The Black City seems to be the only constant in the fade, but yes, all the rest is shaped by will, belief, and perception. That's why it's said (either in banter or codex) that the fade probably wouldn't have floating rocks if dwarves dreamt, since they live in a world where stone is anchored.
I don't think that's necessarily related - it's not like the people who like Solas want to see his plan happen, pretty much everyone agrees that would be bad with the current information we have. And if it did happen, I'm sure we would get to see how the modern world adapts to that more magical setting (if they were going to go ahead and actually change the setting like that, I'm 100% it wouldn't just be "and now all the modern cultures are dead" because that would just be a massive waste).
Personally I'd be interested in seeing more of the modern setting as it is, but I'd also be interested in seeing those modern cultures react to such a thing as the Veil being destroyed if Bioware decided to go that way - I'm interested in seeing the world change and adapt, that's inherently more interesting to me that seeing things stagnate - I don't like how the Mage/Templar conflict has been resolved because it doesn't seem like anything has really changed. I want to see the world grow, in whatever direction Bioware decides to take it.
Ok so... an analogy would actually make the point super simple but since people here don't want RL analogies...
When does imposing your own peculiar perspective of the world on people who feel otherwise EVER work? It never works in history. In Solasland everyone should be super intolerant sexually and white and Elfy, so if you are LGBT or not white or whatever it's a problem.
I could say that's like certain countries, because it's true, but, like I get it, we won't go there.
Solas doesn't accept that kind of person, and those people are offended by his attempt to do... so the solution is to force everyone to live according to those rules?
If you can't get people to agree with you, you don't get to force them to, it's just that simple.
I mean, not that that stops people from using coercion to get agreement, but like literally everyone knows when agreement is coerced or artificial so that's not really a thing in the grand scheme of things.
You want know what will happen? It's like this thread, people will just keep arguing the entire time. In Thedas or whatever, millions or billions or whatever would die, there would be massive displacement, and no progress would be made. It's particularly egregious because as far as craptastic ideologies, Solas's is definitely way up there.
Well except that maybe you should listen to people.
Saying that people should have been paying attention, completely ignores that devs can get away with this kind of stuff 99% of the time, and nothing is ever said. Don't put it on the players. If there was any consistency on this, then it would be a valid argument, As it stands, its not.
Well, you're certainly not going to have some "final say" on whether or not there was enough content. You don't think there was and others disagree.
Devs never "get away" with anything. There's always plenty of forums with plenty of people nitpicking everything they do to death. Let's not pretend you're some arbiter of all that is right or wrong with a particular video game. You have your opinion and that's all you have.
Other players can certainly have an opinion that those who say there is insufficient content - just aren't paying enough attention.
As it stands, opinions vary.
Just like Almostfaceman, I don't find him divorced from anything at all. Dragon Age has always been hinting about the big lore revelations, and they all tie into modern Thedas. Everything seems like a logical progression so far.
I'm interested in Modern Thedas, but you can't understand the "current" world without understanding the past. It's all the same thing to me. The current state of the Elves all tie back to Solas, the current state of mages/templars goes back to all these abuses thousands of years ago. Modern Thedas didn't just spring out of nowhere, it was all due to these major happens in the past.
He's not divorced from the past in a literal intellectual sense, he's divorced from it in a meaningful comprehensive sense. It's like someone aware of the existence of ruins and runes from way in the past, way before everyone else, but he can't read them, and couldn't possibly dream of reading them he just knows they are there.
In fact, random passerbys on the street, just your random average person, is more likely to be able to read them.
There's so much to do in the Hinterlands?Those fetch quests who don't have any substances?According to this reasoning all those players are wrong because these fetch quests are at least something instead of the total nothing?Get out of the Hinterlands isn't a positive meme it's just describe how boring the zone is and how is not worth to be explored.I clear the zones which are full of endless mobs that will eventually respawn more numerous than before via fetch quests and then engage in meaningful social interactions with some npc who stand there more static than a tree and provide most of the time non engaging conversations.
Which "fetch quests" do you exactly mean? The small quests that eventually accumulate to Inquisition making Crossroads into a real refugee camp? Getting zealots' alliance? Finding hideouts of both rogue mages and templars and stabilizing the road to Redcliffe? Investigating a group of unusually well-equipped bandits, until we eventually track them down to abandoned mansion and gain key to Vallamar?
It's boring only if you don't pay attention.
And could they spice up some PC interactions? Sure, they could (even though the major difference betwwen DAI NPCs and other agmes is merely a camera close-up. But we have such an insane amount of interactions and quests in from Skyhold, so many of them touching so many issues and cultural or national relations or conventions (like Josephine's or Sera's) I don't see how the world isn't fleshed out, aside from all what we can stumble upon while questing or doing War Table missions.
He's not divorced from the past in a literal intellectual sense, he's divorced from it in a meaningful comprehensive sense. It's like someone aware of the existence of ruins and runes from way in the past, way before everyone else, but he can't read them, and couldn't possibly dream of reading them he just knows they are there.
In fact, random passerbys on the street, just your random average person, is more likely to be able to read them.
What in the game would support this opinion of Solas?
What in the game would support this opinion of Solas?
I was speaking figuratively, not literally speaking of runes or words.
But like when does he ever discuss his own personal emotional opinion on the situation? It's that childish super rage towards everything.
If the Ancient Elves or anyone else was super powerful or important or had some kind of thematic message to teach us or anyone else, Solas couldn't tell you, he just has "X is good" "Y is bad" kind of basics here and there's it...
That's why this thread is a spew of Elven capital this, fade that, Solas doesn't have anything to teach us about the meaning of these things he's simply created inumnerable categories for the existence of such things.
The reality is, you don't need to know what the Elves did then or what happened with who where to know what's wrong in the present time.
Saying that people should have been paying attention, completely ignores that devs can get away with this kind of stuff 99% of the time, and nothing is ever said. Don't put it on the players. If there was any consistency on this, then it would be a valid argument, As it stands, its not.
"Get away" with what? Not spoon-feeding people information in least subtle way possible? Telling the story in a way that doesn't fit someone's specific or limited understanding of how to rely information about the world?
Yeah, sorry - we can talk about whether the writers have done a good job or not at places or in certain instances. As a whole? It's not serious to accuse them with "getting away" with not establishing an insane amount of information, either in DAI or across all 3 games. Add to that auxillary material and you see why word-building and lore junkies love this world. The fact remains that it is so vast that to keep up with it you *have to* pay attention.
You really don't come across like you've played the game at all, this is pure gibberish. Is English your native language?
Jeez another day more trolling.... reported again. You really should find a new hobby.
And yes I have played the game, my point is Solas is reporting on events of the past, but seems basically at a loss to describe their meaning or purpose, and appears quite directionless at times.
Jeez another day more trolling.... reported again. You really should find a new hobby.
And yes I have played the game, my point is Solas is reporting on events of the past, but seems basically at a loss to describe their meaning or purpose, and appears quite directionless at times.
Report all you want, if you're not making sense I'll say so. And there's nothing in the game to support this opinion. What is directionless about Solas? What does he describe in the past that has no meaning or purpose?
Jeez another day more trolling.... reported again. You really should find a new hobby.
And yes I have played the game, my point is Solas is reporting on events of the past, but seems basically at a loss to describe their meaning or purpose, and appears quite directionless at times.
That... really does come across like you didn't' play game at all. Like, seriously. At this point you're just rambling, as you seem to have something of a penchant for.
Well I'm not even going to read the comments again it's always negative or just really passive aggressive 100% of the time anyway, how does it feel to be so predictable I wonder?
Anyway, I did go back and check and yes Solas is possessed by this curiosity and interest in the past, knowledge of the past, but not what it means per se. He is following logic in all instances not emotions, it's... pretty straightforward.
Well I'm not even going to read the comments again it's always negative or just really passive aggressive 100% of the time anyway, how does it feel to be so predictable I wonder?
Anyway, I did go back and check and yes Solas is possessed by this curiosity and interest in the past, knowledge of the past, but not what it means per se. He is following logic in all instances not emotions, it's... pretty straightforward.
Well if you're not going to read comments then don't post on a public message board. Write in your diary.
You're still not giving us any examples from the game regarding what you're talking about... so it makes it impossible to know what you're talking about. He clearly speaks of the ancient elven past and what it means to him and he doesn't really speak of much without emotion. I can't relate to anything you're saying and you're not providing any examples for a frame of reference.
Well I'm not even going to read the comments again it's always negative or just really passive aggressive 100% of the time anyway, how does it feel to be so predictable I wonder?
Anyway, I did go back and check and yes Solas is possessed by this curiosity and interest in the past, knowledge of the past, but not what it means per se. He is following logic in all instances not emotions, it's... pretty straightforward.
Don't take this the wrong way, but I have to agree with the other posters about your posts being rather nonsensical. It's hard to hold a conversation with someone who seems to be inventing random facts from nowhere without posting anything to back it up and accusing anyone that disagrees with them as trolling. This isn't a case of me disagreeing with your opinions, it's me having having literally no idea of where your opinions have even come from or why. I'm not the only one who seems to have this problem, so I don't think it's my reading comprehension that is the issue... 
You mean he is too aloof from his own story/situation?I was speaking figuratively, not literally speaking of runes or words.
But like when does he ever discuss his own personal emotional opinion on the situation? It's that childish super rage towards everything.
If the Ancient Elves or anyone else was super powerful or important or had some kind of thematic message to teach us or anyone else, Solas couldn't tell you, he just has "X is good" "Y is bad" kind of basics here and there's it...
That's why this thread is a spew of Elven capital this, fade that, Solas doesn't have anything to teach us about the meaning of these things he's simply created inumnerable categories for the existence of such things.
The reality is, you don't need to know what the Elves did then or what happened with who where to know what's wrong in the present time.
According to Solas fans, giving weapons of mass destruction to the embodiment of violence and corruption to create a massive explosion that resulted in significant loss of life and massive property damage is and I will leave the quote down here...
"Not As Evil As You Claim"
I truly wonder what is "evil enough" for Solas fans.
False. The people in post-Veil Thedas are not emotionless. Moreover, this assumes that all who cannot or do not access the Fade are Tranquils in some way. Constant use of Blood Magic slowly blocks one's connection to the Fade. Does this make them Tranquil ? I don't think so.
Furthermore, no one has observed what happens to a non-mage that was administered the Rite of Tranquility.
Also what "full" existence is exactly ? The fact that you put those words in quotes means you don't even know what that means, do you ? Most importantly, do you see any mages exhibiting the qualities of a "full" existence when you bring them to the Fade at Adamant Fortress. Nope.
All peoples of Thedas, except dwarves and the tranquil dream and they dream in the fade. What would be the effect on someone who doesn't dream? would that drive a person insane like not being able to sleep at all;
And those elven artifacts we activated for Solas? were they reinforcing the Veil and thats why Solas was so determined they be activated in the first place. I have to wonder if the artifacts becoming inactive is what awakened Solas in the first place.
Until more information is provided about the Evanuris themselves I will not take Solas word, we know he can lie and subterfuge to suit his own purpose, and everyone skews facts to paint themselves in the best possible light.
From what i understood "Divorced" in the sense that he is not invested in the modern world nor he was part of it's evolution.
He raised the veil then went to sleep until the Dragon age.
Yes, that's what the poster meant by divorced.
What I find most interested about Thedas is not the high magic, ancient gods stuff, but modern Thedas. I think that's one of the biggest reasons why I find Solas uninteresting and his "twist" makes me cringe.
Which leads me to wonder, are his fans alright with how divorced he is from everything else going on in the world? This is a genuine question of mine; I'm not trying to be cheeky.
Yes, this is also one of the reasons why I dislike Solas... he's just "uber mage with a different plan than most of anything we've been dealing with".
NOTE: Had it been Flemythal... I'd have actually digested it better. At least she was established on more than a mythological level.
I preferred it when Thedas was talking about issues that weren't so pointlessly untopical for anything pertaining to the real world. I prefer my literature to have some relevance to life... and ancient uber-mage wanting to bring back ancient uber-mage kingdom where magic magic magic magic magic.... has no intrinsic value to me.
So... perhaps DA:4 won't be for me... but I suspect that DA:4 will be about showing how wrong Solas is... so, I'll probably bite.
Until more information is provided about the Evanuris themselves I will not take Solas word, we know he can lie and subterfuge to suit his own purpose, and everyone skews facts to paint themselves in the best possible light.
Did you play Trespasser? I ask because Solas was put in a position where he had no reason whatsoever to lie, had nothing to gain by lying, would have been better off not talking to the Inquisitor at all, would have served his plans more securely by letting the Inquisitor die or by killing the Inquisitor. He doesn't even let the Inquisitor see him "in the best possible light."
There's no reasonable argument that can be made that Solas lied to the Inquisitor in Trespasser, there at the end.
Did you play Trespasser? I ask because Solas was put in a position where he had no reason whatsoever to lie, had nothing to gain by lying, would have been better off not talking to the Inquisitor at all, would have served his plans more securely by letting the Inquisitor die or by killing the Inquisitor. He doesn't even let the Inquisitor see him "in the best possible light."
There's no reasonable argument that can be made that Solas lied to the Inquisitor in Trespasser, there at the end.
Just like Trespasser is "true" because its an info dump about the ancient world (I remain firm on that being a terrible way of storytelling).
It was also designed mechanically as a form of fan service... so, he talks to the Inquisitor (for the player) he let's the Inquisitor live (for the player) both equally horrible mistakes in storytelling I believe.
You can't say who Solas actually is - because half of his existence is made "for the player".
The novel Solas would have roasted an enemy Inquisitor where he/she stood just like he did to his ancient elf companion Felassan who he probably feels "really bad" about killing. That the enemy Inquisitor's live.. was only because those players paid for a game and would have raged to have no choice at the end.
I really hope they never pull another Trespasser.
I wouldn't say it has no relevance to real world current events.Yes, this is also one of the reasons why I dislike Solas... he's just "uber mage with a different plan than most of anything we've been dealing with".
NOTE: Had it been Flemythal... I'd have actually digested it better. At least she was established on more than a mythological level.
I preferred it when Thedas was talking about issues that weren't so pointlessly untopical for anything pertaining to the real world. I prefer my literature to have some relevance to life... and ancient uber-mage wanting to bring back ancient uber-mage kingdom where magic magic magic magic magic.... has no intrinsic value to me.
So... perhaps DA:4 won't be for me... but I suspect that DA:4 will be about showing how wrong Solas is... so, I'll probably bite.
Don't take this the wrong way, but I have to agree with the other posters about your posts being rather nonsensical. It's hard to hold a conversation with someone who seems to be inventing random facts from nowhere without posting anything to back it up and accusing anyone that disagrees with them as trolling. This isn't a case of me disagreeing with your opinions, it's me having having literally no idea of where your opinions have even come from or why. I'm not the only one who seems to have this problem, so I don't think it's my reading comprehension that is the issue...
It would take forever to synthesize every single statement made by Solas through the 13 hour game (just with dialogue) or reference as such.
But you have clear instances with Solas
"That's great you are interested in keeping the old Knowledge."
"The ancient Elves must have gotten some of their power from somewhere else, somewhere that started the legend, they care about this, the orb itself is Elven."
He bases his conclusions of value on what other people think, what happened, not what he thinks.
Just like Trespasser is "true" because its an info dump about the ancient world (I remain firm on that being a terrible way of storytelling).
It was also designed mechanically as a form of fan service... so, he talks to the Inquisitor (for the player) he let's the Inquisitor live (for the player) both equally horrible mistakes in storytelling I believe.
You can't say who Solas actually is - because half of his existence is made "for the player".
The novel Solas would have roasted an enemy Inquisitor where he/she stood just like he did to his ancient elf companion Felassan who he probably feels "really bad" about killing. That the enemy Inquisitor's live.. was only because those players paid for a game and would have raged to have no choice at the end.
I really hope they never pull another Trespasser.
I accepted his reasons for allowing the Inquisitor to live. I thought they were logical and could apply even to an Inquisitor he was not friends with. There were no such reasons with Felassan.
He bases his conclusions of value on what other people think, not what he thinks.
That's ridiculous, I can think of three examples right off the top of my head where he most certainly gives us his opinion.
He hates the Wardens idea of attacking the remaining archdemons.
He disdains human justice (hanging) and says so right before Blackwall confesses to being a fake.
He schools Cassandra on the true nature of spirits, out right telling her the world has it wrong about the differences between spirits and demons.
And that's just a few examples.
It would take forever to synthesize every single statement made by Solas through the 13 hour game (just with dialogue) or reference as such.
But you have clear instances with Solas
"That's great you are interested in keeping the old Knowledge."
"The ancient Elves must have gotten some of their power from somewhere else, somewhere that started the legend, they care about this, the orb itself is Elven."
He bases his conclusions of value on what other people think, what happened, not what he thinks.
None of those quotes support what you are saying though? He is glad you are interested in knowing about the past, but he doesn't want you too base your opinion off someone else - you actually lose influence by doing this. For example, after future redcliffe, he asks how you know it wasn't a dream or something. If you tell him that you could tell it wasn't, you gain approval, if you tell him Dorian knows, you lose influence, because you are blindly following what someone else says without coming to your own conclusion.
Please give an actual quote where Solas blindly follows someone else conclusion or opinion? If Solas followed other people opinions, he wouldn't have started a slave rebellion.
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