36 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

There's nothing new in the hundred billion (yes that's billion with a "B" or 100,000,000,000) stars in the Milky Way galaxy?

RBG. Nothing to explore. All are the same - blighted by the ME3 ending Bioware cannot run away from fast enough.

[KaiserShep]

RBG. Nothing to explore. All are the same - blighted by the ME3 ending Bioware cannot run away from fast enough.

 

 

And that's really it. No matter what would have been out there, it now has 3 wildly different modes of existence. More importantly though, even if the writers decided "Hey that cluster was like just beyond the range of the Crucible wave", they'd still be in proximity to places that weren't. 

[Linkenski]

I admit, when Mass Effect was first released I found the idea of decisions being imported into later games to be an extremely cool idea.  Unfortunately, the reality of the situation proved highly UNDERwhelming.  To the point where I now consider it essentially a waste of resources.  The choices end up being decorative and little more.   Sometimes not even that.

 

Who cares how well I did or didn't treat a crew mate when in the next game I get called a traitor by them, and can end up romancing them in the third game?

 

What does it matter if you help defeat Space Cthulhu only to have your actions largely forgotten two years later by the very people you saved?

 

Not to mention the bizarre permutations people and organizations go through in order to fit the "vision" of the next game (hi, Cerberus!)

 

And don't get me started on the Human Councilor fiasco.

 

Leaving choices hanging shackles the writers, limits what they can do (or at least do well)  Make every game standalone, let choices and divergence exist in each game.  But start subsequent games with a clean slate.

Uh, let's not exaggerate the matter too much. If it was a waste I imagine Mass Effect Trilogy without any save-import and not feeling nearly as attached to how personalized my story became. It's not so bad it was worthless. It immersed me on a deeper level than almost any other game has ever done all because Shepard sometimes references who died on virmire or someone I met in ME2 show up in ME3, but I think all games could've done less with the shoehorned reappearances. You can literally feel the ticked boxes in how I helped Parassini for example and she shows up in ME2 and similar situations. In ME3 it was a problem with how half the ME2 crew were relegated to having each their own mission which was not tied to the main plot. I get why they avoided that because it's not "feasible" as Armando Troisi put it in his ME2 presentation, but IMO they still kind of overdid how the various returning roles were used and how convenient it was.

 

I gotta wonder though if the new generation we're in allows for a bit more flexibility in choices and variables because we no longer have excessive ram-limiations. Remember DA:I is not a good example because it had to work on last-gen machines.

[KaiserShep]

I'd much rather have the Mass Effect trilogy with the save import feature as it was than whatever the heck it would've been like without it. 

[Iakus]

Bioware has never really gone for this. DAO was as much of an offender as ME1 in that regard.

Dragon Age does a different protagonist and location with each game, minimizing the impact choices make from game to game.

 

But yes, Dragon Age has said "You chose wrong" and picked a canon for us from time to time.

[Iakus]

Uh, let's not exaggerate the matter too much. If it was a waste I imagine Mass Effect Trilogy without any save-import and not feeling nearly as attached to how personalized my story became. It's not so bad it was worthless. It immersed me on a deeper level than almost any other game has ever done all because Shepard sometimes references who died on virmire or someone I met in ME2 show up in ME3, but I think all games could've done less with the shoehorned reappearances. You can literally feel the ticked boxes in how I helped Parassini for example and she shows up in ME2 and similar situations. In ME3 it was a problem with how half the ME2 crew were relegated to having each their own mission which was not tied to the main plot. I get why they avoided that because it's not "feasible" as Armando Troisi put it in his ME2 presentation, but IMO they still kind of overdid how the various returning roles were used and how convenient it was.

 

I gotta wonder though if the new generation we're in allows for a bit more flexibility in choices and variables because we no longer have excessive ram-limiations. Remember DA:I is not a good example because it had to work on last-gen machines.

That kind of the point, though.  "Choices" are purely cosmetic.  They don't mean anything.  Maybe that makes the game more immersive for you, or adds personalization.  But to me that's too many resources being invested for too little return.  

[Killdren88]

I would like to think the OT choices would have had more impact if not of course for the railroaded ending. And honestly the only reason I can think of why they wouldn't retcon it all wasn't the artistic integrity arguments. I just think they didn't want Hudson career damaged after the fact. A crappy ending is one thing. But imagine the message it sends when the whole thing was Retconed? And with Hudson getting most of blame for it, I could see it as damaging for his career in the future if they changed it.....

But back to the topic at hand, if they weren't going to follow up on our choices, then the save import is pointless. Same for Dragon Age...why go through the trouble of making the Keep.if past choices aren't going to have much impact on future games. It just seems like fluff to appease the player base to keep them happy for now.

[Vox Draco]

 

Its not that difficult to reconcile all three ME3 endings into a standardised new universe in the same manner that they reconciled choices before. I don't know why they had to give up the MW galaxy?

 

 

Akatosh save us all ...

 

http://www.uesp.net/...re:Dragon_Break

 

http://www.uesp.net/...arp_in_the_West

 

I admit, when Mass Effect was first released I found the idea of decisions being imported into later games to be an extremely cool idea.  Unfortunately, the reality of the situation proved highly UNDERwhelming.  To the point where I now consider it essentially a waste of resources.  The choices end up being decorative and little more.   Sometimes not even that.

 

Who cares how well I did or didn't treat a crew mate when in the next game I get called a traitor by them, and can end up romancing them in the third game?

 

What does it matter if you help defeat Space Cthulhu only to have your actions largely forgotten two years later by the very people you saved?

 

Not to mention the bizarre permutations people and organizations go through in order to fit the "vision" of the next game (hi, Cerberus!)

 

And don't get me started on the Human Councilor fiasco.

 

Leaving choices hanging shackles the writers, limits what they can do (or at least do well)  Make every game standalone, let choices and divergence exist in each game.  But start subsequent games with a clean slate.

 

I will jump on that boat as well ...

 

With Andromeda I just hope they tell us a more or less straight story - we arrive in the galaxy, makes friends and enemies, and in the end we'll settle down somewhere. Some tentpoles that will be important to the future games, but most decision-making and drama and choices should play on a smaller scale, or personal level. With impacts on the personality of our hero, and how her crew will view her etc

 

Okay, throw in a decision over the fate of some backwater-planet if you like. As long as it is a planet that will not play such a big role later anyway...jsut don't overdo it with that kind of stuff like in the original trilogy, and try not to sell us every decision we make is changing the fate of the galaxy!

[In Exile]

Dragon Age does a different protagonist and location with each game, minimizing the impact choices make from game to game.

But yes, Dragon Age has said "You chose wrong" and picked a canon for us from time to time.

It's not the same. One, RBG affects everything. This is one the level of tearing down the Veil for all time grand choices. There's no going back from it.

DAO has never said you chose wrong. It came up with pretty hokey explanations for why two choices both lead to similar outcomes both they don't overwrite the choice (see killing Leliana in DAO). I think Oghren is the only real retcon?

ME has space travel. You'd have to strand everyone in an isolated part or the milk way with no way to ever visit any part of the ME1 to ME3 setting. Why does it matter whether the made up place is another fake solar system in a fake cluster in a real galaxy that is the Milky Way versus a fake solar system in a fake cluster in a real galaxy that isn't the Milky Way?

[aoibhealfae]

I would have like it if there's different set of different path based on your major choices. Say, if you choose to be Pro-Cerberus, you could play ME3 as Cerberus. Kinda like the Darkspawn chronicles in DAO. Then again, people will still balk at this.

[Drakoriz]

i have 0 problme with ME choices. Really is a story driver game so i play what the Devs want.

 

maybe is why i have 0 issues with DA or ME games

[Iakus]

It's not the same. One, RBG affects everything. This is one the level of tearing down the Veil for all time grand choices. There's no going back from it.
 

That RGB affected everything is another really stupid aspect about the endings, given not all systems have relays (and there are colony worlds without relays in-system), yet somehow the Space Magic still affects everything.

 

So yeah another example of how the endings are bad, and the "choice" is idiotic.

 

 

 

DAO has never said you chose wrong. It came up with pretty hokey explanations for why two choices both lead to similar outcomes both they don't overwrite the choice (see killing Leliana in DAO). I think Oghren is the only real retcon?

 

Anders.  You don't have to recruit either Anders or Justice.  The two can potentially never meet, and heck, you can even kill Justice yourself.

 

 

 

ME has space travel. You'd have to strand everyone in an isolated part or the milk way with no way to ever visit any part of the ME1 to ME3 setting. Why does it matter whether the made up place is another fake solar system in a fake cluster in a real galaxy that is the Milky Way versus a fake solar system in a fake cluster in a real galaxy that isn't the Milky Way?

Because the background of the setting are full of places and institutions which, even if we don't see them personally, shape the state of the galaxy:

 

The Citadel Council

The Systems Alliance

The Batarian Hegemony

Migrant Fleet

Turian Hierarchy

 

And so on.

 

Take these away, and you have a completely different setting with "Mass Effect" stamped on the title for brand recognition.