happened with Shadow Realms, it could happen again - but they clearly intend to develop at least one new IP.

[Joseph Warrick]

DAI is the only generic High Fantasy of the series. Hell, DA2 flirted with Low Fantasy.

 

Not a fan of the shift in tone from the first two games. Part of that was chasing Skyrim money. Game of Thrones making ASOIAF popular also interfered with the writers borrowing from that series as much.

 

Dragon Age borrowed from ASOIAF from the beginning, before GoT. The Grey Wardens take a lot from the Night's Watch. A lifetime oath taken by citizens of all backgrounds to protect the world from hordes of monsters; an isolated and neglected order. Duncan is Uncle Benjen, coming to town and helping you "take the black" as a way out when you get in deep trouble.

 

@OP:

A reboot wouldn't solve the problems you mentioned. The next game would be perfectly able to address them (if they make one). For example, I think they're happy with the art style they created this time. They'll probably settle for that for the most part. Inquisition looks very distinctive without being ugly.

 

I definitely think Dragon Age can do a lot more with its lore. In my opinion there's lots of interesting material to write more stories. It takes work to squeeze out the potential out of that lore and put it in a game. They did that partially in Inquisition with the ancient elves stuff. But there's heaps more.

[AlanC9]

I don't think so. Given that the elves were also given a serious make over in DA2, and then reverted back to a more Origins-like appearance for Inquisition, leads me to believe Bioware doesn't have a vision for Dragon Age like they do for Mass Effect. All three Mass Effect games have artistic continuity while still having a certain artistic flavor to each game. There's nothing wrong with sequels having a different flavor, but when you start changing things that appear to be established in a very drastic way, it's going to disrupt continuity.

You may be more invested in continuity than I am. I'm just interested in the game looking right. DA:O failed to convey the design intent and was awfully bland. DA2 was more distinctive, but too stylized for my taste. DAI was the best of the lot.

Given how DAO and DA2 looked, how should DAI have looked? Even if we say that DA2 was a mistake, that means.... what?

It doesn't matter if you're playing Morrowind, Oblivion, or Skyrim, all three games manage to have their own flavor, which is based on the location where they take place, and still manage to have an art style that flows beautifuly over all three games. You can always tell that you're in a part of Tamriel.

I didn't see that at all. Skyrim had a generic Nordic fantasy look. The races looked TES-like, but that's just because no other setting has Argonians and Khajit running around, or dark elves with those wacky red eyes.

[vbibbi]

I believe you can see the path to the castle, but it crosses a destroyed bridge. Don't ask me how we get there for IHW.

A wizard did it. Clearly.

 

 

Another thing I've just realized, yeah DAO Redcliffe was destroyed by darkspawn, but when it was rebuilt for DAI, it's significantly greener and more lively-looking. I get that Bio wanted to use the new engine to its fullest extent and don't fault them that. This is one of the story-vs-game medium conflicts. But shouldn't DAI be blighted, or at least not as green and lush as it is post-darkspawn? Unless the village isn't built directly on the site of the old one...

[Riven326]

You may be more invested in continuity than I am. I'm just interested in the game looking right. DA:O failed to convey the design intent and was awfully bland. DA2 was more distinctive, but too stylized for my taste. DAI was the best of the lot.

Given how DAO and DA2 looked, how should DAI have looked? Even if we say that DA2 was a mistake, that means.... what?

Am I? How would you feel if they decided to drastically change the look of the krogan or some other established race in Mass Effect?

It means that DA2 looked different (bad, IMO) but was obviously still not something they were happy with. It's clear that the artists at Bioware are having trouble deciding among themselves what Dragon Age should look like. With Inquisition I get the feeling that they told the art team to just make it look pretty and lush and I think they achieved that. But the game doesn't have a style, it's just pretty to look at. The new Mass Effect looks like Mass Effect even though it's running on a new graphics engine; it's still distinctive and easily recognizable and it runs on the same engine as Inquisition.

 

@OP:

A reboot wouldn't solve the problems you mentioned. The next game would be perfectly able to address them (if they make one). For example, I think they're happy with the art style they created this time. They'll probably settle for that for the most part. Inquisition looks very distinctive without being ugly.

In what way?

I would say that great art in a game should tell the history of a place without the player having to read a codex entry or a book in order to gain a sense of the history of the location that the player is in. The locations in Inquisition were only made to look pretty and I think they did that rather well. But there is no sense of history in the art, it looks and feels uninspired compared to other works.

I'll give you some visual examples.

 

Spoiler

 

[correctamundo]

Am I? How would you feel if they decided to drastically change the look of the krogan or some other established race in Mass Effect?

It means that DA2 looked different (bad, IMO) but was obviously still not something they were happy with. It's clear that the artists at Bioware are having trouble deciding among themselves what Dragon Age should look like. With Inquisition I get the feeling that they told the art team to just make it look pretty and lush and I think they achieved that. But the game doesn't have a style, it's just pretty to look at. The new Mass Effect looks like Mass Effect even though it's running on a new graphics engine; it's still distinctive and easily recognizable and it runs on the same engine as Inquisition.

 

In what way?

I would say that great art in a game should tell the history of a place without the player having to read a codex entry or a book in order to gain a sense of the history of the location that the player is in. The locations in Inquisition were only made to look pretty and I think they did that rather well. But there is no sense of history in the art, it looks and feels uninspired compared to other works.

I'll give you some visual examples.

 

Spoiler