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[Almostfaceman]

I don't own it. I'm just relaying what I was told by someone who does. 

As for who said it was factual, that would be Bioware. The Codexes are muddy and biased, but WoT is factual. 

 

Oh, well so far this is what I've found. 

 

"The earliest known points of Thedosian history are documented in partial texts and old stories that only hint at the reality of these ancient times. Dalish keepers and the dwarven Shaperate speak of a Thedas entirely devoid of humans, a time when elves reigned over the land and dwarves ruled the underground.

 

When humans came, everything is said to have changed. What peace may or may not have existed gave way to all-out war, and humans nearly destroyed the elves with the rise of the Tevinter Imperium. This first human empire and its worship of the Old Gods spread across Thedas. The elves either fled to the far reaches of the continent or were enslaved." 

 

I'll keep reading and see if I can find out anything else. 

[Almostfaceman]

So far there's nothing about humans outside of Thedas. There is information about early human tribes and I think this is from where you were told your information. It doesn't support that humans outside of Thedas could not practice magic, however. 

 

The early human tribes are broken into three loose groups. Tevinter Imperium, Ferelden, and Orlais & Nevarra. There's no clear information what the relationship is between them all. 

 

For the Tevinter Imperium, we have this about the Neromenian tribe:

 

"Believed to be the first humans in Thedas, the Neromenians fought early battles with the elves and were also the first humans to practice magic. They settled the entire coastline along the Nocen Sea. Eventually, three distinct tribes broke off to form separate kingoms: Qarinus, Tevinter, and Barindur." 

 

So, out of all the tribes mentioned the Neromenians are the ones who had earliest known contact with the elves and are the earliest known tribe to practice magic. Even this, though, isn't set in stone and is couched in terms like "Believed to be..." 

 

There's also a lot of lore outdated by new lore from Inquisition, since it looks like it was published before Inquisition. It came out in May of 2014 and Inquisition came out in November of 2014. One clear example is the information about lyrium calls it nonliving, while that's clearly being contradicted in Inquisition. 

 

World of Thedas really does nothing to clear up the fog that is the early history of Thedas or the origins of humanity outside of Thedas. 

[Hellion Rex]

As far as I am aware, I do think it was written somewhere that the humans didn't have magic till they came to these shores, but I certainly agree that calling this muddy is an understatement. I don't think it can be definitely stated one way or the other. All we really know for sure is that the Fade affects the denizens of the Thedosian continent, at the least. Whether or not it extends beyond its borders though remains unseen.

That said, I would argue that it perhaps doesn't extend farther though. Solas raised the Veil to separate reality from the world of dreams. The Fade is something that touches all life, and thus the Veil is also connected to everyone living. It is one thing to create such a magical construct that affects a continent and the surrounding areas, but it is another thing entirely to have it affect the entire world.

[Mistic]

As far as I am aware, I do think it was written somewhere that the humans didn't have magic till they came to these shores, but I certainly agree that calling this muddy is an understatement.

 

In WoT you can fin this: "Believed to be the first humans in Thedas, the Neromenians fought early battles with the elves and were also the first humans to practice magic".

 

It's certainly muddy, and as Almostfaceman says, it's open to rumour and interpretation. For all we know, they already knew about magic before arriving. What seems more or less accepted is that humans learned of blood magic in Thedas. Who taught them, however, is still a matter of debate.

[midnight tea]

There's also a lot of lore outdated by new lore from Inquisition, since it looks like it was published before Inquisition. It came out in May of 2014 and Inquisition came out in November of 2014. One clear example is the information about lyrium calls it nonliving, while that's clearly being contradicted in Inquisition. 

 

World of Thedas really does nothing to clear up the fog that is the early history of Thedas or the origins of humanity outside of Thedas. 

 

I wouldn't say it's "outdated" - if it's written from in-game perspective, then it's simply inaccurate in-universe. You know... just like theories that Earth is flat or hollow are inaccurate here, in hindsight

 

But it's true that since WOT is written pretty much entirely from in-universe perspective it will have information that is either inaccurate, half-right or buried under layers of misunderstanding or misinterpretation made by in-universe people. The (out-of-universe) authors will obviously throw hints and interesting tidbits here and there, but we should always treat information there like we do codices: with a grain of salt... Just like Vivienne's comment in Vir Dirthara abut it being impossible for the world without Veil existing since there are no records for it in human history.

[Hellion Rex]

In WoT you can fin this: "Believed to be the first humans in Thedas, the Neromenians fought early battles with the elves and were also the first humans to practice magic".

It's certainly muddy, and as Almostfaceman says, it's open to rumour and interpretation. For all we know, they already knew about magic before arriving. What seems more or less accepted is that humans learned of blood magic in Thedas. Who taught them, however, is still a matter of debate.

I've always kind of wondered who taught them blood magic. I imagine Arlathan elves practiced it in some form or fashion.

Well, we know the Forbidden Ones were connected to the ancient elves, and codices sometimes lay the blame on those 4 demons for teaching humans blood magic, so perhaps there is some actual weight to those claims.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

Me personally IDK WTF the writers were thinking to turn Solas into this complex heartless intellectual to destroy everything to bring back the glory days, it's like they can't come up with nothing new. They should've wrote him a whole lot better like him waiting for the elven Inquisitor to offer her to come with him so they could gather all elves and use the eluvians to find a place and never come back to Thedas ever again. That would be a happy ending for Solas so he could leave all that baggage behind him so he could finally have a new life.

[Hellion Rex]

While I'm down for stopping Solas, including killing him if necessary, I wouldn't call him heartless. He cares for a lot of Inquisitors, but that won't stop him from enacting his plans. It's in spite of his feelings that he acts as he does.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

While I'm down for stopping Solas, including killing him if necessary, I wouldn't call him heartless. He cares for a lot of Inquisitors, but that won't stop him from enacting his plans. It's in spite of his feelings that he acts as he does.

A good person knows when to stop and a good person knows what is wrong and not to do it at all. It just seems to me that the writers were just plain 'ol lazy of not giving Solas a happy ending he deserves, but instead they made him another Corypheus who wants to tear down the Veil. Even if he succeeded it would all be for nothing because the elven gods would wreak havoc and kill him and all of this would be for nothing. *sighs* They could've wrote it better than that.

[Nimlowyn]

I especially enjoy the entry about Solas in World of Thedas Volume 2. It spans about 3 pages and fawns over his "selfless dedication":

 

"Without fanfare or expectation of reward, the quiet apostate gave the Inquisition exactly the tools it needed to succeed at each critical step in the organization's development...Solas left the Inquisition after the defeat of Corypheus, presumably returning to his peaceful, solitary life. Wherever he is now, his work with the Inquisition is a testament to what is possible when people from different backgrounds come together without prejudice for a noble end." (WOT 2 230-232). 

 

Lol. 

 

I mean, you could make the case that he does toil in selfless dedication. I just doubt the in-universe person who wrote this would agree. 

[Macha'Anu]

Well I mean by those standards people thought anders was a good person, just misguided and loghain a good person just misguided. Idk if I would call a umpteen thousand year old God who rebelled, risking his own immortal life and risking losing who he truly was in history (which he did since everyone sees him as some cackling mad God who wrings his hands together in victory. Read that in a codex last night. Close to it anyway) to save his people from branding slavery and death. Somehow the elves with no high standing in society (going back to ancient times to the no elves have high standing today because..pointy ears) have always been treated as lesser beings and objects meant for ownership and labor. And that is what is truly heartless.

[Mistic]

They should've wrote him a whole lot better like him waiting for the elven Inquisitor to offer her to come with him so they could gather all elves and use the eluvians to find a place and never come back to Thedas ever again. That would be a happy ending for Solas so he could leave all that baggage behind him so he could finally have a new life.

 

It could still happen, like an advanced version of the ending at Witch Hunt. An ending in which if you convince Solas to stop, he takes his (surviving) followers through the Eluvians to find a world of their own, never to come back again. Romanced Inquisitor Lavellan going with him optional.

 

Of course, that doesn't imply that, depending on choices, there can't be another ending in which Solas is executed by murder knife.

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

It could still happen, like an advanced version of the ending at Witch Hunt. An ending in which if you convince Solas to stop, he takes his (surviving) followers through the Eluvians to find a world of their own, never to come back again. Romanced Inquisitor Lavellan going with him optional.
 
Of course, that doesn't imply that, depending on choices, there can't be another ending in which Solas is executed by murder knife.

He should've asked her to come with him if he really loved her that much, but he left her to suffer and try not to find a way to heal her marked hand. That's some cold blooded **** in the beginning of the scene where the Inquisitor was suffering from theark and he just strolled with his hands at his back instead of running to her hug and kiss her. That's some half-assed work they did and it's a shame that they wrote it that way.

[Macha'Anu]

He should've asked her to come with him if he really loved her that much, but he left her to suffer and try not to find a way to heal her marked hand. That's some cold blooded **** in the beginning of the scene where the Inquisitor was suffering from theark and he just strolled with his hands at his back instead of running to her hug and kiss her. That's some half-assed work they did and it's a shame that they wrote it that way.

Bollocks. Just absolute Bollocks. Now Im sure you are either exaggerating out of biased or just plain BSing. I romanced Anders and Solas both of whom did or are talking of commiting genocide. Anders kept it a secrect because Hawke is a Noble of sorts. a hero to the city important. In no way shape or form did Anders want to ruin her/his standing simply by doing wht he percived as justice. Regardless if i agreed with him or not. twice i romanced him the first time i stood by him the second time i killed him myself. But I did so knowing he did what he thought was right and i happen to think he was wrong. It was too late to change his mind.

 

Solas is the same concept. He doesnt think he deserves Levellan. His grave in the fade says Dying Alone. He truly has been alone for so long he thinks dying alone is terrifying and yet He leaves her behind because he doesnt think he deserves any kind of happiness. He knows what he is doing is monsterous. And he thinks she deserves better than that. He does this because he knows, or at least in my opinion, what hes about to do is release those he imprisioned and he will have to do whatever it takes to destroy them. He sees them as evil. Even Mythal/Flemeth was up to something shady. I meany why exactly did she need an old gods soul. " I will get her the justice she deserves no matter the cost!" her words. just a few short hours ago. Maybe Mythal isnt as loving and caring as we percieve her. Maybe she could have been planning on doing something worse than solas. We wont know now since he stopped her in her tracks.

There are a ton of things we don't know. A whole lot of things.

Solas is trying, IMHO to protect Levellan by not telling her everything. the less she knows the safer she is?

But again, We don't know everything. Everyone is just wrapped up in their own headcanon without all the real facts.

Solas is Heartless. Misguided and angry perhaps but he rished being found out to stop cory because his initial plan did not work. And he was hoping the mosnter would die in the explosion. I guess he didnt know the darkspawn magister doesnt die so easily.

But this is just my opinion and i dont claim any of it to be fact.

 

Gotta say though I cannot wait til the next installment. So many people are gonna be raging at how wrong they way. Please Bioware stick it to em heh

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

Bollocks. Just absolute Bollocks. Now Im sure you are either exaggerating out of biased or just plain BSing. I romanced Anders and Solas both of whom did or are talking of commiting genocide. Anders kept it a secrect because Hawke is a Noble of sorts. a hero to the city important. In no way shape or form did Anders want to ruin her/his standing simply by doing wht he percived as justice. Regardless if i agreed with him or not. twice i romanced him the first time i stood by him the second time i killed him myself. But I did so knowing he did what he thought was right and i happen to think he was wrong. It was too late to change his mind.
 
Solas is the same concept. He doesnt think he deserves Levellan. His grave in the fade says Dying Alone. He truly has been alone for so long he thinks dying alone is terrifying and yet He leaves her behind because he doesnt think he deserves any kind of happiness. He knows what he is doing is monsterous. And he thinks she deserves better than that. He does this because he knows, or at least in my opinion, what hes about to do is release those he imprisioned and he will have to do whatever it takes to destroy them. He sees them as evil. Even Mythal/Flemeth was up to something shady. I meany why exactly did she need an old gods soul. " I will get her the justice she deserves no matter the cost!" her words. just a few short hours ago. Maybe Mythal isnt as loving and caring as we percieve her. Maybe she could have been planning on doing something worse than solas. We wont know now since he stopped her in her tracks.
There are a ton of things we don't know. A whole lot of things.
Solas is trying, IMHO to protect Levellan by not telling her everything. the less she knows the safer she is?
But again, We don't know everything. Everyone is just wrapped up in their own headcanon without all the real facts.
Solas is Heartless. Misguided and angry perhaps but he rished being found out to stop cory because his initial plan did not work. And he was hoping the mosnter would die in the explosion. I guess he didnt know the darkspawn magister doesnt die so easily.
But this is just my opinion and i dont claim any of it to be fact.
 
Gotta say though I cannot wait til the next installment. So many people are gonna be raging at how wrong they way. Please Bioware stick it to em heh

Dude. It's only my opinion. No need to get all personal I'm just saying it could've been a whole lot better with Solas because he's my favorite character. Chill. Out.

[Mistic]

He should've asked her to come with him if he really loved her that much, but he left her to suffer and try not to find a way to heal her marked hand. That's some cold blooded **** in the beginning of the scene where the Inquisitor was suffering from theark and he just strolled with his hands at his back instead of running to her hug and kiss her. That's some half-assed work they did and it's a shame that they wrote it that way.

 

Er, I think that would have been very out of character for him. After all, he's the guy who had the perfect moment to be honest and tell the truth about who he was, but willingly squandered it to reveal an awful truth about Dalish tattoos (which, depending on choices, can be taken very badly by the Inquisitor) and then break up.

 

We know he wants to play the cold-blooded part. If he's friends with the Inquisitor, he reveals how hard it is for him, but he does it regardless because he believes it's the right thing to do. He's not the first, nor will he be the last, character in fiction that believes that they have to sacrifice their feelings to achieve their goals.

 

Call it preparation for his likely more villainous role in the next game.

[Macha'Anu]

s'all good. I was just giving my opinion on what i have read thus far. Im quite chill. No capslocks here I just personally think your opinion is lacking no worries Happy gaming

[BaaBaaBlacksheep]

Er, I think that would have been very out of character for him. After all, he's the guy who had the perfect moment to be honest and tell the truth about who he was, but willingly squandered it to reveal an awful truth about Dalish tattoos (which, depending on choices, can be taken very badly by the Inquisitor) and then break up.
 
We know he wants to play the cold-blooded part. If he's friends with the Inquisitor, he reveals how hard it is for him, but he does it regardless because he believes it's the right thing to do. He's not the first, nor will he be the last, character in fiction that believes that they have to sacrifice their feelings to achieve their goals.
 
Call it preparation for his likely more villainous role in the next game.

He should saw this as an opportunity to start over with someone he loves, and if I were him I would've told her the truth after Corypheus was defeated. He can settle down to a new place with the elves to start over, instead of tearing down the Veil and he will screw everything up again. What's done is done and he should see that the best thing he can do is to find a new place and leave it that.

[Macha'Anu]

Now that i can understand however I do think if they did put that in there it wouldl ikely mess up an entires plot line and they would have to start from scratch on the story they already have written out. It was, unfortunately a means to an end of DA:I Sometimes we just don't always get the happy ending

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Now that i can understand however I do think if they did put that in there it wouldl ikely mess up an entires plot line and they would have to start from scratch on the story they already have written out. It was, unfortunately a means to an end of DA:I Sometimes we just don't always get the happy ending

The vanilla game had a happy ending. But then they had to ruin it with Trespasser which didn't add anything equivalent to the cost. 

[Macha'Anu]

The vanilla game had a happy ending. But then they had to ruin it with Trespasser which didn't add anything equivalent to the cost. 

Depends on how you played it. you really need to remember not everyone made the same choices as you. More than once in all 3 games i had the typical dark fantasy sadness ending. Also being dumped doesnt feel so happy. Also can happen in many choices of each game.

So No it doesnt always have a happy ending

[Macha'Anu]

I think the biggest lack of understanding today is what a dark fantasy entails. its not going to always be prince charming rescues you and sweeps you off your feet and the bad guy dies and everyone lives happily ever after. Game of thrones should teach people that... Dark Fantasy is called Dark Fantasy for a reason. You can't always get what you want. And a happy ending is included in there

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Depends on how you played it. you really need to remember not everyone made the same choices as you. More than once in all 3 games i had the typical dark fantasy sadness ending. Also being dumped doesnt feel so happy. Also can happen in many choices of each game.

So No it doesnt always have a happy ending

Bad guy defeated, hero survives, the world respects you. That sounds like a happy ending to me. There can be sad parts yes, but that makes it a bittersweet ending which still falls under the happy ending umbrella.

 

I think the biggest lack of understanding today is what a dark fantasy entails. its not going to always be prince charming rescues you and sweeps you off your feet and the bad guy dies and everyone lives happily ever after. Game of thrones should teach people that... Dark Fantasy is called Dark Fantasy for a reason. You can't always get what you want. And a happy ending is included in there

Dragon Age is not dark fantasy, regardless of whether Bioware thinks it is or not. It is high fantasy with a few dark themes.

[dawnstone]

*snip*

 

 Maybe Mythal isnt as loving and caring as we percieve her. Maybe she could have been planning on doing something worse than solas. We wont know now since he stopped her in her tracks.

*snip*

We don't actually know if Flemeth/Mythal is dead, or if she's hitchhiking inside of Solas, or if she sent part of herself elsewhere through the Eluvian in her last scene. This is the woman who says "Why must I be in only one place?" and "Bodies are so limiting.".

[Macha'Anu]

Bad guy defeated, hero survives, the world respects you. That sounds like a happy ending to me. There can be sad parts yes, but that makes it a bittersweet ending which still falls under the happy ending umbrella.

 

Dragon Age is not dark fantasy, regardless of whether Bioware thinks it is or not. It is high fantasy with a few dark themes.

Thats your opinion. Just remember that. And The dragon Age I know Winning is usually not that simple. I've played enough RP games to know that it is NEVER the end. There is always something lurking in the background. More villianous, more evil, more threatening. You can placate it all you want to suit the narrative you choose and that is fine but some of us don't agree and we certainly shouldnt have to go through 4 or 5 pages defending why we think oppisote of you. It shouldn't be a war when it comes to how people see a game and how they feel when they play it and what they think will happen next. In fact this poor OP just wanted to discuss why some of us are crazy enough to undertand solas best we can with what we know and its no different than the anders supporters or the loghain supporters or even the Tevinter supporters. Everyone likes what they like. I for one respect anyone who doesnt think as i do on the games and I absolutely am ok with that. Because its my game to mold and my story to tell. only what i think matters to me. Happy Gaming