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[greenbrownblue]

In the epilogue scene we can see Flemeth sending sth thru the eluvian. Editor notes say it is her "godhood" that she meant to give Morrigan. The notes also mention that Solas "stole her power". These are just notes and not the canonical facts. Anyway,what did Solas take from Flemeth and where is Mythal (the wisp or w/e) now? We know that Flemeth was not limited to being in one place at a time.

I find it suspicious that Solas in the Trespasser DLC is wearing Mythal's armor similar to the one that sentinels wear (and they are bound to obedience). Also, dont you guys find it weird that Solas says "There is no glory here, only the price that I alone will pay" (when referring to tearing down the Veil). So has not Mythal/Flementh paid the price? Is not Mythal known for aiding others for a price?

 

What are your thoughts?

[In Exile]

Keep in mind that the devs have suggested that the notes are of questionable cannon. For example, they suggest that the foci is the "Orb of Mythal" though the wiki says that concept may have been abandoned. 

 

We'll see if we encounter Morrigan in DA:4, I wager. Having the Well of Mythal will likely help her process that power, since she'll have the hundreds of chirping voices of Mythal's ex-priests in her ear (if they don't just drive her crazy). 

[greenbrownblue]

Keep in mind that the devs have suggested that the notes are of questionable cannon. For example, they suggest that the foci is the "Orb of Mythal" though the wiki says that concept may have been abandoned. 

 

We'll see if we encounter Morrigan in DA:4, I wager. Having the Well of Mythal will likely help her process that power, since she'll have the hundreds of chirping voices of Mythal's ex-priests in her ear (if they don't just drive her crazy). 

Yeah , I wrote "These are just notes and not the canonical facts." Also, the other option is that the Inquisitor drinks from the Vir'Abelasan, so I do not think that it is related to the ability to receive the "gift" that Yavana mentioned. Assuming that this "gift" was sent thru the eluvian and not taken by Solas.

[IllustriousT]

Possibility:

 

 Flemeth released Mythal's spirit through the Eluvian, leaving only Flemeth behind with Solas' spirit to release to him and therefore finally ending her "deal" or coexistence with Mythal and accepting death. Solas was weak when he awoke because Mythal was "housing" his power, or his spirit for him. The orb would have allowed him to physically enter the fade, and regain this spirit from her - and destroy the world, but we know how that went. He could not physically reunite with his power/spirit and needed Flemeth/Mythal to collect it, house it, and pass it on. I don't think that Solas kills Mythal, he kills Flemeth, thus ending her story. 

 

Flemeth paid the price.

 

Obviously, these are speculations. 

[Dai Grepher]

Flemeth wasn't passing on her godhood through the eluvian. She already taught this to Morrigan in the meeting with her.

She was probably sending her essence of Mythal through, and possibly her own as well.

Solas gained nothing from the encounter except the active eluvian.

As for Mythal, she is now in the Crossroads. Her spirit is seen floating out of the Well of Sorrows and into the eluvian closing it off after she goes through.

[greenbrownblue]

Possibility:

 

 Flemeth released Mythal's spirit through the Eluvian, leaving only Flemeth behind with Solas' spirit to release to him and therefore finally ending her "deal" or coexistence with Mythal and accepting death. Solas was weak when he awoke because Mythal was "housing" his power, or his spirit for him. The orb would have allowed him to physically enter the fade, and regain this spirit from her - and destroy the world, but we know how that went. He could not physically reunite with his power/spirit and needed Flemeth/Mythal to collect it, house it, and pass it on. I don't think that Solas kills Mythal, he kills Flemeth, thus ending her story. 

 

Flemeth paid the price.

 

Obviously, these are speculations. 

Hum... Mythal was housing Solas' spirit? Never heard of this theory :v ... Solas prolly did not know that Mythal was alive until he went with the Inquisitor to the Arbor Wilds.

[Smudjygirl]

Well, remember all Flemeth needs is a "piece" of herself in order to live on. It could have been that.

[greenbrownblue]

Flemeth wasn't passing on her godhood through the eluvian. She already taught this to Morrigan in the meeting with her.

She was probably sending her essence of Mythal through, and possibly her own as well.

Solas gained nothing from the encounter except the active eluvian.

As for Mythal, she is now in the Crossroads. Her spirit is seen floating out of the Well of Sorrows and into the eluvian closing it off after she goes through.

Ummm, but godhood is not teachable. It is a (quote) "gift" meant for Morrigan. 

If Solas did not take anything editor notes would not mention "stealing" Flemeth's power. Also, in the Trespasser he is much more powerful. He must have taken sth from Flemeth. He would not kill Flemeth for the Eluvians. He had access to them anyway (THe Masked Empire and Trespasser prove it). 

 

Finally, Flemeth said that Mythal and her are one, like the heart is a part of one's body. Also, would not Abelas know that Mythal was in the Well? There is no hint that the woman from the well was Mythal and not some spirit servant or w/e ;//// ... So it is a very risky speculation.

[greenbrownblue]

Well, remember all Flemeth needs is a "piece" of herself in order to live on. It could have been that.

Ah, so you believe she escaped like when HoF "killed" her, right ^^ ? I would like to believe in that, because I loved Flemeth, but her body being so drained out of life makes me doubt it. Not sure if Solas would have new powers if she was not dead.

[Smudjygirl]

Ah, so you believe she escaped like when HoF "killed" her, right ^^ ? I would like to believe in that, because I loved Flemeth, but her body being so drained out of life makes me doubt it. Not sure if Solas would have new powers if she was not dead.

 

We could destroy her body as the Warden, this is not so different. I'm sure Solas knows about her body hopping. The "effective immortality" he spoke of. And when he says "you met Mythal, the first of my kind do not die so easily" he has a smirk. I'm sure, if she lived on, he knows she did. Flemeth (and Mythal by extension) are always one step ahead of people. She probably knew Solas was coming for her power, and prepared accordingly. I wouldn't be surprised if they both knew, since Flemeth is determined to get revenge for Mythal, and Solas is about to release the guilty party from their prison.

 

So yes, i believe it is as simple as her preparing a piece of herself so she doesn't die.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

Keep in mind that the devs have suggested that the notes are of questionable cannon. For example, they suggest that the foci is the "Orb of Mythal" though the wiki says that concept may have been abandoned. 

 

We'll see if we encounter Morrigan in DA:4, I wager. Having the Well of Mythal will likely help her process that power, since she'll have the hundreds of chirping voices of Mythal's ex-priests in her ear (if they don't just drive her crazy). 

 Morrigan for the 4th time?Why  Mythal does even need her?

She can go to whatever host she want,one of her sentinel or Solas.

[Dai Grepher]

Ummm, but godhood is not teachable. It is a (quote) "gift" meant for Morrigan.

Yes, and in the meeting with Morrigan Flemeth puts her hand over Morrigan's head and transfers something to her. Morrigan then says, "I... understand". That was the power Flemeth wanted to give Morrigan.

If Solas did not take anything editor notes would not mention "stealing" Flemeth's power.

Dev notes mean nothing. Besides, the power he stole could have been the eluvian.

Also, in the Trespasser he is much more powerful.

More powerful than what? Also, when we get to the top of the steps in the first elvhen tower, we see an explosion similar to the one at the conclave. That could have been Solas unlocking some elvhen artifact and gaining power that way.

He must have taken sth from Flemeth.

Maybe he just felt she was unworthy of carrying Mythal, and killed her to free Mythal's essence so it could return to her full spirit in the Crossroads.

He would not kill Flemeth for the Eluvians. He had access to them anyway (THe Masked Empire and Trespasser prove it).

Masked Empire proves he didn't have access to the eluvians, and Trespasser comes after Solas kills Flemeth.

Finally, Flemeth said that Mythal and her are one, like the heart is a part of one's body. Also, would not Abelas know that Mythal was in the Well? There is no hint that the woman from the well was Mythal and not some spirit servant or w/e ;//// ... So it is a very risky speculation.

Well who else would it be? There was only one spirit, and it as female. Now, it was a human woman, but the devs have since stated on Twitter or something that the model was supposed to be elven. They just threw in a human female because they thought the water filter would obscure her rounded ears.

Abelas knew little of Mythal. Flemeth even tells you that she doesn't care to reveal herself to anyone.

As for Flemeth being one with Mythal, that only means Flemeth carries a wisp of her, and Flemeth even describes it as a wisp. Mythal's full form was likely in the Well, reforming over the ages.

Solas states that his friend, the Spirit of Wisdom, might reform in the same location in the Fade some day, though it will likely be a different spirit. Mythal is probably doing this, but she had the Well of Sorrows to help her. So she likely returned in her full essence over time.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

More powerful than what? Also, when we get to the top of the steps in the first elvhen tower, we see an explosion similar to the one at the conclave. That could have been Solas unlocking some elvhen artifact and gaining power that way.

 

This does not make sense Solas gained his powers from Flemeth when he killed her

 

Yes, and in the meeting with Morrigan Flemeth puts her hand over Morrigan's head and transfers something to her. Morrigan then says, "I... understand". That was the power Flemeth wanted to give Morrigan.

 

It wasn't Mythal because

1)that soul was sent on the Eluvian

2)the scene only happen in the Altar of Mythal if i remember correctly,not in the fade scenario,however in all honetrsy i don't know what she recieved,maybe a way to become a dragon even without the well of sorrow?

[myahele]

There's too many "outs" for Flemythal. For one thing there's that manifestation of Mythal (?) from the Well that opened up the Eluvian to aid in the escape of the inquisitor and crew. 

 

The one who drank from the well of sorrows, though that just might be knowledge.

 

That thing she put inside the Eluvian.

 

It's possible that he did take the essence/power/soul of Flemythal, but as we've seen with Kieran and even Flemythal herself, a person can hold multiple souls inside them.

 

In the end, I think things are still going according to Flemythal's plan: seek out vengeance to those who killed her. Solas says he's "got plans" 

[Donquijote and 59 others]

 

 

In the end, I think things are still going according to Flemythal's plan: seek out vengeance to those who killed her. Solas says he's "got plans" 

Well i'm sure that Elgar nan has got plans as well during these last thousands of years....he had time to think on how to kill them both permanently.

[Dai Grepher]

This does not make sense Solas gained his powers from Flemeth when he killed her

Evidence?
 

It wasn't Mythal because
1)that soul was sent on the Eluvian

So? Mythal's soul can't use eluvians or something? And what do you mean "sent"? No one sent it there. She floated to the eluvian herself.

2)the scene only happen in the Altar of Mythal if i remember correctly,not in the fade scenario,however in all honetrsy i don't know what she recieved,maybe a way to become a dragon even without the well of sorrow?

It happens in both, and regardless of who drank.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

Evidence?
 

 

The part in which Solas suck Flemeth powers and turn her into a piece of stone?

If you don't believe that you may start doubt that the sun is real for all that matters

 

 

So? Mythal's soul can't use eluvians or something? And what do you mean "sent"? No one sent it there. She floated to the eluvian herself.

 

This statement is gibberish,Flemeth sent that soul on the eluvian it is in the scene.

 

It happens in both, and regardless of who drank.

Nosense,in the fade scene it does not happen

[Donquijote and 59 others]

what's wrong @Dai Grepher you realized that it does not happen in the fade scene?

 Lol

[Xerrai]

To put it simply: we don't know.

It likely won't even matter because of how many possible 'identities' the devs can give essence to suit their whim (old god baby, mythal, godhood, etc.). We don't even know where/when exactly that whole exchange was taking place. Some say it is in the crossroads based on the background, others say it is at one of mythal's/Fen'Harel's temples because of the statuary, and others still claim that it was just "in a nearby elvhen ruin" of no special significance other than its intact eluvian.

 

The essence could have been sent to the crossrads, the fade, real world or some in-between place. The essence could be any number of things. The full extent of Mythal's being is something that is always being added onto every game and we don't even know how her soul-splitting even works.

 

But for the sake of putting a label on it....a bit of mythal's soul maybe? Like a backup plan?

[German Soldier]

There is a glowing thing FLemeth is giving to Morrigan in the altar of Mythal,tough it may simply be knowledge in a magical form,curious that it does not happen in the fade scene.

[IllustriousT]

Hum... Mythal was housing Solas' spirit? Never heard of this theory :v ... Solas prolly did not know that Mythal was alive until he went with the Inquisitor to the Arbor Wilds.

 

It was just something I was thinking. I have no evidence to back up this speculation. I just don't think that Mythal would relinquish her power over to Solas. I think she preserved herself by going through the eluvian, but then this leaves Flemeth. Everything has a price, and I think the deal between Mythal and Flemeth was at an end. I don't think Flemeth herself is a goddess or has immortality - that was Mythal. So, what does Solas take? We clearly are at odds. Solas didn't have power - then he did - after absorbing "something" from Flemeth. It may have been a stretch for me to speculate that it was Solas' power/spirit, but I think it could be plausible. 

 

Also, in the Arbor Wilds when Solas says "So, Mythal endures," and he does seem relieved as if he was not certain. Yet, I believe something happened between then and the epilogue, because, although it seems they had not seen each other in a long time, they do not seem surprised. I believe at some point there was communication about the "bigger" plan...the one Mythal has been preserving for a very long time. 

 

Just stuff. 

[Dai Grepher]

The part in which Solas suck Flemeth powers and turn her into a piece of stone?

But how does that prove he took her powers? I see nothing in that scene which indicates this. All the blue energy from Flemeth goes into the eluvian, not Solas.

Solas' eye glow could have been his own powers manifesting. He did just display some kind of green aura ability which is what caused Flemeth to die in the first place. So maybe this was all his own power.

This statement is gibberish,Flemeth sent that soul on the eluvian it is in the scene.

No, I was referring to the scene in the Temple of Mythal when the spirit in the Well floats into the eluvian before Corypheus can reach it.

Nosense,in the fade scene it does not happen

I don't yet have an OG Kieran worldstate loaded in so I don't have first hand experience with it, but I thought I saw a video on it. If it isn't in the Fade version, then fine. Flemeth used some other process to teach Morrigan in that case. Or BioWare simply forgot to put it in. Regardless, Flemeth placing her hand over Morrigan's forehead and teaching her the dragon form does happen in the version with the alter.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

But how does that prove he took her powers? I see nothing in that scene which indicates this. All the blue energy from Flemeth goes into the eluvian, not Solas.

Solas' eye glow could have been his own powers manifesting. He did just display some kind of green aura ability which is what caused Flemeth to die in the first place. So maybe this was all his own power.





I don't yet have an OG Kieran worldstate loaded in so I don't have first hand experience with it, but I thought I saw a video on it. If it isn't in the Fade version, then fine. Flemeth used some other process to teach Morrigan in that case. Or BioWare simply forgot to put it in. Regardless, Flemeth placing her hand over Morrigan's forehead and teaching her the dragon form does happen in the version with the alter.

Souls and powers aren't the same thing,Flemeth can separate her soul from her powers just when she did it in DAO where she fought the warden wihtout Mythal soul in her,the soul is sent on the eluvian the powers are took from Solas,visit the Solas section for this kind of discussions.

 

I think you are putting too much emphasis on the cinematics,FLemeth put an hand over MOrrigan head only in the altar of Mythal,in the fade she don't do anything other than stole the soul of the dragon.

[greenbrownblue]

We could destroy her body as the Warden, this is not so different. I'm sure Solas knows about her body hopping. The "effective immortality" he spoke of. And when he says "you met Mythal, the first of my kind do not die so easily" he has a smirk. I'm sure, if she lived on, he knows she did. Flemeth (and Mythal by extension) are always one step ahead of people. She probably knew Solas was coming for her power, and prepared accordingly. I wouldn't be surprised if they both knew, since Flemeth is determined to get revenge for Mythal, and Solas is about to release the guilty party from their prison.

 

So yes, i believe it is as simple as her preparing a piece of herself so she doesn't die.

I am sure he did not kill Mythal , it would not make sense. However, I do not think that he would spare Flemeth and Flemeth as much as she knows - she is nt an ancient elf.

[greenbrownblue]

 

 Morrigan for the 4th time?Why  Mythal does even need her?

She can go to whatever host she want,one of her sentinel or Solas.

 

Flemeth wants to give her daughter a "gift". Nothing weird about that.