4635 réponses à ce sujet

[Hanako Ikezawa]

^I don't consider submission to corypheus salvation. But that's me.

It is compared to extinction, which is what Solas is offering. At least Corypheus isn't being racist about it. 

[lynroy]

Extinction? Do we know tearing down the veil will cause extinction?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Extinction? Do we know tearing down the veil will cause extinction?

Solas certainly explains it that way. One does not repeatedly say it will be the end of the world and your people unless that is what is going to happen. He even straight up admits it when you ask him about it. 

Inquisitor: "You'd murder countless people?"

Solas: "Wouldn't you to save your own?" 

(Hate how you can't reply to that)

[Macha'Anu]

Extinction? Do we know tearing down the veil will cause extinction?

Nope. We only know what they THINK will happen. We won't actually know what happens until it happens. IF it even does. I still think the whole point is to see if Solas changes his mind and we all end up fighting a elf who is not going to give up where he does. But who know. DA4 may be about some random town after the years of the inquisition. and it may be something entirely different all together. Never know. Most of the lashing to Solas and his plans is based on assumptions. Imma just wait paitently for the new one to release and see what happen. Meantime back to playthrough number 5 heh

[Hanako Ikezawa]

DA4 may be about some random town after the years of the inquisition. and it may be something entirely different all together. Never know. 

We know. Patrick Weekes stated that DA4 will conclude Solas' story, so it won't be an unrelated thing. 

[Macha'Anu]

We know. Patrick Weekes stated that DA4 will conclude Solas' story, so it won't be an unrelated thing. 

I know. I was being sarcastic. I know what he said i seen and heard the interviews. What im saying is we dont actually know whats going to happen. all of this is fantheory assumptions an sometimes its a little entertaining to see some people literally rage out over it and sometimes its intriguing to see such depth go into what "might" is going to happen. Gotta give crdit where its due. Some wonderful theories out there. I just hope they give me a little satisfaction when it doesnt happen at all the way we think. I love when the devs do that . heh. Anyway happy gaming!

[BansheeOwnage]

That's an insult to Corypheus. At least Corypheus offered his salvation to every race equally, rather than just the ancient elves.

Well, I still think we need to know more about how his plans will function. Because it might have less to do with being personally selective and more to do with certain races being better suited to readapt to the old world than others. Or something else entirely.

[BansheeOwnage]

It is compared to extinction, which is what Solas is offering. At least Corypheus isn't being racist about it. 

"Is submission not preferable to extinction?"                  (And wow, turians might look kinda scary in real life.)

 

Shepard didn't think so. In cases like these, I always like to ask: "What would Shepard do?"

 

Also, totally unrelated:

Spoiler

I had the exact same thought immediately when I watched that movie!

[lynroy]

Solas certainly explains it that way. One does not repeatedly say it will be the end of the world and your people unless that is what is going to happen. He even straight up admits it when you ask him about it.
Inquisitor: "You'd murder countless people?"
Solas: "Wouldn't you to save your own?"
(Hate how you can't reply to that)

That's just saying countless people will die, not everyone. Death toll is going to be high, but there could be survivors. I don't see that as extinction.

The world of the ancient elves was destroyed, the elves are still alive.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I didn't expect so many responses to a not really serious post.

 

"Is submission not preferable to extinction?"                  (And wow, turians might look kinda scary in real life.)

*snip*

 

Shepard didn't think so. Neither did any other sane character. In cases like these, I always like to ask: "What would Shepard do?"

Well, in the end Shepard does submit to the Reaper's reasoning, since the only ending where they don't results in extinction(Refuse) and I'm pretty sure that the cycle would have preferred one of the other options. Even with Destroy Shepard submits to the Reaper's reasoning since they effectively prove the Reaper's point.

 

Awesome Synthesis Saren picture by the way. 

 

That's just saying countless people will die, not everyone. Death toll is going to be high, but there could be survivors. I don't see that as extinction.

Fine, holocaust. Better? 

[BansheeOwnage]

I didn't expect so many responses to a not really serious post.

 

Well, in the end Shepard does submit to the Reaper's reasoning, since the only ending where they don't results in extinction(Refuse) and I'm pretty sure that the cycle would have preferred one of the other options. Even with Destroy Shepard submits to the Reaper's reasoning since they effectively prove the Reaper's point.

Well, hopefully I don't derail the thread, but I don't think it's fair to say that. Shepard destroying the Reapers is simply sticking to their guns (literally, in fact). It's continuing the thinking they had since the beginning. Shepard's thinking, Anderson's, the crew, and every non-indoctrinated person in the galaxy. It's not really submitting in my opinion. I mean, I suppose you could argue that they submitted to the Reapers' options, but they hardly have to adopt their ideology to want to blow them up. I don't see how that would prove the Reapers right in any way.

 

But to veer this back on-topic, Solas seems to have had to choose between roughly destroy (pyrrhic, with losses) and refuse (everyone dies).

[Almostfaceman]

Fine, holocaust. Better? 

 

Yup.

 

But we all know Bioware isn't going to let that happen.

 

Either they're going to change their world with the lowering of the Veil or they're not. No holocaust is going to be involved. We have to have stuff to do after DA4. And Solas will either kick the bucket or not. I'm betting on not, since he's a very popular character. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Well, hopefully I don't derail the thread, but I don't think it's fair to say that. Shepard destroying the Reapers is simply sticking to their guns (literally, in fact). It's continuing the thinking they had since the beginning. Shepard's thinking, Anderson's, the crew, and every non-indoctrinated person in the galaxy. It's not really submitting in my opinion. I mean, I suppose you could argue that they submitted to the Reapers' options, but they hardly have to adopt their ideology to want to blow them up. I don't see how that would prove the Reapers right in any way.

 

But to veer this back on-topic, Solas seems to have had to choose between roughly destroy (pyrrhic, with losses) and refuse (everyone dies).

It proves them right since when the option for peace is there, it will be ignored for further conflict which is what the Intelligence calculated would happen. But yeah, enough offtopic. 

 

So Solas is choosing the worst options of Mass Effect 3. Yay. 

Wait, how is him not doing anything the same as Refuse? I'd say that is more the Destroy choice than him continuing his plan is. Or did you mean it that way?

[Macha'Anu]

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Yup.

 

But we all know Bioware isn't going to let that happen.

 

Either they're going to change their world with the lowering of the Veil or they're not. No holocaust is going to be involved. We have to have stuff to do after DA4. And Solas will either kick the bucket or not. I'm betting on not, since he's a very popular character. 

Yeah, the part of the game involving Solas will be stopping him before he sunders the Veil since like you said if we don't then there isn't a Thedas to play around with anymore. 

I disagree about Solas not kicking the bucket though. While there are fans who chose to redeem him, there are those who chose to stop him in a way that will involve killing him. So not respecting that choice is a slap in the face to those players, just like not having the chance to redeem Solas would be to those who want to save him. 

[Almostfaceman]

I disagree about Solas not kicking the bucket though. While there are fans who chose to redeem him, there are those who chose to stop him in a way that will involve killing him. So not respecting that choice is a slap in the face to those players, just like not having the chance to redeem Solas would be to those who want to save him. 

 

You could be right, but...

 

Leliana and Morrigan are two characters I see people complain about still being alive despite being dead or something... isn't Morrigan capable of being stabbed? And Solas is way more popular than either of them. 

 

If Bioware wants a character to live they've shown they don't mind taking that choice away from us. 

 

The elven pantheon is just too cool to kill off, I see more Mythal and Solas in future games as like background characters or something. In fact we may need them in dealing with these huge Titan creatures they seem to be setting up for future games. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

You could be right, but...

 

Leliana and Morrigan are two characters I see people complain about still being alive despite being dead or something... isn't Morrigan capable of being stabbed? And Solas is way more popular than either of them. 

 

If Bioware wants a character to live they've shown they don't mind taking that choice away from us. 

 

The elven pantheon is just too cool to kill off, I see more Mythal and Solas in future games as like background characters or something. In fact we may need them in dealing with these huge Titan creatures they seem to be setting up for future games. 

Bioware has also expressed that they have heard the criticism and are going to avoid stuff like that in the future. By that I mean bring back a character who can be dead.

 

Where do you get that Solas is more popular than Leliana and Morrigan? 

 

I disagree. I've had enough elfy elven stuff. It's pretty much the only thing I agree with Sera on. 

Ugh, I hope not. Having them always show up and be good guys will kill my interest in the franchise.

[Almostfaceman]

Bioware has also expressed that they have heard the criticism and are going to avoid stuff like that in the future. By that I mean bring back a character who can be dead.

 

Where do you get that Solas is more popular than Leliana and Morrigan? 

 

I disagree. I've had enough elfy elven stuff. It's pretty much the only thing I agree with Sera on. 

Ugh, I hope not. Having them always show up and be good guys will kill my interest in the franchise.

 

Seriously? You want the elves to be the same boring trod-upon second class citizens under the boot heel of the other races? What fun is that? They're not going to get rid of the elves, they've opened up possibilities for the race I don't see them walking that back. 

 

And if they're opening up possibilities for the elves I see them making other races more interesting as well. Lowering the Veil opens up all kinds of interesting possibilities. I want more stuff like the Crossroads. That's pretty amazeballs stuff. 

 

Where do i get he's more popular? It's just my impression. I don't see people discussing Morrigan and Leliana nearly as much and they were both in more games than Solas. It's just my impression, I don't pretend it to be hard scientific fact or anything. Do you see him as less popular? 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Seriously? You want the elves to be the same boring trod-upon second class citizens under the boot heel of the other races? What fun is that? They're not going to get rid of the elves, they've opened up possibilities for the race I don't see them walking that back. 

 

And if they're opening up possibilities for the elves I see them making other races more interesting as well. Lowering the Veil opens up all kinds of interesting possibilities. I want more stuff like the Crossroads. That's pretty amazeballs stuff. 

 

Where do i get he's more popular? It's just my impression. I don't see people discussing Morrigan and Leliana nearly as much and they were both in more games than Solas. It's just my impression, I don't pretend it to be hard scientific fact or anything. Do you see him as less popular? 

I said I've had enough elfy elven stuff, not elven stuff. I would love to have something like helping the modern elves out of their predicament.

 

What possibilities? Everyone but the ancient elves will be dead or best case driven insane by the sudden huge connection to the Fade. 

 

I see him as less popular, yes. While he is being talked about more than them, a lot of it is because there are a lot of people who hate him as well as those that love him. Those two sides debate thus have more noticable discussions than Leliana or Morrigan who don't really have anything to be debated about in comparison. Same reason Anders showed up the most after DA2 despite not being the most popular character. 

[Almostfaceman]

 

What possibilities? Everyone but the ancient elves will be dead or best case driven insane by the sudden huge connection to the Fade. 

 

 

I think they left that deliberately vague. I don't see the holocaust happening so I see the possibilities of everyone having a more conscious connection to the Fade. If your mind doesn't go there, fine. Mine does. 

 

Floating magical cities? Way cool. Crossroads? Awesomesauce. Different flavors of magic based on race? Pure win. Dwarves connecting with Titans and blowing away the Blight with their powers? Sweet!

 

Modern elves aren't interesting without all their background and lore, to me. They can't be separated. You strip away their pantheon you strip away everything that makes them unique and interesting. They become humans with pointy ears. Bleh. 

[Aren]

If he was the one who said to Dorian that Arlathan was no less innocent, then it follows that he did indeed learn it and points to Solas is NOT aiming specifically to restore Elvenhan back.

The removal of the veil isn't necessarily the true natural state of the world but just the state that is more fitting to preserve remnants  of an extinct elven race.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I think they left that deliberately vague on purpose. I don't see the holocaust happening so I see the possibilities of everyone having a more conscious connection to the Fade. If your mind doesn't go there, fine. Mine does. 

How do you see it not happening? Even Solas, the ultimate supporter of his plan, sees that as happening. 

 

Modern elves aren't interesting without all their background and lore, to me. They can't be separated. You strip away their pantheon you strip away everything that makes them unique and interesting. They become humans with pointy ears. Bleh. 

I find the City Elves much more fascinating than the Dalish Elves, despite not having the things you say makes elves interesting. I'm hoping next game we are able to play as a City Elf instead of being forced to be a Pro-Dalish Dalish Elf. 

[Almostfaceman]

How do you see it not happening? Even Solas, the ultimate supporter of his plan, sees that as happening. 

 

 

We just discussed that, see the posts above. 

[Almostfaceman]

The removal of the veil isn't necessarily the true natural state of the world but just the state that is more fitting to preserve the glory of an extinct elven race.

 

It is the natural state of the world unless you have proof otherwise. Solas literally has nothing to gain or any plausible motivations for lying about that. You're welcome to your head canon, of course, but you're going to need a stronger argument than that to be convincing, in my opinion. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

We just discussed that, see the posts above. 

I know. Again I stand with my view that they will just not have it happen and have us stop him before he does it. You never really explained how people would survive this with little to know ill effect like you are projecting.