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[The Elder King]

The system was inherited from the Evanuris and never changed since then.

Yes, it was inherited from a society most know little of it, and even those who know most of the supposed information (dalish) had it mostly wrong

[Lezio]

About Andraste, mostly i wonder if she's Flemeth, or, well, if Flemeth is her.

 

I didn't really believe the theory but after hearing Felemth's words in Inquisition..... well what happened to her in the legends is betrayal alright, but ìt's also nothing too special so why would a spirit of vengeance/justice/betrayal (which, i think, Mythal has become in some form) be specifically attracted to her?

 

Now, though, if it was a prophetess, a goddess amongst men getting stabbed in the back, there woule even be parallelles between the two events

[Donquijote and 59 others]

Yes, it was inherited from a society most know little of it, and even those who know most of the supposed information (dalish) had it mostly wrong

Tyranny is a concept that doesn't need to be learned.

[The Elder King]

They shouldn't have any issue in dismissing  Solas as the Maker since he is no creator of anything.

I guess Bioware, in theory, might have still have in mind a creator of sort for the DA universe. Solas and the Evanuris aren't 'gods' in that sense, just incredibly powerful beings. Admitting the Maker doesn't exist, or that the Maker is a distorted version of Fen'harel would kind of means there's not a godlike Creator in DA. Which they might want to keep it hidden and let the players have their own interpretation.

Beside, while there are something in common betwen Solas and the Maker's faith, there are other things that don't match so far, even if only because Bioware didn't reveal everything about Solas and the Evanuris. It's still not sure that Fen'harel is the Maker.

Not that I'd mind. I personally thought 'Fen'harel and the Maker were just very different legends that humans and elves have of the same being' was an interesting theory long before DAI. I'm just saying I wouldn't be so sure, given the room of freedom Bioware has with the informations given so far in making other shocking revelations.

[The Elder King]

Tyranny is a concept that doesn't need to be learned.

The legends of Arlathan don't have it as a tyranny though. How can they emulate something they didn't know about?

Well, it's true the Imperium might have based its society on Arlathan though, but should know a lot more of that period to be sure.

[The Elder King]

About Andraste, mostly i wonder if she's Flemeth, or, well, if Flemeth is her.

 

I didn't really believe the theory but after hearing Felemth's words..... well what happened to her in the legends is betrayal alright, but ìt's also nothing too special so why would a spirit of vengeance/justice/betrayal (which, i think, Mythal has become in some form) be specifically attracted to her?

 

Now, though, if it was a prophetess, a goddess amongst men getting stabbed in the back, there woule even be parallelles between the two events

Eh, I don't really think Flemeth was Andraste in the past (and not only because I'd laugh if Bioware made her being betrayed so many times by both elves and humans). If she was I think it'd have been revealed before her death.

The events are similar, but Andraste did live, regardless if she was truly a prophet of a 'god' or just a human. I find it strange if she was Flemeth/Mythal in disguise. Though based on the theory of Fen'harel/Maker...it might be that she tried to establish the cult of her friend in a different way in the humans, as well as trying to stop the cult of the Old Gods (regardess of who they are and the connection with the Evanuris or only her). 

It'd be the definite blow on the Andrastian's faith though.

[Lezio]

I don't really believe in the Fen'Harel/Maker thing. I guess it's possible for Solas to have pushed through his uthenera

What i would prefer is for Andraste to have been just like The Inquisitor (should have been), giving hope in a hopeless time, using the pretence of being the prophet of some god to fuel that hope. It would fit quite well with Inquisition's general concept.

 

Plus, if she was genuinely a good person trying to do good, well, it would explain Flemeth's bitterness and Mythal's choosing, and also the former's tendance to "help" heroes along their way

[German Soldier]

I wonder just how worse elves will be treated once Solas' plain fails and/or the Evanuris come back and wreak havoc

Apparently Solas woke up to finish his job of extinguish the elven race because the ancient elves clearly weren't enough now he has to extinguish even the modern version.

[The Elder King]

Apparently Solas woke up to finish his job of extinguish the elven race because the ancient elves clearly weren't enough now he has to extinguish even the modern version.

To be fair, he didn't want to destroy the ancient elves. I think he was shocked to see what his actions lead to. He now wants to restore them...at the expense of everyone else, modern elves included.

The problem is that many elves are joining Solas. 

[German Soldier]

To be fair, he didn't want to destroy the ancient elves. I think he was shocked to see what his actions lead to. He now wants to restore them...at the expense of everyone else, modern elves included.

The problem is that many elves are joining Solas. 

Is called "The Architect's syndrome" you pursue something and end up with the opposite.

Whenever i see DA characters that don't know what they are doing i always apply the principle and so far the predictions were all correct.

[Ieldra]

They shouldn't have any issue in dismissing  Solas as the Maker since he is no creator of anything.

He created the Veil

[In Exile]

Apparently Solas woke up to finish his job of extinguish the elven race because the ancient elves clearly weren't enough now he has to extinguish even the modern version.

 

He doesn't recognize the modern elves as a thing - not really. Any more than he recognizes the modern races as anything other than an unfortunate mistake.

[The Elder King]

Is called "The Architect's syndrome" you pursue something and end up with the opposite.

Whenever i see DA characters that don't know what they are doing i always apply the principle and so far the predictions were all correct.

Well I agree his action, as well as the Architect's, lead to the opposite of what they wanted. I don't see the connection with what will happen to the elves, or your first post I reply. Even if his actions backfired his intention wasn't to make his brethens fall, so it's not like he wanted to hurt them. Granted, this doesn't justify what he did, or the fact that him trying to restore his mistake will lead to the current elves and the rest of Thedas to suffer and die.

 

By the way, how could you predict that Solas would do or did something that lead to the opposite result, as the Architect? We didn't know what he did, well, until after he did it, both with the Veil creation and the orb to Corypheus. At best you could theorize his actions from now on might backfire as they did in the past.

[The Elder King]

He doesn't recognize the modern elves as a thing - not really. Any more than he recognizes the modern races as anything other than an unfortunate mistake.

We're stil talking on lives, and I don't think he likes the fact that his action will lead to the end of those lives. He just considers restoring his previous mistake (and guilt) of what he did to his people more important then ending the current world, but I think he feels/would feel guilt for destroying them.

[Seraphim24]

Well I see this will go on forever, anyway, have fun, and all that.

 

Well what about this, isn't he kind of a sucky character? I mean seriously Dorian is a better mage isn't he, by like a ton. Heck isn't Vivienne better?

 

"Most powerful being ever" my rumples, he can't DPS his way out of a paper bag.

[nightscrawl]

The problem is that many elves are joining Solas.

 
I've been wondering about this.
 
I've only played through Trespasser once on release, so I don't recall much. How is this portrayed in the game? Is he actively deceiving them? Is he just allowing them to think a certain way without correcting them? I do feel there is a distinction between the two. Do these elves know what they're getting into? Do they believe Solas is more than he is -- that is, an actual god? Do they know what he's planning and think that it won't affect them? Do they not realize, or perhaps not fully understand, his distinction between the ancient and modern elves? Can they know something that the player might not?

 

I suppose the most significant question to me is about the active versus passive deception. It just seem to me that most people, regardless of origin, would be terrified at the prospect Solas's plans. Granted, we (the players) don't know the full scope of his plans either, only what he purports them to be in that brief dialogue.

 

On the other hand, it appears to be presented as the downtrodden elves latching onto any scheme, and therefore its author, if it would change the current world they live and suffer in.

[Almostfaceman]

 
I've been wondering about this.
 
I've only played through Trespasser once on release, so I don't recall much. How is this portrayed in the game? Is he actively deceiving them? Is he just allowing them to think a certain way without correcting them? I do feel there is a distinction between the two. Do these elves know what they're getting into? Do they believe Solas is more than he is -- that is, an actual god? Do they know what he's planning and think that it won't affect them? Do they not realize, or perhaps not fully understand, his distinction between the ancient and modern elves? Can they know something that the player might not?

 

I suppose the most significant question to me is about the active versus passive deception. It just seem to me that most people, regardless of origin, would be terrified at the prospect Solas's plans. Granted, we (the players) don't know the full scope of his plans either, only what he purports them to be in that brief dialogue.

 

On the other hand, it appears to be presented as the downtrodden elves latching onto any scheme, and therefore its author, if it would change the current world they live and suffer in.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if he's talking to them like he talked to Sera. Pointing out their inherent link to the Fade, stuff like that. I wouldn't be surprised if he's just telling them straight up what he's going to do. I think a large amount of them will be restored to their former selves, regain their agelessness, their conscious connection with the Fade. Then he'll pass on what he knows.

 

After he and Mythal deal with the Evanuris. 

 

But hey, just my two cents. 

[IllustriousT]

 
I've been wondering about this.
 
I've only played through Trespasser once on release, so I don't recall much. How is this portrayed in the game? Is he actively deceiving them? Is he just allowing them to think a certain way without correcting them? I do feel there is a distinction between the two. Do these elves know what they're getting into? Do they believe Solas is more than he is -- that is, an actual god? Do they know what he's planning and think that it won't affect them? Do they not realize, or perhaps not fully understand, his distinction between the ancient and modern elves? Can they know something that the player might not?

 

I suppose the most significant question to me is about the active versus passive deception. It just seem to me that most people, regardless of origin, would be terrified at the prospect Solas's plans. Granted, we (the players) don't know the full scope of his plans either, only what he purports them to be in that brief dialogue.

 

On the other hand, it appears to be presented as the downtrodden elves latching onto any scheme, and therefore its author, if it would change the current world they live and suffer in.

 

The only information regarding this is from the epilogue:

 

"After the events at the Winter Palace, elves left the Inquisition under mysterious circumstances, as did elven servants across Thedas. None could say where they went, but those who believed the Inquisitor's story about Fen'Harel wondered just how large the Dread Wolf's forces were...and what the ancient elven rebel had planned."

 

So, we receive no information about whether or not Solas is deceiving them or not. We also have the elven spy/guard in Trespasser, but again, very little information can be gained from her.

 

They might have additional information that we are not privy to. 

[The Elder King]

Well I see this will go on forever, anyway, have fun, and all that.

 

Well what about this, isn't he kind of a sucky character? I mean seriously Dorian is a better mage isn't he, by like a ton. Heck isn't Vivienne better?

 

"Most powerful being ever" my rumples, he can't DPS his way out of a paper bag.

Sometimes you have to discend between gameplay and story. Beside, even if you don't, he became/returned stronger since he fought beside the Inquisitor.

 
I've been wondering about this.
 
I've only played through Trespasser once on release, so I don't recall much. How is this portrayed in the game? Is he actively deceiving them? Is he just allowing them to think a certain way without correcting them? I do feel there is a distinction between the two. Do these elves know what they're getting into? Do they believe Solas is more than he is -- that is, an actual god? Do they know what he's planning and think that it won't affect them? Do they not realize, or perhaps not fully understand, his distinction between the ancient and modern elves? Can they know something that the player might not?

 

I suppose the most significant question to me is about the active versus passive deception. It just seem to me that most people, regardless of origin, would be terrified at the prospect Solas's plans. Granted, we (the players) don't know the full scope of his plans either, only what he purports them to be in that brief dialogue.

 

On the other hand, it appears to be presented as the downtrodden elves latching onto any scheme, and therefore its author, if it would change the current world they live and suffer in.

As Illostrious said, it's not sure if the elves are being deceived or not, though I'd propend to the former for now. I don't see currently a reason why they'd help him to achieve his plans.

[Seraphim24]

Sometimes you have to discend between gameplay and story. Beside, even if you don't, he became/returned stronger since he fought beside the Inquisitor.

As Illostrious said, it's not sure if the elves are being deceived or not, though I'd propend to the former for now. I don't see currently a reason why they'd help him to achieve his plans.

 

Why? It's still a video game. Sometimes I think the people harping the story fanatics should focus on things like "Are they good at the game? Can they win?" "Do they have a strategy for winning?"

 

Because believe it or not it's just a video game at the end of the day.

 

Analyzed on a game dimension, Solas is a profoundly crap character it seems to me, weak fragile and you have no use for him compared to the other available mages.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

He created the Veil

Did he?

We already have a problem in define what the veil is if it is some sort of strings membranes(like the theory) then he may just have allocated a pre existing structure.

[The Elder King]

Why? It's still a video game. Sometimes I think the people harping the story fanatics should focus on things like "Are they good at the game? Can they win?" "Do they have a strategy for winning?"

 

Because believe it or not it's just a video game at the end of the day.

I have to segregate story/lore and gameplay because in the latter things like Howe, Loghain, or Zevran being decapitated in combat might happen, while havign their head well attached to their neck in the following dialogue. And that's without considering the many, many things that can happen during gameplay that make no sense for the lore.

Though I shouldn't have said that you have to do so. That's just my stance.

It doesn't change the fact that Solas wasn't at his best during Inquisition, and that he's not stronger then during that time.

[German Soldier]

He doesn't recognize the modern elves as a thing - not really. Any more than he recognizes the modern races as anything other than an unfortunate mistake.

You should tell that to his fans here who think that Solas care for them and view them as people.

[Seraphim24]

I have to segregate story/lore and gameplay because in the latter things like Howe, Loghain, or Zevran being decapitated in combat might happen, while havign their head well attached to their neck in the following dialogue. And that's without considering the many, many things that can happen during gameplay that make no sense for the lore.

Though I shouldn't have said that you have to do so. That's just my stance.

It doesn't change the fact that Solas wasn't at his best during Inquisition, and that he's not stronger then during that time.

 

I don't even really know what you are saying here to be honest... sorry.

[Lezio]

I wouldn't be surprised if he's talking to them like he talked to Sera. Pointing out their inherent link to the Fade, stuff like that. I wouldn't be surprised if he's just telling them straight up what he's going to do. I think a large amount of them will be restored to their former selves, regain their agelessness, their conscious connection with the Fade. Then he'll pass on what he knows.

 

After he and Mythal deal with the Evanuris. 

 

But hey, just my two cents. 

 

Do you think Flemeth and Mythal, or possibly Morrigan and Mythal, will side with Solas to fight the Evanuris or that they will side with him period?

 

I can see the first possibility happening, but the second not really. Personally i see her as the opposite of Solas, most of all because she (they?) really has done nothing to damage the world (that we know of) or to make it as it was, in fact i dare say she tried to protect it whenever she could even if she didn't have to (most of all in Origins)

 

She's Solas' opposite, in my opinion, and the fact that she's human is a visual rapresentation of that