319 réponses à ce sujet

[MrFob]

You don't follow many games do you? This news is reported ALL the time for any high profile game. As I said, it was very public when Witcher 3 had like 6-8 senior devs in key points leave about 8 months before that game released. Didn't hurt the quality of that game based on user reviews and Metacritic.

 

It's sites creating news on slow days for clicks. I'm saying don't worry about it until you see the game with your eyes. It's okay to be cautious but I'm not going to lose sleep over something that's common in the game industry especially around big AAA titles with hundreds of devs on it.

 

Nah, I don't loose sleep over it either. Still, I think it is noteworthy and if ME:A turns out to have similar problems than ME3, I'll be sure to point to this thread in a year.

 

Also, if you read my previous posts, you'll see that it's not just that one occurrence that got me interested, it's a number of factors that make me think this may have an impact.

[The Arbiter]

You don't follow many games do you? This news is reported ALL the time for any high profile game. As I said, it was very public when Witcher 3 had like 6-8 senior devs in key points leave about 8 months before that game released. Didn't hurt the quality of that game based on user reviews and Metacritic.

 

It's sites creating news on slow days for clicks. I'm saying don't worry about it until you see the game with your eyes. It's okay to be cautious but I'm not going to lose sleep over something that's common in the game industry especially around big AAA titles with hundreds of devs on it.

Can you give me the source of the devs leaving CDPR? Also FYI the wonky combat in Witcher 3 had an impact on the game due to the designer leaving 

[Il Divo]

You can't mean BG. You can even really mean BG2, because the dialogue isn't that great there. But BG has awful dialogue. And then we have other older games like NWN. 

 

I'm always quizzical when I see people lambaste Bioware's post-EA games and then immediately bring up Baldur's Gate 1 (I can't speak to 2 to any reasonable capacity). I don't think Bioware has an RPG that's more lackluster in terms of dialogue, characters, and presentation. For it's time, I could see it being considered highly innovative. But it's highly reliant on cheese factor, far and away above even what the ME series gave us. 

[Il Divo]

It's always annoying when people bring up Planescape: Torment as an example why another game's writing is terrible. Planescape: Torment is perhaps the greatest written game ever made. It's analogous to saying X basketball player is **** compared to Michael Jordan. Tiresome comparison that tells you virtually nothing about the game to which it's being compared.

 

Also, this^. 

[straykat]

Jordan has many competitors actually.

 

But then again, I think Planescape does too. Not many RPGs though.

[Draining Dragon]

I'm always quizzical when I see people lambaste Bioware's post-EA games and then immediately bring up Baldur's Gate 1 (I can't speak to 2 to any reasonable capacity). I don't think Bioware has an RPG that's more lackluster in terms of dialogue, characters, and presentation. For it's time, I could see it being considered highly innovative. But it's highly reliant on cheese factor, far and away above even what the ME series gave us.

IMO, BG1 was garbage in terms of dialogue.

BG2, on the other hand, was excellent.

[FKA_Servo]

BG1 in many of its aspects is practically a proof of concept.

 

It would be ridiculous to claim that every single Bioware game has been better than the previous one - but I'll stand behind the assertion that every Bioware game since BG1 has been better than BG1.

[In Exile]

I'm always quizzical when I see people lambaste Bioware's post-EA games and then immediately bring up Baldur's Gate 1 (I can't speak to 2 to any reasonable capacity). I don't think Bioware has an RPG that's more lackluster in terms of dialogue, characters, and presentation. For it's time, I could see it being considered highly innovative. But it's highly reliant on cheese factor, far and away above even what the ME series gave us.

It was never innovative in terms of dialogue or story or even RP. It was innovative in terms of gameplay, essentially making the D&D combat experience crisp.

[pdusen]

Can you give me the source of the devs leaving CDPR? Also FYI the wonky combat in Witcher 3 had an impact on the game due to the designer leaving 

 

What wonky combat?

[The Arbiter]

What wonky combat?

If you choose standard movement, Geralt fights like a guy with a worm in his butt... When you have this one guy who is your sole target he instead jumps to another guy and another guy midway in execution of your primary target. To make matters worst if you decide to lock onto one target the stupid camera also gets locked to the target and you can't see the others targeting your back. I am not sure what the devs where going for it seems they attempted to create like real life blind spots for Geralt during combat which explains him changing targets instantly almost unpredictably if someone approaches him from behind or sideways

[Hiemoth]

It's always annoying when people bring up Planescape: Torment as an example why another game's writing is terrible. Planescape: Torment is perhaps the greatest written game ever made. It's analogous to saying X basketball player is **** compared to Michael Jordan. Tiresome comparison that tells you virtually nothing about the game to which it's being compared.

 

The argument annoys me even further than that as, and I write this as someone who loves Ps:T, that game also did have some serious flaws. For example, a lot of the really indepth choices were available if the PC poured a lot of points to WIS, INT and CHA, but there was no reward for players focusing on physical stats. The combat system and encounter designs were pretty horrid, the game was really, really short partially due to the complexity of the system and so forth. At times it even almost collapsed on that complexity, because it would build scenarios without really giving any payoff for them. And all of this ignoring that it also did use the AD&D system which was just horrid.

 

It is an awesome game and I would heartily recommend it to anyone, but the way it is elevated as the sign of perfection in discussions is always frustrating to me. Especially since it was a pretty big financial flop when it came out, so focusing on that model isn't exactly a sustainable business model.

 

It sounded like their plan was to make games before the original ME trilogy took place, but after polling discovered that fans (perhaps unsurprisingly) overwhelmingly wanted a sequel in some capacity. So the choice was either canonize an ending or Andromeda.

 

I'm personally very glad they are continuing the series, though I wouldn't have minded if ME3 was the last one. BioWare once had another sci-fi license that they decided not to make another sequel for: Knights of the Old Republic. I was pissed, but then their new project turned out to be Mass Effect, so that taught me about being close-minded.

 

I don't know, I am looking forward to MEA, even if I am nervous about the exploration focus, but I kind of have to respect the game developers deciding that this is a story we want to tell in this world and focusing on delivering that instead of trying to figure out a way to keep the world open for further games. I mean most of the choices in ME3 would be impossible to do if they wanted to keep the world open for sequels in the future.

[Hiemoth]

I'm always quizzical when I see people lambaste Bioware's post-EA games and then immediately bring up Baldur's Gate 1 (I can't speak to 2 to any reasonable capacity). I don't think Bioware has an RPG that's more lackluster in terms of dialogue, characters, and presentation. For it's time, I could see it being considered highly innovative. But it's highly reliant on cheese factor, far and away above even what the ME series gave us. 

 

I'm always puzzled by it as well. I remember when BG1 came out, it did have a really huge impact on the genre as it did introduce a lot of elements that were considered impossible before, but in retrospect it is really clumsy. Which is okay, as it was the first step. BG2 improved on it in almost every conceivable way, but it also was far from perfect in large part due to the already clumsy AD&D mechanics which were never meant for high-level characters to begin with.

 

I think that currently there is almost a certain kind of baggage due to BG games, similar to DAO, as they are constantly used as these shining examples despite being first steps upon which the devs wanted to improve upon.

[straykat]

I'm always puzzled by it as well. I remember when BG1 came out, it did have a really huge impact on the genre as it did introduce a lot of elements that were considered impossible before, but in retrospect it is really clumsy. Which is okay, as it was the first step. BG2 improved on it in almost every conceivable way, but it also was far from perfect in large part due to the already clumsy AD&D mechanics which were never meant for high-level characters to begin with.

 

I think that currently there is almost a certain kind of baggage due to BG games, similar to DAO, as they are constantly used as these shining examples despite being first steps upon which the devs wanted to improve upon.

 

I wouldn't praise much about DAO's gameplay. And not much about the main story either, other than Loghain. But it's still great for the attention given to the PC variations. Along with being the right kind of story for that. As a group, the Inquisition is not the same as Grey Wardens...and trying to replicate it halfassedly was dumb.

[Mcfly616]

 Also FYI the wonky combat in Witcher 3 had an impact on the game due to the designer leaving 

  Combat seemed just fine to me. Nothing "wonky" about it. Your label is rather subjective.

[goofyomnivore]

  Combat seemed just fine to me. Nothing "wonky" about it. Your label is rather subjective.

I thought the combat was pretty subpar until that patch a few days after release that cleaned up some bugs/smoothed some interactions out. After that patch it wasn't bad. It was okay, but nothing I would write home about.

[Seraphim24]

I'm always quizzical when I see people lambaste Bioware's post-EA games and then immediately bring up Baldur's Gate 1 (I can't speak to 2 to any reasonable capacity). I don't think Bioware has an RPG that's more lackluster in terms of dialogue, characters, and presentation. For it's time, I could see it being considered highly innovative. But it's highly reliant on cheese factor, far and away above even what the ME series gave us. 

 

Well those are two different people... the one blasting and the one who brought up Baldur's Gate...

[Seraphim24]

BG1 in many of its aspects is practically a proof of concept.

 

It would be ridiculous to claim that every single Bioware game has been better than the previous one - but I'll stand behind the assertion that every Bioware game since BG1 has been better than BG1.

 

Ok! That's fine... look somehow it got brought up and I remember very clearly playing BG2 and going... oh this is still fun but lost some of the lustre of BG1 is all... just like in NWN it was the same sort of feeling... I still played them all and, all in all, had some positive experiences.

 

I think it would be equally ridiculous to claim that any given Bioware game features a cataclysmic gap in the experience no?

[KaiserShep]

But a game can be pretty and still be poor.

 

 

You can just use Battlefront as an example. It sure is nice to look at, and that's about it. 

[NKnight7]

You can just use Battlefront as an example. It sure is nice to look at, and that's about it. 

 

Or The Order: 1886. Nice looking game, but that's pretty much what it has going for it.

[Drakoriz]

U guys are making a big deal about ppl switching job.

 

Really at the point that ME:A probably is this will have 0 impact.

 

And probably this ppl are leave for different reasons and no bc they dislike Bioware.

[Linkenski]

Can you give me the source of the devs leaving CDPR? Also FYI the wonky combat in Witcher 3 had an impact on the game due to the designer leaving 

Not to mention the third act and ending (not the epilogues) are a hot mess. If stuff went down as opposed to the game simply getting a bit rushed at the end, then that explains it. I haven't managed to finish that game twice yet because I was so disappointed in the finale of the plot. Almost zero actual causality between choice and consequence that makes it wholly unsatifying to experiment with choices on subsequent playthroughs and the climax was just... seriously, what the **** was that?

 

You can just use Battlefront as an example. It sure is nice to look at, and that's about it. 

My first impression of Battlefront is this: First map: Brown. Second map: Green, Third map: Jungle. etc.

 

Dice are bad at making unique level-design, like, really really bad IMO.

[Drakoriz]

People left, but I think it was still in the designing stage. Some of their best writers left, before ME2 was even finished as well. You can see the effect their loss had. Chris L'Etoile wrote Legion, Thane, and Ash. Brian Kindregan wrote Jack and Grunt, as well as the male Shaman/Tuchanka arc. Among other things. All of those took a much different direction. And then of course Drew K left.

 

Kristina Norman also left, but some would say ME3's gameplay was an improvement on her ideas. She set the tone for the action direction in ME2.

 

i really dont see the issue ME 3, only problem was the ending. Pretty much everything till the point of the star child shows up.

 

ME trilogy suffer much bc it never have a solid idea on how the 3 games where to play. Everyone know the whole story was making on during the dev of 2 and 3.

 

They never have the whole idea.

[Giantdeathrobot]

The argument annoys me even further than that as, and I write this as someone who loves Ps:T, that game also did have some serious flaws. For example, a lot of the really indepth choices were available if the PC poured a lot of points to WIS, INT and CHA, but there was no reward for players focusing on physical stats. The combat system and encounter designs were pretty horrid, the game was really, really short partially due to the complexity of the system and so forth. At times it even almost collapsed on that complexity, because it would build scenarios without really giving any payoff for them. And all of this ignoring that it also did use the AD&D system which was just horrid.

 

It is an awesome game and I would heartily recommend it to anyone, but the way it is elevated as the sign of perfection in discussions is always frustrating to me. Especially since it was a pretty big financial flop when it came out, so focusing on that model isn't exactly a sustainable business model.

 

 

All that is true, but Plancescape is a cult classic precisely because it has awesome writing. Not because it is a perfect game, because it's basically the best written video game that many people have played. Even if the rest of the experience is lackluster, that aspect alone makes it stand out. 

 

It also uses its creative setting very well. Because while I like both Dragon Age and The Witcher, I still think fantasy RPGs are way too fixated on not-medieval Europe with elves and dwarves. Planescape on the other hand was a very unique setting, and the writers exploited it as much as they could to great effect.

[In Exile]

All that is true, but Plancescape is a cult classic precisely because it has awesome writing. Not because it is a perfect game, because it's basically the best written video game that many people have played. Even if the rest of the experience is lackluster, that aspect alone makes it stand out. 

 

It also uses its creative setting very well. Because while I like both Dragon Age and The Witcher, I still think fantasy RPGs are way too fixated on not-medieval Europe with elves and dwarves. Planescape on the other hand was a very unique setting, and the writers exploited it as much as they could to great effect.

 

This is why the best parts of DA:I to me are those that abandon it's not-medieval Europe setting for the surreal and supernatural nature of Thedas, or feature non-traditional fantasy races (the Qunari).

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

How about discussing something really important, like Sansa Stark is preggers by Ramsay Bolton! Or will Melisandre bring Jon Snow back to life?