It's interesting... if Thedas works at all like the real world... then even the piece of Par Vollen has to be "below" their equatorial line.
If you look at ours... the equator runs through the middle of Africa, the top of South America and India is quite a ways above it. Italy is way above the equator.
But more than that... skin tone has to do with sun exposure. Both India and South America were predominantly shielded from the intense heat of the equatorial sun by heavy canopy. While in a great deal of Africa the deserts have been steadily growing for tens of thousands of years.
I don't care if Tevinter are "dark colored Romans" - what I WOULD care about is if Indian culture was supplanted into a mountainous peninsula in a Mediterranean climate - but that's not the case here.
If anything... the preposterous amount of dragon statues says: "I'm trying for fantasy too hard." Not sure if there's any real cultures that just overload on their animal iconography that much. I am shocked that there aren't more magister statues instead of dragons.
There are plenty of real live brown and black people who have white facial structures and coloring, yet are still not white. I get mistaken for being lots of things other than what I am, which is a light skinned, white featured black woman. Hell, when I got married Cook County mistakenly listed me as white and I had to get my marriage license application redone.
Sort of off-topic, but what's the point of listing things like ethnicity on forms? Especially when a picture is involved, as it will be more informative than any other description. Bleh, I just don't like all this categorization (not just this), because I feel like it fuels discrimination through highlighting differences instead of ignoring them.
If anything... the preposterous amount of dragon statues says: "I'm trying for fantasy too hard." Not sure if there's any real cultures that just overload on their animal iconography that much. I am shocked that there aren't more magister statues instead of dragons.
Well, to Tevinter, dragons are gods. Heck even the Qunari respect them as symbols of unbridled power. And given Tevinter ran most of Thedas at one time or another, it's no wonder there's dragon statues all over the place!
As for coloration, I'm still disappointed the Qunari have stopped being "bronze-skinned giants" and are instead kinda grayish-with-poison-fingerpaint now.
As for coloration, I'm still disappointed the Qunari have stopped being "bronze-skinned giants" and are instead kinda grayish-with-poison-fingerpaint now.
I'm sad they changed the Qunari strange eyes from DA2 , eyes are also a hot topic in Thedas (or not) because you still find codices talking about the strangeness or beauty of elves and Qunari eyes ,except in games Qunari have now regular eyes , and from time to time you find elves with larger eyes but nothing that would send poets in transe as the lore describes.
@Iakus: No, I get the dragon connection... I'm not saying: "No dragons"
But... I don't think Rome had eagle statues everywhere. Yes, there was a lot of eagle imagery no doubt... but every picture of Tevinter that I've seen has had a dragon statue (or two, or three) in it.
EDIT: it's doesn't have to be "Rome" - but, as I said before... I don't think there's really any culture that is "so" obsessed with a single kind of statuary that it totally dominates the landscape. (Unless the statuary is of humans)
Also... dragons have not been worshipped in Tevinter for some time. It would be far more likely that these statues would have fallen into disrepair and then replaced by other more appropriate iconography by now. I think it's been what... 1100 years since Andraste's war? (Something like -200 Ancient Age)
@Iakus: No, I get the dragon connection... I'm not saying: "No dragons"
But... I don't think Rome had eagle statues everywhere. Yes, there was a lot of eagle imagery no doubt... but every picture of Tevinter that I've seen has had a dragon statue (or two, or three) in it.
Also... dragons have not been worshipped in Tevinter for some time. It would be far more likely that these statues would have fallen into disrepair and then replaced by other more appropriate iconography by now. I think it's been what... 1100 years since Andraste's war? (Something like -200 Ancient Age)
I think the lore explanation for the dragons statues is the same with Ferelden and wolves/dogs statues which are supposed to represent some old fereldan pagan religion , when people converted to andrastian , they kept part of their old culture in arts etc and just dropped the faith.
It's slightly harder to explain in Tevinter , what with the Blight and when they converted to the faith of the Maker , it was violent ...you'd imagine they would have destroyed signs of the Old Gods.
It's possible though , they didn't , because all of those were created with magic they had less access to when they slaughtered the Altus.Story is most temple of the old Gods were turned into circles and other public buildings.
The dragon is also still Tevinter heraldy if I remember correctly.
EDIT: it's doesn't have to be "Rome" - but, as I said before... I don't think there's really any culture that is "so" obsessed with a single kind of statuary that it totally dominates the landscape. (Unless the statuary is of humans)
@Heimdall: Yes, absolutely... but that's the dominating monotheistic religion.
The dragons are from a polytheistic religion that dominated the region about 1100 years ago - and polytheistic religions are vastly more tolerant of other faiths than monotheistic ones.
So... it would stand to reason that Andrastianism should have torn down those pagan images and replaced them with their famous female martyr.
At the very least it's odd they weren't just neglected into rubble. 1100 years of rain is enough to turn them into unrecognizable blobs of stone.
What "IS" the climate of Minrathous? I assumed semi-tropical.
I don't get why this is considered a "retcon." In a recent dev presentation, David Gaider stated that "darker skin tones are more prevalent" in eastern Tevinter. When you consider its proximity to Rivain and Antiva, this makes sense.
We still see plenty of lighter Tevinters in DAI. The dark Tevinters we see in DAI are Dorian, his father Halward, and Servis. All the rest, Felix, Alexius, Erimond, Calpernia, and numerous Venatori NPCs are all light-skinned. I might even add Corypheus to the light bunch for his remaining skin, but his Tevinter is 1000+ years gone and the demographics are different. How are they "swarthying" the Tevinters?
I don't think it's a retcon either. Previous DA games had very few Tevinters in them.
In DAI, even with Gereon and Felix being fairer than Halward Pavus, I never thought they looked white, more Middle Eastern, maybe. So if that is "swarthying" (I never knew this could be a verb....?), and if the Alexius and Pavus families' looks are what we are to expect in Tevinter, then I'm really, really looking forward to it.
What "IS" the climate of Minrathous? I assumed semi-tropical.
Don't know about the climate in Minrathous , but there's talk of jungles and elephants in Tevinter.
We know at the very least it's warm.
I have assumed that the climate is at least subtropical. Qunari make dreadnoughts out of palm trees, Dorian has a reference to humidity, in addition to his many complaints about the cold.
A northern palm tree in Orlais...
Spoiler
The difference in climate is rather amusing. It seems that in Tevinter, even though the cultural analogue is Ancient Rome, not very much else is, including the climate. A Mediterranean climate is much cooler and drier than what Tevinter appears to have, at least on the coastal regions, which includes Qarinus and Minrathous.
I have assumed that the climate is at least subtropical. Qunari make dreadnoughts out of palm trees, Dorian has a reference to humidity, in addition to his many complaints about the cold.
A northern palm tree in Orlais...
Spoiler
The difference in climate is rather amusing. It seems that in Tevinter, even though the cultural analogue is Ancient Rome, not very much else is, including the climate. A Mediterranean climate is much cooler and drier than what Tevinter appears to have, at least on the coastal regions, which includes Qarinus and Minrathous.
What the crap... the "cutting of a piece of palm tree".
Plants are my business... and you can't make a new tree from lumber.
Of course... now I'm going to have to hear "Magic did it." So boring.
I hate magic when it's like spell-check, GPS and calculators... making people stupid.
Cause that's not how you "take cuttings" unless dreadnoughts are living ships.
EDIT: Okay... I misread it, but why would a qunari dreadnought have palm trees on them to take cuttings from?
^Odd that those same palm trees are found in the Arbor Wilds, just about as far South as you can go in the game. It should be colder the further south one goes, unless they chock it up to magic.
^Odd that those same palm trees are found in the Arbor Wilds, just about as far South as you can go in the game. It should be colder the further south one goes, unless they chock it up to magic.
They don't have to. Temperate rainforests are a real biome.
^Odd that those same palm trees are found in the Arbor Wilds, just about as far South as you can go in the game. It should be colder the further south one goes, unless they chock it up to magic.
That might have something to do with the fact that WPHW was originally going to take place in the Arlathan Forest in the cancelled Exalted March expansion, which is near Kirkwall.
That's also true, I live in one. There are some palm trees, but I get the impression they're non-native...
Yeah, palm trees aren't common in them since the canopy is dominated by coniferous or broadleaf trees, but palm plants can and do exist in some of them. So maybe the Arbor Wilds is a rare case where a palm tree evolved to live in a temperate zone, like the Windmill Palm on Earth.
They don't have to. Temperate rainforests are a real biome.
Granted palm trees aren't common in them, but palm plants are.
True, but the colorful foliage and the fluorescent purple parrots flying around screams Amazon rain forest to me. It was the same with the JoH setting. Tropical looking flora and parrots clashing with DA's version of Elder Scrolls Nords- the Avvar. It was all odd to me.
That might have something to do with the fact that WPHW was originally going to take place in the Arlathan Forest in the cancelled Exalted March expansion, which is near Kirkwall.
It was the same with the JoH setting. Tropical looking flora and parrots clashing with DA's version of Elder Scrolls Nords- the Avaar. It was all odd to me.
Glad you brought that up - I've asked myself the same question. I always found the Avvar's choice of clothing odd for the perceived climate.
I don't think we should read too much into the fact that they reused the same palm tree resource, particularly when that singular tree in Orlais is the only time outside of the Arbor Wilds that model is found in the game.
What the crap... the "cutting of a piece of palm tree".
Plants are my business... and you can't make a new tree from lumber.
Of course... now I'm going to have to hear "Magic did it." So boring.
I hate magic when it's like spell-check, GPS and calculators... making people stupid.
Cause that's not how you "take cuttings" unless dreadnoughts are living ships.
EDIT: Okay... I misread it, but why would a qunari dreadnought have palm trees on them to take cuttings from?
Lol... funny you should phrase it this way, as I had always wondered the same thing. "A cutting salvaged from a burning dreadnought" always read to me like they took a piece of the ship and grew a tree from it.
That said, it never really bothered me, probably because I was fixated on seeing the tree in the first place and of the fact that it ostensibly came from the north, meaning Dorian would also be familiar with them growing up, just as I was. (I'm insane about this guy, don't mind me.)
I miss palm trees, especially the Florida royal palm. =/
Lol... funny you should phrase it this way, as I had always wondered the same thing. "A cutting salvaged from a burning dreadnought" always read to me like they took a piece of the ship and grew a tree from it.
Yeah, hey just a small nitpick but this thread is full of "looks Hindu" like Hinduism is a religion so you can't "look" it.
Orthodox Jew. Amish. Sikh. It's quite possible to "look" a religion. Sometimes it has to do with dress, sometimes genetics. In terms of Dragon Age, try to tell me that a qunari warrior sporting red bodypaint and/or string doesn't "look" Qunari. Or that an elf with vallaslin doesn't "look" Dalish. Or that Divine Victoria in her regalia doesn't "look" Andrastian.
Orthodox Jew. Amish. Sikh. It's quite possible to "look" a religion. Sometimes it has to do with dress, sometimes genetics. In terms of Dragon Age, try to tell me that a qunari warrior sporting red bodypaint and/or string doesn't "look" Qunari. Or that an elf with vallaslin doesn't "look" Dalish. Or that Divine Victoria in her regalia doesn't "look" Andrastian.
I may be misunderstanding your point in regards to the Dragon Age portion of your comment but what you mention in regards two of your examples are an indication of or connected to a culture or religion;
Vallaslin are an indication of being Dalish as it performed as a right of passage within that culture. The regalia worn by the Divine Victoria is the regalia of the religious leader of the Chantry.
@Heimdall: Yes, absolutely... but that's the dominating monotheistic religion.
The dragons are from a polytheistic religion that dominated the region about 1100 years ago - and polytheistic religions are vastly more tolerant of other faiths than monotheistic ones.
So... it would stand to reason that Andrastianism should have torn down those pagan images and replaced them with their famous female martyr.
At the very least it's odd they weren't just neglected into rubble. 1100 years of rain is enough to turn them into unrecognizable blobs of stone.
I think Dragons are still something of a nationalistic symbol for Tevinter? Probably maintained through magic.
True, but the colorful foliage and the fluorescent purple parrots flying around screams Amazon rain forest to me. It was the same with the JoH setting. Tropical looking flora and parrots clashing with DA's version of Elder Scrolls Nords- the Avvar. It was all odd to me.
Glad you brought that up - I've asked myself the same question. I always found the Avvar's choice of clothing odd for the perceived climate.
The "jungle" might seem out of place, but it's actually fully intended that way, I'm sure - if you pay attention you'll notice that both Frostback Basin and Arbor Wilds jungle in which Temple Of Mythal is hidden has one thing in common: ginormous trees around which the jungle itself sprouts (if you travel on the little island and look back at the Basin's river delta you'll note that the jungle only extends to the valley below the tree. The rest of the land is barren and - apparently - pretty damn cold).
Spoiler
interesting detail about JoH tree:
What's more, the Temple of Mythal is basically built around that giant tree. And the tree from Frostback Basin appears to be growing right above the ancient temple we find Ameridan and release Hakkon.
The game basically visually screams "oy, neither these trees or jungles are normal!"
What exactly they are or how they came to be (or what cut half of Frostback Tree, or how is it still sprouting branches and apparently keeps the jungle alive) we don't yet know, but we have some clues peppered throughout the game:
"In this place we prepare to hunt the pillars of the earth. Their workers scurry, witless, soulless. This death will be a mercy. We will make the earth blossom with their passing."
And in Trespasser we find a rune on Solas' mural depicting either slaying or defeating the Titan that has an interesting detail mentioned (http://dragonage.wik..._the_Deep_Roads): "For a moment, the scent of blood fills the air, and there is a vivid image of green vines growing and enveloping a sphere of fire."
Inquisitor also makes a mention that the elves mined Titans for lyrium and "something else".
Whatever that 'else' is, it likely enabled elves to grow entire jungles in places that wouldn't be fit for it IRL.
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