25 réponses à ce sujet

[!nick]

As a rift mage, I'm finding it incredibly difficult, mainly because of the enormous amounts of health enemies have. Plus, with trials, some qunari are resistant to both cold and fire damage, thus rendering my heavy hitters useless. Enemies just take forever to die. Has anyone soloed trespasser with a mage?

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Honestly, Rift Mage is crap in the harder difficulties and with Trials on. If you want to play Trespasser on Nightmare with Trials as a Mage, either go Necromancer or Knight Enchanter.

[PapaCharlie9]

Honestly, Rift Mage is crap in the harder difficulties and with Trials on. If you want to play Trespasser on Nightmare with Trials as a Mage, either go Necromancer or Knight Enchanter.

I'm still disagreeing. RM does great in JoH and Descent on Nightmare.

But Trials are a different story, and I'll admit I haven't run Trespasser with Even Ground AND Walk Softly with any class, let alone RM. But I am running all that in the main quest, so I do have a tip or two to offer.

!nick, what's your RM build and gear? Do you have upgraded Dispel? Do you have Stonefist upgraded and toggled if facing promoted enemies with Guard?

You refer to your "heavy hitters" being fire/ice. What about spirit? RM isn't quite as good as the other specializations for spirit damage, but it's not terrible either. Staff should be upgraded with Superb Spirit Rune. You should be able to tune your cooldown buffs and mana regen so that you can spam Stonefist every 4 or 5 seconds. Sure, that will get monotonous, but you're the one who wanted to run solo with Trials.

How about grenades? Bees and Confusion would be helpful.

Finally, you could use the Weakness/Sleep exploit if all else fails and go for a Storm loadout with an Encore electricity staff. If you apply Weakness to Shocked, you get Asleep, and then if you hit Asleep enemies with Dispel, Energy Barrage or Mind Blast, you get 800% damage. Not as good as a Searing Glyph, but also nothing to complain about either, particularly if you can Mind Blast a mob and get an 800% AoE effect.

Also, turns out Lightning Bolt doesn't glitch Weakness, so you could focus on that if you want. Discussed here:

http://forum.bioware...ctricity-spell/

In short, you've got to min/max to the situation. You can't rely on old standards like Searing Glyph to work every time. Adapt.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I'm still disagreeing. RM does great in JoH and Descent on Nightmare.

But Trials are a different story, and I'll admit I haven't run Trespasser with Even Ground AND Walk Softly with any class, let alone RM. But I am running all that in the main quest, so I do have a tip or two to offer.

 

I was speaking from the perspective of someone who plays the game on Nightmare with Trials and yes, I think that in that context, Rift Mage is simply ineffective. In fact, when I say Rift Mage sucks (not just in this thread but in other threads), what I mean is that it sucks for Nightmare and Trials. If you are strictly playing on Nightmare, Rift Mage is great. If you did not toggle all the trials on, especially Even Ground and Walk Softly, it is great. However, if you do, it isn't.

 

Fascinatingly, the reason for Rift Mage not being very good on Nightmare + Trials is not due to Shock-Weakness bug. The reason for this is due to the 8 ability lock in combat. For a Rift Mage to survive Nightmare on Trials, here is the list of spells they require.

1. Dispel
2. Veilstrike
3. Energy Barrage
4. Winter's Grasp
5. Fire Mine
6. Stonefist
7. Ice Mine
8. Lightning Bolt
9. Pull of the Abyss
10. Barrier

You need all of these to be a successful Rift Mage on Nightmare with Trials. You will need all 3 Rift Mage abilities. Dispel and Barrier are also a must (unless if you want to rely on Guard enchantments). Winter's Grasp and Ice Mine is there for Winter's Ruin and Ice Armor. Fire Mine is just awesome. Lightning Bolt is for enemies like Qunari. Lastly, Energy Barrage is there to proc masterwork enchantments.

 

Personally, here is how I play as a mage on Nightmare with Trials

1. Fade Step
2. Dispel
3. Energy Barrage
4. Wall of Fire
5. Blizzard
6. Walking Bomb
7. Static Cage
8. Barrier

This setup allows me to:-

• Recuperate mana and avoid damage with Fade Step.
• Deal with enemy spellcasters, demon Rift spawns and negative status effects with Dispel.
• Proc masterwork enchantments with Energy Barrage.
• Cause fire damage over time, crowd control and induce panic (which synegizes with Blinding Terror passive) with Wall of Fire. The damage over time element also goes well with Static Cage.
• Cause frost damage over time, trigger Ice Armor with Blizzard (I am using Winter Winds upgrade). The damage over time also goes well with Static Cage. I could have used Ice Mine but I wanted the damage over time synergy with Static Cage.
• Cause spirit damage over time and explosion detonation damage via Walking Bomb. Once again, its damage over time goes well with Static Cage.
• Cause lightning damage over time, paralysis and crowd control with Static Cage.
• Gain damage protection and mana regeneration with Barrier since I have Rejuvenating Barrier passive.

I always open with Static Cage followed by a damage over time spell and watch the delicious combo funsies take place. If mana is low, I use Fade Step. If I need single target damage, I rely on Energy Barrage and Walking Bomb.

 

Fyi, Wall of Fire's panic effect only fail against 14 enemies in the game and a few of them have to be enraged for it to not work. So do not underestimate it. http://dragonage3.wi...ife.com/Enemies

 

Obviously this build is not perfect. For one, the almighty Fire Mine is not in it. But I can use it in pretty much any situation without having to worry about toggles or needing to swap out abilities.

 

Alternatively, you can ignore the Blinding Terror Passive and go with this setup instead. If you do end up going this route, bring along a second mage with Wall of Fire and/or Horror so you can get some use out of your own Blinding Terror passive. Ideal mage for that would be Dorian since he is a Necromancer himself and because he is an awesome guy. But if you are soloing then don't do this.

1. Fade Step.
2. Dispel.
3. Energy Barrage.
4. Fire Mine.
5. Ice Mine.
6. Walking Bomb.
7. Static Cage
8. Barrier.

Or this one. If you wish to strictly use the Frost spell to proc Ice Armor, then use Ice Mine with Chilling Array upgrade. If you wish to use Frost spell to proc Ice Armor and do some damage, then use Blizzard with Winter Winds upgrade. Either way, the mana difference is negligible - Its only a 5 mana difference between Ice Mine and Winter Winds' Blizzard.

1. Fade Step.
2. Dispel.
3. Energy Barrage.
4. Fire Mine.
5. Blizzard.
6. Walking Bomb.
7. Static Cage.
8. Barrier.

This is why I endorse specializing in Necromancer if you want to play as a mage on Nightmare with Trials - You can make Necromancer work with just Walking Bomb. With Rift Mage you need all three abilities to get the most out of it. Now obviously you can do the same with Knight Enchanter by just using Fade Cloak but given that Knight Enchanter training and specialization quest involves crafting the Spirit Blade, it would be ridiculous to not use it. The Necromancer's specialization quest involves you crafting a talking skull, so that leaves some room for interpretation.

[PapaCharlie9]

I was speaking from the perspective of someone who plays the game on Nightmare with For a Rift Mage to survive Nightmare on Trials, here is the list of spells they require.

• 
  
• Dispel
• Veilstrike
• Energy Barrage
• Winter's Grasp
• Fire Mine
• Stonefist
• Ice Mine
• Lightning Bolt
• Pull of the Abyss
• Barrier

You need all of these to be a successful Rift Mage on Nightmare with Trials. You will need all 3 Rift Mage abilities. Dispel and Barrier are also a must (unless if you want to rely on Guard enchantments). Winter's Grasp and Ice Mine is there for Winter's Ruin and Ice Armor. Fire Mine is just awesome. Lightning Bolt is for enemies like Qunari. Lastly, Energy Barrage is there to proc masterwork enchantments.

That looks right to me. Not all at the same time, obviously, since you only have 8 slots and need to save one for Aegis, but in terms of what to have on hand depending on the situation, sure.

But how does that equate to RM sucks? I mean, if you strip out all the abilities common to any mage, you're left with three abilities that work great in NM+Trials situations. Compared to what?

Necro has Walking Bomb. I might make an argument for Horror as some kind of CC too, but even you don't use it in your Dorian build.

KE has barrier regen and Spirit Blade. Fade Cloak is pretty good peak damage, but it's a hit-or-miss kind of thing, works great when you have the right target in the right place, otherwise, it's just taking up a slot on your actives.

It looks to me like RM has the edge in terms of versatility. And I haven't even mentioned how Weakened stacks up against Panicked and ... well, nothing equivalent for KE, right?

[Bayonet Hipshot]

*snip*

 

Rift Mage could have been versatile if Bioware allowed us to switch out abilities during combat. But they don't which means you need to know what you are going up against in order to make the most out of Rift Mage.

 

That can the fact you cannot use lightning enchanted weapons, most of the Storm spells except Lightning Bolt & Energy Barrage, Elemental Mines and Flask of Lightning is a point against its versatility.

 

Don't get me wrong - I like Rift Mage specialization, especially from the lore perspective (and I am big on the lore) but it has plenty going against it. It reminds me of Shapeshifter in DAO where the specialization is supposed to be cool and it has an interesting lore but it does not perform in gameplay. Luckily we have mods that fix the shapeshifter's problem.

 

If we can have a mod that either fixes the Shock-Weakness bug or allows you to switch ability during combat, then Rift Mage would be good for me. Alas, no such mod exist.

 

The thing with Horror as a CC tool is that there is a better option in the Inferno tree. The radius is smaller than Wall of Fire, Horror does no damage but Wall of Fire does damage over time (if you use Terror upgrade) and Horror is far more expensive than Wall of Fire.

 

By the way, I want your opinion on Wall of Fire vs Fire Mine for Necromancer. Would you use Wall of Fire over Fire Mine due to Blinding Terror Passive or would you use Fire Mine for its superior damage ?

[Lendario]

Rift Mage could have been versatile if Bioware allowed us to switch out abilities during combat. But they don't which means you need to know what you are going up against in order to make the most out of Rift Mage.

 

That can the fact you cannot use lightning enchanted weapons, most of the Storm spells except Lightning Bolt & Energy Barrage, Elemental Mines and Flask of Lightning is a point against its versatility.

 

Don't get me wrong - I like Rift Mage specialization, especially from the lore perspective (and I am big on the lore) but it has plenty going against it. It reminds me of Shapeshifter in DAO where the specialization is supposed to be cool and it has an interesting lore but it does not perform in gameplay. Luckily we have mods that fix the shapeshifter's problem.

 

If we can have a mod that either fixes the Shock-Weakness bug or allows you to switch ability during combat, then Rift Mage would be good for me. Alas, no such mod exist.

 

The thing with Horror as a CC tool is that there is a better option in the Inferno tree. The radius is smaller than Wall of Fire, Horror does no damage but Wall of Fire does damage over time (if you use Terror upgrade) and Horror is far more expensive than Wall of Fire.

 

By the way, I want your opinion on Wall of Fire vs Fire Mine for Necromancer. Would you use Wall of Fire over Fire Mine due to Blinding Terror Passive or would you use Fire Mine for its superior damage ?

 

I'm taking this chance to ask you this because i seen a lot of good posts from you.

I'm rolling a new game, Nightmare with trials on and i want to go Necro. What build would you suggest me for max DPS? I'm using a full party, with Solas as full support.

[PawsPause]

Check out Seb Alleman on youtube. Hes here on the forums under another name not sure its been awhile since hes been on, but he pretty much changed the minds of a lot of folks who doubted the power of the necro. He does a few solos.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I'm taking this chance to ask you this because i seen a lot of good posts from you.

I'm rolling a new game, Nightmare with trials on and i want to go Necro. What build would you suggest me for max DPS? I'm using a full party, with Solas as full support.

 

Max DPS ? If DPS is your primary concern, you should go with Double Dagger Rogue. A player controlled Double Dagger Rogue has the highest DPS in game, not a Necromancer mage.

 

If you want to maximize the damage from Necromancy, you need to make use of the Walking Bomb trick. Walking Bomb's mana cost is not calculated until it hits a target which means you can circumvent the cost of casting a single Walking Bomb by casting Walking Bomb and Energy Barrage in quick succession. The Energy Barrage will hit first resulting in Walking Bomb's cost not being calculated.

 

Next, you want your Masterwork enchantment to be Fade Touched Cotton which gives you a chance to apply Walking Bomb. If you are a Necromancer, you can control this masterwork-procced Walking Bomb.

 

So this gives you three Walking Bombs - 1 from the trick, 1 from masterwork enchantment and 1 from normal spellcasting.

 

As for the rest of your skills, you will want to use:-

1. Fade Step
2. Dispel
3. Energy Barrage
4. Fire Mine
5. Ice Mine or Blizzard
6. Walking Bomb
7. Static Cage
8. Barrier

and you are good to go. You will also want to use Amulet of Renewal and Ring of Doubt. Amulet of Renewal increase mana regeneration which is something the Necromancer needs and Ring of Doubt allows a mage to enter stealth which allows them to crit when they come out of stealth. As for rings, go with Ring of Life Drain to make use of Simulacrum. Alternatively, you could use Fade Touched Snoufleur Skin to gain on heal on hit. 

 

Now for Solas, you will want to build him like this:-

1. Veilstrike
2. Dispel
3. Ice Mine or Winter's Grasp
4. Stonefist
5. Fire Mine or Wall of Fire
6. Revival or Energy Barrage
7. Pull of the Abyss
8. Barrier

This is how you would want a full support Solas to look like.

 

As for warrior squadmate, go with a Sword and Shield Cassandra or Sword and Shield Blackwall. Cassandra is powerful against spellcasters of all types including mages and spirits/demons. Blackwall is very difficult to kill.

 

When it comes to Rogues, go with Archer Varric or Double Dagger Cole. If you choose to go with Cole, you will need to micromanage him but if you do so, he will have a very high DPS, one of the highest in game, which is what you want. Alternatively, you could give him daggers with "Guard on hit" masterworks to alleviate the need to micromanaging him. Otherwise, you could go with Varric since his Artificer abilities are useful for the whole party.

[Gya]

Check out Seb Alleman on youtube. Hes here on the forums under another name not sure its been awhile since hes been on, but he pretty much changed the minds of a lot of folks who doubted the power of the necro. He does a few solos.

 

Holy carpfish, Batman! That guy is insane! 

[PapaCharlie9]

Holy carpfish, Batman! That guy is insane!

Yeah, the video of the final boss battle in Trespasser is really good. Notice that his big damage routine is Static Cage + Energy Barrage, with lots of critical hits. Not a lot of Necro going on. Occasional use of Walking Bomb, triggered. Fade Step to escape. It's a good build.

If I recall correctly, he posts as ottffsse. He hasn't posted in a while, but check out his old posts, lots of good stuff in there.

[Gya]

Yeah, the video of the final boss battle in Trespasser is really good. Notice that his big damage routine is Static Cage + Energy Barrage, with lots of critical hits. Not a lot of Necro going on. Occasional use of Walking Bomb, triggered. Fade Step to escape. It's a good build.

If I recall correctly, he posts as ottffsse. He hasn't posted in a while, but check out his old posts, lots of good stuff in there.

 

The funny thing is, as I was watching his video, I was thinking, ottffsse would approve of this 

[Bayonet Hipshot]

He is Ottffsse. His videos were the ones that introduced me to the glory of Ice Armor.

 

His playstyle involves using Static Cage, Energy Barrage, Walking Bomb and Fire Mine as his primary source of damage. He uses Fade Step for evasion and mana, Barrier for damage mitigation and Ice Mine for Ice Armor.

[Blood Mage Reaver]

The problems with Rift Mage is that it was made focused on team fights rather than soloing, the bulk of it's abilities lie in making enemies more vulnerable and less damaging for other party members to exploit.

 

With that said, Rift Mages have one immense advantage over both Necromancers and Knight Enchanter's, they can have a virtually unlimited supply of mana.

 

The key for this class is having a Sigil of the Great Bear and an Enhanced Cooldown Amulet (or higher) coupled with Blizzard and Ice Armor.

 

This more or less ensures you'll take very low damage, especially from weakened enemies, while constantly damaging and freezing every enemy around you for the rest of the fight. The itens mentioneD also make it possible to quickly cast spells and reapply weakness in high succession without ending up on a deadlock.

 

For soloing, it would be most welcome to use an armor crafted with Fade Touched Snoufleur Skin (Heal) alonside ample stagger and health bonuses. I would also recommend that you pick Guardian Spirit besides Dispel and keep yourself armed with Bees and Confusion grenades.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

For those who wish to make a Knight Enchanter that can do well in Nightmare with Trials, I present you all:- Caster Knight Enchanter. Yep, screw the lightsaber Spirit Blade, we will just rely on just the Force pure spellcasting to carry us through.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Build (for non-Humans)

• Knight Enchanter Specialization - 7 (Spirit Blade, Combat Clarity, Fade Cloak+, Fade Shield, Veiled Riposte, Knight-Protector)
• Inferno School - 7 (Immolate+, Flashpoint, Pyromancer, Clean Burn, Fire Mine+)
• Winter School - 5 (Fade Step+, Winter's Grasp+, Winter Stillness)
• Storm School - 5 (Energy Barrage, Conductive Current, Static Charge, Static Cage+)
• Spirit School - 7 (Barrier+, Peaceful Aura, Guardian Spirit, Dispel+, Rejuvenating Barrier)

Tactical Bar (for non-Humans)

1. Energy Barrage
2. Dispel (Transmute Magic) / Immolate (Wildfire)
3. Fade Step (Frost Step)
4. Fade Cloak (Decloaking Blast)
5. Fire Mine (Flaming Array)
6. Winter's Grasp (Winter's Ruin)
7. Static Cage (Lightning Cage)
8. Barrier (Energetic Defense)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Build (for Humans)

• Knight Enchanter Specialization - 7 (Spirit Blade, Combat Clarity, Fade Cloak+, Fade Shield, Veiled Riposte, Knight-Protector)
• Inferno School - 8 (Immolate, Flashpoint, Pyromancer, Clean Burn, Fire Mine+, Wall of Fire+)
• Winter School - 5 (Fade Step+, Winter's Grasp+, Winter Stillness)
• Storm School - 5 (Energy Barrage, Conductive Current, Static Charge, Static Cage+)
• Spirit School - 7 (Barrier+, Peaceful Aura, Guardian Spirit, Dispel+, Rejuvenating Barrier)

Tactical Bar (for non-Humans)

1. Energy Barrage
2. Dispel (Transmute Magic) / Wall of Fire (Lasting Flames)
3. Fade Step (Frost Step)
4. Fade Cloak (Decloaking Blast)
5. Fire Mine (Flaming Array)
6. Winter's Grasp (Winter's Ruin)
7. Static Cage (Lightning Cage)
8. Barrier (Energetic Defense)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Notes

• This build is a close to medium range combat mage. If you are too far away, you will have to rely solely on Rejuvenating Barrier for mana regeneration instead of Combat Clarity and Rejuvenating Barrier.
• There is no Ice Armor in this build because you do not need it since you will have Barrier, Fade Step and Fade Cloak.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Staff - Lightning staves with Spirit Rune. Why ? Because you already have 2 Inferno spells and 2 Winter spells. So naturally its best to take a Lightning Staff with a Spirit Rune so that you can have more lightning damage and spirit damage. Unique Lightning staves for casters...

1. Isana's Song (loot from Emissary Alpha in Heidrun Thaig)
2. Hakkon's Wisdom (loot from Ice Dragon Hakkon Wintersbreath)
3. Heart of Pride (solve the Veilfire Puzzle in the Unknown Ruin section of the Deep Roads in Trespasser DLC)
4. Scepter of Razikale (loot from chest during Storvacker's rescue quest)
5. Fade-Knocker (slay Wyvern in Crestwood as part of the Wyrm Hole quest)
6. Staff of Aidahn Allied (get Dagna, it will be in Skyhold's Undercroft)
7. Stormbreak (short list perk)
8. Tempest's Center (random trials reward)
9. Staff of the Void (loot from Hivernal)

Armor - Up to you.

 

Accessories - Amulet of Renewal and Ring of Doubt is what I tend to put on all my mages. The rest is up to you.

[!nick]

How about grenades? Bees and Confusion would be helpful.

Finally, you could use the Weakness/Sleep exploit if all else fails and go for a Storm loadout with an Encore electricity staff. If you apply Weakness to Shocked, you get Asleep, and then if you hit Asleep enemies with Dispel, Energy Barrage or Mind Blast, you get 800% damage. Not as good as a Searing Glyph, but also nothing to complain about either, particularly if you can Mind Blast a mob and get an 800% AoE effect.

Also, turns out Lightning Bolt doesn't glitch Weakness, so you could focus on that if you want. Discussed here:

http://forum.bioware...ctricity-spell/
 

 

I am running confusion grenade. Thanks for the link, that helps. I don't know what I'll drop for this though. 8 slot limit is killing me.

A major source for my troubles is that with trials, the physics for stonefist and PotA seems to weird out. Enemies bounce together and go flying out of the circle.

 

The problems with Rift Mage is that it was made focused on team fights rather than soloing, the bulk of it's abilities lie in making enemies more vulnerable and less damaging for other party members to exploit.

 

With that said, Rift Mages have one immense advantage over both Necromancers and Knight Enchanter's, they can have a virtually unlimited supply of mana.

 

The key for this class is having a Sigil of the Great Bear and an Enhanced Cooldown Amulet (or higher) coupled with Blizzard and Ice Armor.

 

 

 

True, but mana is not an issue for any spec now because of amulet of renewal and energizing step. KE has rejuvenating barrier and combat clarity on top of that. So rift mage's only draw now is the impact detonator and crowd control, which is still great. 

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I am running confusion grenade. Thanks for the link, that helps. I don't know what I'll drop for this though. 8 slot limit is killing me.

 

True, but mana is not an issue for any spec now because of amulet of renewal and energizing step. KE has rejuvenating barrier and combat clarity on top of that. So rift mage's only draw now is the impact detonator and crowd control, which is still great. 

 

Confusion grenade is awesome. I found the best use for it is during the Gurd Harofsen boss fight in Jaws of Hakkon DLC. Throw one of the Confusion Grenade on Gurd's minions and they will kill him for you.

 

Rift Mage's draw is mana, combos, crowd control, damage reduction and status effect increment. All those are dependent on Weakness, except for crowd control and combos. If you lose Weakness or it bugs out, then you lose mana regeneration, damage reduction, and status effect increment.

 

The only way I see to make Rift Mage awesome is to remove the disable ability swap feature while in combat. Like I said, the problem with Rift Mage is not the Shock-Weakness bug since we can use Lightning Bolt but the lack of slots or the lack of ability swapping in combat.

1. Veilstrike
2. Energy Barrage
3. Ice Mine
4. Stonefist
5. Fire Mine
6. Winter's Grasp
7. Lightning Bolt
8. Pull of the Abyss
9. Dispel
10. Barrier
11. Aegis of the Rift

Either we have 11 slots or 8 slots that allows for ability changes / swapping in combat. I am sure it is easy to remove the disable ability swapping feature. Someone should make a mod for it. Make Rift Mage great again !

[myztikrice]

Why are we talking Nightmare + Trials and then worry about Focus abilities? I completed all DLC with Nightmare and Trials without using a single focus ability. And Ice Mine can be handled by a second mage.

[Lendario]

Confusion grenade is awesome. I found the best use for it is during the Gurd Harofsen boss fight in Jaws of Hakkon DLC. Throw one of the Confusion Grenade on Gurd's minions and they will kill him for you.

 

Rift Mage's draw is mana, combos, crowd control, damage reduction and status effect increment. All those are dependent on Weakness, except for crowd control and combos. If you lose Weakness or it bugs out, then you lose mana regeneration, damage reduction, and status effect increment.

 

The only way I see to make Rift Mage awesome is to remove the disable ability swap feature while in combat. Like I said, the problem with Rift Mage is not the Shock-Weakness bug since we can use Lightning Bolt but the lack of slots or the lack of ability swapping in combat.

1. Veilstrike
2. Energy Barrage
3. Ice Mine
4. Stonefist
5. Fire Mine
6. Winter's Grasp
7. Lightning Bolt
8. Pull of the Abyss
9. Dispel
10. Barrier
11. Aegis of the Rift

Either we have 11 slots or 8 slots that allows for ability changes / swapping in combat. I am sure it is easy to remove the disable ability swapping feature. Someone should make a mod for it. Make Rift Mage great again !

 

Thank you for your earlier response.

Turns out i really want to go Mage, for rp and dialogue. I tried going Rogue for Assassin, but i got to 10 and restarted as Mage.

I know Assassin DPS is awesome as i managed to optimize and use Cole pretty well in my Templar run, but i have this Mage itch.

 

I still can't decide between RM and Necro through and i'm almost flipping a coin when i reach 10. xD

Necro is awesome because Walking Bomb hits like a truck and i can use Lightning Cage. But it sucks because i HATE having to spend points skills like Horror and not using it.

RM is awesome because of PoTA, weakness and mana regen, but it sucks because of the shock bug and NM/Triaks enemies weakness resist.

 

But...Does a RM really need Barrier and Dispel? I Feel like a support Solas could handle those alone.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Thank you for your earlier response.

Turns out i really want to go Mage, for rp and dialogue. I tried going Rogue for Assassin, but i got to 10 and restarted as Mage.

I know Assassin DPS is awesome as i managed to optimize and use Cole pretty well in my Templar run, but i have this Mage itch.

 

I still can't decide between RM and Necro through and i'm almost flipping a coin when i reach 10. xD

Necro is awesome because Walking Bomb hits like a truck and i can use Lightning Cage. But it sucks because i HATE having to spend points skills like Horror and not using it.

RM is awesome because of PoTA, weakness and mana regen, but it sucks because of the shock bug and NM/Triaks enemies weakness resist.

 

But...Does a RM really need Barrier and Dispel? I Feel like a support Solas could handle those alone.

 

I prefer to make characters that are self sufficient by themselves or as self sufficient as they can be, because that's who I am and who I try to be in real life so it rubs off on my characters.

 

If you are playing on Nightmare with Trials, you will need at least 2 sources of magic dispelling because mages and demons will be much harder to fight. This can come from either a Mage's Dispel or a Templar's Spell Purge. The thing is, if you are playing as a Mage, the only source of Spell Purge you will get is from Cassandra.

 

The issue with that is Cassandra only gains her Templar specialization when you reach Skyhold. So before that you will have to rely on Mages for dispelling magic. So yes, you could not have Barrier or Dispel on your own Mage but that means running a 3 Mage party - Mage Inquisitor, 2 more Mages for Dispel. Since we are limited to only 4 people in a party, that means you have to forgo a Rogue or a Warrior which is not practical.

 

As for Barrier, if you are very good at managing threat levels, use Fade Step, have access to enchantments that heal your character and use Guard gaining enchantments, then yes you do not need Barrier. Which means at the lower levels at least, you will need to use Barrier.

[jonmoore86]

If you are playing on Nightmare with Trials, you will need at least 2 sources of magic dispelling because mages and demons will be much harder to fight. This can come from either a Mage's Dispel or a Templar's Spell Purge.

 

I've seen this opinion and others about having two dispels, and honestly early game, i think there are only three instances that you NEED two dispels. Even then, you can get by with having your support mage have an upgraded dispel and just cc the hell out of em until they die.

 

I tend to not get dispel on my damage mage, and just get barrier for guardian spirit.

[PapaCharlie9]

I've seen this opinion and others about having two dispels, and honestly early game, i think there are only three instances that you NEED two dispels. Even then, you can get by with having your support mage have an upgraded dispel and just cc the hell out of em until they die.

 

I tend to not get dispel on my damage mage, and just get barrier for guardian spirit.

 

How early is early? Sure, it's not really a problem until you get to promoted enemies that have barrier ability and mines, like Venatori with spellbinders. That can happen as early as the Haven raid, though.

 

But your Guardian Spirit isn't going to do much good if you run into a promoted enemy ("Walk Softly" Trial) with the Barrier Breaker trait. I've seen that trait on all sorts of enemies, including, I kid you not, on a nug.

 

Is two Dispels absolutely necessary? No, nothing really is in this game. Well, except for class specific stuff, like mage to whammy obstacles, rogue for locks, warrior for wall bashing. It sure is handy to have two dispels, though, when you run into a bunch of promoted enemies with mines and barrier and whatnot.

[jonmoore86]

How early is early? Sure, it's not really a problem until you get to promoted enemies that have barrier ability and mines, like Venatori with spellbinders. That can happen as early as the Haven raid, though.

 By early i meant pre-skyhold. right after, i get cassandra's spell purge and keep her with me most of the time. I mainly meant the mage boss in witchwood and the two rebel mages in fallow mire and storm coast. and i do keep barrier on the bar until i get ice armor, then i drop it.

 

just saying, ive done nightmare+even ground+walk softly+take it slow on rift and ke, and never felt the need to have a dispel on my rift mage.

[Blood Mage Reaver]

True, but mana is not an issue for any spec now because of amulet of renewal and energizing step. KE has rejuvenating barrier and combat clarity on top of that. So rift mage's only draw now is the impact detonator and crowd control, which is still great. 

 

The problem with the Amulet of Renewal is that it's looted from Imshael and by the time you confront him on Suledin's Keep with all the trials on you have pretty much finished 90% of the main game.

 

Objectively speaking, the only enemy in the game which is immune to the rift mage's weakness debuf is the Giant but it is also immune to panic so necromancers don't fare any better besides using concentrated Walking Bomb which deals more damage than Stonefist.

 

Despite that minor advantage against giants, rift mages have a greater advantage when fighting other bosses who are immune to panic but not weakness and those include not only every story boss but also dragons.

 

The biggest disadvantage of the Necromancer is that it relies on enemies dying to replenish mana and increase damage but with every trial on they can take a lot of punishment before going down.

 

The Rift Mage on the other hand just needs to constantly weaken enemies in order to have virually unlimited mana reserves and they aren't just increasing their susceptability to damage but also making them less damaging by 30%. When you combine that with Ice Armor the Rift Mage becomes nearly unkillable as the KE.

 

The only mage class who basically outlives anything is the Knight Enchanter, I don't know how they fare against barrier breakers but everything else in the game is downright incapable of taking them down. Their only disadvantage is that they suck on crowd control and you have to run after your enemies to fight them.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

The problem with the Amulet of Renewal is looted from Imshael and by the time you confront him on Suledin's Keep with all the trials on you have pretty much finished 90% of the main game.

 

Objectively speaking, the only enemy in the game which is immune to the rift mage's weakness debuf is the Giant but it is also immune to panic so necromancers don't fare any better besides using concentrated Walking Bomb which deals more damage than Stonefist.

 

Despite that minor advantage against giants, rift mages have a greater advantage when fighting other bosses who are immune to panic but not weakness and those include not only every story boss but also dragons.

 

The biggest disadvantage of the Necromancer is that it relies on enemies dying to replenish mana and increase damage but with every trial on they can take a lot of punishment before going down.

 

The Rift Mage on the other hand just needs to constantly weaken enemies in order to have virually unlimited mana reserves and they aren't just increasing their susceptability to damage but also making them less damaging by 30%. When you combine that with Ice Armor the Rift Mage becomes nearly unkillable as the KE.

 

The only mage class who basically outlives anything is the Knight Enchanter, I don't know how they fare against barrier breakers but everything else in the game is downright incapable of taking them down. Their only disadvantage is that they suck on crowd control and you have to run after your enemies to fight them.

 

If you are not soloing, Ice Armor is not necessary as long as you have a warrior to pull aggro properly. However, yes I agree that without any special items, Rift Mages and Knight Enchanters are very powerful.

 

Necromancers need to rely on special items and enchantments to reach their maximum potential. Rift Mages and Knight Enchanters have to simply rely on their spells.

 

As for crowd control, Knight Enchanter does not really need crowd control because they have lots of ways to avoid or mitigate damage. My favorite melee Knight Enchanter setups goes something like this -

1. Energy Barrage (no upgrade)
2. Spirit Blade (either upgrade works)
3. Fade Cloak (decloaking blast)
4. Fade Step (frost step)
5. Fire Mine (flaming array)
6. Chain Lightning (either upgrade works)
7. Dispel (transmute magic) / Winter's Grasp (winter's ruin)
8. Barrier (energetic defense)

You just Fade Step into a group of enemies, drop Flaming Array and destroy everything. Or use Winter's Ruin. Or use Chain Lightning to fill up your Spirit Blade charges.