.... If you don't help to appreciate ANYONE they will ALL fight you.
Also, how is "not recruiting" the same as "not helping", especially considering some characters are mandatory?
Because he only accepts very specific, cherry-picked circumstances that are okay in his book. I wouldn't take it too seriously. I think he's just trying to have fun and stir some feels anyway.
You don't have to help Alistair with killing Loghain as he very obviously wants to kill him already. I even let Alistair duel Loghain and after he wins, he immediately lops Loghain's head off without any input from the Warden. (That's my worldstate anyway. I enjoy it.) If the Warden wasn't there, I assume the same thing would happen.
Isn't it canonical that this would have happened? That's the worldstate in The Darkspawn Chronicles.
Because he only accepts very specific, cherry-picked circumstances that are okay in his book. I wouldn't take it too seriously. I think he's just trying to have fun and stir some feels anyway.
He's not even consistent with his cherry picking. Deliberately killing Leliana doesn't count, but deliberately killing Zevran does count. Lol ok. But yeah, he's probably akin to a troll anyway, judging by his other threads. Or thinks his headcanon is universal canon. God knows why I still try.
Isn't it canonical that this would have happened? That's the worldstate in The Darkspawn Chronicles.
I take everything with Darkspawn Chronicles with a grain of salt. It's Alistair running things. Kind of a crap canon.
Isn't it canonical that this would have happened? That's the worldstate in The Darkspawn Chronicles.
Good point. I was also wondering whether or not to use TDC as an example because it's an alternative universe that never happens, nor is it meant to. But, yes. In that universe, Alistair pulls his own weight just fine and does all the leading as the last Warden.
.... If you don't help to appreciate ANYONE they will ALL fight you.
Also, how is "not recruiting" the same as "not helping", especially considering some characters are mandatory?
Without your influence Morrigan becomes a slave to her own mother and Leiliana turns into a psychopath. I don't class either of those things as being fine.
He's not even consistent with his cherry picking. Deliberately killing Leliana doesn't count, but deliberately killing Zevran does count. Lol ok. But yeah, he's probably akin to a troll anyway, judging by his other threads. Or thinks his headcanon is universal canon. God knows why I still try.
Lol what?if i remember it is Zevran who is attacking the warden during their first encounter while leliana is simply recruitable or not Lolyou did't even bother to distinguish between their situation while making a nonsensical generalization
Considering that Leliana is one of the characters who you can kill, simply for not agreeing with them, but that's getting dismissed as "you have to deliberately go psycho and kill some of them at best" and "Killing characters deliberately is one thing while not helping them is another thing", why does that rule not apply to Zevran? Because he attacked the Warden? Because Leliana and Wynne WILL attack you if you defile the Sacred Ashes in their presence.
Considering that Leliana is one of the characters who you can kill, simply for not agreeing with them, but that's getting dismissed as "you have to deliberately go psycho and kill some of them at best" and "Killing characters deliberately is one thing while not helping them is another thing", why does that rule not apply to Zevran? Because he attacked the Warden? Because Leliana and Wynne WILL attack you if you defile the Sacred Ashes in their presence.
Morrigan is beyond salvation it's either she or you also until now i have yet to see how this well of sorrow will affect the owner.Leliana psycho path is the hardened leliana and she is not by default she need the PC influence for that path you have to manipulate her
Morrigan is dumb enough to want to drink from the Well if you don't intervene and stop her. Becoming a slave to her mother is literally her worst nightmare.
Leiliana does not need your influence to become hardened, it's the opposite. If you don't interact with her in Inquisition she always become hardened.
So the 2 most major female characters in the series both need your influence not to destroy their own lives or go crazy. Same as the males.
Why you think that their life are destroyed?Morrigan is dumb enough to want to drink from the Well if you don't intervene and stop her. Becoming a slave to her mother is literally her worst nightmare.
Leiliana does not need your influence to become hardened, it's the opposite. If you don't interact with her in Inquisition she always become hardened.
So the 2 most major female characters in the series both need your influence not to destroy their own lives or go crazy. Same as the males.
If we're discussing a scenario without the Warden, why bring up the scenarios where Zevran attacks the Warden or needs to have certain approval with the Warden? Without the Warden, none of those things should happen. Unless they happened the same way but with Alistair.
Zevran first encounter is scripted to be a fight,a mandatory fight regardless of choices.Leliana and Wynne fight is only triggered if the warden follow all these steps1 recruit them both2 Bring them during the relative quest3 defile the urn at their presence while knowing perfectly the result since none of these two characters hide their religious attachmentSo you have creating in purpose a tons of "if" and compared them to a mandatory event.
Why do the "if"'s matter? You're talking about "what if" situations when calling the male characters losers, why does it suddenly matter right now that Leliana and Wynne dying is a "what if" situation as opposed to Zevran's situation?
It isn't a scenario without the warden since the result would be everyone dead because Urthemiel won,but simply one where the PC influence is minimal(Warden,Champion or Inquisitor)If we're discussing a scenario without the Warden, why bring up the scenarios where Zevran attacks the Warden or needs to have certain approval with the Warden? Without the Warden, none of those things should happen. Unless they happened the same way but with Alistair.
You are using the what if situationsWhy do the "if"'s matter? You're talking about "what if" situations when calling the male characters losers, why does it suddenly matter right now that Leliana and Wynne dying is a "what if" situation as opposed to Zevran's situation?
You are using the what if situations
I simply tried to show the differences between characters when the PC don't help them or fulfill their requests and most(if not all)females npc don't have any problems.
With Zebran em Zevran simply spare him is an act of help since his life depend on you without any if because that encounter is mandatory.
Ah, classic argument. "No u!"
Why does it even matter that it's mandatory? Yes you CAN kill Zevran, you also CAN kill Leliana and Wynne. But I guess you're just stuck in this idea that showing mercy is synonymous for 'helping'. Never mind the fact that the "it's mandatory" argument would show that it's got nothing to do with character's genitals.
It isn't a scenario without the warden since the result would be everyone dead because Urthemiel won,but simply one where the PC influence is minimal(Warden,Champion or Inquisitor)
So only you personally can decide which very specific circumstances and very specific outcomes are acceptable? Gotcha.
Well, I'll leave it be. We apparently have very different opinions. However, I don't consider that to be a problem and I'm sure we can both live with that.
Well, I'll leave it be. We apparently have very different opinions. However, I don't consider that to be a problem and I'm sure we can both live with that.
So many people have say that to me, lol. (If you are one of those indivuals, then O.o)
Heh, I believe it's for the best to stop arguing if neither side seems to budge. Better than getting stuck in circular arguments up to the point it gets frustrating for everybody. And, I mean, it's just opinions anyway. People are allowed to have theirs. (Sometimes it's hard to see the fine line between explaining one's point and downright arguing about it, though. At least it is for me.) So, yes, I suppose this is quite a popular way to drop an argument that's starting to lead/leading nowhere.
I don't think we, as in you and I, have ever got into an argument, though. Which is good. I prefer fangirling over the games to arguing about them anyway. I do remember exchanging a post or two, though.
I don't think we, as in you and I, have ever got into an argument, though. Which is good. I prefer fangirling over the games to arguing about them anyway. I do remember exchanging a post or two, though.
Sten had plenty of moral fiber. It was pre-retcon Qunari moral fiber, but he had loads.
Cullen is just fan service really, not sure why you named him as one of the good males.
I think that aside from some few notable exceptions(your highness Solas and Cullen of DAI) the others are a bunch of losers with no fiber and strong temper.The few that could have been interesting to explore die (like Duncan,Daveth and Riordan).So what's wrong with males in DA? Where are the badassess strong male characters?
Your highness Solas?
Oh, you're one of them.
Move along people, nothing to see here.
You got to be kidding me? And it's funny you use Solas and Cullen as an exception to the rule.
Solas, Cullen, badass and strong? Alright, if you say so.
Yeah, while I did appreciate how Bioware actually tried to make Cullen a character in this around instead of merely something to hang your towels off of, their attempts to portray him as some kind of expert military leader fell a little flat. Seriously, Bioware, he was the XO of a concentration camp. That doesn't make him Eisenhower, no matter how much you pretend otherwise.
Solas is a loser who has continuously failed to do what he had planned.
So there.
Indeed, as I've mentioned before, he's the Elven God of Complete $#@*-Ups,
Whatever, I punched a (would-be) god.
"I've had it with your condescending lectures!" 
Still doesn't change the fact that he's just an eggead who doesn't like the world. And sleeps too much.
Well put.
...
I don't understand this thread at all.
Apparently, what makes a companion qualify as 'badass' is if they're independent and don't need the protagonist.... All right... Let's see how the women stack up:
- Leliana needs the Warden to help her figure out her own personality (whether she's Stabby McStabbin' or Sweetie McCupcake)
- Morrigan needs the Warden to help her fix her mommy issues
- Wynne needs the Warden to fix son issues
- Isabela needs Hawke to properly fix the tome/stealing issues
- Merrill needs Hawke to fix her mirror/demon issues
- Aveline needs Hawke to fix her relationship/duty issues
- Cassandra needs the Inquisitor to fix her faith issues
- Vivienne needs the Inquisitor to fix her dying husband/political issues
- Sera needs the Inquisitor to fix her snobby nobles issues
- Josephine needs the Inquisitor to fix her family issues
... Huh.
Indeed, and not a single one of them are lesser for it. Everyone needs help every once in a while, men and women, and there's nothing wrong with acknowledging that and seeking it out. Add in the fact that the player character is the hero, and helping people is what heroes are supposed to do, and this comes across as a rather strange objection.
I agree and I am absolutely, positively offended. As a Masculinist I can not support this blatant disregard of Male characters. Bioware's portrayal of Males in the DA series is just offensive.I think that aside from some few notable exceptions(your highness Solas and Cullen of DAI) the others are a bunch of losers with no fiber and strong temper.
The few that could have been interesting to explore die (like Duncan,Daveth and Riordan).
So what's wrong with males in DA? Where are the badassess strong male characters?
I guess at least most of them have bad-ass moments as well as their "loser" moments.
In terms of Cullen I think most badass thing Cullen did was standing up to Meredith at end of DA2: "You will have to go through me first". In case of Solas- I think he's quite badass in Trespasser DLC at least.
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