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[Swaggerjking]

I don't care or know about Solas or Mythal and I hope they aren't really andraste and shartan but I do know if you a v in Sera's name it becomes an anagram of Revas which is Elven for Freedom which I think is kinda ironic

[In Exile]

@Gervaise,
If Solas and Mythal are supposed to have parallels to Shartan and Andraste, I think you're probably right. That is is how folkore really works, anyway, legends getting mixed up with different real historical events over time... Mythical history doesn't really recount the historical facts of a people as they literally happened, so much as the spiritual, symbolic, and cultural values of a people. It happens to the Inquistitor in game even, being compared to Andraste. It's not that the Inquistitor is really the same as Andraste, but is carrying on what Andraste stood for, in spirit.

 

It may actually be that part of their story was wrapped up into the story of Andraste. 

[Big I]

It may actually be that part of their story was wrapped up into the story of Andraste. 

 

From where? Elven slaves in Tevinter? Even the Dalish don't remember the connection between Fen'Harel and Mythal, so it's unlikely the Tevinter elves during Andraste's time would. And if they don't there's no one to pass down the story and for Shartan and Andraste to be substituted into it.

 

It's entirely likely that there was no official mention of the relationship between Fen'Harel and Mythal during the ancient elven empire anyway. Solas was an enemy of the state. Pairing him in any capacity with a living god is unlikely to have been at all acceptable.

[Gervaise]

You are missing the point.   The elves didn't remember any names in the story.   It was a folktale about a rebellion of a trickster warrior against tyrants.   Now I'm quite surprised that the Dalish didn't make the connection with Fen'Harel but then again he is considered such an enemy of the people by them and their Creators are revered as benevolent overlords that probably accounts for why they didn't equate the two.    It is easy to see how this old folktale would have survived through their years of captivity by the tyrants of Tevinter and then been used by Shartan to inspire his followers in their fight.    It is also quite possible that the followers of Fen'Harel, who knew the truth, kept the memory of his fight alive by continuing the tale of his struggle against the Evanuris, but deliberately dropped his name from the tale because of the hatred that the followers of the Evanuris had for his actions.   So instead of calling the hero of the story Fen'Harel, he became simply known as "The Trickster Warrior", which in elven would translate as ******'Harel (I don't know the elven word for warrior), instead of Fen'Harel.    Whilst Fen'Harel is translated Dread Wolf (Fen = Wolf), harel usually means "to trick or deceive" and harellan means "trickster.

 

It just seems too convenient to me that we have an old elven folktale about the exploits of a rebel trickster warrior who fought against tyrants in order to free the slaves, associated with a story of Shartan fighting against Tevinter to free slaves and then finding out that in fact Fen'Harel was a rebel who fought against the tyrant mage lords of the elves in order to free their slaves. 

 

In the version of the Shartan story given by Sister Petrine in DA2 it implies that the battle of the Valarian Fields went Andraste's way not simply because Shartan's archers managed to break the enemy ice magic with fire arrows but they were actually taken into the battle by the Tevinter as part of their army (slave soldiers are often used to bolster numbers and sent in as the first line of defence so they are taking the casualties) and then changed sides at a crucial point in the fight. Shartan's division were in a much better position to attack the mages, who would have been standing back to cast their spells, than Andraste's army were and so it makes sense that this made the crucial difference in the outcome of the battle.  So instead of the arrows destroying the ice wall, their arrows broke the mages concentration so their spells failed.  

 

The fact that in official versions (as shown in World of Thedas 2) much of the text is blacked out, suggests that her version is nearer the truth than the Chantry would like to admit.   So as with the history of Andraste, we have two versions of what occurred with the elven rebellion.    One has them planning in advance to betray their masters but doing so actually at a crucial point in the battle itself; the other has them as slaves fleeing for their lives from the slave hunters and after killing them, hearing the approach of Andraste's army and joining up with them long before they even get to the Valarian Fields.    The difference between these two versions is presumably why the author of the preface to the Canticle of Shartan draws attention to the earlier elven folktale and the similarities with it.   Hence my assumption that probably much of the Canticle is narrating the earlier struggle of Fen'Harel with Shartan's name attached to it.

 

The writers of Dragon age say in the preface to World of Thedas 1 that there are hints within it about the future of Dragon Age and I assume that applies to WoT2 as well.   I could be wrong of course but I think the connection between that old elven folktale and the Canticle of Shartan is just one of those hints.

[Ieldra]

I don't post often, but this place is ok to post spoilers in, right?

 

Considering that spirits of wisdom can be twisted into pride demons, as Solas explains in Haven to an elfquisitor, and the following two lines from Cole in Trespasser:

 

"Bare-faced but free, frolicking fighting, fierce. He wants to give wisdom, not orders."

 

"He did not want a body. But she asked him to come. He left a scar when he burned her off his face."

 

.... My money's firmly on Solas meaning pride, and I'm getting some pretty spoilery vibes that Solas was a spirit first, summoned into a body by Mythal, and that for a while he wore her vallaslin until he eventually perfected the technique that later allowed him to remove the marks from other elves' faces. Which is why in game Solas has a ... thing... on his forehead. Have these two lines been addressed by anyone yet?

 

Any other meaning to the word is probably coincidental, and I'm betting in the case of Spanish and Irish, BW's writers probably giggled secretly and slapped each other on the back, but that's it.

 

Edited for formatting, sorry.

Fascinating. I never heard those lines. Thanks for posting them.

[Secret Rare]

That's why i said that Solas behave like a spirit,he is stubborn like them in pursuing his goals.