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[daveliam]

Hey all:

I thought it might be neat to have a thread that discusses some of the non-Bioware games that offer romance -- what with this being the "Romance Defense Force" and all....

 

I'm always looking for games that offer it, since I tend to enjoy that content.  Personally, I really am only interested in ones that offer s/s options, but I always enjoy reading about other games (past or present) that offer it too.

 

I thought I'd start by delving back about 25 years and focusing on the very first game that I ever played that gave me a choice in my 'love interest'.

 

 

I wore this game out when it first came out in the 90's.  I'm a bit older than some of the youngin's on the board, so when this first came out, I was in middle school.  I actually put it on lay-away and made payments every week from money that I earned doing odd-jobs. 

 

If you aren't familiar with it, it's widely considered as the worst addition to the Phantasy Star series (comparable with Halloween III in the fact that it's not directly related to the main series story arc).  But, if you ask me, I think those people are fools and it's amazing.  The game spans three generations of characters.  At the end of each generation, your hero (always a guy) chooses a marriage partner (always a girl) and then the story picks up with your child(ren) in the next generation.  So, since this happens over three generations, there are a total of four final generation characters that you can play as.

 

The story isn't necessarily terribly exciting or innovative and, despite the appearance of choice through the first and second generation, it all bottlenecks back into the same story in the third generation.  But I seriously spent hundreds of hours playing this game in the early '90's and I do think that the generational game design was super innovative for the time.  It's been done since then (like in the Record of Agarest War series), but this was done first, so it will always have a special place in my heart.

 

My personal favorite (and 'canon') story was:

• First generation - Rhys (blue haired warrior prince) marries Maia (blue haired princess and cliche damsel in distress)
• Second generation - Ayn (blue haired warrior/mage) marries Sari (brunette warrior woman and over-powered character)
• Third generation - Crys (goldenish hair - warrior with support magic) is the hero

 

But I suspect the actual 'canon' would be (since it's the only one where you maintain the throne of Landen for all three generations):

• First generation - Rhys (blue haired warrior prince) marries Lena (brunette dual wield rogue princess)
• Second generation - Nial (brunette warrior prince) marries Laya (blonde ancient mage/archer)
• Third generation - Adan (blond warrior/mage with forehead jewel) and Gwyn (blonde mage archer and only daughter in the series) are the heroes

 

 

Anyway, what other games have you played or are you excited to play that feature romance options in them?

[Biotic Apostate]

I'm sorry, but I'm gonna continue the gay angle. I'm also interested only in m/m romances, so my list is pretty small.

 

The first game I'm going to mention is The Sims. Yep, the first one. The relationships in those games are basic, and the mechanics are pretty transparent, but it was kind of big in 2000, when it came out. I didn't have a console after the Famicom (or better known as the NES), so I missed games like Final Fantasy.

 

Anyway, I started playing, created a big new family and planned out how to pair them. I began to raise their friendship level, so most of them would like each other. And then, suddenly, I got the flirt option for two male characters. Stunned, I selected it, one thing lead to another, and they were in a relationship. Honestly, that was so unexpected, I felt like I was doing something illegal. And I should mention this was outside of the US, gay people were non-existent in the popular media at the time.

 

The second game is Fable. I know many people disliked the game, in many cases because of the outlandish promises (trees grow in real time!), but I never got much of it. The romances are shallow, but that was really the point. Again, you get to romance either gender, which is a big plus. The game itself is a very light take on a fantasy setting. It never really takes itself seriously, it's filled with Monty Python style comedy, and the romances adhere to it. They involve saying "Hey" seductively a few times and buying gifts, nothing complicated, but they are very lighthearted and the approach was pleasantly relaxed. And you can get a royal wedding with a co-op buddy in Fable 3!

 

I should also mention Fallout 4. Speaking strictly about romances, it was a quite good effort. There are some inconsistencies and usual Bethesda errors, but generally, the game gives you a nice selection of romanceable companions, open to both genders. Of course I ended up liking the guy, whose story was dropped in the middle, but that's just my luck.

 

Edit:

Also, Kian Alvane from Dreamfall (awesome adventure game) and Dreamfall Chapters (yet to play, but he steps up to the role of the protagonist) is gay?! First, I won a 2006 bet, and second, I have to finally play it!

[HuldraDancer]

Well jeez I feel pretty bad not having one that offers s/s options available in it though one was suppose to and it was taken out in the American localized version. *shakes fist in air*

 

Harvest Moon was probably the first game I recall playing where it had romance in the sense that you could pick who you wanted to be with. 'HM A Wonderful Life' was my first introduction into it which led to many more Harvest Moon games and eventually Rune Factory games which always were a little odd in retrospect with some of the romances. For example one of my favorite in the bunch 'Tides of Destiny' has a character that was born female but lives as a male (I'm not sure I would call them trans) if you play as a female character you never find out and they continue to live as male if you play a male character you find out and they start to live as female and you are allowed to court them. Theres another one where if you play as a boy you can 'date' twins at the same time but in that defense in that game you are like 7 so it's not really dating at all just kids being adorable.

 

Anyway Rune Factory rant aside Harvest Moon was my first intro into games with romances in them and oddly enough kind of helped me ease into my sexuality in a small way without my knowing there was really anything besides being straight at that point.  The romances are pretty shallow in some ways you just give gifts till love but you also get cute little cut scenes at certain amounts of hearts and in some games you actually get a gift back or go on dates with them which is a nice touch I enjoy but I'm a sucker for these games and I seriously hope that an eventual release comes out with s/s options but I sadly doubt it.

 

Darn you localized version I was ready for my farmer to get married to the princess of her dreams you cold bastards *shakes fits into sky*

[Lady Artifice]

So my first experience with optional romances in an rpg was with Fable 3. Ah, Elliot and Elise. They didn't have a lot of personality, but they were both pretty and compassionate, so that was something. They were also the only characters in the game that had something even close to believable chemistry with the protagonist. 

 

What was annoying was that to proceed with those romances to the end of the game, you had to make two significant choices that were arguably the more selfish of your options. 

 

I did it anyway, of course. It was one of the few ways to allow the protagonist a story with much emotion to it. 

 

---

 

My only other context for non-bioware rpgs that offer romances--or something resembling--are Bethesda and The Witcher. 

 

In Skyrim, I liked Marcurio best. His cocky reassurances when we searched underground areas was slightly charming, but then meeting characters like Serana in the dawnguard DLC just made the whole awful marriage mechanic more frustrating, because it showed that they're capable of making multidimensional characters who have chemistry with the PC, but instead of allowing for something more to develop with those characters, they scatter a bunch of flat characters around the map and let you recruit one of them as your live in money machine. 

 

In the Witcher 3, I did like the Geralt/Yennefer story, but I wasn't invested in it the way I am with player characters that I have a more personal chance of relating to. 

 

In Fallout 4, I went with Danse. He had a moderately interesting story arc, plus several moments that made me genuinely feel for the character. Also, he has a nice voice and character model. However, he also has the firmly principled, rigid boy scout thing. This wouldn't really be a problem, if 1. his principles were ones that I find more sympathetic, and 2. I had the option of openly disagreeing with him while still pursuing a relationship. 

 

Now, I get why 2 wouldn't really be feasible with Danse. I'm just indulging a small fantasy of being to play the Catwoman to an LIs Batman. I dig it when opposites attract in fiction. If I had somehow been able to proceed with his character arc without signing myself up with the BoS and proceeding so far into that story arc, I would have been pretty happy. 

 

---

 

Speaking of which, there is one other game series that flirts with romance content, and I love it. The Arkham series has Batman x Catwoman and Batman x Talia. There are also hints of Batman x Vicki Vale. 

 

Batman x Catwoman forever. 

[HuldraDancer]

This probably shouldn't count but I'd like to talk about it since it was the first game I ever came across with an s/s romance option. When I was younger I stumbled on a few really adorable sim date style games, they had a simple art style that was very adorable to me so I played the hell out of them. One of the first I ever tried (and I feel awful for not remembering the name of it) there was an s/s option for you and one option that you could never get with at all no matter how much you raised his affection however he was an option in the male version of that game and I've always found that kind of neat that he's in both male and female versions but he's also gay in both of them. Now I must stop talking before I go further into my shame and go on a ramble on just how much I played those cutesy ones or start going on about my favorites.

[Biotic Apostate]

In Fallout 4, I went with Danse. He had a moderately interesting story arc, plus several moments that made me genuinely feel for the character. Also, he has a nice voice and character model. However, he also has the firmly principled, rigid boy scout thing. This wouldn't really be a problem, if 1. his principles were ones that I find more sympathetic, and 2. I had the option of openly disagreeing with him while still pursuing a relationship. 

 

Now, I get why 2 wouldn't really be feasible with Danse. I'm just indulging a small fantasy of being to play the Catwoman to an LIs Batman. I dig it when opposites attract in fiction. If I had somehow been able to proceed with his character arc without signing myself up with the BoS and proceeding so far into that story arc, I would have been pretty happy. 

Yeah the marriage mechanic was very frustrating in Skyrim.

 

Concerning Danse, his story arc was very good, but dropped in the middle. The big reveal gave a chance for character growth, and to see him become more accepting. Calling him out on some of his views, while still romancing him would have made much sense. If by his principles you mean, for example, his attitude towards ghouls, then the game gave plenty reason to think he was more sympathetic than he appeared. You get [Danse disliked that] every time you are rude to a ghoul (kid in the fridge, Kent, Arlen Glass, and more), and you get plus points for helping them. He is basically a good person, who got charmed by the whole idea of having a family (which is what the brotherhood presents itself to its loyal members), and the harsh views were a strict requirement if you want to belong.

 

I basically get to a point with the brotherhood to get his quest, see my character as frustrated with the BOS and that mission being the last straw, and flock to the Minutemen. Plus Danse is precious in a romance, and during the game he shows he has a sense of humor (very dry, but it's there).

 

(you can guess that I enjoyed his romance in any case, sorry for the highjack)

[SardaukarElite]

Sunless Sea has possibly the most interesting use of romance options I've seen because it ties them in to the core mechanics. In the 1800s London was stolen by bats (yes, I know) and now it's underground on the edge of a vast, unlit, Lovecraftian sea (called the Zee for some reason). The game is  basically Sid Meier's Pirates!, mixed with a heap of interactive fiction. You play as a Zee captain who ventures out from London  to do odd jobs and earn a living, while out in the dark you accumulate a stat called terror, and as that gets higher, bad, weird things start to happen. At 100, bad, terminal, weird things happen. This creates a cycle were you go out do missions, trade and so on, but consume supplies and gain terror, you return to London to resupply, refit, upgrade, take missions and try and lower your terror.

 

Anyway, in London, you can carouse and have a chance to meet the Likely Lass or Dapper Chap (no characters are named, it's a thing) and start a relationship. The relationship has various little (fairly minimalist) story beats, but the key thing is that it lowers terror, and thus it ties into the whole feeling of the game's main cycle. There's also officers you can brief liaisons with at Zee, which are supposed to have consequences with the love in London.

 

---

 

Wing Commander 3 and 4 are supposed to let you choose who FMV Mark Hamil romances, though I apparently missed it in both. 

[Aesa]

The last game I played with romance options was Fallout 4. I chose Pipes 'cause I love her honesty and selflessness, as well as the way the glitches make her seem like an incredibly awkward and clumsy person. She's always falling down staircases, getting stuck in weird places, sitting on invisible chairs, and starting personal conversations in the middle of combat. It's kind of adorable.

 

Life is Strange technically has two romance options, but in my heart Chloe & Max are canon and anything else is simply wrong.

[HuldraDancer]

Again not sure if this counts but it has such an odd way of doing 'romances' that I'd like to talk about it, it's 'Inuyahsa The Secret of the Cursed Mask'  you play a new character get to pick between being a boy or girl to go through the game and in the game they have little points where your character and the group rests and you get to pick who you want to hang out with for a while, the more you hang out with one person the more special attacks you unlock so if you want all of combined special attacks for a certain character you have to always choose to hang out with them.

 

If you are say playing as Male and always hang out with Sango then your character gets the hots for her and her love interest in the show gets a little grumbly and slightly jealous. Throughout the game whenever you do that though it is very much said a lot that it is entirely one sided the other character is oblivious to your feelings for them and if I recall correctly even get a scene or two with their actual love interest because of your character falling for them. Even at the end of the game if you went down that road you confess how you feel and that's it, there's nothing given back (though to be fair due to circumstances they don't actually have time to reject you)

 

I always found that kind of odd, not that you don't get your characters feelings returned but that your character just falls for anyone of age of the opposite sex that you hang out with a lot. Though I did like that the hang out with them dialog did change depending on what gender you played as, and I did find it amusing that if you found little hidden scenes you could get a hidden 'LI' as well (though as far as I know they are only available to the female pc, I haven't tried with a male pc)

 

Anyway I always thought that was interesting but odd that you character can fall in love with other characters but you never get them because they always have feelings for someone else (barring the 'hidden LI' in certain parts of that) and can't say I've played a game that did that other than this one. Though if one exists I would be very interested to know about it.

[Steelcan]

Do you want illicit love between a duchess and her bodyguard?  Do you want illegal love between two catholic priests? Do you want to bang all your daughters in law to ensure your grandchildren have the right stuff?  Do you want to live out your inner Lannister fantasies?  Do you want to take slaves and either make them concubines or sacrifice them in blood rituals to the Old Gods?  All of this and more is possible with one of my personal favorite games of all time.

 

[karushna5]

Winterwolves is a game company I cannot praise enough. They were inspired by bioware and do VNs and RPGs  most of which allow both genders and same sex options for romance.

 

Loren the amazon is their most famous game, but this company seriously sates my bioware itch inbetween games.

[Undead Han]

Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura

 

It is one of the earliest RPGs I can remember where there were romance subplots. Like Bioware games it was party-based, and some of the recruitable companions could be love interests for the main character. 

 

On a side note....I'd love for either Bioware or CD Projekt Red to pick up that IP and make a sequel out of it. It had one of the more interesting settings of a fantasy-based RPG, but Troika Games went under before it could ever expand on it in a sequel.

 

Setting:

 

Spoiler

Arcanum is the name of the fantasy world in which the game unfolds. It consists of a continental mainland and three islands.  The world is inhabited by various races resembling those from the works of Tolkien, including humans, elves and half-elves, dwarves, gnomes, halflings, orcs, ogres, and various wildlife. Players can choose from humans, elves, dwarves, gnomes, halflings, and human hybrid races, including half-elves, half-orcs and half-ogres as playable races. The continent is divided between several different political entities. The Unified Kingdom is rapidly industrializing. Its two largest cities are Tarant and Ashbury, and it is the most technologically advanced kingdom. The Kingdom of Cumbria is a deteriorated kingdom, consisting of Dernholm and Black Root, and ruled by an old conservative king. The Kingdom of Arland, extending from Caladon to Roseborough, is a small but thriving monarchy west of the Stonewall range. The Glimmering Forest, the largest in Arcanum, is home to the elven city of Qintarra and the dark elven city of T'sen-Ang, and has been untouched by the technological advancements of the time. The Stonewall and Grey Mountain Ranges are home to the remaining dwarven clans: the Black Mountain Clan, the Stonecutter Clan, the Wheel Clan, and the Iron Clan. Many other minor settlements also exist, as well as containing ruins of past civilizations. The biggest of these is the ruins of Vendigroth, the most advanced city on Arcanum, which met a sudden and mysterious end.

 

An important in-game dynamic is the dichotomy of magic and technology in the world. Technology is explained to function by using physical law to produce a desired result, e.g., a bolt of electricity from a Tesla Gun would arc through the most conductive path to its target, with some plated armors being more prone to electrical damage than others. Magic, on the other hand, is explained to manipulate physical law to make a lightning spell follow the shortest path to the target, instead of the natural path. The two are incompatible to the point that they overwhelm each other. Technological devices will become ineffective or even permanently inoperative in the presence of powerful magic and vice versa. Much of the population has chosen to embrace technology for its efficiency, accessibility, and permanent results. The elves, dark elves, and some humans continue to practice magic exclusively. This also affects interactions between different characters, as spells cast on technologists or firearms used against mages have a failure rate.

 

Orcs and ogres are looked down upon as savage, feral peoples by Arcanum's civilized folk, who own virtually all the industry of the major population centers. There is a great enmity between elves and dwarfs, the former being naturally inclined towards magically-defined society, the latter being forerunners of the technology race—and many elves blame the dwarfs for the rise of human technology and concomitant waning of elfish political power. Scientists are unwelcome in magical societies like Qintarra or Tulla but will be respected if they are righteous and good folk. Conversely, a mage would be admitted onto a steam train only on the provision that he take a third-class seat on the last caboose, so as not to cause interference with the engine (despite there being no in-game mechanic by which even the powerful mages can affect it). Powerful mages may be denied transport altogether.

 

Plot: 

 

Spoiler

Arcanum begins with a cut scene of the IFS Zephyr, a luxury zeppelin, on her maiden voyage from Caladon to Tarant. Two monoplanes, piloted by Half-Ogre bandits, close in on the craft and commence attack runs, succeeding in shooting it down. An old gnome who is a passenger aboard the Zephyr is now in his death throes under charred debris and tells the player to bring a silver ring to "the boy," and promptly dies. Being the only survivor of the crash, the main character is proclaimed as "The Living One," a holy reincarnate, by the only witness to the crash, Virgil. The story follows the player's path as he searches for the origin of the ring. Over the course of the game, the player uncovers more about the history of the continent, the motivation of the assassins who are trying to kill him, and the identity of the one threatening to end all life in the land.

 

Arcanum is an example of a non-linear role-playing game. At various points throughout the game, players may take the story in different directions, sometimes permanently removing different paths of action. The game's central quest ultimately develops according to how players navigate its dichotomies, the most apparent being that of magic and technology. Many of the game's side quests allow for more than one solution depending on the player character's specializations and certain portions of the main quest can be solved more easily through dialogue than through combat. The game's magic/technology and good/evil alignments also influence what followers a character can attract throughout the game or how other NPCs will react to the player.

 

One thing not mentioned that I thought was interesting about the setting, is that while there are barbarian orc tribes out in the wilds, some orcs and half-orcs had moved into the cities and become a sort of underclass that works in human or dwarf owned factories. They're exploited by 19th Century style robber barons, and the struggle between labor and the factory owners is also a big part of the lore. One of the side quests involved helping half-orc factory workers organize a Union. 

 

Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura

 

The elf woman on the cover was one of the LIs.

[HuldraDancer]

Winterwolves is a game company I cannot praise enough. They were inspired by bioware and do VNs and RPGs  most of which allow both genders and same sex options for romance.

 

Loren the amazon is their most famous game, but this company seriously sates my bioware itch inbetween games.

 

Just checked out and bought Loren The Amazon today though silly pop up that wont go away kind of making playing the game annoying but the tiny bit I've seen so far does have my interests.

 

EDIT: Well got that fixed can't wait to dive into the game proper now

[karushna5]

Happy to hear that, its pretty fun if a lot more simple than what we are used to.

 

Even coming out with a game in march with 3 main (female) characters with 6 romance interests, 3 guys and 3 girls each sister has 4 options and has a lot of leeway. Its called Queen of Thieves

 

Making an all gay game and an all lesbian game. Heirs And Graces  and Summer In Trigue respectively.

 

Season of the Wolf is much more combat focused with only 2 romance intrest for each gender but better written.

 

They have a sci fi game Planet Stronghold 1 was made by one person and shows it, but Planet Stronghold Colonial Defense is pretty funny with lots of gaming references and 4 unique romances for each gender. Don't need the first one at all sense it came is a prequel.

 

Their best game VN wise is Roomates. Not much options as gay or lesbian but very well written and funny. You play Max (a guy about his band) or Anne (A serious student looking for more out of school) The cool thing is even after you pick one the other character is romanceable and a full time NPC. 

 

Basically I think if you are looking for romance of the Bioware persuasion, he has a lot of options.

[HuldraDancer]

@karushna5

 

Been playing the Loren one more and my goodness thank you heartily for mentioning this game in the thread I've been enjoying it quite a bit! Despite my own lack of knowing making me get stuck in a few places I really love this game thus far.

 

 

 

 

(Sorry for the off topic posts OP)

[Panda]

In terms of games already mentioned I really like Fallout 4's romances. They aren't as good as Bioware's, there is no really skinship, but you get lot of options and I really like how different characters you can romance are. And there is even non-human options: Ghoul and Al!

 

In terms of games not mentioned Saint Row 4 kinda has romances. You get mostly funny, but sometimes quite sweet scene between your character and LI, but this doesn't lock your romance in any way and romance doesn't go outside of that one scene (that you can repeat though). You can also romance almost everyone in your team without anyone mentioning it. Still, it's quite nice to have this option and all the romances are available for both genders as well.

 

 

Gat's was sweetest to me and Matt's funniest ^^;

[HuldraDancer]

Haven't gotten a chance to actually play this game yet but I am interested in getting it, Stardew Valley, from my understanding it's akin to Harvest Moon games, you get a farm make connections to people and what not with some added things. While looking into the eligible marriage candidates today out of curiosity I found out that all 10 choices are available to both genders. Something I've been wanting in my HM games for a while now. I'm looking forward to eventually getting this steam game.

[vertigomez]

Stretching the definition of romance, but in Vampire: the Masquerade - Bloodlines you can receive cheesy love letters from Velvet Velour if you do right by her, and your ghoul Heather Poe is supernaturally infatuated with you. It's actually really skeevy and dark (or maybe the one light in your morally repugnant existence, depending on how you play your character!), but also sexy. Because vampires.

There are several other encounters, but they're mostly just literal necking, sex, or flirting to get blood or information. I'd say the flirts are mostly f/f, then m/f, followed by, like, three or four flirt opportunities for guy characters who're into guys.

At one point I got rejected by a necrophiliac and my ego has never recovered.

Oh! And there are several background NPC relationships, like Pisha and... Pisha, Isaac and Ash's daddy issue laden love affair, Lily and E... it's all good fun. And by fun I mean schadenfreude.

[Donk]

Haven't gotten a chance to actually play this game yet but I am interested in getting it, Stardew Valley, from my understanding it's akin to Harvest Moon games, you get a farm make connections to people and what not with some added things. While looking into the eligible marriage candidates today out of curiosity I found out that all 10 choices are available to both genders. Something I've been wanting in my HM games for a while now. I'm looking forward to eventually getting this steam game.

 

I've been playing that. Funnily enough, I never played HM before.

It's really cute! And the romance/friendship mechanics exceeded my expectations.. meaning, I just thought you had to click on them to talk and shower them with gifts, but you can actually unlock some really cute moments that fleshes it out more.

[HuldraDancer]

I've been playing that. Funnily enough, I never played HM before.

It's really cute! And the romance/friendship mechanics exceeded my expectations.. meaning, I just thought you had to click on them to talk and shower them with gifts, but you can actually unlock some really cute moments that fleshes it out more.

 

From my understanding a lot of Harvest Moon fans really like that game since it feels like older versions of harvest moon games.  From the little I've read online the marriage and romance system seems to work very similar but I'd wager a guess that this game might do a little more fleshing out since HM focuses on being very cutesy (which isn't a bad thing imo) I can hardly wait to play it I've got the money but no way to actually buy it yet^^;

[HuldraDancer]

World's Dawn from the very small amount I've played seems to have an odd way of going about who you can get with. In the CC after you've picked your gender and hair they ask you what sex you are interested in. I don't think this amounts to anything more than only letting some rather than all of the marriage candidates be available for marriage but i"m not sure seeing as I went with a bi woman.

[HuldraDancer]

Messing around with Stardew Valley pretty much since I got it and got a cut scene that makes me wonder if the characters that can be romanced or player sexual or bisexual. One of them has mentioned an ex in one of her cutscenes and mentioned them being female, not sure if the ex remains female even if you play as a male (currently playing female) or if they turn male if you play as male. While I have a feeling the ex's gender changes based on your own it would be pretty neat imo if the ex's gender just remained the same regardless of which gender you play as.

 

Also another cute mention about the romances, I find it really cute and nice how you can influence some of them for later cutscenes, for example I got one with a character who was a writer and was asked what kind of books I like to read, I answered Sci-Fi then later in another scene when they do a book reading of the novel they just finished the book was Sci-Fi as well.  

[Donk]

Yeah all characters are romancable regardless of gender.

[HuldraDancer]

I knew that, but the mention of the ex for one of the romanceable characters being the same gender as the character I was playing as made me wonder if they're all bisexual or playersexual. Sorry for not being more clear on that.

[nightscrawl]

I'm going to make a post about this in the gay KISA thread as well.

 

The visual novel game with m/m gay romances, Eldet, now has a working demo teaser. I haven't played it yet as of this posting, but I will shortly. I think the actual demo is probably not far behind.