219 réponses à ce sujet

[Ghost Gal]

Oh look, another "I hate Fiona so much I'd rather side with the Templars and condemn all mages just to spite her" thread.

[vbibbi]

This makes me wonder, how many Templar supporters have actually played a pro Mage playthrough? I've made a pro Templar character but it seems some pro Templars haven't played a pro Mage character.

 

I'm not a templar supporter. I always choose mages in DAO and DA2, apart from the one playthrough in each game trying the other option. My first playthrough of DAI was IHW because I assumed the mages would be painted sympathetically, if flawed, like they had been in the previous two games.

 

But I was surprised at the lack of consequence for Fiona. And when I played the game again and went with templars, I just enjoyed the Fade sequence, envy demon, and Ser Barris more than time travel and no one being held accountable from the mages.

 

And for my first playthrough, I was a mage, allied with the mages, and romanced Dorian. So I'd consider it as a pro-mage playthrough.

 

 

EDIT: @Revassan Lavellan

 

Come on now, have you read any of the posts, or are you just stating this from the topic? Which, by the way, discusses wanting to judge Fiona, which would only be possible if we sided with the mages.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Oh look, another "I hate Fiona so much I'd rather side with the Templars and condemn all mages just to spite her" thread.

With the same people of course

[TK514]

EDIT: @Revassan Lavellan

 

Come on now, have you read any of the posts, or are you just stating this from the topic? Which, by the way, discusses wanting to judge Fiona, which would only be possible if we sided with the mages.

 

Logic is not welcome here.

[Shechinah]

Oh look, another "I hate Fiona so much I'd rather side with the Templars and condemn all mages just to spite her" thread.

 

Except it's not; it is arguably the opposite. The opening post is about Fiona and how sim-ran wishes Fiona could be judged for selling the mages into slavery and how she never seems to face any consequences for that act.

 

It's for what she did to the mages that sim-ran wants her to be judged for. sim-ran even gives In Hushed Whispers with praise during the opening post.

[SgtSteel91]

The Rebel Mages seem to forgive Fiona and still look to her for leadership after In Hushed Whispers, so...

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Oh look, another "I hate Fiona so much I'd rather side with the Templars and condemn all mages just to spite her" thread.

 

People want Fiona to be judged. As for me, I conscript Templars, not ally with them.

[vbibbi]

The Rebel Mages seem to forgive Fiona and still look to her for leadership after In Hushed Whispers, so...

Exactly. Anyone the rebel mages trust after that wins World's Worst Leader mug.

 

[Medhia_Nox]

With the same people of course

 

LOL Why would you expect different people?  It's not like you don't spout the same stuff in a million threads. 

[Cute Nug]

The Rebel Mages have already been granted refugee status by the Ferelden Crown. They sabotaged it by indenturing themselves to a Tevinter Magister.

 

The Inquisition does provide sanctuary to those who are part of the Rebel Mages but they wanted to leave. The problem was there was only one Tranquil, Clemence who was willing to do so. The Herald can care about it by showing it in their actions.

 

It should have been part of the conversation with Alexius. 

 

Alexius walks in you toss him a murdered Tranquil skull  you had shown to Fiona and declare the indenturing contract void for any mage that no longer wants to join the murderer of the Tranquils. The rebel mages are free to accept the offer to join the Inquisition or remain indentured with Alexius. 

 

Alexius can refuse to let anyone go.You can state that you need a certain number of mages to close the breach threatening all of Thedas within a set time whether they remain indentured to Alexius or join the Inquisition. Alexius can also refuse this.

 

You can give up and try the rebel templars instead (why are the worst two groups the only options to close the breach) or tell Alexius you will be back in force with Inquisition soldiers to escort any mages wanting to leave, after informing the Ferelden crown of the potential for armed conflict in their lands in defense of the mages they had given refuge to.  

As the game is the Herald has no actions that show that they cared about the murder of the Tranquil. If they judge Alexius at Skyhold they don't even mention it as one of his crimes. Actions say the murder of Transquils is not a crime the Quizzy cares about. Quizzy got Tranquil issues apparently.

 

The Heralds actions as to how much they are willing to risk to save the rebel mages from Alexius depends on in game choices which I felt offered a good range of meaningful choices. Should have been better addressed during the first visit to Redcliffe IMO. IRL sometimes you have an important conversation and completely miss the most important issues. Would have been a nice touch if your companions mentioned the Herald is stupid to not to confront Alexius on the Tranquil murders if for now other reason then to declare rebel mages can then leave their indentured service contract to help the Inquisition.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

LOL Why would you expect different people?  It's not like you don't spout the same stuff in a million threads. 

 

thesuperdarkone2 BTFO ! +420 STUMPED !

[Bayonet Hipshot]

It should have been part of the conversation with Alexius. 

 

Alexius walks in you toss him a murdered Tranquil skull  you had shown to Fiona and declare the indenturing contract void for any mage that no longer wants to join the murderer of the Tranquils. The rebel mages are free to accept the offer to join the Inquisition or remain indentured with Alexius. 

 

Alexius can refuse to let anyone go.You can state that you need a certain number of mages to close the breach threatening all of Thedas within a set time whether they remain indentured to Alexius or join the Inquisition. Alexius can also refuse this.

 

You can give up and try the rebel templars instead (why are the worst two groups the only options to close the breach) or tell Alexius you will be back in force with Inquisition soldiers to escort any mages wanting to leave, after informing the Ferelden crown of the potential for armed conflict in their lands in defense of the mages they had given refuge to.  

As the game is the Herald has no actions that show that they cared about the murder of the Tranquil. If they judge Alexius at Skyhold they don't even mention it as one of his crimes. Actions say the murder of Transquils is not a crime the Quizzy cares about. Quizzy got Tranquil issues apparently.

 

The Heralds actions as to how much they are willing to risk to save the rebel mages from Alexius depends on in game choices which I felt offered a good range of meaningful choices. Should have been better addressed during the first visit to Redcliffe IMO. IRL sometimes you have an important conversation and completely miss the most important issues. Would have been a nice touch if your companions mentioned the Herald is stupid to not to confront Alexius on the Tranquil murders if for now other reason then to declare rebel mages can then leave their indentured service contract to help the Inquisition.

 

This amount of depth and complexity is beyond Bioware these days. I only expect this level of writing from CDPR these days.

[thesuperdarkone2]

thesuperdarkone2 BTFO ! +420 STUMPED !

What does this even mean?

[Akiza]

How about crimes committed against the people of Thedas, namely starting a war?

What you are saying is gibberish nonsense.
"The people of Thedas" isn't a legal authority.

[Dabrikishaw]

The option should have been there for those that wanted it. Say after you ally or conscript the mages, another option wheel pops up asking what you want to do with Fiona.

 

1. Keep her with you as an ally/conscript like normal.

2. Jail her to be judged later on.

3. Leave her in Redcliffe for Alistair and/or Anora.

[Medhia_Nox]

Okay... I do have to admit.  It would be so satisfying for her to be on the executioners block and say: 

F--k the Inquisition.

 

*CHOP*

[GreaterGoodIreland]

What evidence do you have that the Fereldan army killing the mages? 

I didn't say that they were killing the mages, I'm saying that would have been the result had the conflict not been stopped by the intervention of the Inquisition; an event that wasn't foreseeable at the time of the conflict's start.
 

The Templars and mages were tearing the guts out of one of Ferelden's most important and most populous regions. Assuming the Templar win scenario didn't play out, a mage victory still would have left them holding the baton on all of that destruction. Fereldan public opinion would not have been kind to that. Food prices would be up because of the conflict, people displaced and the families of the killed would demand justice, the prestige of the Ferelden state would be under dire threat to contain the whole situation.

 

Eventually, the monarch(s) would have had to intervene to remove the mages, and public opinion would not have allowed them to do it diplomatically.

[ModernAcademic]

I hate to admit it but I absolutely DO this! I mean at that point she's gone even further - she's trying to kill the Inquisitor, the one person who can stop the world getting swallowed by the breach. And openly allying with Corypheus without any mind control involved. How was she ever a warden, Grand Enchanter and rebel?!

 

My assumption is that the Venatori were controlling her through blood magic or using threats. I may be wrong, but after Alexius' death (it happens right after you finish Champions of the Just), they must've threatened to kill the rebel mages should they refuse to fight for Corypheus. 

 

Like I said, she was a pawn in a game played by larger forces. Ironically, Alexius was her only effective protection against them. She deserves to be trialled and condemned for what she did, but not punished. A desperate person has no choice at all. If anything, she should be neutralized as a threat, that's all. Exile, conscription, there are many alternatives.

It's important to notice the rebel mages shouldn't be sacrificed. Not when they were fighting for a just cause: the end of the Chantry's lies and secrets, such as Tranquility not being an irreversible process. 

 

 

 

What's even more ironic is that the fate of the rebel mages was a direct consequence of Anders' actions. If he had blown up the Chantry when it was devoid of people, it would've been a statement of the Chantry's omission in the face of mage oppression.

Instead, his actions automatically labelled apostates as murderers. From that day on, any mage who resorted to direct action in order to solve problems was branded a murderer and hunted by templars.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

My assumption is that the Venatori were controlling her through blood magic or using threats. I may be wrong, but after Alexius' death (it happens right after you finish Champions of the Just), they must've threatened to kill the rebel mages should they refuse to fight for Corypheus. 

 

Like I said, she was a pawn in a game played by larger forces. Ironically, Alexius was her only effective protection against them. She deserves to be trialled and condemned for what she did, but not punished. A desperate person has no choice at all. If anything, she should be neutralized as a threat, that's all. Exile, conscription, there are many alternatives.

 

It's important to notice the rebel mages shouldn't be sacrificed. Not when they were fighting for a just cause: the end of the Chantry's lies and secrets, such as Tranquility not being an irreversible process. 

 

What's even more ironic is that the fate of the rebel mages was a direct consequence of Anders' actions. If he had blown up the Chantry when it was devoid of people, it would've been a statement of the Chantry's omission in the face of mage oppression.

 

Instead, his actions automatically labelled apostates as murderers. From that day on, any mage who resorted to direct action in order to solve problems was branded a murderer and hunted by templars.

 

The Mayor of Crestwood and Mistress Poulin of Sahrnia were also desperate leaders who resorted to terrible things. The Inquisitor could judge and punish them. The punishment varied from merciful ones to harsh ones but it was there. Fiona should have gotten the same treatment.

[thesuperdarkone2]

The Mayor of Crestwood and Mistress Poulin of Sahrnia were also desperate leaders who resorted to terrible things. The Inquisitor could judge and punish them. The punishment varied from merciful ones to harsh ones but it was there. Fiona should have gotten the same treatment.

If you ally with them, you are forgiving her. If you conscript, you've already punished her. You'd just cause more problems by arbitrarily punishing her

[Steelcan]

If you ally with them, you are forgiving her. If you conscript, you've already punished her. You'd just cause more problems by arbitrarily punishing her

its not an arbitrary punishment though, it is well deserved

[thesuperdarkone2]

Did everyone suddenly forget arl wulff

[German Soldier]

its not an arbitrary punishment though, it is well deserved

Well deserved according to what tribunal?

[thesuperdarkone2]

Well deserved according to what tribunal?

The tribunal of the 'I hate fiona' club

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 I am dismayed that the game did not give me the option to waterboard Fiona. Or any prisoner, for that matter.

 

 

And yes, the Inquisition would have listened to my orders. That's what being a leader is about.