109 réponses à ce sujet

[Kakistos_]

The point is not that the MC can perform feats of magic but rather that magic itself finds it's way to work with the MC.

 

Case in point, the Inquisitor, regardless of being a mage or not, got mastery over Fade Rifts due to Solas true magic being transplanted into his/her hand and to match Solas the next MC will inevitably need an overwhelming amount of magic power at his/her disposal.

 

This can happen through two ways:

 

1- The next MC is a hedge mage whose unique untamed magic can interact with ancient Elven artifacts and screw up with Solas plans.

 

2- The next MC is Inquisitor 2.0 who gets his mojo from interrupting Solas magic ritual entirely by chance.

 

The first option gives way for an MC which is unique to all of Thedas in his/her own right like a true choosen one for all subsequent games, the second basically makes retiring the Inquisitor and severing his hand a blatant cop-out for having made the previous protagonist too powerful to remain on the front.

 

So to beat Solas we need a protagonist who randomly has the power to take him on at the expense of lore and story? No. I think the writers can come up with something better than Inquisitor 2.0. Even if they did go down that road mutilating the lore surrounding Hedge Magic is not the way. That said I do think the DA4 protagonist will have unique abilities. Not random but something that has been brewing for a while. Even still they shouldn't be able to take Solas on one on one and even in a group. He is an ancient God after all. Even IF he is defeated by force it should be done in a smart tactical way, not through blunt force.

 

Again, I admit that I'm not incredibly well versed in this issue.   However, what I have read and heard stated about the subject seems to indicate that arcanist derangement is about more than a lack of discipline.  If it were as simple as that then there would not logically be any reason that a hedge mage would not be able to develop normal spellcasting practices.  

 

I also didn't get the impression that all hedge mages belong to specific traditions.  I suppose that traditions such as Avvar shamanism would fall under the distinction of hedge magic (though I wouldn't be inclined to believe that if it weren't stated), but what I've read seems to indicate that hedge mages can manifest their abilities without any specific training.  They may develop their own methodologies for employing their gifts, but I'd be more likely to believe that most of them would be more akin to solitary practitioners who don't belong to a formal tradition than someone who actively participates in Wicca or, like, the Golden Dawn.

 

The way that hedge magic is discussed in the Apostate codex entry makes it seem like the term "hedge mage" can be applied to any mage who practices magic in a way different than the one taught at a Circle.  I doubt that's all it takes to be labeled a hedge mage, since groups like Dalish mages would then fall under that description.  It leaves out any mention of arcanist derangement, which seems to be a key element of what separates a true hedge mage from a mage who just hasn't been trained.

 

On a side note, I wonder if all this means that Avvar mages and Chasind witches would then be unable to employ traditional spellcasting as practiced by Circle Mages, or if they're referred to as hedge mages more as a colloquialism than a strict academic term.  I'm inclined to believe the latter, but not for any specific reason.

 

As I stated in an earlier post, there Hedge Mage as an insult and then Hedge Mage as a condition. Avvar and Rivaini Mages are derided as Hedge Mages, the insult, because they do not follow "traditional" Circle teachings. This is all part of the Chantry's dogma and their crusade to control Magic. Avvar, Chasind and Rivaini Mages do not suffer from Arcanist Derangement and are trained.

 

In fact, their methods and teachings predate the Chanty and Circle and as we see in The Jaws of Hakkon their unrestricted exploration of Magical Forces over their history has made them and their societies safer from threats like Demons as opposed to Circle Mages who are forbidden from such research.  And we know that they are capable of learning Circle taught Spells and vice versa as Morrigan, a "hedge mage" can teach the Circle taught Mage Warden Shapeshifting and a Mage Inquisitor can learn Fade Magic as Solas does.

 

You are right that in the case of the Avvar and Rivaini Mages that the term is colloquial but in the case of Mages such as the Sarrebas who lack training it is academic.

[Blood Mage Reaver]

So to beat Solas we need a protagonist who randomly has the power to take him on at the expense of lore and story? No. I think the writers can come up with something better than Inquisitor 2.0. Even if they did go down that road mutilating the lore surrounding Hedge Magic is not the way. That said I do think the DA4 protagonist will have unique abilities. Not random but something that has been brewing for a while. Even still they shouldn't be able to take Solas on one on one and even in a group. He is an ancient God after all. Even IF he is defeated by force it should be done in a smart tactical way, not through blunt force.

 

Solas isn't a god, he is just an extremely powerful mage from an era when magic wasn't capped by the Veil and the Elf himself hates being addressed as such.

 

Lore stated that the Evanuris rose from leaders, to generals, to kings and ultimately gods because of their talent which is something a new MC certainly won't be lacking in.

 

Getting the power to confront Solas directly isn't out of question, the HoF could destroy Flemeth's body despite of Mythal's power. Not only that but half of DAI is your Inquisitor finding allies to power up his Mark or suppress the magics he needs to beat so expect us to increase our abilities dramatically as we confront and enlist new factions from Thedas.

 

As for the Mark and the Inquisitor... it is not hedge magic.  It's a magical item - which is why Solas can just remove it on a whim.  

 

It is an ancient magic spell created by Solas to grant control over the Veil which got stuck into the hands of the wrong person and acts like an unstable spirit nuke.

 

If you don't consider a pulsing fade-warping spell gone wrong to be hedge magic then you are the one who doesn't know what hedge magic is.

 

 

 

The entire point of the thread is that the next MC will have some unique magic special to him which can interfere with Solas plans and it will either be because he was born with that magic (hence a hedge mage) or he will acquire it from another weird macguffin like the Inquisitor did, which would make retiring the latter completely redundant.

[AlanC9]

It does give Bio an instant way to make the PC special., which is something Bio likes to do. And maybe does too often.

[SwobyJ]

The Mages of Rivain are trained in their art. They have a Circle Tower. I'm not going to respond to the rest of that drivel at this time. Anyone else who pays attention to the game, history and lore feel free to rip this apart.

 

No they don't. The Circle was a big fail. They learned their magic through other means. 

 

EDIT: I'm not huge expert on Dragon Age lore, but wasn't a big part of Inquisition about how magic is kind of beyond what is typically 'magic'? That you have to think beyond the schools if you want to understand? Hedge Mages lack the direct route of blood and the clear path of the Circles, but they practically use old traditions of imagination to 'discover' what else 'magic' can offer them. The 'full' extent of the Fade isn't just a land to breach (through blood), or a dream realm to visit (through blue lyrium), but at least in some ways, it is a dimension to shape to your will, and through magic, shape Thedas. 

 

Hedge Mages aren't necessarily 'magical progressives' who can make up anything, but their traditions and rituals may, in storytelling, include precedent for expansion of what magic always was. Hedge Mages can be on their own, but they still tend to find affinity in some sort of old and off-the-path ways instead of something totally experimental and 'new'. So for example, Morrigan knew shapeshifting but its learned from Flemeth and that is decided to be some sort of old magic that is rarely done. Solas is considered under the disguise of being a Hedge Mage in being a very good dreamer - something not exactly unknown.

 

Hedge Mages express themselves uniquely and individually more than the average Circle Mage. They're more about being themselves and letting their power be anything they can make it be. But they're not just alone. While there's hermits, sure, it seems in the lore that Hedge Mages still have some level of communication with others; whether it be learning from ancient ruins of 'lost' magics, living in a more isolated tribe, having a family owned artifact of deviant nature, or really just existing in a culture that is considered further away from any obsession with blood magic or the controlled curriculum of the Circles (overall). They are chaotic compared to what we usually know, but they also don't exactly have some emphasis on magic that would hurt others. They're both/either of the oldest 'stuff' or experimental in trying the 'newest' stuff.

 

Hedge - a naturally grown boundary. Compared to artificial boundary, artificial freedom, natural freedom. AKA they're the ones that try out their limits but don't necessarily aim on breaking them. Particularly because they don't tend to be as practiced, educated, ambitious. They just don't want to let convention of most of the world get in their way of existing as a magical person.

 

I don't necessarily want a hedge mage protagonist but I wouldn't mind some bigger role of them. Their place in Dragon Age is often one of providing insights that wouldn't normally happen in Thedas. They inject a little bit of "Wait, how does X work again?" and get us to think a little more. But also, most of the time, Hedge Mages don't offer much in terms of skill. To expand on my older post: I could see a Hedge Mage origin mattering, but not a central role for the protagonist. Hedge Mages would typically have to have more about them that would show them as capable enough to face off against the threats of a main title Dragon Age game.

 

But I DO love the idea of being someone more likely to be an eccentric archetype of some sort. Bioware does this for companions but errs closer to neutral tones for their voiced protagonists. Some Hedge Mages even could live in a small community that doesn't interact with most of Thedas and could actually treat the Mage as a regular folk, and that Mage just turned out to be particularly resistant to anything bad like possession or accidental destruction, etc. It would be intriguing playing someone who is almost an alien to how the Chantry, Tevinter, Qunari, etc regard magic. We could roleplay into eventually deciding magic is indeed a danger, or we can be in a better position to try to convince others on how it is a boon. Stuff like that.

 

 

EDIT2: The magic of Solas and his artifacts are both indeed and not Hedge Magic. Its Hedge by present day Thedas standards but it'd be at least much more 'conventional' for how the ancient elves were. In the longer run of the series, I wouldn't be surprised to gain a context that it was an irony that Solas basically presented as a Hedge Mage in DAI when his magic was probably of the relatively experimental (though again, conventional for the state of Thedas then) sort then. Solas may not have been a 'Hedge Mage' back in the day, but he was likely a more 'unique' sort that took a different angle on the universe than others, though he may have had sympathy for at least some of the Forgotten Ones and affinity with at least one of the Creators. IMO he was a video game player trying for optimal story conditions and trying to make his headcanon part of the game even if it meant modding.

 

No one is 'born' with 'Hedge Magic'. Their environment, their culture, their training or lack of it makes Hedge Magic. Comparatively left more often with their own imagination yet not resorting to Blood Magic (at least not as the default) makes more variety in what is possible as Magic. It does not make one a stronger or improved mage, but it does either introduce or reintroduce (depending on the Mage's experiences and attention) a revealing of what Magic can be/was. The Anchor/Mark wasn't 'Hedge Magic'. It was, if anything, Fade or Rift Magic that may be considered rather Hedge today, but technically wasn't at all that in ages past, when the Fade and Thedas had more communication. Again, the Hedge stuff was a disguise. Hedge doesn't just mean 'weird different thing'. It means being part of something, individually or collectively, that explores Magic in a way to discover its supposedly natural boundaries. Qunari Saarabas themselves aren't about to break boundaries (at least not as their focus) of destructive capability, but they're still going to just unleash whatever they consider at hand. Morrigan isn't trying to shapeshift as other humans or as elves etc, but she's figured out Shapeshifting is a thing so she resists efforts to control that. The Seers communicate with spirits to protect and serve their villages, but they're not about to try to find some new way to improve that communication and change the broad nature of that relationship. They're 'chaotically traditional' - again, either to the 'nature' of themselves (thus hermitlike tendency) or to some sort of tradition or lost culture. Solas was a 'progressive' that just came off as a 'traditional' because of his lies, more alien behavior, and the fact that even the most advanced and 'new' of Elven magic would be seen as traditional - albeit a lost traditional - at this point.

[SwobyJ]

Bioware protagonists tend to have unique qualities one way or another. They're never fully Everyman from the start. The Warden* was a Grey Warden (special but not unique) that inspired or drove forward others, where otherwise all would have fallen (unique character). Hawke (at least as we got him in the release version of the game) was a particularly talented person (special but not unique) that gathered others to his side in friendship or rivalry as he reached the heights of Kirkwall's society (unique character) before its fall. Inquisitor was the most Chosen One of them all, being the first Inquisitor in centuries and then obtaining the Mark allowing them to be the only one who could close Fade rifts during a crisis.

 

If I'm to guess, I think we'll still get a unique power/status/something, but Bioware will lay off the degree of Chosen One that DAI had. Concepts like Hedge Mage, Dreamer, Blood Mage, all come to mind. I know that's super Magey but lore can create a working sort of thing for anyone. I personally theorize that we left the 'Warrior' stage of the franchise and are getting into the 'Mage' stage. Not going to explain it in depth here, but all it means in this case is that I don't see it as too much of a problem to have a greater or maybe greatest ever emphasis on magic in a game. Especially if I'm right that future games will get into the 'Rogue' stage (aka now that we're kicking ass and in a more wonderful world, lets mess with it? Sure sounds appealing to Qunari philosophy and that's where I think we're going eventually anyway. ANY WAY....).

 

 

*Though some origins can be very Everyman, we're still given the Origin level where we make some sort of name for ourselves quickly. Technically RPGs could have us squarely in the Everyman position from the start, but Bioware wants us to at least think of ourselves as NOT playing the Everyman, very quickly.

[Kakistos_]

Solas isn't a god, he is just an extremely powerful mage from an era when magic wasn't capped by the Veil and the Elf himself hates being addressed as such.

 

Lore stated that the Evanuris rose from leaders, to generals, to kings and ultimately gods because of their talent which is something a new MC certainly won't be lacking in.

 

Getting the power to confront Solas directly isn't out of question, the HoF could destroy Flemeth's body despite of Mythal's power. Not only that but half of DAI is your Inquisitor finding allies to power up his Mark or suppress the magics he needs to beat so expect us to increase our abilities dramatically as we confront and enlist new factions from Thedas.

 

I'm well aware that he isn't a God in the traditional sense. He is however ancient, extremely powerful and exceedingly intelligent with centuries if not more of experience and advanced unknown knowledge to call upon. The Mythal that we defeated was just a fraction of the whole, she was in no way a pushover and yet she still crept back from death. According to Fen'harel his counterparts, The Evanuris, could have destroyed the entire world. No one will be taking on Solas one on one and surviving longer than that entire unit of Qunari did.

[TheKomandorShepard]

I'm well aware that he isn't a God in the traditional sense. He is however ancient, extremely powerful and exceedingly intelligent with centuries if not more of experience and advanced unknown knowledge to call upon. The Mythal that we defeated was just a fraction of the whole, she was in no way a pushover and yet she still crept back from death. According to Fen'harel his counterparts, The Evanuris, could have destroyed the entire world. No one will be taking on Solas one on one and surviving longer than that entire unit of Qunari did.

His power still come from the fade as for every mage, if you find way to nullify it he would be helpless.Templars can nullify mages powers so they would be perfect match against Solas.Flemeth survived only because she was prepared and used amulet to "split her soul" .Normal mages can destroy world as well so this isn't exclusive to Evanuris and merely could mean their actions and behavior would lead to world destruction, plus it was pre-veil.  

[Kakistos_]

No they don't. The Circle was a big fail. They learned their magic through other means. 

 

 

Here are two sources in reference to the Circle Tower in Rivain. Read.

 

"A shade will weaken the living by its very proximity. If it focuses its will, it can drain a single target very quickly. Some have even been known to assault the minds of a living victim, causing confusion or horror and making the target ripe for the kill. The tragedy of a shade is perhaps that, once it has drained a target whole, its appetite is only heightened rather than slaked."

—From the journal of former Senior Enchanter Maleus, once of the Circle of Rivain, declared apostate in 9:20 Dragon Age.

 

 

"We of the Dairsmuid Circle wait now, behind barricades. I have sent word to our brother and sister mages of this outrage. When they break through, we will not die alone."

—Final journal entry of First Enchanter Rivella, slain in Dairsmuid, 9:40 Dragon

 

It is also mentioned in Asunder and The World of Thedas.

[SwobyJ]

Here are two sources in reference to the Circle Tower in Rivain. Read.

 

"A shade will weaken the living by its very proximity. If it focuses its will, it can drain a single target very quickly. Some have even been known to assault the minds of a living victim, causing confusion or horror and making the target ripe for the kill. The tragedy of a shade is perhaps that, once it has drained a target whole, its appetite is only heightened rather than slaked."

—From the journal of former Senior Enchanter Maleus, once of the Circle of Rivain, declared apostate in 9:20 Dragon Age.

 

 

"We of the Dairsmuid Circle wait now, behind barricades. I have sent word to our brother and sister mages of this outrage. When they break through, we will not die alone."

—Final journal entry of First Enchanter Rivella, slain in Dairsmuid, 9:40 Dragon

 

It is also mentioned in Asunder and The World of Thedas.

 

Ugh that's exactly what I meant. I've read those entries and the World of Thedas multiple times. This is what I meant by it being a failure. Rivain culture is among the least hospitable to a Circle. If the Circle was a success, the Seers would not be so prominent in the culture. And the Circle itself was, compared to others, more of a formality than a working system. When this was figured out, the Rite of Annulment was declared. Again, because the Circle failed at its 'job'. Hedge mages everywhere. Female mages going off to be seers instead of focusing on Chantry approved magics. Rivain culture has resistance to both Andrastan and Qunari influences, while welcoming a degree of both.

[Heimdall]

No, it's time for the Seeker class - Templar's suck.
The sooner I get to boil the lyrium inside a mage the better.

"Scary when someone has more power over you than they ought to... isn't it mage?"

So sick of the mages in this IP.

I would like that actually, they could make a quest out of aquiring it.

[Silcron]

I'm imagining bringing my Dark Souls build of a sword and shield warrior that shoots lightning javelins ala Zeus, or the Dragon's Dogma magic warrior.

Alright I'm in, as long as not all the abilities are about magic, I love my swordplay.

[Medhia_Nox]

@swobyj:  Not to mention the psychos in Rivain consider abominations "natural disasters".  

 

Idiots.  

 

@Heimdall:  Give my growing hatred for the mutants of DA and spawned in no small part by their proponents on these forums... I'd love to play someone that makes mages cry.  

 

And I find the Seekers fascinating... in fact, I consider them better than mages in a great many ways. Not as individuals... since clearly they can be just as douchey as the next person... but in the way they're "made". 

 

You'd never see a DA mage spending a year in meditation, solitude and fasting... they're too busying being out of control, emo-cutting social rampagers.  

 

I'd be terrified of the mage who showed real willpower on Thedas.

[Kimarous]

You'd never see a DA mage spending a year in meditation, solitude and fasting... they're too busying being out of control, emo-cutting social rampagers.

 

And you never see an atheist minding their own business... they're too busy insulting religious people and asserting that God doesn't exist.

 

Vocal minorities, pal. The only reason you hear about the extremists is because they're the only ones that make any noise.

[Medhia_Nox]

And you never see an atheist minding their own business... they're too busy insulting religious people and asserting that God doesn't exist.

 

Vocal minorities, pal. The only reason you hear about the extremists is because they're the only ones that make any noise.

I can't tell... are you agreeing with me?  Insulting me?  Schooling me?  I just... I mean, I actually agree with you - but I'm not sure if you're trying to say I'm wrong.  

 

Please advise.  

[Kimarous]

I can't tell... are you agreeing with me?  Insulting me?  Schooling me?  I just... I mean, I actually agree with you - but I'm not sure if you're trying to say I'm wrong.  

 

Please advise.  

 

Evidently I'm confused as well. Let's go with mutual agreement.

[Phoe77]

Wynne wasn't really all that wildly out of control, even as she was bound to a spirit from the Fade.  First Enchanter Irving was pretty chill too, as I recall, as is Bethany.  

 

Nevertheless, Seekers are interesting and I think it would be neat to be given the chance to be one, but I'm not sure how I could see it being done.  We know that it takes a lot of training and a lot of time, so it would be kind of weird to be able to choose it as a specialization, but I guess that's never stopped them before.  Really though, I think that the game would have to be built around the concept in order for it to get the amount of reactivity it deserves.  

[Xerrai]

@swobyj:  Not to mention the psychos in Rivain consider abominations "natural disasters".  

 

Idiots.  

 

@Heimdall:  Give my growing hatred for the mutants of DA and spawned in no small part by their proponents on these forums... I'd love to play someone that makes mages cry.

 

And I find the Seekers fascinating... in fact, I consider them better than mages in a great many ways. Not as individuals... since clearly they can be just as douchey as the next person... but in the way they're "made". 

 

You'd never see a DA mage spending a year in meditation, solitude and fasting... they're too busying being out of control, emo-cutting social rampagers.  

 

I'd be terrified of the mage who showed real willpower on Thedas.

I'm all for player choice and everything, but it honestly just sounds like you hate them for their popularity among fans. Which is fine, but cringe worthy if you base that growing (presumably intense) hatred more on the reactions of the fanbase than that of the actual mages in game.

[SwobyJ]

Yeah sure, mages are mutants, its not like 'magic' wasn't arguably the natural state of Thedas or anything.

[Kakistos_]

Ugh that's exactly what I meant. I've read those entries and the World of Thedas multiple times. This is what I meant by it being a failure. Rivain culture is among the least hospitable to a Circle. If the Circle was a success, the Seers would not be so prominent in the culture. And the Circle itself was, compared to others, more of a formality than a working system. When this was figured out, the Rite of Annulment was declared. Again, because the Circle failed at its 'job'. Hedge mages everywhere. Female mages going off to be seers instead of focusing on Chantry approved magics. Rivain culture has resistance to both Andrastan and Qunari influences, while welcoming a degree of both.

 

It was not a failure. It was a place for Mages to learn their craft. The Seers, prominent Mages in Rivaini culture and politics, learn their skills there. Simply because it didn't function the way the Chantry wanted it to doesn't equate to failure. Again there are two uses for the term Hedge Mage. One is as an insult and the other is for an actual Magical condition. The Mages in Rivain are the former. They are not trained and restricted in the way the Chantry wishes them to be but they are trained none the less and are likely more capable than oppressed Circle Mages elsewhere.

[TheKomandorShepard]

It was not a failure. It was a place for Mages to learn their craft. The Seers, prominent Mages in Rivaini culture and politics, learn their skills there. Simply because it didn't function the way the Chantry wanted it to doesn't equate to failure. Again there are two uses for the term Hedge Mage. One is as an insult and the other is for an actual Magical condition. The Mages in Rivain are the former. They are not trained and restricted in the way the Chantry wishes them to be but they are trained none the less and are likely more capable than oppressed Circle Mages elsewhere.

It was a failure because this circle defied very purpose of the circles that is protecting world from mages by creating abomnations and letting mages go unrestricted ,by doing that it endangered population and world.

[Kimarous]

It was a failure because this circle defied very purpose of the circles that is protecting world from mages by creating abomnations and letting mages go unrestricted ,by doing that it endangered population and world.

 

A major reason behind mage/everybody woes is the inability for culture at large (inside Circles and out) to accept the dual nature that Circles are both a learning institution and a security precaution. In the former sense, it didn't fail in its purpose; in the latter... yeah, they loosened the reigns too much. I'm sure some sort of happy balance could have been found had BoomBoom McMissesCat not set up us the "balm" and forced conflict.

[TheKomandorShepard]

A major reason behind mage/everybody woes is the inability for culture at large (inside Circles and out) to accept the dual nature that Circles are both a learning institution and a security precaution. In the former sense, it didn't fail in its purpose; in the latter... yeah, they loosened the reigns too much. I'm sure some sort of happy balance could have been found had BoomBoom McMissesCat not set up us the "balm" and forced conflict.

It failed it's purpose because learning in circles serves nothing more than as another security measure to lessen chances of mage becoming an abomnation. There is no happy balance, either you compromise safety of people in order to give mages more freedom what also means more opportunities for mages to wreck havock or compromise mages freedom in order to maintain safety what in short would mean putting more restrictions on mages.Circles were good example that balance and compromise isn't always good thing that will work and make both sides happy. 

[Medhia_Nox]

But is the argument that we want a mage from a different tradition of magic?  Or, we want a mage who simply has a handful of strange, unique traits. 

 

A hedge mage that never finds proper learning of any sort... whether through the Circles, Seers, Witches of the Wild, Avvar, etc. etc. will simply be a wild chaotic magical entity.  

 

You don't just have... "warriors that have a fireball".  That's not how hedge magic works.  It says plainly that hedge mages live chaotic lives... forget possession, one must expect that hedge mages are far more prone to killing themselves early in life (take the mage that sets himself on fire in the Mage Origin as a great example). 

 

Of course.. the player, being what he is... can be the Unique Snowflake... and, while learning how to be a warrior... somehow masked his awesome magical powers and trained secretly and privately to hone his magic to take "whatever" effect without all the trappings common to hedgemages (superstitions and charms and rituals).   

 

Do we want the biggest Mary Sue we can possible get for the next character?

[Kimarous]

You don't just have... "warriors that have a fireball".  That's not how hedge magic works.  It says plainly that hedge mages live chaotic lives... forget possession, one must expect that hedge mages are far more prone to killing themselves early in life (take the mage that sets himself on fire in the Mage Origin as a great example).

 

Also Wilhelm of Shale's backstory. Not even Circle mages given official leave to go hedge are safe from lapses in judgement. Tinkering with a golem - a soul bound to walking, talking, pigeon-crushing stone - as a counter-demon measure? At the VERY least, he shouldn't have been conducting those experiments all by his lonesome. No wonder he met an untimely end.

[Blood Mage Reaver]

@swobyj:  You'd never see a DA mage spending a year in meditation, solitude and fasting... they're too busying being out of control, emo-cutting social rampagers.  

 

I'd be terrified of the mage who showed real willpower on Thedas.

 

That's because Seekers stopped recruiting mages and turned the Rite of Tranquility into a tool of systematic oppression against the latter.

 

If mages knew that magical lobotomy was reversible the whole Circle system would never have existed in the way it did.