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Venting 2.0 Now With Even Better Ventilation

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#1301
Sifr

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"Sexual orientation IS teachable"

giphy.gif

 

Ugh, that's maddening.

 

Even if we take the idea of supposedly hetero men or women entering into same-sex relationships in prison as an example of this supposedly taking place, that's probably because they had prior bisexual leanings that they didn't realise existed.

 

People who claim to be "prison gay" don't often stop having relationships with women after they've finished doing porridge at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

 

(Apologies if that British prison slang referring to serving time behind bars, sounded like dirty innuendo when read out of context) :lol:

 

Same as if you threw a bunch of gay or lesbian people onto an island with the respective opposite gender, they wouldn't immediately become "island straight" as a result of having no other options available.

 

As with the above example, those who might pursue a "hetero" relationship are more likely to discover they are closer to bisexual on the spectrum, but that wouldn't diminish their attraction to their own gender.

 

Sexuality is a broad spectrum and some people can find it may fluctuate over time, but that does not necessarily mean that you can "teach" people to be one orientation or another. Human sexuality doesn't really work that way and isn't that easily defined (or "correctable").



#1302
Biotic Apostate

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People who claim to be "prison gay" don't often stop having relationships with women after they've finished doing porridge at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

 

(Apologies if that British prison slang referring to serving time behind bars, sounded like dirty innuendo when read out of context) :lol:

Haha o man, that did sound really dirty  :lol:

 

People really should learn about the Kinsey scale. There are people, who are interested only in the opposite sex, but then meet that one same-sex person they fall for. It doesn't mean they turned gay, it just means they are predominantly interested in the opposite sex.

 

And agreed, prison relationships (and I mean relationships, pure sex doesn't count) just expose hidden bisexuality. It's still not that accepted to be LGBT, so some people prefer to ignore their same-sex attraction, if they are also attracted to the opposite sex.



#1303
Sifr

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Haha o man, that did sound really dirty  :lol:

 

People really should learn about the Kinsey scale. There are people, who are interest only in the opposite sex, but then meet that one same-sex person they fall for. It doesn't mean they turned gay, it just means they are predominantly interested in the opposite sex.

 

And agreed, prison relationships (and I mean relationships, pure sex doesn't count) just expose hidden bisexuality. It's still not that accepted to be LGBT, so some people prefer to ignore their same-sex attraction, if they are also attracted to the opposite sex.

 

Conversely, it's interesting how soap operas and television often show characters (or perhaps it's just the writers) unable to reconcile gay or lesbian characters entering into hetero relationships. While same-sex relationships are now more commonly depicted in fiction, bisexuality is still often treated as being either non-existent or something that is "made up".

 

For instance, there's a long debate in the Buffy community over whether Willow is more bisexual than a lesbian, but claimed the latter because her partner Tara identified as such and was rather insecure whenever Willow's previous male romantic interests were brought up?

 

It does seem that in the real world, people who are bisexual often seem to come out as gay or hide their attraction to the opposite sex, because they perceive it as being more accepted to fall into one group, whereas admitting they fall into neither risks alienating both.



#1304
Biotic Apostate

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^ Yeah, sadly that's true. The 'I won't date a bi person' sentiment is strong among both straight and gay people. The cries about turning companions bi are also telling, people have problems with seeing characters that were revealed to be bisexual as anything else than what they have initially categorised them as. 'I thought he was straight based on the info I had, therefore retcon!'

 

That situation in Buffy weirdly enough seems like a commentary on the real world, a partner's insecurity is a big reason a bi person would want to just go 'yeah, I'm a lesbian.'

 

(also, I always find errors in my posts only after someone quotes them, it was obviously supposed to say "interested in")



#1305
nightscrawl

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And agreed, prison relationships (and I mean relationships, pure sex doesn't count) just expose hidden bisexuality. It's still not that accepted to be LGBT, so some people prefer to ignore their same-sex attraction, if they are also attracted to the opposite sex.


It does seem that in the real world, people who are bisexual often seem to come out as gay or hide their attraction to the opposite sex, because they perceive it as being more accepted to fall into one group, whereas admitting they fall into neither risks alienating both.


These two things, especially.

 

Conversely, it's interesting how soap operas and television often show characters (or perhaps it's just the writers) unable to reconcile gay or lesbian characters entering into hetero relationships. While same-sex relationships are now more commonly depicted in fiction, bisexuality is still often treated as being either non-existent or something that is "made up".


I think using something like a soap opera, or even some of these game characters/LIs, is not really the best example because the producer may have a character with known (read: observed) sexuality (A), and then introduce another character that doesn't match A's sexuality, but wants there to be a relationship between the two for dramatic and entertainment purposes.

The sexuality issue aside, both of the serious relationships that Willow entered into on the show were very formative for her character and both LIs became a part of that supernatural landscape (werewolf, witch); neither were "normal" people in that sense. Tara helped Willow develop her witchcraft further, since they were both into it, and we saw that with her (fridge) death, Willow became all corrupt, then was saved, and had more character development. Joss Whedon is known for having involved storylines that are developed in advance; he doesn't wing it. In that sense, if that was his plan for Tara all along, I think it makes the death even worse, since she was only put into the show as a vehicle for Willow's character development, and then it certainly falls in with the "bury your gays" trope.

 

There is also something to be said for showing a known gay character and then have them do something heterosexual. Apparently, in Empire (I don't watch the show), one of the main characters is gay and has been pretty open about it to the extent that it is a point of contention with his father. Last season, I think he made out with Alicia Keys or something and some viewers were, I think rightly, like, "Wtf?!"

 

(If someone watches the show and I got things wrong, my apologies. This is only what I've gleaned from bits on the internet.)

 

To me, that sends the message that the character isn't really, totally gay, because SEE hetero stuff!

 

In general, I think that Hollywood just doesn't know what to do with sexuality, ANY sexuality, as even heterosexuality is shown to be too rigid on occasion.



#1306
vertigomez

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Man, this group is a bastion.

The No Bisexuals thing is exhausting. In addition to constantly being expected to cheat on your partner or suspected of having 4,000 diseases or of being a raving sex fiend... if you're a bisexual man you're definitely actually gay and just in the closet, and if you're a bisexual woman you're definitely actually straight and just 'experimenting'.

Such is the power of the penor. Anyone who touches it is RUINED FOREVER!!1
 

BUT I will say that the existence of the m/m Zevran cinematic, with the same amount of content as the others, gets points for that in terms of showing it and treating it as the others, way back in 2009 no less. And you know, he doesn't leer at you creepily the way Alistair does. >.>


Nah, he only does that if you want to talk to him. "Alright, but I get to stare at you luridly while you do so." :lol:

Though I always thought it was weird that in Zev's m/m Enya underwear sex scene, he bottoms to dwarves and humans and tops elven Wardens. Random trivia thanks to years of lurking in his Ridiculously Awesome thread.

#1307
nightscrawl

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I think an example of prison revealing hidden bisexuality can be found in the HBO series Oz with Beecher and Keller. Now, I'll grant that it is one of the more f'd up relationships I have ever seen in fiction (not exaggerating), but the feeling and attraction is there, particularly on Beecher's side. It was an interesting development in his character, especially with the slow burn format of the show.

 

(It's a really good show, but REALLY violent. There are also rapes. I think it may be even more violent and rapey in some respects than GoT and I probably wouldn't watch it were I to come upon it today.)



#1308
Sifr

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The sexuality issue aside, both of the serious relationships that Willow entered into on the show were very formative for her character and both LIs became a part of that supernatural landscape (werewolf, witch); neither were "normal" people in that sense. Tara helped Willow develop her witchcraft further, since they were both into it, and we saw that with her (fridge) death, Willow became all corrupt, then was saved, and had more character development. Joss Whedon is known for having involved storylines that are developed in advance; he doesn't wing it. In that sense, if that was his plan for Tara all along, I think it makes the death even worse, since she was only put into the show as a vehicle for Willow's character development, and then it certainly falls in with the "bury your gays" trope.

 

Joss said that he toyed with making either Xander or Willow eventually come out as gay, but didn't know which character it'd be until he reached Series 3.

 

That's one of the reasons Xander has a minor subplot in Series 3 where his classmate Larry keeps urging him to come out (to repay Xander for unwittingly inspiring him to), stemming from Larry misunderstanding his comments about the stress of keeping secrets all the time as a confession of Xander being closeted.

 

I do agree though that it was unfortunate that Tara fell never really developed as a character (barring some moments) into anything other than Willow's girlfriend and ultimately fell into the bury your gays trope.

 

And the less said about Willow's rebound in S7 the better. I can understand that Joss was in a difficult position as he didn't want to have Willow hook up with a man because it might suggest that Tara was only "a phase", but did they have to make her next girlfriend into an awful character?

 

At least Doctor Who eventually admitted that Martha was the rebound companion when it became clear she didn't work as intended, whereas Buffy actively seemed to avoid this idea when it came to Kennedy.

 

/End Buffy Rant :blush:



#1309
Biotic Apostate

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Man, this group is a bastion.

giphy.gif

 


Such is the power of the penor. Anyone who touches it is RUINED FOREVER!!1

:lol: Praise it!!

 


Zev's m/m Enya underwear sex scene

Haha I can't, I just imagined it with the music and I can't stop laughing  :D



#1310
nightscrawl

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Though I always thought it was weird that in Zev's m/m Enya underwear sex scene, he bottoms to dwarves and humans and tops elven Wardens. Random trivia thanks to years of lurking in his Ridiculously Awesome thread.


Really? I'm surprised there is that variation in the cinematics at all. The one I watched was with an elf Warden, so I kind of assumed that they were all the same.

But OF COURSE the elf bottoms for a human and a dwarf. :rolleyes:

 

Another point for fade to black.



#1311
vertigomez

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Haha I can't, I just imagined it with the music and I can't stop laughing  :D


That's exactly what it sounds like to me! :lol:
 

Really? I'm surprised there is that variation in the cinematics at all. The one I watched was with an elf Warden, so I kind of assumed that they were all the same.

But OF COURSE the elf bottoms for a human and a dwarf. :rolleyes:
 
Another point for fade to black.


Zev has a crapton of variety. In addition to those tent scenes, his kisses are different depending on the Warden's race. And apparently if he's sexing a dwarf, he's smiling more? (sfw, it's just a thread link) That cracks me up.

But yeah, the slo-mo grinding fundoshi scenes were awful and I much prefer fade-to-black or the tasteful nudity of DAI.

I do think the positions issue is a little weird and arbitrary, though.

#1312
nightscrawl

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^ Actually, from the video I watched, it looked as if the scene were over in Morrigan's sleeping area and not inside a tent... haha... Then again, I didn't see those vials of blood, or whatever the heck those are, so perhaps not, but it did look outside.



#1313
vertigomez

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^ Actually, from the video I watched, it looked as if the scene were over in Morrigan's sleeping area and not inside a tent... haha... Then again, I didn't see those vials of blood, or whatever the heck those are, so perhaps not, but it did look outside.


I was under the impression that everybody was having sex in Morrigan's tent.

Poor Morrigan.

#1314
nightscrawl

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Random thing: I really like the planet Saturn. From this article, I learned that there are actually "ring scientists." So awesome...



#1315
Biotic Apostate

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I was under the impression that everybody was having sex in Morrigan's tent.

Poor Morrigan.

*Garrett Hawke voice* Kinky.



#1316
daveliam

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People who claim to be "prison gay" don't often stop having relationships with women after they've finished doing porridge at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

 

Wait, what?  "Doing porridge at Her Majesty's Pleasure" means "prison sex"?  First of all:  That's awesome.  Second of all:  How have I never heard that before?  Third of all:  I'm finding a way to work that into conversation next week.  #lifegoals



#1317
Biotic Apostate

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Wait, what?  "Doing porridge at Her Majesty's Pleasure" means "prison sex"?  First of all:  That's awesome.  Second of all:  How have I never heard that before?  Third of all:  I'm finding a way to work that into conversation next week.  #lifegoals

Haha I don't think it does. From what I remember, both 'doing porridge' and 'detained at Her Majesty's Pleasure' mean being incarcerated. But I have to admit, this is the first time I've seen them together and it does sound like an urban dictionary sex act  :lol:



#1318
Grieving Natashina

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Why is a thread requesting incest still up on the ME:A forums? I reported it an hour ago and apparently it's shift change for the mods. This sockpuppet has even said that if being gay is okay, then incest should be okay. It's not only gross, but stupid. Hasn't the OP seen the pictures of royalty and nobility that's been the product of one too many first cousins marrying each other?

That's without touching the implication that pedophilia and incest should be treated with as much acceptance as the LGBT community. Some of the arguments the OP is using seem all too familar.

On a happier note: Sasquatch is taking the night off. Our AC died a couple of days ago and we're in the middle of a heatwave. So boo for the AC, hurrah for spending time with da hubby.

#1319
Steelcan

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Why is a thread requesting incest still up on the ME:A forums? I reported it an hour ago and apparently it's shift change for the mods. This sockpuppet has even said that if being gay is okay, then incest should be okay. It's not only gross, but stupid. Hasn't the OP seen the pictures of royalty and nobility that's been the product of one too many first cousins marrying each other?

That's without touching the implication that pedophilia and incest should be treated with as much acceptance as the LGBT community. Some of the arguments the OP is using seem all too familar.

Well I don't think said OP is defending it based on genetics and whatnot (fun facts, the first generation of incestuous offspring will likely be fine even if there is a very close blood relation, its generations of the stuff that gets you Charles II of Spain)



#1320
Grieving Natashina

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Well I don't think said OP is defending it based on genetics and whatnot (fun facts, the first generation of incestuous offspring will likely be fine even if there is a very close blood relation, its generations of the stuff that gets you Charles II of Spain)


True enough, but I hear incest and I think of folks like Charles the II. I know that doesn't happen if one or two close cousins marry, but still...

Oh well. At least this thread will hopefully get nuked soon enough. One thing is for sure. It hasn't been dull around here since Sunday.

#1321
Lady Artifice

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Every time I think I've become insulated against ME:A section obnoxiousness, it suddenly becomes much, much worse all over again.

Thank my lucky stars for you guys.

#1322
BraveVesperia

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Why is a thread requesting incest still up on the ME:A forums?

*flashbacks to Let Me Romance Bethany threads*

 

:wacko:

 

Though at least they never dragged the LGBT community into it... as far as I remember.



#1323
Lady Artifice

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The gamergate thread is wow. 

 

http://forum.bioware...effect-4/page-1

 

Just lots of things going on in there. I mostly read through to like all of Dave's posts.



#1324
FKA_Servo

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As much as I'd like continually offer my two shiny pennies in that thread, I think I need to stay away. It's a race to the bottom.

 

I think I need another vacation from the BSN.



#1325
nightscrawl

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^ Your first post there was gold. :wizard: