156 réponses à ce sujet

[ZipZap2000]

Are we allowed to agree that inquisition did thing better than mass effect, while also agreeing mass effect is a better franchise?

I want to be on that team.

[Farci Reprimer]

This is very valid issue here but you people do understand that "auto-dialogue" is to some extend necessary to keep the gameplay and story flowing.

 

Imagine how tedious it could be in a long run if game would keep asking you every other second what type of response your character would give to different situations.

[Karlone123]

This is very valid issue here but you people do understand that "auto-dialogue" is to some extend necessary to keep the gameplay and story flowing.

 

Imagine how tedious it could be in a long run if game would keep asking you every other second what type of response your character would give to different situations.

 

We are not all against auto-dialogue being used in a sensible capacity. It just seemed that it was used excessively in ME3 and Bioware had too much of a reliance on it to the point we felt no longer part of the conversation. I am all good for auto-dialogue being used in a smart fashion, but not to the point where the character assumes its own agenda and says things we would rather say different to.

[wright1978]

This is very valid issue here but you people do understand that "auto-dialogue" is to some extend necessary to keep the gameplay and story flowing.
 
Imagine how tedious it could be in a long run if game would keep asking you every other second what type of response your character would give to different situations.

I personally don't see anything tedious in picking responses. I accept though that me1/2 levels of inoffensive neutral dialogue may be simpler for them to implement where choice is less vital and auto-dialogue won't inherently puncture the immersion of roleplaying.

[Midnight Bliss]

Are we allowed to agree that inquisition did thing better than mass effect, while also agreeing mass effect is a better franchise?

I want to be on that team.

I can't really think of anything Inquisition did better than Mass Effect.

[Shechinah]

In my opinion, the problem is less the existence of auto-dialogue and more when auto-dialogue has a set tone, a set opinion and a set morality.

 

According to my observations, there has always been auto-dialogue present in the Mass Effect series. It tended, however, to be a case of the former and so not as noticeable while in the third game, it became noticeable because it tended to be a case of the the latter. This kind of auto-dialogue directly interfers with the roleplaying aspect of the franchise and creates character inconsistency.

[Andrew Lucas]

Longevity does help with the icon status though.

If it's bad, then it doesn't.

[KaiserShep]

This is very valid issue here but you people do understand that "auto-dialogue" is to some extend necessary to keep the gameplay and story flowing.

 

Imagine how tedious it could be in a long run if game would keep asking you every other second what type of response your character would give to different situations.

 

Sure, autodialogue serves well to keep the flow of the dialogue, but that's not really the problem. 

The real problem is the content. When a character is speaking automatically in response to something, I greatly prefer that this remain neutral, and not express a certain belief or convey certain emotions (within reason, as I understand that facial expressions and such are needed for cut scenes). When Shepard tells Garrus "It's damn good to have you back" in his first dialogue aboard the Normandy in ME3, I see no reason why this couldn't have been tied to a specific dialogue option rather than it being the only way to end that conversation. I like Garrus so this doesn't bother me, but it's one of those things where the game fixes the character dynamic for you and you can't change things up except to simply never talk to that character at all (like, instead of always saying that to Garrus, Shepard could say something to the effect of "Now let's get to work.")

[GreyLycanTrope]

If it's bad, then it doesn't.

Yeah it can actually, more time with a character means the writers have more time to develop and improve on said character and the audiance had more time to get attached.

[Sylvius the Mad]

People raved about Fallout's dialogue system in 4. And to be honest, while I've had fun with FO4, my least favorite part of the game was entering dialogue. In order to be successful you need to spend points in Charisma ? No thank you.

Yes, please. More stat-driven mechanics.

And FO4's dialogue wheel is moddable. Don't like paraphrases? There's a mod for that. Don't like the voiced protagonist? There's a mod for that.

[Sylvius the Mad]

This is very valid issue here but you people do understand that "auto-dialogue" is to some extend necessary to keep the gameplay and story flowing.

Imagine how tedious it could be in a long run if game would keep asking you every other second what type of response your character would give to different situations.

That's not tedious. That's roleplaying.

I'm making thise decisions anyway, deciding how my character interprets the things she sees, moment to moment. I would love it if the game actually cared about that rather than actively trying to contradict me in every conversation.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Yeah it can actually, more time with a character means the writers have more time to develop and improve on said character and the audiance had more time to get attached.

If I don't get to play the character, I'm not going to get attached.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I can't really think of anything Inquisition did better than Mass Effect.

How about every single thing?

No, wait, the Mako was better than the horse.

But that's it.

[SlottsMachine]

So is this like the new feud on the BioWare forums (Mass Effect vs Dragon Age)? CDPR vs BioWare was getting kind of stale I guess. 

[KaiserShep]

How about every single thing?

No, wait, the Mako was better than the horse.

But that's it.

 

 

Don't ever change, Sylvius. 

[Shechinah]

That's not tedious. That's roleplaying.

I'm making thise decisions anyway, deciding how my character interprets the things she sees, moment to moment. I would love it if the game actually cared about that rather than actively trying to contradict me in every conversation.

 

I'm one of the people that'd love for the game to ask me to select a dialogue response to everything in every situation. It could be down to the seemingly tedious such as whether or not my character wanted a beverage or what they wanted for dinner and I'd still love for it to happen.

 

I do not expect it because I know the odds of seeing it implemented successfully are very miniscule for  a variety of reasons. 

 

It is for the same reasons I can understand why auto-dialogue is necessary. I do not, however, consider auto-dialogue with a set tone, opinion or morality to be necessary in a game when a feature of said game is establishing and roleplaying a character through dialogue options especially since such auto-dialogue is often detrimental to this feature.
 

[Shechinah]

Related to my criticisms about auto-dialogue with a set item and my opinion about how it interfers with characerization by causing character inconsistency is auto-action with a set item.

 

The mandatory hug with Liara on Illium during Mass Effect 2 is an example of an auto-action that I dislike as it assumes a set relationship value between characters which can contradict relationship value and characterization established in and allowed by the prior game thereby creating an out-of-character moment that is very, very apparent. 

[Andrew Lucas]

Yeah it can actually, more time with a character means the writers have more time to develop and improve on said character and the audiance had more time to get attached.

That was never the point. You said Shepard is iconic because he/she had three games, but also that such accomplishment could be either be good or bad.

Make your mind.

[SlottsMachine]

Well seeing as Shepard is about as interesting as drying paint obviously his/her popularity is heavily influenced by having a trilogy about them.  Same goes for Master Chief from Halo, dude has zero personality but he's iconic all the same. 

[In Exile]

That's not tedious. That's roleplaying.

I'm making thise decisions anyway, deciding how my character interprets the things she sees, moment to moment. I would love it if the game actually cared about that rather than actively trying to contradict me in every conversation.

 

That's not how the game works, however. Because you don't actually get character-specific information - you get character independent meta-information. 

[GreyLycanTrope]

That was never the point. You said Shepard is iconic because he/she had three games, but also that such accomplishment could be either be good or bad.

Make your mind.

It is what I said. That's part of why Shepard is iconic.

[Sylvius the Mad]

That's not how the game works, however. Because you don't actually get character-specific information - you get character independent meta-information.

I don't follow.

[aoibhealfae]

Well seeing as Shepard is about as interesting as drying paint obviously his/her popularity is heavily influenced by having a trilogy about them.  Same goes for Master Chief from Halo, dude has zero personality but he's iconic all the same. 

 

I could say BroShep is dull but FemShep being uninteresting in the whole trilogy? The same person who prefer to wear lace instead of camo-printed underpants. Who stare murderously at people who call her a stripper? Who always give an adorable smile when she accomplish something that made her proud... why do I get the feeling that I'm playing a different game than everyone...

[Pearl (rip bioware)]

Minimal auto-dialogue involving the player character, but there needs to be quite a bit between squadmates, and characters so the world doesn't feel stale. Also, death to the Dialogue Wheel™.

[GaroTD]

I think Shepard acted out of character for me once in one of the Aria missions in 3. He just killed 2 Batarians and gave 0 fucks.