Those are just internet jokes with very little hard truth to them.
Anyway, Andromeda won't go back to 90's RPGs. It will be a step foward, just like all three games were. Or at least tried to be.
I agree it won't it'll be a ME style story on the engine that powered DAI which is a good thing as I nevre found ME over complicated anyway even ME1 was relatively easy to figure out. Once I figured out the combat basics and all that. it was just a case of remembering to upgrade my equipment as I went.
Mass Effect is a sci-fi game, but what kind of game?
An RPG TPS. I thought this was obvious. The largest mechanical shift in the entire series was between 1 and 2, and even that didn't make the two utterly incomparable. Then, of course, ME3 did its best to re-implement certain lost RPG mechanics.
What kind of story? What kind of atmosphere?
These things can be quite fluid between entries in any series. Just look at Star Wars and Empire Strikes Back; both are from the same trilogy, but each have fairly different stories and atmospheres. In fact, I'd argue that a such changes are necessary for a successful sequel.
What separates Mass Effect from any other scifi setting?
The characters, the aesthetic, and the setting. I can show props from Star Trek and Mass Effect and people will be able to tell the difference between the two.
You're trying to split hairs for no reason. If I grabbed a random person and had them play a mission from each game, they would probably think that the games were sequels. If they didn't immediately pick up on the connection, then I still seriously doubt they would call me a liar if I told them they were all from the same series.
I would argue that we can avoid the Nashkel mines. BG does a great job of not forcing us to go there, and it doesn't even force on us the information that would lead us there. This is why BG was BioWare's best story - because the story was hidden from us until we went to find it.
For Nashkel mines it's true, but we are really forced to go to Nashkel city. Your companions, both Jaheira/Kalhid and Montaron/Xaar press you very hard in the early moments of the game. If I am not wrong there is also a game clock set at 10 days, after which your companions leave you if you don't bring them there. After the meeting with Nashkel's Mayor you are free and you can choose to explore every place as you wish, but at that point I would say that they have already set you on the story path, at least a little...
Interesting that your PnP experience doesn't involve a lot of headcanon.
The story (as opposed to the rules) is entirely in your head.
Alan kinda hit on this a bit. In PnP, you're visualizing the events in your head similar to a novel. In that sense, we could call it headcanon. But that also doesn't function as a carte blanche opportunity to add in whatever material I'd like.
Often times, the silent protagonist/top down view is used as a justification for certain concepts "I can role-play a coward" that would never work in pen and paper. Your DM might let you role-play a coward, but it doesn't involve the same mental effort necessary to make the coward concept work. The DM plays a critical role in tabletop that no computer (that I know of) has thus far been able to simulate.
For Nashkel mines it's true, but we are really forced to go to Nashkel city. Your companions, both Jaheira/Kalhid and Montaron/Xaar press you very hard in the early moments of the game. If I am not wrong there is also a game clock set at 10 days, after which your companions leave you if you don't bring them there. After the meeting with Nashkel's Mayor you are free and you can choose to explore every place as you wish, but at that point I would say that they have already set you on the story path, at least a little...
That wouldn't really be a barrier for Sylvius, from an in character stand point, he'd say he might not even have a reason to visit the Friendly Arm Inn.
I personally dislike Baldur's Gate's game design all the way through. But conceptually, it is closer to a sand box than every other Bioware game, with very little gated content. In a lot of ways, it's a world first and a plot/story second.
That was the generation of Love in game developing.
But it turns out that regardless we got better hardwares most of the content and work of video games are about the best possible graphical technologies, amazing soundtracks and CGI movies and much less time and work on the content we actually wan't to enjoy.
That wouldn't really be a barrier for Sylvius, from an in character stand point, he'd say he might not even have a reason to visit the Friendly Arm Inn.
Well that may be true.. but at this point, you could also choose, as a character, to not meet with Gorion and never leave CandleKeep 
For Nashkel mines it's true, but we are really forced to go to Nashkel city. Your companions, both Jaheira/Kalhid and Montaron/Xaar press you very hard in the early moments of the game. If I am not wrong there is also a game clock set at 10 days, after which your companions leave you if you don't bring them there. After the meeting with Nashkel's Mayor you are free and you can choose to explore every place as you wish, but at that point I would say that they have already set you on the story path, at least a little...
To play devil's advocate, that's only the companions pressuring you to go to Nashkel. You yourself don't have to go. It will just mean you'll be travelling just with Imoen longer, until you find others. Which will make the early game that much more challenging
Personally I find most of the gameplay mechanics of the old school RPGs to be incredibly clunky and annoying to use.
So I'd say that has improved with time.
That kind of has nothing to do with what I said. I said the older games were better because of the "everything," not "everything was better."
BG > NWN > DA
You can apply this to similar other franchises.
Morrowind > Oblivion > Skyrim
Fallout 2 > Fallout 3
And so on down the line. Not without exception, but often, and in the case of Bioware?
Here is how it goes with Bioware after DA, I'm using >> to mean much greater than, >>> much much greater than, etc.
DA1 >>>>>>>>>> SWTOR/Sonic/SWTOR add-ons/Strongholds>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DA:I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> KOTOR/JE/ME1/ME2/ME3/Throne of Bhaal/pretty much every Bioware DLC ever made/Knights of the Fallen Empire
Ok, I was getting a little silly with the symbols, but I mean it's hard as a hardcore gameplayer to gel the fact that these are often just not as much fun, more casual, etc, particularly in the case of Bioware which went very strongly in that direction.... but..... yeah.
To play devil's advocate, that's only the companions pressuring you to go to Nashkel. You yourself don't have to go. It will just mean you'll be travelling just with Imoen longer, until you find others. Which will make the early game that much more challenging
Of course you are right .What I was trying to say is that, somehow, they try to set you a little into the story path. After that you are free to decide whether to follow it or not, but the hint (and the aim at the feeling of urge) is still there...
Of course you are right .What I was trying to say is that, somehow, they try to set you a little into the story path. After that you are free to decide whether to follow it or not, but the hint (and the aim at the feeling of urge) is still there...
Sure. If you're going to buy an rpg (unless it's an absolute sandbox without a central story at all), the assumption is that you're going to want to play the story, even if you may want a lot of freedom in how and why your character gets involved in it. So of course the game is going to want to nudge you in that direction.
Sarevok would have to willing to join up with you for that first one to work.
But that we can't ignore Irenicus is a huge problem with BG2. BG2 doesn't let us do anything that doesn't follow the path BioWare laid out for us. Imagine how different BG2 would be if we could explore it freely, without having all of the areas gated by quest-givers.
I would argue that we can avoid the Nashkel mines. BG does a great job of not forcing us to go there, and it doesn't even force on us the information that would lead us there. This is why BG was BioWare's best story - because the story was hidden from us until we went to find it.
Your Revan example misses the point. KotOR does give us those divergent outcomes. We can react the the Revan discovery pretty much however we want. We can have it influence our character design or not, as we see fit. Really, what I'm asking for is NWN's character creation, BG's story structure (or DA2's, which was nearly as good), and KotOR's divergent endings.
Why does no one cite Arena when making these comparisons? Or the original Might & Magic? Or AutoDuel? Or any of the CRPGs that just dropped you in the world with little or no guidance.
Those limits you describe are much harder to see if we're not explicitly told what to do.
Same reason I can mention Ultima and Alkabeth, or Daggerfall and Goldbox games, it's roughly the same in different beats.
In the end, those comparisons are roughtly the same with different beats.Regardless, the limits are there in Might and Magic and AutoDuel and the like, some older games arguably hide it better though I will say.
Those are just internet jokes with very little hard truth to them.
Anyway, Andromeda won't go back to 90's RPGs. It will be a step foward, just like all three games were. Or at least tried to be.
i agree, for me too, the new rpgs are a step forward.
What are a thousand opinions that "I think X is better" against the actual truth that X is worse though?
Nothing, ultimately.
What are a thousand opinions that "I think X is better" against the actual truth that X is worse though?
Nothing, ultimately.
but what u saying is a opinion too. Something isnt just better bc someone say it. Or a review say it. At the end of the day everyone make thier own mind about what they like or no.
And the change on the RPG, and on games in general is base on Marketing, and how u can reach a bigger audience target.
but what u saying is a opinion too. Something isnt just better bc someone say it. Or a review say it. At the end of the day everyone make thier own mind about what they like or no.
And the change on the RPG, and on games in general is base on Marketing, and how u can reach a bigger audience target.
Where did I say "I think?" I intentionally did not say "I think" because it's not what I think, it's plain as day to anyone who has actually played a lot of these games that in general the quality has declined.
Saying what I said was "opinion" is just severe mischaracterization and effectively censorship, which is well... not good.
Moreover it's declined so severely in recent times as to not even really be able to stand on it's own, at this rate they'll just be eaten up by other companies that make better games now, even though they formerly were not capable of making necessarily as great games (such as Blizzard)
It's not an opinion, your attempt to label it as such is just bad.
Where did I say "I think?" I intentionally did not say "I think" because it's not what I think, it's plain as day to anyone who has actually played a lot of these games that the quality has declined.
LOL im not trying to label it as one. But u cant come and say that what i write is a plain fact bc u said it. Is that simple.
LOL im not trying to label it as one. But u cant come and say that what i write is a plain fact bc u said it. Is that simple.
I'm sorry, I don't understand what you just said, sorry.
Anyway, I'm just saying, there are a lot of "opinions" here, and most of them are "wrong."
I'm sorry, I don't understand what you just said, sorry.
Anyway, I'm just saying, there are a lot of "opinions" here, and most of them are "wrong."
what i was trying to said is, that bc u think older RPG are better that the new ones, dont make it a fact. Is just your way to see it. I know alot of ppl that cant play 1 hour of Baldur Gate w/o getting bored.
U said the quality have go down?? on what part? Story wise? maybe, depend how u see. RP elements, maybe. World design, i doubt it. Mechanics, again i doubt it.
Well that may be true.. but at this point, you could also choose, as a character, to not meet with Gorion and never leave CandleKeep
Where did I say "I think?" I intentionally did not say "I think" because it's not what I think, it's plain as day to anyone who has actually played a lot of these games that the quality has declined.
It is? News to me, and my first CRPG was Starflight.
Was that good? I never played it.
I already said, often, not always. In fact, my mini-chart said as such, but I'll edit it to say "generally" because that's more clear. Would assume it's obvious I'm not talking about literally everything.
In fact, as stated before, KOTOR was the first of the pretty bad games by Bioware, which came out all the way back in 2003 or something...
what i was trying to said is, that bc u think older RPG are better that the new ones, dont make it a fact. Is just your way to see it. I know alot of ppl that cant play 1 hour of Baldur Gate w/o getting bored.
U said the quality have go down?? on what part? Story wise? maybe, depend how u see. RP elements, maybe. World design, i doubt it. Mechanics, again i doubt it.
This is more just pure censorship essentially, I never said "think" or "I" you just take my statements and re-constitute to fuel what you want to see, which is well... not good... it's very common here unfortunately.
Retour en haut
