4632 réponses à ce sujet

[Almostfaceman]

@Medhia_Nox - in other words... you're being melodramatic. Nobody can bully you here and the tone and adjectives used in this discussion haven't reached strong or vehement levels. If they had, the mods would have locked the thread by now. 

[Illyria]

 

Regardless of whom would have been that sacrifice it does not change that it was necessary(or at  least i presume it was) and Solas while aware of this wanted it unlocked.For someone which has his level of knowledge and understanding i expect more compassion

 

 

The only part i never grasped in trespasser is the point in which you seem to imply that Solas didn't know for sure that Corypheus had the capacity to unlock the Orb,this actually is in conflict somehow with the plan he made to use that Orb to try to kill him since i do not think that he gambled the Orb with such level of uncertainty.

 

 

@midnight  @Illyria

 

Dunno why you perceived it as a form of "escalation" do you viewed it as a form of vitriol?

Then it was most likely a form of wrong expression.This sad but is like... i feel that i'm perceived as an hostile foe.

I don't particularly like a character in which you seem to be interested but it does not mean that i dislike you or some of the argumentations you both made.

It's like if we or if you prefer I started an hostility for some misused words maybe you perceived as a form of aggressiveness?I will try to soften the tones.

 

I'm sorry if I came off as, well, kind of rude.  I've debated about Solas a lot on this forum and sometimes I just get a little tired of the same old arguments.

 

Solas' compassion to the people of Thedas prior to joining the Inquisition is pretty low.  He didn't see them - or tried not to see them - as 'people' (because doing so would make what he was doing impossible).

 

I kind of misunderstood you at some points during this thread, and have also been answering rather flippantly, sorry about that.  Solas' primary goal was to unlock the power of his orb.  He allowed Coryface to find it.  The goal seemed to be powering it up, and if Cory tried to unlock it he would be killed.  Obviously, everything went very wrong.  He didn't give the Orb to Cory with the intention of allowing him to use it.

 

As for the why: Solas seems desperate to get his plan done soon.  Hence why he gave the Orb to Cory.  We can assume that something is going to happen (perhaps to do with the reawakening of the dragons) that is causing Solas urgancy in his plan.

 

(The 'escalation' is a reference to the movie Anchorman and is usually used in a lighthearted context.)

[dawnstone]

Oh great, we've gone from OTT character malignment to depiction as endorsement. Such a colorful thread.

 

Here, have Nipuni's Solas with an adorable ridiculous manbun.

http://nipuni.tumblr...ove-all-of-your

[German Soldier]

I cannot really understand what is so fantastic about Solas but maybe is just me.

@Almostfaceman: The picture you use is so appropriate for you.

I understand the feeling..

[Jackup28]

Solas is a nerd to the max!!!  

[Almostfaceman]

Yes, and to show that he was conflicted and did actually come to care about you and the rest of the companions, nearly changing his mind.

That he is still going ahead now anyway, despite all that, is the important bit, and does say something about his character--both that he has doubts, and that he is also committed despite his doubts, for what he thinks is necessary and the greater good to protect his people. He asks the Inquisitor if they would not do the same to save their own people, and you (the audience) are supposed to ponder that question. Would you? How far would you go to save the world? Is Solas only the villian because he opposes you? How far would you have taken the Inquisition? Etc.

 

 

Agreed. Misinformation is not useful to Solas at the end of Trespasser. At that point, destroying the Inquisitor (or letting the Anchor do the job) is of most utility. 

 

Solas doesn't destroy the Inquisitor. Why? He's conflicted. He's gone on a particular journey, one that has bonded him to the "modern" citizens of Thedas more closely than when he had first awakened. 

 

Here's the events as they play out in a friendship ending in Trespasser. This is always my perspective, I don't romance him. 

 

Inq: Solas... *cries out in pain, the Anchor is destroying him*

 

*Solas turns the writhing Inquisitor to stone, eliminating them as a potential threat to Solas's future plans*

 

Just kidding.

 

*Solas uses his powers to subdue the destruction of the Inquisitor*

 

Solas: That should give us more time. I suspect you have questions.

 

Inq: How were you able to control the Anchor? 

 

Solas: In the same way as when I stopped it from killing you at Haven... although I am stronger now. The mark you bear was bestowed upon you by the Orb of Fen'Harel. My orb. 

 

Inq: You're Fen'Harel.

 

Solas: I was Solas first. "Fen'Harel" came later... an insult I took as a badge of pride. The Dread Wolf inspired hope in my friends and fear in my enemies... not unlike "Inquisitor," I suppose. You also know the burden that has all but replaced your name. 

 

Inq: Our legends about you are wrong. I saw the truth as we traveled the Crossroads. 

 

Solas: You saw another story, written in desperation to give me more credit than I ever deserved. 

 

Inq: You were a hero, Solas. 

 

Solas: I sought to set my people free from slavery to would-be gods. I broke the chains of all who wished to join me. The false gods called me Fen'Harel, and when they finally went too far, I formed the Veil and banished them forever. Thus I freed the elven people and, in so doing, destroyed their world. 

 

Inq: How did creating the Veil destroy the world? 

 

Solas: You saw the remains of Vir Dirthara. The library was intrinsically tied to the Fade, and the Veil destroyed it. There were countless other marvels, all dependent on the presence of the Fade, all destroyed. Your legends are half-right. We were immortal. It was not the arrival of humans that caused us to begin aging. It was me. The Veil took everything from the elves, even themselves. 

 

Inq: You love the Fade. Why would you create the Veil to hide it all away? 

 

Solas: Because every alternative was worse.

 

Inq: Meaning? 

 

Solas: Had I not created the Veil, the Evanuris would have destroyed the entire world. 

 

Inq: You said that the elven gods went too far. What did they do that made you move against them?

 

Solas: They killed Mythal. A crime for which an eternity of torment is the only fitting punishment. 

 

Inq: I thought Mythal was one of the Evanuris. 

 

Solas: She was the best of them. She cared for her people. She protected them. She was a voice of reason. And in their lust for power, they killed her. 

 

Inq: You banished the false gods - you didn't kill them? 

 

Solas: You met Mythal, did you not? The first of my people do not die so easily. The Evanuris are banished forever, paying the ultimate price for their misdeeds. 

 

Inq: The Evanuris were elven mages? How did they come to be remembered as gods? 

 

Solas: Slowly. It started with a war. War breeds fear. Fear breeds a desire for simplicity. Good and evil. Right and wrong. Chains of command. After the war ended, generals became respected leaders, then kings and finally gods. The Evanuris. 

 

Inq: That's the past. What about the future? 

 

Solas: I lay in dark and dreaming sleep while countless wars and ages passed. I woke still weak a year before I joined you. My people fell for what I did to strike the Evanuris down, but still some hope remains for restoration. I will save the elven people. Even if it means this world must die. 

 

Inq: Why does this world have to die for the elves to return? 

 

Solas: A good question, but not one I will answer. You have always shown a thoughtfulness I respected. It would be too easy to tell you too much. I am not Corypheus. I take no joy in this. But the return of my people means the end of yours. It is my fight. you should be more concerned about the Inquisition. Your Inquisition. In stopping the Dragon's Breath you have prevented an invasion by Qunari forces. With luck, they will return their focus to Tevinter. That should give you a few years of relative peace. 

 

Inq: The Qunari said the Inquisition was unknowingly working for agents of Fen'Harel. 

 

Solas: I gave no orders.

 

Inq: You led us to Skyhold. 

 

Solas: Corypheus should have died unlocking my orb. When he survived, my plans were thrown into chaos. When you survived, I saw the Inquisition as the best hope this world had of stopping him. And you needed a home. Hence, Skyhold. 

 

Inq: You gave your orb to Corypheus? 

 

Solas: Not directly. My agents allowed the Venatori to locate it. The orb had built up magical energy while I lay unconscious for millennia. I was not powerful enough to open it. The plan was for Corypheus to unlock it and for the resulting explosion to kill him. Then I would claim the orb. I did not forsee a Tevinter having learned the secret of effective immortality. 

 

Inq: What would have happened if Corypheus had died and you'd recovered the orb? 

 

Solas: I would have entered the Fade, using the mark you now bear. Then I would have torn down the Veil. As this world burned in the raw chaos, I would have restored the world of my time.. the world of the elves. 

 

Inq: If you destroyed the Veil, wouldn't the false gods be freed? 

 

Solas: I had plans. 

 

Inq: I never thought of you as someone who would do that, Solas. 

 

Solas: Thank you. You must understand. I awoke in a world the Veil had blocked most people's conscious connection to the Fade. It was like walking through a world of Tranquil. 

 

Inq: We aren't even people to you? 

 

Solas: Not at first. You showed me that I was wrong... again. That does not make what must come next any easier. 

 

Inq: Whatever your reasons, we couldn't have defeated Corypheus without you. 

 

Solas: Your doubts are misplaced. Everything you accomplished, you earned. 

 

Inq: What's wrong with the Inquisition? 

 

Solas: You created a powerful organization and now it suffers the inevitable fate of such: betrayal and corruption. 

 

Inq: It's not that simple.

 

Solas: Do you know how I discovered the Qunari plot? The plot I disrupted by leading them to your doorstep? The Qunari spies in the Inquisition tripped over my spies in the Inquisition. The elven guard who led you to the Qunari body, who intercepted the servant with the gaatlock barrel? Mine. 

 

Inq: Why bother disrupting the Qunari plot, if you're going to destroy the world regardless? 

 

Solas: You have shown me that there is value in this world, Inquisitor. I take no joy in what I must do. Until that day comes, I would see those recovering from the Breach free of the Qun. 

 

Inq: Why? 

 

Solas: Because I am not a monster. If they must die, I would rather they die in comfort. In any event, it is done. 

 

Inq: I guess we owe you for that one too.

 

Solas: I hope it gives your people some final peace. 

 

Inq: You control the eluvians now? 

 

Solas: Yes. You remember Briala from Halamshiral? For a time, she controlled part of the labyrinth. One of my agents was supposed to take it from her, but he did not succeed. I had to override the magic personally. The Qunari stumbled upon this section independently. With them gone, the eluvians are now mine. 

 

Inq: There's still the matter of the Anchor. It's getting worse. 

 

Solas: Yes, I'm sorry. And we are almost out of time. 

 

Inq: *cries out in pain* 

 

*Solas cackles manically and watches as the Inquisitor writhes in pain and dies a slow agonizing death* 

 

Solas: Now you will take my secrets with you to your grave!

 

Just kidding.

 

Solas: The mark will eventually kill you. Drawing you here gave me the chance to save you... at least for now. 

 

Inq: You don't need to destroy this world. I'll prove it to you. 

 

Solas: So you will resist my plans!?!? Time to die!

 

Just kidding.

 

Solas: I would treasure the chance to be wrong once again, my friend. Take my hand. I'm sorry. *Solas casts a spell to save the Inquisitor* Live well, while time remains. 

 

[Illyria]

Agreed. Misinformation is not useful to Solas at the end of Trespasser. At that point, destroying the Inquisitor (or letting the Anchor do the job) is of most utility. 

 

Solas doesn't destroy the Inquisitor. Why? He's conflicted. He's gone on a particular journey, one that has bonded him to the "modern" citizens of Thedas more closely than when he had first awakened. 

 

Here's the events as they play out in a friendship ending in Trespasser. This is always my perspective, I don't romance him. 

 

*snip*

 

 

Thanks for this (also I liked your 'improvements').  There's no reason for Solas to lie here.  Maybe in real life he would, but this is fiction and the entire point of the scene is to set things up for future storylines and also for the writers to provide answers to the players.  Lying serves no purpose, either for Solas' plans, or for the writers providing closure.

 

(even the low approval version of the scene, the one that last all of 10 seconds, contains this information).

[Medhia_Nox]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction.  

 

It is not that he absolutely lied like a mustache twirling villain... he tells you his entire plan at the beginning of the game, he just leaves out that he can do what he's talking about.  

 

I believe his perspective is skewed beyond use.  Unlike Flemythal... he has not dealt with his issues.  Destroying the entire world is not, for me, an okay way to work out your problems of letting go.  Flemythal went through much of the same as Solas... yet, she has never yet mentioned anything about destroying the world.  In fact, she goes out of her way to save it... and, I believe there's a lot of evidence that she planned for Solas' return with Morrigan who is going to be key in defeating Solas (for those of us that don't talk him down).  

 

So... Solas and Flemythal... one of them I see as a wise ancient being who has lived countless generations and is more, to me, like Dr. Who by miles.  And the other - is the same being that sacrificed the ancient world for his own agendas (we can discuss casting world altering spells that you don't know the outcome of... and their merit... at some other juncture if you wish).  They've both experienced the same ancient elven wonders... and one of them was even the victim of murder... and yet, she ends up being the patient and wise one who doesn't blow up Conclaves of people for her agendas. 

 

I think he absolutely believes everything he's saying... but that doesn't mean that I, or my characters, have to.  People believe their own lies all the time.  Yes, I know you're saying this is Patrick Weekes conveying info about the ancient world... I am saying I find that to be terrible technique because - as you pointed out - it relies on the "meta" to be examined. 

 

And - of course - ultimately, even if I found out that Solas is right about everything... I'm not going to say:  "Well geeze... guess we should destroy modern Thedas." So ultimately - he'll be a monster in any situation other than standing down and depowering permanently... because I could never, in good conscience, let someone who was about to destroy the world but just happens to change his mind today... walk away. 

 

NOTE:  I'm curious... if the Veil never existed, why do ancient elven artifacts to measure it dot the landscape? 

[Lady Luminous]

 

NOTE:  I'm curious... if the Veil never existed, why do ancient elven artifacts to measure it dot the landscape? 

 

Ever since I found out Solas' plan, I'm not actually convinced they do strengthen the veil... 

[Secret Rare]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction.  

 

It is not that he absolutely lied like a mustache twirling villain... he tells you his entire plan at the beginning of the game, he just leaves out that he can do what he's talking about.  

 

I believe his perspective is skewed beyond use.  Unlike Flemythal... he has not dealt with his issues.  Destroying the entire world is not, for me, an okay way to work out your problems of letting go.  Flemythal went through much of the same as Solas... yet, she has never yet mentioned anything about destroying the world.

They are both obsessed by their own ghosts.

Mythal endured for all this time for the sole reason to gain revenge she is not so different than Solas who want to complete the task at any cost.

Flemeth also is different than Solas in which she is not completely elvhen like Solas is.

 

In fact, she goes out of her way to save it... and, I believe there's a lot of evidence that she planned for Solas' return with Morrigan who is going to be key in defeating Solas (for those of us that don't talk him down).  

 

 

Which hints and evidences?

[Xerrai]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction.  

 

It is not that he absolutely lied like a mustache twirling villain... he tells you his entire plan at the beginning of the game, he just leaves out that he can do what he's talking about.  

 

I believe his perspective is skewed beyond use.  Unlike Flemythal... he has not dealt with his issues.  Destroying the entire world is not, for me, an okay way to work out your problems of letting go.  Flemythal went through much of the same as Solas... yet, she has never yet mentioned anything about destroying the world.  In fact, she goes out of her way to save it... and, I believe there's a lot of evidence that she planned for Solas' return with Morrigan who is going to be key in defeating Solas (for those of us that don't talk him down).  

 

So... Solas and Flemythal... one of them I see as a wise ancient being who has lived countless generations and is more, to me, like Dr. Who by miles.  And the other - is the same being that sacrificed the ancient world for his own agendas (we can discuss casting world altering spells that you don't know the outcome of... and their merit... at some other juncture if you wish).  They've both experienced the same ancient elven wonders... and one of them was even the victim of murder... and yet, she ends up being the patient and wise one who doesn't blow up Conclaves of people for her agendas. 

 

Yeah but did she though? Mythal may have gone through the fall of her empire and culture, but for all intents and purposes Flemeth's people have simply lived on and evolved and are all alive in some form while their culture persists (even if it changes over time).

 

​Flemeth was never an ancient elf who was killed by immortal mage kings and then doomed to crawl through the ages as a wisp. That was Mythal. Flemeth was merely a person who lived her own life with her own people with its own culture, and was (presumably) betrayed in her own way. Whatever memories and experiences she inherited form Mythal was looked at through the lense that only a person with another life could. Her own life allowed her look upon Mythal's with a context and angle that no singular person could accomplish.

 

Think of it like experiencing the memories left in the Vir Dirthara. Yes you can feel and sympathize with the subject depicted, but ultimately you are person who had lived in circumstances that do not even remotely look like the circumstances depicted in ancient times. You are an outsider looking in.

 

Same with Flemeth. While she may have gotten Mythal's wisp of an essence, she was never Mythal the evanuris, and never will be. Any growth you attribute solely to Flemythal is grossly oversimplified if you forget this.

[Secret Rare]

 

 

Same with Flemeth. While she may have gotten Mythal's wisp of an essence, she was never Mythal the evanuris, and never will be. Any growth you attribute solely to Flemythal is grossly oversimplified if you forget this.

Also i would like to point out that It seems that Solas wasn't the only one to have an Orb  each Evanuris has one hidden somewhere.

This mean that Flemeth know where's Mythal Orb and that maybe she will use it for her plans.

[Abyss108]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction.  

 

I guess every piece of fiction is bad then, since you can point at any scene from any piece of media and I can tell you the narrative reason behind it. The way a narrative works is not a secret, the aim is not to confuse the viewer as to why something is included. The aim is to communicate with the viewer. If you look at a scene and think "I don't know why this is here", something has gone seriously wrong.

 

Now, I agree the way it was handled could be better, but that's not because we can look at a scene and see the mechanics and how it was put together. I can do that for anything.

[Medhia_Nox]

 

They are both obsessed by their own ghosts.

Mythal endured for all this time for the sole reason to gain revenge she is not so different than Solas who want to complete the task at any cost.

Flemeth also is different than Solas in which she is not completely elvhen like Solas is.

 

Which hints and evidences?

 

 

I think Mythal likes to talk about revenge - but I don't think she's going to ever take it.  I think she's angry... bitter - but still ultimately loves the world more than she did as a human/Evanuris.  I think she has gained genuine wisdom in her many years of life. 

 

As for "hints" - we know that the myth of Flemeth's daughters has lasted for a long time.  We know that she had multiple.  We have no reason to believe that Flemeth was going to ever die on her own.  I believe Flemeth knew Solas was going to come back - knew Solas was going to "kill her" - and that she would transfer a spark to a chosen daughter to end Solas. 

 

We'll see - maybe I'm grasping at straws - but yes, I believe Flemeth will be absolutely instrumental in ending the threat Solas presents.  If I'm correct - I do question whether or not she actually gave herself freely to trick Solas - or whether she simply knew he would take what power he needed ending the being that was Flemythal.  

 

@Xerria:  Then that could imply that killing Solas will help him get better.  He states that the elven orb is a conduit to the elven gods (I just reached that part in the gameplay with my Lavellan when he confesses it on the mountaintop before reaching Skyhold)... and, like everyone is so fond of saying - what reason does he have to lie?  

 

So... Solas is similar to the Evanuris in every way but name... according to his own testimony.

 

So... if killing him releases the spark locked in the past and allows it to connect with a modern human, elf, qunari... whatever.  Then that would allow him to heal and begin that journey through time and away from his past.  

 

While I would personally eyeroll through the entire moment... even romance and friends of Solas "might" just have to kill him to help him.  It would... after all, be in line with what I already feel is heavy handed melodrama. 

 

Personally - I don't care "how" Flemythal got to where she is... only that she got there.  I have no indictation she agrees with Solas or finds Solas' plans worthwhile.  She knows what the Evanuris are... she knows what she was.  Look at all the elf lore fans on these boards.  If one of them was told - in game - they were secretly holding the spirit of an ancient elf... chances are they wouldn't react the way you're suggesting.  They would throw themselves completely into being an ancient elf...not living as an outsider looking in.  Heck... some elven lore fans already do that and they're just posting about a game. 

 

So.. however Flemeth reached her current state... it is better than a psychotic god who wants to obliterate the present to fix his mistakes

 

I'll never be able to understand how this isn't seen as phenomenally selfish.  I recently borrowed money for something I "thought" I wanted... it was a mistake... and sure, I "could" just abandon the mistake and lose the money I borrowed hurting this person I 'claim' to care about and "fix" my mistake... but that's a disgusting way to be.  Instead - I have to live with my mistake and fix it the hard way.  And we have not seen Solas even consider other ways of fixing this problem... or even discussing why it can't be.  But... people just trust him when he says:  "Can't tell you, but it has to be this way."   For me.. that's Jim Jones level trust... and I'm not capable of it.  

 

The elf is fixing the wrong mistake... 

[Sah291]

@Medhia_Nox,
You make a good point about the differences between Solas and Mythal... Mythal is the one who was left behind, awake in the world all this time... While he was unconscious/dreaming for ages. Mythal must have gone through many changes over the ages, as she endured, while he more or less remained static. He remembers the world just as it was. But recall Mythal (and Morrigan) has been the one harping about change coming to Thedas all along. Mythal is comfortable with change... She'd have to be. Solas, not so much.

I think it's impossible to say at this point whether they are on the same side after all this time, even if they were once good friends, ages ago. It could be his sort of antagonistic banter with Morrigan was a hint. Morrigan is the person Mythal has been grooming.

My guess. Mythal wanted to go forward into a new age. Solas wants to go back and restore the old one.

[Xerrai]

@Xerria:  Then that could imply that killing Solas will help him get better.  He states that the elven orb is a conduit to the elven gods (I just reached that part in the gameplay with my Lavellan when he confesses it on the mountaintop before reaching Skyhold)... and, like everyone is so fond of saying - what reason does he have to lie?  

 

So... Solas is similar to the Evanuris in every way but name... according to his own testimony.

 

So... if killing him releases the spark locked in the past and allows it to connect with a modern human, elf, qunari... whatever.  Then that would allow him to heal and begin that journey through time and away from his past.  

 

While I would personally eyeroll through the entire moment... even romance and friends of Solas "might" just have to kill him to help him.  It would... after all, be in line with what I already feel is heavy handed melodrama. 

 

Personally - I don't care "how" Flemythal got to where she is... only that she got there.  I have no indictation she agrees with Solas or finds Solas' plans worthwhile.  She knows what the Evanuris are... she knows what she was.  Look at all the elf lore fans on these boards.  If one of them was told - in game - they were secretly holding the spirit of an ancient elf... chances are they wouldn't react the way you're suggesting.  They would throw themselves completely into being an ancient elf...not living as an outsider looking in.  Heck... some elven lore fans already do that and they're just posting about a game. 

 

So.. however Flemeth reached her current state... it is better than a psychotic god who wants to obliterate the present to fix his mistakes

 

I'll never be able to understand how this isn't seen as phenomenally selfish.  I recently borrowed money for something I "thought" I wanted... it was a mistake... and sure, I "could" just abandon the mistake and lose the money I borrowed hurting this person I 'claim' to care about and "fix" my mistake... but that's a disgusting way to be.  Instead - I have to live with my mistake and fix it the hard way.  And we have not seen Solas even consider other ways of fixing this problem... or even discussing why it can't be.  But... people just trust him when he says:  "Can't tell you, but it has to be this way."   For me.. that's Jim Jones level trust... and I'm not capable of it.  

 

The elf is fixing the wrong mistake... 

Where did all of that come from?

The only thing I was talking about was how you were attributing Mythal's character development (as the one who "went through much of the same as Solas") to Flemeth's character development when they are not the same people. I didn't say anything about Solas.

 

But as for the orb thing...

Are you really so certain Solas is hiding his soul/wisp inside the orb? The only thing I recall from that conversation was how the orbs channeled "ancient magic" from the pantheon. There was little that indicated that that magic was anything more than a form of energy that was collected. While I don't disagree that it may be possible, power does not instantly equate to soul/spark/wisp.

[Medhia_Nox]

@Sah291:  And let me be clear... I don't think Flemythal wants to "kill" or "defeat" Solas... I think she's aware that his transition has been a misguided one. 

 

For Maker's sake... Solas says over and over again that the Fade is about perception and that none of those perceptions are the "correct" one - and he's been "living" there for 3000 years.  Of course the man doesn't have the right perspective.  

 

I think Flemythal wants to help her friend/lover/servant whatever he used to be into transitioning into the future without destroying everything. 

 

@Xerrai:  All that came from the fact that I write too much.  

 

In short... I think Solas is just like the Evanuris... releasing him from his past might actually help him like it helped Mythal transition into the modern age by attaching to another living being.  

 

He specifically says that it channels the energy of the elven gods... and I got the impression he meant from a specific god.  Perhaps it was simply from the pantheon.  

 

BUT... it's "his" orb... and the Evanuris have no more power.  So what's powering the orb if not him?  Mythal maybe?  

[midnight tea]

Where did all of that come from?

The only thing I was talking about was how you were attributing Mythal's character development (as the one who "went through much of the same as Solas") to Flemeth's character development when they are not the same people. I didn't say anything about Solas.

 

But as for the orb thing...

Are you really so certain Solas is hiding his soul/wisp inside the orb? The only thing I recall from that conversation was how the orbs channeled "ancient magic" from the pantheon. There was little that indicated that that magic was anything more than a form of energy that was collected. While I don't disagree that it may be possible, power does not instantly equate to soul/spark/wisp.

 

Solas himself tells us that the orb was soaking up power while he was unconscious for millenia - and even that the explosion was the result of the orb overflowing in it. There's no mention of soul or anything, plus Dorian mentions in banter that the Tevinters called the orbs "Somnaboriums" which means "vessels of dreams". Judging form that - and the color of power emanating fro the orb, which is green -it may simply be that the orb is a very capacious storing device that can absorb a lot of raw energy from the Fade over a long period of time for a person it's assigned to.

 

And it's no wonder Solas would want/need it - he tells us that he woke "still weak" from his slumber. Apparently the creation of the Veil OR the trap he sprung for Evanuris that eventually "the wolf chewed its leg off" to escape has drained him to the point of turning him catatonic for millenia. He would need raw power to charge his batteries - though ironically he didn't even have enough power to unlock it.

 

Even more so - he went after Flemeth's power ONLY after his orb was destroyed.

[Medhia_Nox]

"such things were foci, set to channel power from our gods.  Some were dedicated to specific members of our pantheon" - Solas, In your Heart Shall Burn

 

I wonder... is this one of those times where the writer wasn't giving us specific information that implies it's "Solas' orb"? 

[Sah291]

@Medhia_Nox,

Yeah I think it's possible they could have had similiar goals...keeping magical knowledge alive, helping the elves, stopping Corypheus from hijacking the orb, revenge on the other Evanuris... But very different perspectives on what the future of the world should be, perhaps. Mythal, unlike Solas, does seem to accept modern elves as being part of the "People", she refers to both Merrill and the Elven Inquisitor that way, and also comments that the Dalish Inquistitor is bright and young and will make them proud (when you show her respect).

Solas coming for Mythal's power could have been the turning point where their plans finally diverged.

[Xerrai]

"such things were foci, set to channel power from our gods.  Some were dedicated to specific members of our pantheon" - Solas, In your Heart Shall Burn

 

I wonder... is this one of those times where the writer wasn't giving us specific information that implies it's "Solas' orb"? 

Well it was described as being Mythal's orb in a few of the development notes once. But no one is really sure.

[Illyria]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction. 

 

I'm sure scholars of literary criticism will be delighted to know they're wasting their time with the 'not very good fiction' they're analysising.

 

I know what I'm looking for in a scene when I'm looking at how it's constructed.

[Shechinah]

@Illyria:  If you can see the mechanics of fiction - it is not very good fiction.  

 

I must disagree on this: Amongst the fictional works I could mention is A Song of Ice and Fire by George R. R. Martin which I consider to be quite good work of fiction.

[Medhia_Nox]

Good grief... my point is, you guys are saying that you're basing your understanding of the entire scene (Trespasser) on "story mechanics" and not what is said.  You're not basing it on the story being told... you're basing it on knowledge Patrick Weekes is telling you outside of the story.  If that's what you think is good writing - I can't change it - but it isn't.  I'll be happy to entertain the company of any literary critics you wish to send my way and have this very discussion with them.

 

@Illyria:  You admitted yourself... if you weren't reading this "as a story" - you could consider Solas a liar.  I'm sorry... but if I were to write something, I wouldn't want you to read it "as a story".  Sure, I can critique a story mechanically as well... but I don't consider that the same as reading a story.  Again.. you may, I can't change that. 

[Illyria]

Good grief... my point is, you guys are saying that you're basing your understanding of the entire scene on "story mechanics" and not what is said.  You're not basing it on the story being told... you're basing it on knowledge Patrick Weekes is telling you outside of the story.  If that's what you think is good writing - I can't change it - but it isn't.  I'll be happy to entertain the company of any literary critics you wish to send my way and have this very discussion with them.

 

@Illyria:  You admitted yourself... if you weren't reading this "as a story" - you could consider Solas a liar.  I'm sorry... but if I were to write something, I wouldn't want you to read it "as a story".  

 

I...

 

*shrugs*