73 réponses à ce sujet

[UpUpAway]

What if MEA starts where ME3 ends. With the Storyteller (Stargazer ?) and the Child.

 

Child: ... Tell me another story about the Shepard.

Gramps: It's time for bed. But alright. One more story....

 

Mom: NO!! It's time for bed. Stop making up fairy tales dad. It's time for your space meds.

 

*All of ME 1 - 3 turns out to be a (fictional) old man's fictional bedtime story.*

 

^ Worst idea yet?

 

Could be done... would be a cheezy literary trick, IMO. 

 

I really think they're just going to place ME:A so far into the future of ME3 and "in a galaxy far, far away" that the ending variances in ME3 will have just had time to "naturally" homogenize... and exactly how that happened... timelines merging, another undefined war, mad science, etc.... just won't be explained by them.  There is a bonus though, we can spend another 4 years debating it here.

[Chealec]

What if MEA starts where ME3 ends. With the Storyteller (Stargazer ?) and the Child.

 

Child: ... Tell me another story about the Shepard.

Gramps: It's time for bed. But alright. One more story....

 

Mom: NO!! It's time for bed. Stop making up fairy tales dad. It's time for your space meds.

 

*All of ME 1 - 3 turns out to be a (fictional) old man's fictional bedtime story.*

 

^ Worst idea yet?

 

Well it would certainly complete the underlying theme that Shepard is space Jesus...

[In Exile]

Honestly, I would've preferred an "Enhanced Breath Scene" mod, where everything is pretty much entirely the same, only the breath scene now gives an indication that there's a shuttle or something over the rubble (like a search light, shuttle noise or radio chatter). For all intents and purposes, anyone who prefers Shepard just die right then and there could still think that, while it adds a minor detail that gives you a straightforward idea that Shepard was at least found shortly after.

I prefer one that just ends when Shepard reaches for the console to trigger the crucible. Thats actually a bittersweet ending, and one where the protagonist dies at the end. Apart from the LOL worthy absurdity of Harbinger nuking Shepard (a realistic moment in an unrealistic game that's a total inconsistent tone shift) that moment works, and follows on the poignant Anderson scene.

[Han Shot First]

I prefer one that just ends when Shepard reaches for the console to trigger the crucible. Thats actually a bittersweet ending, and one where the protagonist dies at the end. Apart from the LOL worthy absurdity of Harbinger nuking Shepard (a realistic moment in an unrealistic game that's a total inconsistent tone shift) that moment works, and follows on the poignant Anderson scene.

 

I think had Bioware ended the game right then, with the console destroying the Reapers and Shepard dying with his/her hand on the console, there wouldn't have been an ending controversy. Some people would have griped about Shepard dying of course, but it wouldn't have been a majority. The biggest mistake Bioware made with their endings was in not knowing where to end the game. They had an ending and wrote past it.

[UpUpAway]

I think had Bioware ended the game right then, with the console destroying the Reapers and Shepard dying with his/her hand on the console, there wouldn't have been an ending controversy. Some people would have griped about Shepard dying of course, but it wouldn't have been a majority. The biggest mistake Bioware made with their endings was in not knowing where to end the game. The had an ending and wrote past it.

 

I think they doomed themselves to write past a logical ending right from the start... fell too much in love with the concept and reflective nature of Tennyson's "Ulysses."

[wright1978]

I think had Bioware ended the game right then, with the console destroying the Reapers and Shepard dying with his/her hand on the console, there wouldn't have been an ending controversy. Some people would have griped about Shepard dying of course, but it wouldn't have been a majority. The biggest mistake Bioware made with their endings was in not knowing where to end the game. They had an ending and wrote past it.

 

Removing any element of choice from a series that was built from the premise of choice wouldn't have gone down well.

So whilst perhaps the sheer scale of the unhappiness wouldn't have been as broad it would have lingered.

[Chealec]

Removing any element of choice from a series that was built from the premise of choice wouldn't have gone down well.

So whilst perhaps the sheer scale of the unhappiness wouldn't have been as broad it would have lingered.

 

Not necessarily - they could have had multiple different outcomes at the point where Shep presses the button determined by the actions you took over the series; rather than giving you an obvious "pick your ending" button you get the ending relevant to what you actually did during the trilogy and how "well" you did it.

[themikefest]

I think had Bioware ended the game right then, with the console destroying the Reapers and Shepard dying with his/her hand on the console, there wouldn't have been an ending controversy. Some people would have griped about Shepard dying of course, but it wouldn't have been a majority. The biggest mistake Bioware made with their endings was in not knowing where to end the game. They had an ending and wrote past it.

The game could end when the arms are fully extended, the crucible fires its bag of goodies destroying the reapers or it sends out a pulse that reprograms the reapers. They are seen leaving the galaxy. I'll let BioWare flip a coin to choose which one they like.

 

What that does is it gets rid of the magic carpet ride up to lala land. It gets rid of the thing calling itself catalyst. It gets rid of you do not know them, and there's not enough time to explain comment. It gets rid of synthesis is the final evolution of all life comment. It gets rid of pull this, shoot this and jump in this endings

 

Regarding Shepard. He/she can survive. Shepard doesn't have to die.

[Han Shot First]

Giving the players choices during the finale is also sometimes overrated.

 

I don't think it was really necessary to give Shepard a choice in how to resolve the Reaper threat. DA:O's ending for example was largely praised, and it didn't provide any means to resolve the Blight other than to kill the archdemon. I think ME3 would have been far better off, if like DA:O, they kept it simple. It didn't need a twist in the end game, or new, unexpected solutions to the Reapers.

[vbibbi]

Ahh one of those threads where it is proposed to hammer the endings into a completely cheap paste so as to be homogenous.
I can't think of much worse, heck even canonising is preferable to that and I am not a particular fan of that.

I'm still waiting for MEA to show that the ME3 was all just a dream, and Shep smashes a bottle of champagne on the ark before it departs. Then Shep and [insert LI here] have a dance party.

[wright1978]

Giving the players choices during the finale is also sometimes overrated.

 

I don't think it was really necessary to give Shepard a choice in how to resolve the Reaper threat. DA:O's ending for example was largely praised, and it didn't provide any means to resolve the Blight other than to kill the archdemon. I think ME3 would have been far better off, if like DA:O, they kept it simple. It didn't need a twist in the end game, or new, unexpected solutions to the Reapers.

 

I agree that we didn't need option of infecting everyone with the blight in Origins or controlling the archdemon and ME3 suffered badly for trying to twist in these options at the last minute. Origins still had options though. It didn't conclude with forced murder of the warden.

[UpUpAway]

Giving the players choices during the finale is also sometimes overrated.

 

I don't think it was really necessary to give Shepard a choice in how to resolve the Reaper threat. DA:O's ending for example was largely praised, and it didn't provide any means to resolve the Blight other than to kill the archdemon. I think ME3 would have been far better off, if like DA:O, they kept it simple. It didn't need a twist in the end game, or new, unexpected solutions to the Reapers.

 

I agree... the game choices determining who Shepard was and what he believed in at his soul had already been made by the player.

 

I view the endings as an already dead man reviewing his life just as some interpretations of "Ulysses" put forth (and Dante puts Ulysses in hell).  To me, anything past the point of Shep crawling towards the console is a review and an imagining perhaps of what he would have like to have seen done if he had lived a moment longer.  He dies then and there never having been given the chance or the power to actually resolve the Reaper threat (akin to "Death closes all" - we humans simply cannot avoid dying). 

 

i think that, given that BW did decide to add this reflective element, they should have perhaps included a "final breath/sigh of satisfaction" in all the possible endings of the game, rather than dissolving Shep's corpse in 2 of them.  The dilemma/choice for the player in the end only being to decide whether or not they were pleased with the choices they had made throughout the game... and Shep simply never knows how the Reapers were defeated or allied with or controlled or even whether or not they were defeated... and we all move onto a new story in a new galaxy.

 

Of course, to go that route, they would have been seen as absolutely making it so the player's choices didn't matter... but in reality, in a reflective sense, the choices to that point should have very much mattered to Shep in the only way any of our choices matter to ourselves in death.

[Killdren88]

"Mass Effect Happy Ending Mod" is by far one of the most detestable creations I have ever had the displeasure of witnessing. People who completely missed the point of the trilogy committed a far greater sin by bastardizing everything that happened and coming up with a Disney fairy tale that is completely out of sync with the rest of the franchise. This is why writing is best left to the professionals rather than fans who think they know what is "best."

 

ME3's ending might be far from perfect, but MEHEM is far worse in every conceivable way and manner.

 

I'm neither here or there when it comes to that mod. It was the creation of justifiably angry people after they were lied to right in the face by Bioware (the Infamous ABC interview). Also, what the point of the Trilogy was is completely subjective. You have your idea of what the point was, and others have alternates. Hell, I would have loved a happy ending personally. I am a firm believer of earning your happy ending. Always taking that extra step, be it scanning every single planet for all potential assets, or completing an extra mission that is hard as a hell, but by doing it, more options are open up to you.

[In Exile]

Removing any element of choice from a series that was built from the premise of choice wouldn't have gone down well.
So whilst perhaps the sheer scale of the unhappiness wouldn't have been as broad it would have lingered.

But they wouldn't remove choice. They could do a DAO and Trespasser/DAI style Epilogue

[Revan Reborn]

I'm neither here or there when it comes to that mod. It was the creation of justifiably angry people after they were lied to right in the face by Bioware (the Infamous ABC interview). Also, what the point of the Trilogy was is completely subjective. You have your idea of what the point was, and others have alternates. Hell, I would have loved a happy ending personally. I am a firm believer of earning your happy ending. Always taking that extra step, be it scanning every single planet for all potential assets, or completing an extra mission that is hard as a hell, but by doing it, more options are open up to you.

All that mod achieved was showing how people had ridiculous expectations for an ending that was never likely to occur.

 

There is nothing subjective about the fact that beating the reapers was unlikely. It took most of the galaxy's forces just to kill Sovereign. ONE reaper. Considering Shepard never had any sort of plan or strategy for killing reapers at all, you really think the chances of beating an entire army were that great? Do you really believe a happy ending was that reasonable? No. It wasn't. People who expected it were delusional and wanted to "earn" something that was never promised or articulated in the story. There was no plan. The crucible was wishful thinking and nobody knew what the catalyst was. A happy ending was not a reasonable expectation for anyone to possess.

 

I beat all three Mass Effect games on Insanity and did a completionist run for the entire trilogy. I collected, scanned, completed, everything the game had to offer. That in no way made me feel I "deserved" or "earned" a happy ending. The game would have made a mockery out of the entire trilogy if we just had a happy ending where everybody survived and the reapers were destroyed.

 

I'm sorry you were so disappointed by the ending that was provided by BioWare, but honestly the only person you should be blaming is yourself. You, alone, set yourself up for disappointment. Your expectations were never reasonable or realistic from the start.

[Xen]

Do you really need this explained OP?

It's not just the endings themselves anyway, it's other boneheaded design decisions in ME3 like enabling the player to be solely responsible for the survival of no less than a half dozen entire species (krogan, rachni, geth, quarian, hanar, drell, and even human if we take the low EMS Destroy option where the vast majority of humanity is wiped out when Earth's destroyed). Trying to go forward from ME3 without establishing a canon (which would рiss tons of people off, apparently, and Biower don't want that after ME3) would be impossible without it being insanely stupid. They burned the MW setting and pissed on the ashes, so Andromeda it is.

[AlanC9]

What if MEA starts where ME3 ends. With the Storyteller (Stargazer ?) and the Child.
 
Child: ... Tell me another story about the Shepard.
Gramps: It's time for bed. But alright. One more story....
 
Mom: NO!! It's time for bed. Stop making up fairy tales dad. It's time for your space meds.
 
*All of ME 1 - 3 turns out to be a (fictional) old man's fictional bedtime story.*
 
^ Worst idea yet?

Not at all. I've heard way worse.

[Rocks_and_shoals]

I'm interested in knowing what kind of ending people are expecting, instead of just moaning what the ending turned out to be. Specifically, what would they have wanted? It seems in science fiction, if there is an all powerful enemy, there always seems to be some kind of ancient superweapon that wipes them all out. Like the Merlins weapon against the Ori, the ark of truth for the ori followers, the ancient device on Takara for the replicators who destroyed the go'uld, the halo devices against the flood etc.

[UpUpAway]

I'm interested in knowing what kind of ending people are expecting, instead of just moaning what the ending turned out to be. Specifically, what would they have wanted? It seems in science fiction, if there is an all powerful enemy, there always seems to be some kind of ancient superweapon that wipes them all out. Like the Merlins weapon against the Ori, the ark of truth for the ori followers, the ancient device on Takara for the replicators who destroyed the go'uld, the halo devices against the flood etc.

 

Well, since I think we're talking about Andromeda and Pathfinder (Perseus) and Perseus did use Medusa's head to turn his enemies to stone...

 

but, I leave it up to the developers as to how they want to incorporate Medusa's head into a sci-fi fiction fantasy videogame.

[Andrew Lucas]

*insert obligatory Let It Go gif*

 

It's been four years, mate. 

[Iakus]

I'm interested in knowing what kind of ending people are expecting, instead of just moaning what the ending turned out to be. Specifically, what would they have wanted? It seems in science fiction, if there is an all powerful enemy, there always seems to be some kind of ancient superweapon that wipes them all out. Like the Merlins weapon against the Ori, the ark of truth for the ori followers, the ancient device on Takara for the replicators who destroyed the go'uld, the halo devices against the flood etc.

"Ancient superweapon" kinda became a requirement after ME2 was spent spinning its wheels gathering random bad@sses to fight bug-people rather than trying to find a way to effectively fight the Reapers.  So while finding something that wasn't literally a giant magic wand would have been nice, that hasn't been in the cards since 2010 at least.

 

As for what was wanted, a lot of people wanted an ending where Shepard could survive without being rendered a faceless torso, stranded on a damaged Citadel, in a place no organic had ever stepped foot before.  And where it seems everyone except an inexplicably Force-Sensitive LI has given Shepard up for dead (otherwise why make a plaque and hold a memorial?)

 

So, yeah, there's that.

 

Another thing people (like me) wanted was an ending where you could free the galaxy from the Reapers without resorting to genociding your own side.  Yeah, I know there's some people who don't consider synthetics to be "real boys" which is fair enough, I guess.  There's also a lot of edgemasters who proclaim "omelets and eggs" or whatever.  But you know what?  For some of us, this is a betrayal that sucks all the fun out of the endgame.  It simply doesn't feel like a "win"  it feels like the Abyss gazing back at you.

[Iakus]

*insert obligatory Let It Go gif*

 

It's been four years, mate. 

Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice...Strike Three!

 

[UpUpAway]

It simply doesn't feel like a "win"  it feels like the Abyss gazing back at you.

 

... and that's what Tennyson's "Ulysses" was all about (IMO, just saying.  Of course, it's still debated all over)... and the ME Trilogy is a sci-fi videogame adaption of the story of Ulysses/Odysseus that people will probably debate about almost as long as they have Tennyson's version

[Iakus]

... and that's what Tennyson's "Ulysses" was all about (IMO, just saying.  Of course, it's still debated all over)... and the ME Trilogy is a sci-fi videogame adaption of the story of Ulysses/Odysseus that people will probably debate about almost as long as they have Tennyson's version

I have read the Odyssey.  There are few, if any parallels.

[UpUpAway]

I have read the Odyssey.  There are few, if any parallels.

 

... ah, but the premise clearly presented in ME Trilogy is Tennyson's "Ulysses"... which is a representation of Odysseus reflecting upon his life not an actual retelling of the voyage of Odysseus.  There are other literary references, of course... some of them only mentioned in some cases.  For example, Tennyson's "Charge of the Light Brigade" ("Boldly they rode and well, into the Jaws of Death, into the mouth of Hell") comes into the game only if you romanced Ashley and talk with her in London.  This encounter, however, would perhaps foreshadow an inability to "win" without at least significant losses to your own side.  The inability to "win" outright is, however, mentioned very clearly near the very beginning of the Trilogy by Barla Von. "But no matter how long you play, no matter how many secrets you buy, you can never win."

 

Clearly, with a videogame, most people expect that there should be a definitive win.  At odds with this is that Bioware seems to like to write tragedies.  Reflective tragedies like Tennyson's "Ulysses" do tend to make people feel like the Abyss is staring back at them.