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What origin should I choose?


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#26
dragonflight288

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Since you already played an elf previously, and both CE and HN are both pretty connected to the story, it's a tough choice.  Considering other factors you explained in the other thread, (like you want to spare Loghain) you may want to play the HN.  A HN has more reason/roleplay sense to spare the regent who was selling elves to Tevinter blood mages than a man who actually loses family to that little bit of dirty dealing.

 

If you're going to do another playthrough after this, I'd recommend a female CE as their origin tale is by far the better of the two genders.  Usually Bioware doesn't do that much of a difference from genders but the female CE vs male has no comparison really.  Epic.

 

I don't know about that. I mean, yes, I think the female city elf is more emotionally invested than the male, but there is room for roleplaying as the male for how much guilt and self-punishment you put yourself through for not preventing the women from being taken from your own wedding. Last time I played a male city elf, I had a lot of fun going with "I'll try to be the best husband I can, oh no, my cousin and bride have been stolen and I could do nothing! Let me go in....ah! Shianni!!! Why wasn't I faster? Why couldn't I stop them from being taken?"

 

Yes, the female is epic, but there is room for that as well as the male, it just takes more work. 


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#27
straykat

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I don't know about that. I mean, yes, I think the female city elf is more emotionally invested than the male, but there is room for roleplaying as the male for how much guilt and self-punishment you put yourself through for not preventing the women from being taken from your own wedding. Last time I played a male city elf, I had a lot of fun going with "I'll try to be the best husband I can, oh no, my cousin and bride have been stolen and I could do nothing! Let me go in....ah! Shianni!!! Why wasn't I faster? Why couldn't I stop them from being taken?"

 

Yes, the female is epic, but there is room for that as well as the male, it just takes more work. 

 

My reasoning was if you talk to the other PCs, they urge to be careful. Like Soris' parents got killed in the last purge. And the death of Adaia really affects his mind too. I played a really aggressive elf, but in this one moment, he thought he was doing good by thinking for a bit and worrying about how many would get killed. It was a mistake. He should have stayed aggressive.

 

But OTOH, I forgot that Alarith doesn't sell you the skillbook later if you did this. lol.. So I'm trying another playthrough where male is the hero.

 

But I still like the other way. I love guilt ridden characters.


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#28
MichaelN7

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If you're stuck, Human Noble is good to use, the only caveat is that it's for Warriors and Rogues (Mages have their own Origin).

It fits very well thematically with the main story, and ties in well with the Awakening expansion.

 

The other origin I would recommend is the Mage, since that also plays into the story.

 

Granted they all do, but Human Noble and Mage are my favorites.



#29
dragonflight288

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If you want to marry Anora and spare Loghain, be a noble. If he survives Origins and you marry Anora, he'll tell us he wants grandchildren in Awakening.

#30
sylvanaerie

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I don't know about that. I mean, yes, I think the female city elf is more emotionally invested than the male, but there is room for roleplaying as the male for how much guilt and self-punishment you put yourself through for not preventing the women from being taken from your own wedding. Last time I played a male city elf, I had a lot of fun going with "I'll try to be the best husband I can, oh no, my cousin and bride have been stolen and I could do nothing! Let me go in....ah! Shianni!!! Why wasn't I faster? Why couldn't I stop them from being taken?"

 

Yes, the female is epic, but there is room for that as well as the male, it just takes more work. 

There's an immediacy and danger present in the female version that is lacking on the male.  The danger isn't as personal or impactful (for me) for the male as it is for the female.

Spoiler

 

Not saying the male lacks impact, it's just so much less of an experience than the female, from my perspective.  But then, as I pointed out upthread, I'm female and relate more to the female mind-set.  I can play males, but with few exceptions, (my King Cousland and Daylen Amell being stand out males I connected to) the roleplay is nearly non-existent when I play a male.  Call it a personal preference I guess. ;)

 

And responding to Cailan about how exactly Duncan chose you to be a warden is epic on a City elf, regardless of gender, but again has a bigger impact for me on the female.


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#31
straykat

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My main overall vibe for female is that of a badass survivor. While the male is stereotypical heroic.

 

Overt heroes might sicken some people. Anita Sarkeesian actually used the Male City Elf to criticize DAO, and how it propagates "damsels in distress". Perhaps it does. She can still go suck an egg.

 

I like female/hero more, but guilt is so easy roleplay with. He doesn't have any cool lines with Cailan, but all of my character's actions are a sort of death wish. Why else, for example, would some unlikely City Elf just jump into the Circle Tower and fight demons (demons he's never seen or heard about before).. when the Templars don't even want to do it? They gotta be crazy. Moreso than the other origins.

 

Not that the other City Elf versions can't be crazy too though. They're all crazy in their own way. :P



#32
sylvanaerie

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Another distinction that comes to me is some NPC's refer to your female elf as 'pretty'.  (Vaughan and Loghain for two come to mind) which just adds a level of ..."Ick" to the conversation.  "Viewing the elves as a negotiable commodity put on Thedas just to be exploited" comes to mind and adds a whole new level of creep to it in the case of Loghain considering his actions later.  As far as I know no one refers to the male CE as "pretty" except Zevran who's trying to flirt with the warden.  

 

Duncan certainly didn't recruit the CE female because she was a 'pretty face'.

 

Killing both Vaughan and Loghain on my CE was especially satisfying since neither of them saw her as 'pretty' right before she lopped off their heads.



#33
straykat

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Leliana says a similar thing to both genders, about being pleasant to look at.

 

But Loghain is no Vaughn... not just yet. He had the Night Elves at one point. I think at Ostagar, he might have been sincere.



#34
Jaison1986

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Another distinction that comes to me is some NPC's refer to your female elf as 'pretty'.  (Vaughan and Loghain for two come to mind) which just adds a level of ..."Ick" to the conversation.  "Viewing the elves as a negotiable commodity put on Thedas just to be exploited" comes to mind and adds a whole new level of creep to it in the case of Loghain considering his actions later.  As far as I know no one refers to the male CE as "pretty" except Zevran who's trying to flirt with the warden.  

 

Duncan certainly didn't recruit the CE female because she was a 'pretty face'.

 

Killing both Vaughan and Loghain on my CE was especially satisfying since neither of them saw her as 'pretty' right before she lopped off their heads.

 

You really don't know when to let go huh? I have to say I had a great deal of satisfaction when my F!Surana had Alistair sent to the hangman. Too bad she didn't personally saw him squirm. I bet he made a funny noise when his neck snapped at the rope.



#35
sylvanaerie

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You really don't know when to let go huh? I have to say I had a great deal of satisfaction when my F!Surana had Alistair sent to the hangman. Too bad she didn't personally saw him squirm. I bet he made a funny noise when his neck snapped at the rope.

 

Don't know, I always assumed he got his head lopped off with an axe.  Or maybe a sword--though as far as I know, only one person in history got her head removed via sword (Anne Bolyn).  Not sure someone can make sounds if no air is passing through their larynx (which is what happens if you get hanged)?



#36
straykat

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Death just seems like overkill to me. If I have a beef with Alistair, I think drunk and dejected Alistair is appropriate (that is, if I go that route). He doesn't even want to be king anyways.



#37
Jaison1986

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Don't know, I always assumed he got his head lopped off with an axe.  Or maybe a sword--though as far as I know, only one person in history got her head removed via sword (Anne Bolyn).  Not sure someone can make sounds if no air is passing through their larynx (which is what happens if you get hanged)?

 

If one is dropped violently enough, their neck may snap at impact, killing the individual instantly and possibly resulting in some noise.



#38
sylvanaerie

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If one is dropped violently enough, their neck may snap at impact, killing the individual instantly and possibly resulting in some noise.

It's possible I imagine, if the lungs had air pushed out of them by the impact before the rope closes off the trachea.  The biggest key sign of a choking victim (beyond the instinctive 'grab your throat' maneuver)  is an inability to speak/make noise because air can't pass through the windpipe.  The heimlich uses residual air in the lungs to push out the obstruction in the windpipe, so some air is usually present even if you got caught on an exhalation.

 

I've never actually read the mechanics of a hanging or witnessed one in person, only seen it on movies/tv in old westerns.  All I know for sure is the length of the rope vs the weight of the person determines the efficiency of the execution either snapping the neck or strangulation.



#39
ArcadiaGrey

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Death just seems like overkill to me. If I have a beef with Alistair, I think drunk and dejected Alistair is appropriate (that is, if I go that route). He doesn't even want to be king anyways.

 

It's a shame they made it an option. Imo Alistair shouldn't be able to die so that he can always come back to the franchise.  Making Maric's only heir killable wastes a great character, and makes him irrelevant going forward.  He can never do anything major as he might be dead.  

 

So I wish they'd left it with him just being a wandering drunk.  That's what I chose, I'll never kill him.  I have the same opinion about Loghain tbh, the hangman's noose is too often used in DAO if you ask me.  I'd say it's like the suicide mission all over again but that came afterwards soooo.....


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#40
sylvanaerie

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It's a shame they made it an option. Imo Alistair shouldn't be able to die so that he can always come back to the franchise.  Making Maric's only heir killable wastes a great character, and makes him irrelevant going forward.  He can never do anything major as he might be dead.  

 

So I wish they'd left it with him just being a wandering drunk.  That's what I chose, I'll never kill him.  I have the same opinion about Loghain tbh, the hangman's noose is too often used in DAO if you ask me.  I'd say it's like the suicide mission all over again but that came afterwards soooo.....

 

I'd actually have preferred better closure to the Loghain story than what we get.  Having him locked up in the tower instead of executed in front of his child.  Would have made a cool scene I think, coming into Ft Drakon to find him and a handful of guards fighting off darkspawn.  He covers the warden's flank as you finish the mission to the roof and his fate is left 'unknown' like unQueen Anora's.  Would leave him open for a return.

Spoiler



#41
ArcadiaGrey

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I'd actually have preferred better closure to the Loghain story than what we get.  Having him locked up in the tower instead of executed in front of his child.  Would have made a cool scene I think, coming into Ft Drakon to find him and a handful of guards fighting off darkspawn.  He covers the warden's flank as you finish the mission to the roof and his fate is left 'unknown' like unQueen Anora's.  Would leave him open for a return.

Spoiler

 

Yes I'd have preferred that too.  After reading The Stolen Throne Loghain became one of my favourite characters, and I enjoyed saving him and taking him around on quests to hear his dialogue.  He should never have been killable, leaving him alive would keep the potential of his character open for future games.  He's so well written with a great past and is a link to the old Ferelden of Maric, Rowan and the Orlesian occupation.  That's an important history that most players will never know, leaving him alive would have let the writers explore that more.

 

I've only gone thru Inquisition once so far, but it was with Loghain.  I loved seeing how he'd made a life for himself within the Wardens.  If he'd been guaranteed to survive DAO, then we could have had either him or Alistair and just got rid of Stroud altogether.


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#42
Ghost Gal

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I'd actually have preferred better closure to the Loghain story than what we get.  Having him locked up in the tower instead of executed in front of his child.  Would have made a cool scene I think, coming into Ft Drakon to find him and a handful of guards fighting off darkspawn.  He covers the warden's flank as you finish the mission to the roof and his fate is left 'unknown' like unQueen Anora's.  Would leave him open for a return.

Spoiler

 

The reason we can't just have him locked in the tower to be executed or tried later is because we have to either kill him or recruit him to end the civil war. No matter how thoroughly we win the Landsmeet, at least a small amount of nobles support Loghain, which would allow for political unrest later should other nobles try to rebel or seize power in his name. The game makes it clear that the only way to stop the Blight and ensure political stability to recover afterwards is if the Landsmeet is united, and the only way to ensure they're united is to take Loghain out of the picture politically and give them a monarch they can all rally behind. If Loghain is not explicitly on your side (as in, takes the Joining and becomes your subordinate), then he's a political loose end that needs to be tied up with the hangman's noose. Execution or recruitment--there's no other way unless you want to invite dissension later.

 

Yes I'd have preferred that too.  After reading The Stolen Throne Loghain became one of my favourite characters, and I enjoyed saving him and taking him around on quests to hear his dialogue.  He should never have been killable, leaving him alive would keep the potential of his character open for future games.  He's so well written with a great past and is a link to the old Ferelden of Maric, Rowan and the Orlesian occupation.  That's an important history that most players will never know, leaving him alive would have let the writers explore that more.

 

I've only gone thru Inquisition once so far, but it was with Loghain.  I loved seeing how he'd made a life for himself within the Wardens.  If he'd been guaranteed to survive DAO, then we could have had either him or Alistair and just got rid of Stroud altogether.

 

Speak for yourself. I personally think he should never have been sparable since I think that's more than he deserves, but I'm not going to go around trying to force people to kill him just because that's what I do in all my playthroughts. Just because you've completely forgiven him and think he deserves redemption doesn't mean everyone else has.

 

(Yes, I've read The Stolen Throne. No, it doesn't make me any more charitable toward him. In fact, it made me hate him even more. In the game, everyone talks about how he was an honorable man who only recently started acting like a chronic backstabber out of pride and paranoia. The book reveals that, no, he was always dishonest and spiteful, and Flemeth herself warned Maric that "he will betray you, each time worse than the last." Not to mention his passion for freeing Ferelden doesn't give him brownie points for me anymore because it just makes his willingness to sell elves into slavery to fund his own armies, and callous disregard to a city elf who objects to it, all the more hypocritical and infuriating. Apparently "slavery" (more like military occupation) is only an unforgivable travesty when it happens to human freeholders like him, but it's completely fine when it's elves. He even tells an elven Warden who spares him and tell him so at camp, "Honestly, elf, do you think that among that among all my crimes is the one that keeps me up at night? It's a bit egotistical of you, don't you think?" Says the man that almost allowed the darkspawn to take all of Ferelden for fear of Orlais. **** you, you hypocrite. If you don't care about your own subjects that you sold into slavery, then I don't care about you or your tragic past. Go rot.)



#43
ArcadiaGrey

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Speak for yourself. I personally think he should never have been sparable since I think that's more than he deserves, but I'm not going to go around trying to force people to kill him just because that's what I do in all my playthroughts. Just because you've completely forgiven him and think he deserves redemption doesn't mean everyone else has.

 

(Yes, I've read The Stolen Throne. No, it doesn't make me any more charitable toward him. In fact, it made me hate him even more. In the game, everyone talks about how he was an honorable man who only recently started acting like a chronic backstabber out of pride and paranoia. The book reveals that, no, he was always dishonest and spiteful, and Flemeth herself warned Maric that "he will betray you, each time worse than the last." Not to mention his passion for freeing Ferelden doesn't give him brownie points for me anymore because it just makes his willingness to sell elves into slavery to fund his own armies, and callous disregard to a city elf who objects to it, all the more hypocritical and infuriating. Apparently "slavery" (more like military occupation) is only an unforgivable travesty when it happens to human freeholders like him, but it's completely fine when it's elves. He even tells an elven Warden who spares him and tell him so at camp, "Honestly, elf, do you think that among that among all my crimes is the one that keeps me up at night? It's a bit egotistical of you, don't you think?" Says the man that almost allowed the darkspawn to take all of Ferelden for fear of Orlais. **** you, you hypocrite. If you don't care about your own subjects that you sold into slavery, then I don't care about you or your tragic past. Go rot.)

 

Wow, a little salty there.  This is a forum where I can speak my mind anyway I like, my opinion is valid as it is MY opinion and I'm not forcing it on anyone.  Also I'd like to know where I said that I've 'completely forgiven him and think he deserves redemption'?  Pretty sure I didn't say that, don't put words into my mouth.

 

My point is, love him or loathe him, he was a very well written character in the books and deserved better writing in DAO, and should be in further games.  Even if you can't stand the man, he's a great character.  Dragon Age needs more relatable bad guys instead of the almost cartoon like writing of Loghain (in DAO, not the Stolen Throne) and Corypheus.

 

If you want to play games full of daisy and daffodils and loveable characters who never do anything wrong, then may I suggest Animal Crossing?


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#44
straykat

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Loghain's interesting, but I've never seen him in DAI. He's really that worth it, huh?

 

I agree for them needing more villains like that. I think only the Arishok comes close.


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#45
ArcadiaGrey

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Loghain's interesting, but I've never seen him in DAI. He's really that worth it, huh?
 
I agree for them needing more villains like that. I think only the Arishok comes close.


I hoped for more honestly, but he gives the impression of a man who's spent the last ten years realising he made the wrong choices, and trying to atone for them within an Order that doesn't necessarily want him.
It's interesting and if you're doing a few playthroughs, making a Warden that can respect Loghain's military achievements or believes in second chances, so saves him, is well worth it.

#46
straykat

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I hoped for more honestly, but he gives the impression of a man who's spent the last ten years realising he made the wrong choices, and trying to atone for them within an Order that doesn't necessarily want him.
It's interesting and if you're doing a few playthroughs, making a Warden that can respect Loghain's military achievements or believes in second chances, so saves him, is well worth it.

 

I'll keep it in mind. Like you, I only have one Inquisitor. And don't plan on more. I did try others before, but deleted them. Heh. So technically, it's just one.



#47
ArcadiaGrey

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I'll keep it in mind. Like you, I only have one Inquisitor. And don't plan on more. I did try others before, but deleted them. Heh. So technically, it's just one.

 

Ah well, at least it's nice to keep these other choices in mind for the future.  Should you ever go back you can create a different world and at least the cameos will be fresh content.

 

I plan on 3 more, but after my first I need a break tbh.  102 hours is a long long playthrough, I want to want to play again if you know what I mean, rather than make myself do it.  Loghain will be making one more appearance, with Stroud and Alistair having one each.  I'm really looking forward to seeing Alistair as a Warden, I'm assuming it's the role he'll be happiest with.



#48
straykat

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Ah well, at least it's nice to keep these other choices in mind for the future.  Should you ever go back you can create a different world and at least the cameos will be fresh content.

 

I plan on 3 more, but after my first I need a break tbh.  102 hours is a long long playthrough, I want to want to play again if you know what I mean, rather than make myself do it.  Loghain will be making one more appearance, with Stroud and Alistair having one each.  I'm really looking forward to seeing Alistair as a Warden, I'm assuming it's the role he'll be happiest with.

 

Well, this is probably unpopular, but I always liked the DA2 prebuilt state with the Martyr. Where the Dalish actually sacrificed herself and let Loghain live. It's always intrigued me.... I'd like to fill the blanks on what would make them do that. So that's probably how I'd set up Loghain in DAI, personally.



#49
ArcadiaGrey

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Well, this is probably unpopular, but I always liked the DA2 prebuilt state with the Martyr. Where the Dalish actually sacrificed herself and let Loghain live. It's always intrigued me.... I'd like to fill the blanks on what would make them do that. So that's probably how I'd set up Loghain in DAI, personally.

 

That's a powerful story.  Perhaps the elf would think that Loghain had the knowledge, history and ear of the human nobles to help Ferelden going forward, whereas a Dalish elf would never get the respect or voice they deserved?

 

I'm more inclined to kill off the Warden these days knowing they barely have a voice in DAI.  Perhaps it's better they die a hero.  And as time goes on I find it harder and harder to justify the DR.  It leaves a nasty taste these days, especially since I played a dwarf noble who was super excited to die fighting a dragon.  What a noble death!

 

Sounds like a great world state though.



#50
straykat

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My main Warden is US too.. but man, that's above the call of duty.