216 réponses à ce sujet

[Medhia_Nox]

Well... didn't contact with Reaper tech cause indoctrination throughout the series?

Using Sovereign would actually have been exceedingly stupid if that's the case. 

[Revan Reborn]

If reaper technology were available, it would have been foolish not to use it.

As such, I suspect they didn't, because the people in charge throughout the ME trilogy were idiots.

The Council was, but they were merely puppets being controlled by various special interest groups.

 

Well... didn't contact with Reaper tech cause indoctrination throughout the series?

Using Sovereign would actually have been exceedingly stupid if that's the case. 

That's what makes it incredibly interesting. We also learn in the Leviathan DLC that there is a method for blocking indoctrination. Either way, it would be interesting to see how the builders would handle that situation.

[Kabooooom]

There is no similarity whatsoever with that ship and a Reaper, unless you count that both travel through space. That's a bit of a stretch, Revan.

The Citadel though, it does resemble. I've pointed out in the past that the concept art resembles a modified Bernal Sphere (a structure more useful for a starship compared to a space station) more closely than it does a Stanford Torus like the Presidium, but that it obviously was intended to evoke a Presidium-like nostalgia. The central portion of the ark concept art could easily be that location.

And that alone creates enough speculation, without throwing the "ark is a reaper" into the mix unnecessarily. For example, since it resembles the Citadel, did the species of the galaxy build it? I find that unlikely, unless we are all wrong about the ark leaving to escape the Reapers and the game is a true sequel to ME3, something that Bioware has already denied. Or, conversely, did the Reapers build it? If so, for what purpose (undeniably a nefarious one)? Those are really the two most likely possibilities.

[Rexts]

That would be interesting the Ark is built with parts of the Sovereign's remnant. What if the Sovereign is still living but staying silence secretly while all other Reapers being busy on harvesting Milky Way?

1. Albeit Council is launching the Ark intergalactically, Reaper is the only one known species can travel across galaxies, that means Reaper is very familiar to what the Ark could happens/does in traveling to Andromeda, so it doesn't need to expose the project immediately, or you can call it a "trap" for later harvest after the operation at Milky Way has done.

2. In fact, the Ark was launched before ME3's story, Does it mean that the living Reaper lost contact to other Reapers at Milky Way after the ending of ME3? The RGB wave doesn't hit the Ark? Would the Ark be also the Ark of Reaper?

3. Andromeda is the closest galaxy to Milky Way, I am afraid that they only help balancing the living at Milky Way in 50,000 years when they have the ability of intergalactic traveling. It may denote that Andromeda could be the previous/next stop of Reaper's harvest routine. As you can see in the CG teaser of MEA, the unknown species hold quite equivalent tech in comparison with Milky Way's, it proves that Andromeda is also suffering Reaper's invasion, then they would also know Reaper and their fate. Assuming Andromeda is the next stop of Reaper's harvest routine, and the advanced species of Andromeda find out the Ark and the resemble with Reaper because it is using Reaper's techs and emitting Reaper's signal, would they think the Ark is the vanguard of Reaper invasion like what happened at Milky Way in ME1?

4. The guardian golem-like species of Andromeda, what they are guarding? from who? Reaper?

To Andromeda, we are the unknown threat, it is very interesting if the Ark is actually based on Reaper's tech and has a dormant Reaper inside, what is the planning of this Reaper? Would it be friendly or hostile?

 

​

[Medhia_Nox]

@Rext:  While I don't want the next chapter to have anything to do with Reapers... I do want the Andromeda Galaxy to see us as a threat.  Then, I want them to realize we're refugees and have a kind of schism where some consider us vermin to be exterminated while other races take a more benevolent approach.

 

NOTE:  There's this little masterpiece called Homeworld that would detail a similar concept. 

 

I'm confident I'm going to be disappointed though - I cannot see any way Bioware is going to tell a story where the main PC isn't the rising star.

[ArcadiaGrey]

No problem!

 

Would they know "the threat of indoctrination?" As I understood it, only Shepard and his crew actually seemed to know the threat of indoctrination based on their dealings with Saren. You have to remember, the only way you believe indoctrination being true is if you believe the reapers are real. Nobody believed Shepard that the reapers were real. It is a bit hard to take someone seriously when they claim they are having visions and that this mysterious threat is coming. Even when Sovereign did finally show himself, the Council covered him up to the public and just wrote him off as "Saren's flagship." This either means the Council believed Shepard, which I doubt, or they just believe Sovereign is based on some new, advanced technology they don't know anything about.

 

Remember, it isn't until ME2 that we actually start learning more about how indoctrination works and functions based on Shepard having to go to the derelict reaper in order to get the reaper IFF to make it through the Omega-4 Relay safely.

 

I only said for "obvious reasons" as indoctrination on the ARK would spell bad news for the crew. Especially if this launches before the events of ME3, there's no telling what kind of impact reaper indoctrination could have and what would happen to the crew as they make their way to Andromeda. I'm just assuming BioWare isn't going to open up that can of worms and indoctrination is not going to be a factor or an issue.

 

My belief is that the ARK leaves before ME3, so the ARK would have to be based on Sovereign. The events of ME3 in no way impact the ARK.

 

But....if the council are making an ARK it would take a helluva long time, so they must have believed Shep in ME1 to start the project in the first place.  

....which would mean they accept indoctrination and wouldn't risk using Sovereign.

Even if they didn't and used it anyway, by the time indoctrination is commonly accepted surely they'd change the design to remove any of Sovereign's components to stop that happening?

 

It's an interesting read, but it comes down to this simple point (for me at least) -

You're trying to save humanity and the other species.  No way in hell would you put all your resources into an incredibly expensive and vast project like the ARK and then willingly put any parts of a Reaper into it.  It's just stupid, they'd be jinxing the project before it even started and wiping out any chance of survival.

 

Using concepts and tech they've learnt from the Reapers, yes.  But no Reaper bits.  Not in my opinion anyway.  Now let's see the game come out and prove me entirely wrong. 

[Revan Reborn]

But....if the council are making an ARK it would take a helluva long time, so they must have believed Shep in ME1 to start the project in the first place.  

....which would mean they accept indoctrination and wouldn't risk using Sovereign.

Even if they didn't and used it anyway, by the time indoctrination is commonly accepted surely they'd change the design to remove any of Sovereign's components to stop that happening?

 

It's an interesting read, but it comes down to this simple point (for me at least) -

You're trying to save humanity and the other species.  No way in hell would you put all your resources into an incredibly expensive and vast project like the ARK and then willingly put any parts of a Reaper into it.  It's just stupid, they'd be jinxing the project before it even started and wiping out any chance of survival.

 

Using concepts and tech they've learnt from the Reapers, yes.  But no Reaper bits.  Not in my opinion anyway.  Now let's see the game come out and prove me entirely wrong. 

Not necessarily. Consider the MEA N7 Day Teaser trailer for a moment. Note that in that trailer Shepard states that humanity needs to explore for the sake of curiosity, and the fear of what should happen if we don't. I think this suggests the Council wasn't building the ARK initially to run from a reaper threat they didn't believe existed. Rather, they were using Sovereign's technology in order to go beyond the Milky Way for the sake of science and expanding their influence. It wasn't until the collector's and the destruction of the mass relay that wiped out the batarians that I believe the Council recognized there was more to Sovereign than they originally thought.

 

This is all certainly speculation, but I see no other way for how the ARK could have been built if not for the use of what was left of Sovereign.

[Kabooooom]

I could easily speculate that the ark is anything, Reaper remains or not. For example, both the concept art of the "Presidium-like" area and the design of the ark itself are similar to a Bernal Sphere, rather than a Stanford Torus like the true Presidium. Gagarin Station was a Bernal sphere, and was described as the largest station in Alliance Space, even larger than Arcturus Station, and was created specifically to research FTL technology before the discovery of mass effect fields, and was subsequently used for all sorts of clandestine research. And it was never explicitly stated to have been destroyed during the Reaper invasion. Maybe the ark is a refurbished Gagarin Station. After all, there's probably more similarities there than to a Reaper.

I dont actually believe that. Just pointing out where wild speculation can lead with just a few facts.

[Revan Reborn]

I could easily speculate that the ark is anything, Reaper remains or not. For example, both the concept art of the "Presidium-like" area and the design of the ark itself are similar to a Bernal Sphere, rather than a Stanford Torus like the true Presidium. Gagarin Station was a Bernal sphere, and was described as the largest station in Alliance Space, even larger than Arcturus Station, and was created specifically to research FTL technology before the discovery of mass effect fields, and was subsequently used for all sorts of clandestine research. And it was never explicitly stated to have been destroyed during the Reaper invasion. Maybe the ark is a refurbished Gagarin Station. After all, there's probably more similarities there than to a Reaper.

I dont actually believe that. Just pointing out where wild speculation can lead with just a few facts.

I'd say my theory has a bit more validity just due to the fact that the ARK is capable of intergalactic travel. Not to mention, if it is the new "Citadel" social hub BioWare has suggested, then it's obviously been based off of reaper technology. Is it really that hard to believe that the source that powers the ARK is Sovereign's core? What other vessel other than the reapers were capable of traveling in Dark Space unhindered? I really don't think there is a better explanation for the ARK's origins than this, unless BioWare just makes something up.

[Killroy]

Being a new Citadel-like structure means it has to also be Reaper tech? What?

[shodiswe]

I don't see the Reaper resemblance, it has a small resemblance to the Citadel thoguh, but it's only passing.

 

Unless they found an old relic I'm pretty sure it's been built by the council. If it's Citadel size or even close to that then it vastly bigger than a Reaper. 

 

Anything Citadel sized could support millions.

 

Doubt it's reaper built and I doubt it's Leviathan built even if that would be possible... But  Idon't see the council gettign their hands on a Leviathan ship that size that has elluded discovery but all the other species for millions or billions of years. Seems unlikely. That's all.

[Revan Reborn]

Being a new Citadel-like structure means it has to also be Reaper tech? What?

The reapers built the Citadel, so yes, that makes it "Reaper tech."

 

I don't see the Reaper resemblance, it has a small resemblance to the Citadel thoguh, but it's only passing.

 

Unless they found an old relic I'm pretty sure it's been built by the council. If it's Citadel size or even close to that then it vastly bigger than a Reaper. 

 

Anything Citadel sized could support millions.

 

Doubt it's reaper built and I doubt it's Leviathan built even if that would be possible... But  Idon't see the council gettign their hands on a Leviathan ship that size that has elluded discovery but all the other species for millions or billions of years. Seems unlikely. That's all.

As I said in the OP, this is Sovereign rebuilt by the Council. We don't know the actual scale of the ARK, but it seems to be comparable in size to the Citadel. If that's the case, then clearly the Council has expanded on Sovereign quite substantially.

[Killroy]

The reapers built the Citadel, so yes, that makes it "Reaper tech."

 

The Reapers built the Citadel so that means they built everything that resembles the Citadel in form or function as well? That makes zero sense.

[Revan Reborn]

The Reapers built the Citadel so that means they built everything that resembles the Citadel in form or function as well? That makes zero sense.

That means anything that resembles the Citadel is likely using reaper tech or based off of it. So yes, it is either directly or indirectly reaper tech. Again, it is very likely the ARK is largely based off a reaper tech, specifically Sovereign, collector ships, and the citadel. It seems to be an amalgamation of reaper technology, which would make sense as only the reapers were able to traverse Dark Space and anything beyond the Milky Way.

[Cainhurst Crow]

I hate the reapers as a concept and in execution, and feel they're the worst part of mass effects lore and the main source for the massive dip in writing quality the series is known for. In my opinion whoever penned them being a boss and not a long since gone threat needs a slap upside the head.

That said, if we were to make a ship out of a dead and no longer indoctrinatable reaper...that'd be pretty cool.

[Killroy]

That means anything that resembles the Citadel is likely using reaper tech or based off of it.

No it doesn't. That's completely illogical. If I build a home in the mid-century modern style was it somehow actually built by Joseph Eichler?

So yes, it is either directly or indirectly reaper tech.

So taking design cues from the Citadel means the Reapers made it?

[DarthSliver]

To me it doesn't look like a Reaper but it does look like the Citadel.

 

 

I actually think this thing was built pre-Mass Effect 1 because Humans can't be only ones that take caution can we. I mean I'd hate to see what the Citadel space society was like before humans entered the picture, galaxy lacking caution. I strongly believe that the design came from one of the many scrattered Prothean Beacons discovered throughout the galaxy. I also think that maybe the council built it after Sovereigns attack and they been playing Shepard for a fool ME2 and ME3 to keep it a secret. 

 

I guess I am saying I would like the Ark to be the Councils redemption. Would like to believe they were only playing the fool to our Shepard and took Shepard's warning very seriously after ME1. 

[Vodiara]

There has been a lot of discussion recently about how it is "impossible," based on the lore, to have intergalactic travel. While this might be true to a degree based on conventional means of transportation, who's to say anything is conventional about the ARK being used to travel towards Andromeda? Why don't we explore what the ARK might actually be?

 

Here's a screenshot of it from the MEA N7 Day 2015 Teaser:

 

 

I don't know about you, but I noticed something rather troubling. The ARK has a resemblance to the Citadel. Perhaps, and what I think is also important to note, it even has a resemblance to a reaper.

 

Here's more potential evidence the ARK could be based on reaper technology:

 

 

This is concept art of a Citadel-esque environment that BioWare Montreal showed in a video during N7 Day 2014. While we don't know if this is actually the ARK, it wouldn't be unreasonable to believe it might be as BioWare suggests this could be a "social hub" and the ARK seems to be filling the void of what the Citadel was in ME1-3. It wouldn't be out of the realm of reason to believe BioWare would want some sense of familiarity in this new galaxy.

 

Lastly, and my final point, who's to say the ARK isn't actually the remnants of Sovereign?

 

As you know, ME1 concluded with Sovereign's destruction. In ME2, Sovereign's true identity is covered up by the Council and the wreckage is confiscated by a wide variety of groups. We see examples in ME2 and even the DLC of various groups getting their hands on pieces from Sovereign. However, what about the larger pieces that were likely confiscated by the Council? Who's to say that the ARK isn't actually a recreation of Sovereign?

 

As always, this is purely speculation, but I think it's important to note that the ARK, in fact, could be the galaxy's first and only self-created reaper. I'm assuming all of the detrimental aspects of a reaper, such as indoctrination, are likely not present for obvious reasons. Or are they?

 

Anyways, what does the community think? Is the ARK actually Sovereign remade for a new purpose? How would you feel about being on a ship that used to be Sovereign?

Di i miss something, where can i get CANON info about this ARK thing?

[Ahriman]

 took Shepard's warning very seriously after ME1. 

They did. It looked like some backthought on writers part in Citadel, but Sovereign was recognised as Reaper, while officially declared as infamous "Geth dreadnought".

Di i miss something, where can i get CANON info about this ARK thing?

Nowhere, the only official thing is that trailer. Even concept-art is out of context.

[Revan Reborn]

I hate the reapers as a concept and in execution, and feel they're the worst part of mass effects lore and the main source for the massive dip in writing quality the series is known for. In my opinion whoever penned them being a boss and not a long since gone threat needs a slap upside the head.

That said, if we were to make a ship out of a dead and no longer indoctrinatable reaper...that'd be pretty cool.

Do you even like Mass Effect? The reapers were the entire focus of the original trilogy...

 

No it doesn't. That's completely illogical. If I build a home in the mid-century modern style was it somehow actually built by Joseph Eichler?


So taking design cues from the Citadel means the Reapers made it?

Your reading comprehension is absolutely horrendous. I made it rather clear the ARK was built by the Council. However, they are using Sovereign (reaper technology) as the basis for building the ARK. In other words, the Council used Sovereign, as well as likely the Citadel and perhaps a collector ship, in order to construct it. In case you forgot, all of those ships are reaper technology.

 

To me it doesn't look like a Reaper but it does look like the Citadel.

 

 

I actually think this thing was built pre-Mass Effect 1 because Humans can't be only ones that take caution can we. I mean I'd hate to see what the Citadel space society was like before humans entered the picture, galaxy lacking caution. I strongly believe that the design came from one of the many scrattered Prothean Beacons discovered throughout the galaxy. I also think that maybe the council built it after Sovereigns attack and they been playing Shepard for a fool ME2 and ME3 to keep it a secret. 

 

I guess I am saying I would like the Ark to be the Councils redemption. Would like to believe they were only playing the fool to our Shepard and took Shepard's warning very seriously after ME1. 

No one could understand the beacons except Shepard, so I highly doubt this. You are just agreeing with what I stated that the Council used Sovereign to build the ARK after ME1. Whether the Council believed Shepard or not doesn't matter. Either way, they would have used the technology for their own benefit.

 

Di i miss something, where can i get CANON info about this ARK thing?

There is no canon information. This is just a theory based on what we do know about it.

 

They did. It looked like some backthought on writers part in Citadel, but Sovereign was recognised as Reaper, while officially declared as infamous "Geth dreadnought".

Nowhere, the only official thing is that trailer. Even concept-art is out of context.

I don't believe that for a second. The Council was more in denial than recognizing any threat. They just assumed Sovereign was some sort of Geth ship and hoped that was the end of it. Had they taken Shepard seriously, they would have made attempts at preparing the galaxy for an invasion, which they did not. They did nothing.

 

We do not know if the concept art is "out of context." We do know that the concept art was described by BioWare, itself, as being a social hub. Considering the ARK is the replacement for the Citadel, it's likely the concept art is of the ARK. It's a pretty logical conclusion to make.

[Prince Enigmatic]

I see subtle resemblances between the ARK and Sovereign-class Reapers, especially in the Citadel Ward-esque arms that extend out.

 

I also see other influences as well, and while extremely unlikely they had a hand in building it, I see the sphere shape in the centre (it could be a core, i'm not sure) as resembling that of the quarian's liveships.

 

Perhaps in its construction, influence was drawn from other races. I've seen others here speculate whether there could have been Prothean and Volus involvement, maybe as well as Sovereign and the Citadel the ARK was based on other species technologies.

[Ahriman]

 

I don't believe that for a second. The Council was more in denial than recognizing any threat. They just assumed Sovereign was some sort of Geth ship and hoped that was the end of it. 

That's exactly what this record about. Geth ship was a public version, they even edited it in video to be one.

[DarthSliver]

No one could understand the beacons except Shepard, so I highly doubt this. You are just agreeing with what I stated that the Council used Sovereign to build the ARK after ME1. Whether the Council believed Shepard or not doesn't matter. Either way, they would have used the technology for their own benefit.

 

 

Well I thought I was mainly saying Council actually took Shepard seriously and built the ARK. Not to mention all those other Prothean Beacons out there probably had plans for such a device too so its construction could've started predate ME1 in itself too. Shepard only couldn't understand the Beacon on Eden Prime because Shepard didn't have an understanding of Prothean language, that was the whole point for getting Liara and talking to the Thorne. I was under the impression they understood what was coming from these Prothean caches considering they were able to build Ships that work with Mass Relays lol. Its kinda hard to do that if you can't understand the source these are coming from

 

Also if Ark was built off of Prothean plans as the Cruicible it would've been from one of the seemingly untouched Prothean locations like Illos

Modifié par DarthSliver, 29 février 2016 - 04:47 .

[Revan Reborn]

I see subtle resemblances between the ARK and Sovereign-class Reapers, especially in the Citadel Ward-esque arms that extend out.

 

I also see other influences as well, and while extremely unlikely they had a hand in building it, I see the sphere shape in the centre (it could be a core, i'm not sure) as resembling that of the quarian's liveships.

 

Perhaps in its construction, influence was drawn from other races. I've seen others here speculate whether there could have been Prothean and Volus involvement, maybe as well as Sovereign and the Citadel the ARK was based on other species technologies.

I'm sure it's a compilation of technology from all races in the Milky Way. If the Council did, indeed, construct it, that certainly wouldn't be unreasonable. I just think its very core and what powers the ARK is Sovereign.

 

That's exactly what this record about. Geth ship was a public version, they even edited it in video to be one.

I know what the Council told the public. I'm just merely suggesting they wanted to believe that as being the truth as well. I don't believe for a second the Council ever took Shepard seriously or his warning of the reapers. They just saw Saren as a spectre gone rogue and Shepard as a nut rambling about visions he had. They saw his predictions more than likely as coincidence rather than the beginning of the end.

 

Well I thought I was mainly saying Council actually took Shepard seriously and built the ARK. Not to mention all those other Prothean Beacons out there probably had plans for such a device too so its construction could've started predate ME1 in itself too. Shepard only couldn't understand the Beacon on Eden Prime because Shepard didn't have an understanding of Prothean language, that was the whole point for getting Liara and talking to the Thorne. I was under the impression they understood what was coming from these Prothean caches considering they were able to build Ships that work with Mass Relays lol. Its kinda hard to do that if you can't understand the source these are coming from

 

Also if Ark was built off of Prothean plans as the Cruicible it would've been from one of the seemingly untouched Prothean locations like Illos

I just don't believe it was built by the protheans. Besides Shepard, nobody could actually understand the beacons. I doubt they would have found any derelict ship that just happened to have the capacity for intergalactic travel, which the protheans weren't capable of. The protheans didn't create the mass relays, the reapers did. The asari discovered the Citadel due to the protheans grooming them to be the next leaders of the galaxy. Most asari were not consciously aware that their evolution was forced. Again, you are conflating prothean technology and reaper technology as being the same. Obviously the galaxy and a rudimentary understanding of reaper technology. However, we have no indication they ever understood prothean technology. Heck, the galaxy wasn't even sure the protheans were real and not just some myth.

 

The crucible wasn't prothean either. It was built by various species over various cycles. The protheans just finished the project but never figured out what the catalyst was. I think you are giving far too much credit to the protheans. They were pawns more than anything else.

[Killroy]

Your reading comprehension is absolutely horrendous. I made it rather clear the ARK was built by the Council. However, they are using Sovereign (reaper technology) as the basis for building the ARK. In other words, the Council used Sovereign, as well as likely the Citadel and perhaps a collector ship, in order to construct it. In case you forgot, all of those ships are reaper technology.

...hold on. You're operating under the assumption that your "theory" is 100% correct?