46 réponses à ce sujet

[The Baconer]

Because the Qunari needed to be even more annoying than they were before.

[German Soldier]

Because they're not Qunari?

They are of the dame race even if they don't share the Qun

[AresKeith]

They are of the dame race even if they don't share the Qun

 

Ok? Doesn't mean they were trained the same way as the Qunari
 

[thesuperdarkone2]

Did everyone forget about the circle mage-esque qunari mages that fought alongside Marjolaine in DAO?

 

 

Here they are:

http://vignette1.wik...=20130321141523

 

 

No, the Inquisitor isn't the first case of a qunari mage not fighting like a saarebas

[Addictress]

Did everyone forget about the circle mage-esque qunari mages that fought alongside Marjolaine in DAO?

 

 

Here they are:

http://vignette1.wik...=20130321141523

 

 

No, the Inquisitor isn't the first case of a qunari mage not fighting like a saarebas

Fine

[Addictress]

I hate Leliana, Marjolaine, or any such related content or DLC, so it's no wonder I missed it.

[Shechinah]

....

 

S'funny, I remembered they were qunari but I'd forgotten they were mages.
 

[Kurogane335]

Aren't the Qunari that have magical abilities supposed to be like Saarebas - super powerful? And have those...force-field abilities? I would've appreciated a special Saarebas-like set of abilities for the Qunari Inquisitor.

Why would you be surprised ? A Vashoth hasn't been educated into the Qun. He obviously don't know how the Saarebas are using their magic. Even if they are not trained, some off them out there had to learn himself those powers. And the others followed him. The Vashoth doesn't have such knowledge because he didn't saw them before.

 

And in general, a Vashoth character is very bland because, just like city elves, he doesn't have a culture of its own. He can't adhere to the Qun, because he would have left the other Vashoths to go to Par Vollen if he would. he can be Andrastian, because he probably lived in a country which believes in the Maker. But that's why a human will bring more to the story than a Vashoth, since he will have access to more possibilities lore wise, when a Vashoth is basically bound to be culture-less or a low-rung member of a country.

[Aulis Vaara]

No, no, I mean that the dragon blood makes qunari more powerful as mages and not that qunari do not have dragon blood.

Well, it was able to pull multiple people into the Fade even in a greatly diluted form in Maric Theirin. To even send one mage consciously into the Fade, the Mages needed lyrium. So yeah, I'd definitely expect someone to have Dragon Blood coursing through their veins to be more powerful.

[Big I]

Then why did that miner guy say they're more powerful? He wasn't referring to just Saarath.

 

I assumed Saarath was so powerful because he'd been fed red lyrium. The letter he writes to Tallis clearly documents his increasing instability (I think it also mentions hearing "the song"), and the letter is in the storeroom where they're keeping the red lyrium. He's also clearly physically mutated (he's bigger even than normal qunari, like some sort of ogre).

 

In the letter it says he used to be a tamassran before becoming a saarebas. How does that work? Was he hiding his magic? Did he not know he had magic? Did he only get magic after taking red lyrium? So many questions.

[Kurogane335]

I think that Saarath magic manifested at a latter date. Interestingly, him being a Tamassran mean, if the wiki is right... that he was a she. Now, it may be a mistake and he was supposed to be Ben-Hassrath but if Tamassran was his/her role, he/she was Aqun-Athlok.

[Andromelek]

I think that Saarath magic manifested at a latter date. Interestingly, him being a Tamassran mean, if the wiki is right... that he was a she. Now, it may be a mistake and he was supposed to be Ben-Hassrath but if Tamassran was his/her role, he/she was Aqun-Athlok.

Actually he was an Ashkari, not a Tamassran, Saarath is a male.

[Heimdall]

I assumed Saarath was so powerful because he'd been fed red lyrium. The letter he writes to Tallis clearly documents his increasing instability (I think it also mentions hearing "the song"), and the letter is in the storeroom where they're keeping the red lyrium. He's also clearly physically mutated (he's bigger even than normal qunari, like some sort of ogre).

 

In the letter it says he used to be a tamassran before becoming a saarebas. How does that work? Was he hiding his magic? Did he not know he had magic? Did he only get magic after taking red lyrium? So many questions.

I think it was just normal lyrium (Though that too can cause instability and unstable power levels) given that he displayed no over signs of  red lyrium growing out of him.

[Kurogane335]

Actually he was an Ashkari, not a Tamassran, Saarath is a male.

Ah, it makes more sense. Having such an hulking guys as a Tamassran without any effect one anyone would have been strange.

[JadeDragon]

Technically all 3 mages spell wise should be different. This was the first time in Dragon Age history that mages had a different background depending on race because Origin Mages Human or Elf were circle and Hawke is human. If you randomly take a Dalish Mage, Circle Mage, and Vashoth Mage (hedge mage) and tell them to display a series of spells very rare chance all 3 would use the same type of spells or do them the same way. But due to the nature of the game it would be to much to ask from the devs to make all the mages different by origin because you have to then do that for every class and race. Also the magic system itself was flawed this game in the fact it was dumbed down not even using the 4 basic schools introduced in its own lore since Origins. It was all Primal Magic which in the devs defense if Primal Spells are the most basic you can get away with 3 different mages knowing the same spells. But I am sure that was not the reason they dumbed down the magic system it just happened to workout for all origins. While it would be Great if that much attention to detail is showed as far as character origins and abilities its not needed.  

[Toasted Llama]

It wouldn't be just mages who would be more powerful; even warriors.

 

I'd argue a massive hulking qunari packs more of a punch than a small elf.

 

But this would throw off gameplay balance so I'm guessing they used gameplay-related reasons to not make Vashoth mages be as powerful (or have the potential to be as powerful) as a Saarebas.

[Big I]

Actually he was an Ashkari, not a Tamassran, Saarath is a male.

 

Wow, that sucks even more for him. Aren't ashkari revered holy leaders in the qun, like Koslun? To go from that to being chained up like an animal, that's brutal.

[Big I]

Ok? Doesn't mean they were trained the same way as the Qunari
 

 

I think it's canon that mage QunQuisitor was trained by a Valo-Kas saarebas (who we can assume lived under the qun before becoming Tal Vashoth). Pretty sure that's what is says on the inquisition website, and you can say as much to Vivienne at Haven.

[Andromelek]

Wow, that sucks even more for him. Aren't ashkari revered holy leaders in the qun, like Koslun? To go from that to being chained up like an animal, that's brutal.

Yeah, I can't avoid feel pity for that guy, he even tried to advice Talis for a moral conflict she had, on the same note he also revealed that the lyrium gave him nightmares and pain, it's even stated that he was barely able to write.

[Sifr]

I think it's canon that mage QunQuisitor was trained by a Valo-Kas saarebas (who we can assume lived under the qun before becoming Tal Vashoth). Pretty sure that's what is says on the inquisition website, and you can say as much to Vivienne at Haven.

 

Yeah, a mage Adaar being trained by a Tal-Vashoth Saarebas is canon.

 

While Saarebas are solely focused on destructive spellcasting since that's how the Qunari train them, they likely don't practice or teach the more destructive spells once they become Tal-Vashoth since it'd be an easy way for them to get spotted by the Templars.

 

There's also no reason that a mage Adaar couldn't have learned the basics from the Saarebas and then sought further training elsewhere, so they weren't forced to be limited to just one school of magic. According to WOT2, there's apparently a secret network of mages (possibly the Collective) that goes around mentoring mages so they can keep themselves off of the Templar's radar.

 

With that in mind, it would make sense that Tal-Vashoth mages might seek outside help to shore up the gaps in their magical knowledge that Saarebas wasn't able to provide them? Since mercenary groups often employ apostates, it's not like they'd be hard-pressed to find someone who could help.

[Kurogane335]

Wow, that sucks even more for him. Aren't ashkari revered holy leaders in the qun, like Koslun? To go from that to being chained up like an animal, that's brutal.

I think they are more philosophers. Koslun devised the Qun, and current Askaari are the ones who define it today, or at least discuss about it and its demands. It probably mean that Saarath took to his new role as a Saarebas relatively well, since he knew that it was his duty under the Qun. It is probably because he was Askaari that he was designated to be fed a lot of lyrium, the Viddasala probably expected that his mind would be strong enough to endure it (and it was, even if it had begun to crack).

[electricfish]

Regarding a former Saarebas training an Adaar: I feel like that's a mistake by whoever the writer was at the time, just like how an Adaar is called a Tal-Vashoth instead of Vashoth several times during the game. It's impossible for a Saarebas to perform Circle spells because magic isn't actually that flexible.

When it comes to magic, if a person does not receive formal training, then the manner in which they channel magic becomes set in certain "paths." A hedge mage or someone learning on their own develops a method for using magic in a certain way (which is different than Circle trained mages), and after a certain point they are no longer able to form new "paths." This means a hedge mage or a Saarebas would never be able to train in Circle methods for casting spells or bridge gaps in their knowledge. They simply cannot perform magic via new "paths" even if they tried. 

 

On the other hand, if a person has had formal training in a Circle, they are much more receptive to different styles of casting and different types of spells. They have had a much more generalized training that CAN be specialized later on.
It's a bit like a river that has multiple dams. Hedge mages have some of those dams rust and some of them are open based on how they tried to use magic. Circle or more formally trained mages potentially have all the dams partially open, with the potential to open a few completely in order to specialize of make use of innate talents.

 

tl;dr Saarebas shouldn't have been teaching our Adaars anything because they don't know southern mage Circle spells and can only perform Saarebas-specific magic. They might be able to academically learn how a spell should work, but they would have a super hard time teaching without demonstration.