Questa discussione ha avuto 224 risposte

[German Soldier]

Is right or wrong to kill AListair for desertion at the Landsmeet?

The warden who made the choice is a tyrant or an executor of justice?

[ArcadiaGrey]

It's a stretch for me tbh, you'd have to be very hard to think he deserves death.  The closest I've got is letting him go be a wandering drunk, we have fought together after all.  It's a tyrannical form of justice I guess.

 

Besides, he's such a good character I'd rather leave the door open to him being able to come back at a later date.  The landsmeet is over-complicated imo, there are far too many options.

[thebigbad1013]

It is always wrong to kill Alistair. Always.

[Tidus]

The truth is simple Bloodlust versus common sense.

 

There's no need to kill Alistair for desertion since he's the rightful heir to the throne and the warden sees the best way to unite  Ferelden is to place Alistair on the throne.

[German Soldier]

It's a stretch for me tbh, you'd have to be very hard to think he deserves death.

I think is not so dissimilar than Duncan behaviour against Jory,with the big difference that Jory wasn't officially a GW but a recruit.

 

The truth is simple Bloodlust versus common sense.

 

There's no need to kill Alistair for desertion since he's the rightful heir to the throne and the warden sees the best way to unite  Ferelden is to place Alistair on the throne.

Alistair is not the rightful heir of the throne of the Ferelden,it's only through election that one is monarch in Ferelden

 

[Tidus]

So you don't realize Alistair is King  Maric's son and half brother to King Cailan? He is indeed the rightful heir to the throne through blood.

 

The rebel queen was Maric's mother and he was a prince   as  was Cailan and as was Alistair by blood which makes them legal heirs to the throne.

[German Soldier]

So you don't realize Alistair is King  Maric's son and half brother to King Cailan? He is indeed the rightful heir to the throne through blood.

 

The rebel queen was Maric's mother and he was a prince   as  was Cailan and as was Alistair by blood which makes them legal heirs to the throne.

I think you are just taking Eamon's philosophy of blood legacy too seriously.

 Cailan(which was even more noble than Alistair since his mother was Rowan and not Fiona) wasn't more rightful  than Bryce for the throne,the only important thing is that the candidate is a noble the rest is irrelevant.

[Secret Rare]

A warden who caused the death of a person whom S/he knew and with whom S/he had a bond of mutual affection under the consideration of the action of deserting the person, cause and organization has to possess a very complex personality mixed with an obsession for the duty and the person in question(if they didn't cared for Alistair they would have simply let him go).

I think is not so different from those wardens who romance Morrigan but ultimately attacked her in the Dlc,they let their obsessions to exceed their caring for the person.

These kind of decisions require an intricate personality which is fitting for morally  obliged characters which are tied with the concept of dark justice.

[Catilina]

 

Is right or wrong to kill AListair for desertion at the Landsmeet?

The warden who made the choice is a tyrant or an executor of justice?

 

Clearly tyrannical act, not justice. But let's play with the idea!

 

The mere existence of the bastard prince threaten the reigning ruler. No matter whether the bastard prince want to reign or not: the current king's opposition can always organize an uprising in his behalf. So: it maybe cruel, maybe tyrannical, but there is a reasonable basis. (Only the dead bastard the secure bastard...)

 

Based on this reasoning, murdering Alistair is a logical step.

Nicely you can explain with a "greater good" (such as Ferelden peace).

 

(Of course, not ethical to murder someone, because he may do something and then at some point, or somebody may do something in his behalf.)

[Tidus]

German Soldier,Me thinks you skipped some cut scenes or mayhaps dozing.. Alistair is a heir to the throne by blood just like Cailan.

 

Why do you think they covered up Alistair's real mother and made a story about  her being a mere maid? Why did Duncan do everything he could to protect Alistair? Duncan knew who Alistair's mother was and that he was a heir to the throne.

 

Why do you think Loghain wanted him dead? It wasn't just because he was a GW. Loghain knew Alistair was a heir after all he was Maric's close friend and confident.

 

Why the Templars? Where else could he been educated and trained and kept a eye on in case he inherit his mother's magical skills.

[Ghost Gal]

Wrong.

 

Whether you like or agree with each other or not, he's been your constant companion helping you stop the Blight and helping you survive Loghain's constant attacks against you and other Grey Wardens. Then you side with the tyrant that's been hunting you and doing everything in his power to prevent you from stopping the Blight all game, and turn around and kill your companion of a year? Yeah, that's wrong as far as I'm concerned.

[Secret Rare]

Wrong.

 

Whether you like or agree with each other or not, he's been your constant companion helping you stop the Blight and helping you survive Loghain's constant attacks against you and other Grey Wardens. Then you side with the tyrant that's been hunting you and doing everything in his power to prevent you from stopping the Blight all game, and turn around and kill your companion of a year? Yeah, that's wrong as far as I'm concerned.

I would say the same thing about any other companion,the warden simply started to see such companions as enemies from a certain point( their critical requests).I don't think is wrong is more about dark justice performed by a very dutiful warden afterall Alistair is an official deserter here.

[Jedi Comedian]

Is right or wrong to kill AListair for desertion at the Landsmeet?
The warden who made the choice is a tyrant or an executor of justice?

For my Warden there's no right or wrong choice, he found in Loghain an interesting companion and strong fighter.
But of course, he loathed Alistair so it's an easy choice for him.

[Tidus]

My warden kills Loghain and puts Alistairs fanny on the throne--just to get rid of him.

 

My female warden has Anora  to marry Alistair-more like dumps him  on her lap.

 

My warden isn't full of  bloodlust in fact he/she only kills those that needs put down.

[Jack007]

WRONG !!!!

 

You NEVER kill: Alistair. He's the nicest KING and FRIEND to have.

Even in : NEXT games !!!

 

LOGHAIN: i would say: I accept youre surrounder.

(Before: try to COUPLE: Alistair & Annoying ****** Queen)

When  Loghain is down, let him live. Try to couple: Alistair with that Stupid B*TCH.

In LandsMeet.

 

Have fun

[Dai Grepher]

My rationale is this...

Anora calls for Alistair's execution. Your choice is simply to defend him or not defend him.

You can be evil about it and let him die because you don't like him or think he's weak, obviously. But there is also a moral side to letting him die. One thought, that I don't particularly hold to, is that executing him ensures Ferelden's stability. It prevents the possibility of rebellions being raised in his name. But of course, if you know Alistair, you know something like that won't happen because of him.

The only scenario thus far in which I have executed him is in the case of my female Surana. She had no ill will against him through most of the game. Honestly. But she concluded that he was an irresponsible waste of a fool who thought only of himself at the cost of others.

My Surana is a Loyalist, and a devout Andrastian. So she takes service and faith seriously. She believed that Alistair was chosen to be a templar. He wasn't happy with it, and Duncan saw that, and so he conscripted him as was the Warden's right by law, and the Chantry allowed Alistair to become a Grey Warden. Fine. She accepted that.

Alistair liked being a Grey Warden, and as such he was fighting against the incarnation of mankind's second sin. She respected that. As a result, Alistair did not want to be king. While she believed being king was Alistair's duty, she respected that he wanted to remain a Warden. So she overlooked his shirking of the crown.

When Alistair refused let Loghain live and become a Warden and tried to take the crown himself, she denied it to him, knowing that he wasn't accepting the crown out of duty or service to the people, but rather to satiate his own lust for revenge.

But the true offense was in his choice to leave the Grey Wardens. He could not put his petty vendetta aside and hold to the sacred duty of the Wardens to do what was necessary to defeat the blight. He chose to try and run from his obligation. He tried to shed the oath that could not be foresworn. And in so doing, forfeited his own life.

When Anora called for his execution, my Surana eagerly agreed. He can run from his responsibility to lead the people, but not his responsibility to defend the people from the Darkspawn. And he can't run from the Maker's judgment. She didn't give that deserter a second glance.

[Secret Rare]

My warden kills Loghain and puts Alistairs fanny on the throne--just to get rid of him.

 

My female warden has Anora  to marry Alistair-more like dumps him  on her lap.

 

My warden isn't full of  bloodlust in fact he/she only kills those that needs put down.

What's wrong with some users?

I saw plenty of "My warden did this and did that" but why we should care?

 

But the true offense was in his choice to leave the Grey Wardens. He could not put his petty vendetta aside and hold to the sacred duty of the Wardens to do what was necessary to defeat the blight. He chose to try and run from his obligation. He tried to shed the oath that could not be foresworn. And in so doing, forfeited his own life.

I think  Duncan  would have probably killed Alistair in the given situation since he doesn't seem the type who tolerate desertions within the order.

[Tidus]

Rare,Its how we play the game.. I suspect the majority of us don't have bloodlust and feel the need to kill our team mates-that would be like a stupidly dumb soldier killing his own squad because he simply can.

 

Of course I realize a lot of these topic are nothing more then camouflage  trolling.

[GoldenGail3]

No. Don't kill lee Alistair...

[Mike3207]

From Anora's point of view(the one who kills him), it makes a lot of sense. If he remains alive, at some point Eamon will use him in a rebellion and try to undermine her reign. It'd be preferable to kill Eamon, but the game doesn't give you that choice.

 

The flip side of killing him is you're wiping out an entire royal line-Maric's line. The more twisted among us can rationalize that maybe Ferelden is better off without that royal line, but it's still got a long heritage.

 

As a result, I'm less likely to kill him than I was in the past. It helps that I haven't done a male Cousland playthrough in a while, which is the origin that has a motivation to kill Alistair if you marry the queen.

[Catilina]

From Anora's point of view(the one who kills him), it makes a lot of sense. If he remains alive, at some point Eamon will use him in a rebellion and try to undermine her reign. It'd be preferable to kill Eamon, but the game doesn't give you that choice.

 

The flip side of killing him is you're wiping out an entire royal line-Maric's line. The more twisted among us can rationalize that maybe Ferelden is better off without that royal line, but it's still got a long heritage.

 

As a result, I'm less likely to kill him than I was in the past. It helps that I haven't done a male Cousland playthrough in a while, which is the origin that has a motivation to kill Alistair if you marry the queen.

 

From the direction of Eamon arl don't lurk danger: Anora is Eamon's cousin. After Loghain's neutralising, Eamon will not mind if Anora reigns.

 

Incidentally, I think, Anora not a legitimate ruler, she only the widow of the deceased king. Because Maric's family extinct (if Alistair do not want to be king), interregnum occurs, and the Landsmeet can decide which of the noble family set a king and who would be the king.

 

However, Anora don't have the prerogative against the Cousland-descendant (I think). (From Anora's family arl Eamon Guerrin the rightful heir.)

 

Alistair elimination in both respects the safest method... but Anora (and Eamon arl...) also can get a tombstone past him, for the Couslands... (ofc, strictly for Ferelden peace...)

[Ash Wind]

Definitely have a love/hate relationship with that choice. Ultimately I think its wrong... the few times I went that way, I'd spare him. He's my Bro!

 

HOWEVER, I find this to be one of those writer's quandaries... Simply stated, if you spare loghain, I think Ali would still refuse to acknowledge you, despise you, and refuse follow you, but, I think given his game-long commitment to Duncan and the Grey Wardens, he would have shown up on the roof of Fort Drakkon to assist in the defeat of the blight, despite your choice.

 

I can't hate on the writers too much for this one, they wanted to force a decision that had repercussions, though, I just think Ali would have responded a little differently than the railroaded choices of either becoming dead; becoming the angry prince consort or becoming a mindless drunk who disavowed his commitment. 

 

Still, its one of those things that make DAO the game it is... consequence.

[Voidinist]

I consider the choice of executing him a lot, but I have him exiled in my canon playthrough.

 

I'm aware it barely makes any difference, but I wouldn't let that jester anywhere near the throne and my canon Warden keeps Loghain alive to throw at the darkspawn.

 

I can't really say if either option is "right" or "wrong". The demonstrably more capable ruler with years of experience is Queen Anora and her reign will be far easier if there is no living heir to the throne. King Alistair is basically an inexperienced unstable puppet to Eamon and Teagan regardless of what you do with him - marry/harden/soften. And arguably, you should be making an example out of a deserter, but I can't make my Wardens do it no matter how hard they are. I see him as little more than a dumb, irresponsible child.

[sniper_arrow]

 

Is right or wrong to kill AListair for desertion at the Landsmeet?

The warden who made the choice is a tyrant or an executor of justice?

 

 

That depends. Do you consider Alistair as a friend or someone you don't get along? Do you also consider his desertion a lawful crime or a complete slap in the face after everything you've done?

[Tidus]

Funny.. A follow Grey does exactly what Loghain tried and failed to do kill Alistair. So,in my eyes that Grey is no better then Loghain,Howe or Vaughan.

 

The only real justice is putting down Vaughan, Howe, the Trevinter slaver and Loghain the four human baddies of the game.