322 réponses à ce sujet

[BansheeOwnage]

As I've said before, I want a balance between pre-defined PC and blank slate PC. To that end, I'd like some sort of background, but obviously not something too constraining for roleplaying. I don't have overly strong feelings about the Origins, but I will say that the best way to avoid making RP choices for us is to let us make them ourselves. That is, a playable background is better for RP than an unplayable one, in theory.

 

But I also like to see something of what my character's life was like before the events of the game, to get a sense of who they are. It's hard to RP without a foundation.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

If horned people start planting bombs everywhere and your goal is to disband the organization lead by a horned person the 1st, logical, thing you do is using that as fodder. Why? Because most people don't even know the difference between Vashot and Qunari, but what they would know is that horned people wanted to make a massacre and that The Inquisitor has horns

 

In other words, truth is not the same as politics and fear can be easily manipulated

By the time they even know of the Dragon's Breath plan, it is the final cutscene of the game and they are already blaming us for the Qun's actions. There is nowhere for them to react to your race since you literally walk in and drop the book on them, either agreeing with their request or disbanding, either case resulting in them winning.

[Lezio]

By the time they even know of the Dragon's Breath plan, it is the final cutscene of the game and they are already blaming us for the Qun's actions. There is nowhere for them to react to your race since you literally walk in and drop the book on them, either agreeing with their request or disbanding, either case resulting in them winning.

 

Nope, they learn of the Qunari halfway through DLC. They may not know about the Dragon's Breath, but they still don't even mention the race of The Inquisitor, which is just odd

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Nope, they learn of the Qunari halfway through DLC. They may not know about the Dragon's Breath, but they still don't even mention the race of The Inquisitor, which is just odd

Why would they? A lone Qunari doesn't really mean anything to them at that point in time for them to become racist towards the Inquisitor. 

Also, with Trespasser really any reaction to the Inquisitor was cut since they had a lot of other things they had to devote resources to. We see this with how they got rid of a lot of the inquiry. 

[Addictress]

Why would they? A lone Qunari doesn't really mean anything to them at that point in time for them to become racist towards the Inquisitor.
Also, with Trespasser really any reaction to the Inquisitor was cut since they had a lot of other things they had to devote resources to. We see this with how they got rid of a lot of the inquiry.

People side-eyed Iron Bull. We had one or two lines, asking Leliana if the Iron Bull knows anything. Secondly, hello touchy Bann Teagan. Sounds exactly like something he'd comment on, and that he'd be the first person to overlook the differences between Qun and Vashoth. The epilogue even says Tal Vashoth, although separate from Qunari, were met with suspicion and difficulties across the south afterward.

So yeah, they dropped the ball not mentioning the Inquisitor's appearance. What is the point of having different races, right? Just cosmetic?

[vbibbi]

At that point you aren't seen as a Qunari, you are seen as the Inquisitor. That was even one of the slogans main themes of the game:

"Whatever we were before, we are now the Inquisition." 

 

Yeah but in this case, race and background wouldn't even mean anything. If the PC is going to be treated the same regardless of our background, isn't that the same as Hawke always being human? So why were people who asked for multiple race options okay with their PC being treated the same?

[Hanako Ikezawa]

People side-eyed Iron Bull. We had one or two lines, asking Leliana if the Iron Bull knows anything. Secondly, hello touchy Bann Teagan. Sounds exactly like something he'd comment on, and that he'd be the first person to overlook the differences between Qun and Vashoth. The epilogue even says Tal Vashoth, although separate from Qunari, were met with suspicion and difficulties across the south afterward.

So yeah, they dropped the ball not mentioning the Inquisitor's appearance. What is the point of having different races, right? Just cosmetic?

You mean the Ben-Hassrath spy and/or the mercenary? Yes people would side-eye that, but that'd happen regardless of his race. 

 

How would having origins in DAI have changed Trespasser? 

 

Yeah but in this case, race and background wouldn't even mean anything. If the PC is going to be treated the same regardless of our background, isn't that the same as Hawke always being human? So why were people who asked for multiple race options okay with their PC being treated the same?

Because for most of the game you were proving yourself to the world and thus you wouldn't be treated the same. Once you defeat Corypheus, you become a symbol and are seen the same regardless of who you are. 

[Jeradon]

The introductions in Origins were a powerful way of linking the player to the Dragon Age universe. They showed the PC's ordinary life , and the traumatic change brought by the Blight. It was hard not to relate to what happened to your character.

Inquisition casts you outright in The Herald of Andraste's shoes and it's up to you to relate (or not) to whatever you discover during your map-scouting activities. I clearly prefer the introductions in Origins since they brought a narrative to life.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The introductions in Origins were a powerful way of linking the player to the Dragon Age universe. They showed the PC's ordinary life , and the traumatic change brought by the Blight. It was hard not to relate to what happened to your character.

Inquisition casts you outright in The Herald of Andraste's shoes and it's up to you to relate (or not) to whatever you discover during your map-scouting activities. I clearly prefer the introductions in Origins since they brought a narrative to life.

All the Origins did for me was separate me from 'my' character. I related to them as a character, but in the way I relate to NPCs or predefined protagonists. Inquisition put me in the same position as the Inquisitor, having no idea what happened. For all they and we knew, we were the ones who caused the Breach. So both the protagonist and the player were looking for the same answers. 

[Lezio]

You mean the Ben-Hassrath spy and/or the mercenary? Yes people would side-eye that, but that'd happen regardless of his race. 

 

How would having origins in DAI have changed Trespasser? 

 

Because for most of the game you were proving yourself to the world and thus you wouldn't be treated the same. Once you defeat Corypheus, you become a symbol and are seen the same regardless of who you are. 

 

For the bolded part see the Grey Wardens

 

The discussione started because you stated that Gaider said "that instead of doing an origin story for each race, he'd rather those resources be spread out over the game so the choice of what you are is reacted upon throughout the entire game then just one or two clusters."

To which i answered that i found it ironic since in trespasser the race of My Inquisitor was completely overlooked. Origins have nothing to do with this

It's all in the previous page , if you wish

[Hanako Ikezawa]

For the bolded part see the Grey Wardens

 

The discussione started because you stated that Gaider said "that instead of doing an origin story for each race, he'd rather those resources be spread out over the game so the choice of what you are is reacted upon throughout the entire game then just one or two clusters."

To which i answered that i found it ironic since in trespasser the race of My Inquisitor was completely overlooked. Origins have nothing to do with this

It's all in the previous page , if you wish

Gaider didn't work on Trespasser, so I don't see the irony there. 

[Lezio]

Gaider didn't work on Trespasser, so I don't see the irony there. 

 

He did work in the main game(i think?), which for the most part suffers from the same problem

But you're right, in this case it's more funny than it is ironic. Which is actually what i wrote in the post after your statement

[Hanako Ikezawa]

He did work in the main game(i think?), which for the most part suffers from the same problem

But you're right, in this case it's more funny than it is ironic. Which is actually what i wrote in the post after your statement

The main game was also going to be human-only for most of its development. They got the year extension in part so they could add the other races. If they did that from the beginning, there would be a lot more recognition. 

[JadeDragon]

And? Riding the wave will leave those that don't want it washed up, and they have a right to voice their opinion about it. 

 

I recall David Gaider saying that instead of doing an origin story for each race, he'd rather those resources be spread out over the game so the choice of what you are is reacted upon throughout the entire game then just one or two clusters. 

Not really washed up at all. Because you are saying you dont want the extra content is similar to me not wanting certain side quest in DA:I but you know what I did them and while I disliked doing them there is some people who may have enjoyed it so why would I cut out important because there are a few players who dislike it. Lets say DA:O cut out the origins because a few players did not like it the game would have had much less impact at certain moments. And reason I can claim the majority would have wanted Origins in DA:I is because not just causal players who played Origins missing them but it is very rare to find any player who would not want extra content in there game. If playing a 5-10 min map is a deal breaker for you then idk what to tell you but DA4 needs to have origins to introduce players to Tevinter. Why cut needed and wanted content for a 1-5% of fanbase who will play the game regardless. BUt by all means you can voice whatever you want because I surely will be voicing how origin stories help the series, DA2 can get a pass and DA:I is over with but DA4 can not give us as much blank state as they did in DAI

[AlanC9]

Well, wanting origins in DAI is the easy part. It's wanting enough other stuff cut in order to free up dev time for the origins that would be hard.

[JadeDragon]

The main game was also going to be human-only for most of its development. They got the year extension in part so they could add the other races. If they did that from the beginning, there would be a lot more recognition. 

But this is why I honestly feel like is the real reason we have no Origin stories or follow up in DA:I with the race. It was a late addition and would have disrupted the established flow. If they planned on race selection day 1 I am sure the races would have been followed through much better. Qunari was added even later and got the least development as a race which makes sense. There was other things they still needed to work on. But a few predetermined answers to give Josie and a singular predetermine answer to give Cass about where you are from is not a trend that should continue. That is why DAO handled multiple races better. No matter what some aspects of our character will be predetermined the only difference was game had us play it and followed through with at least one main quest connection and the other just gave us codex to read with wartable missions(even more reading) as a follow up. That would be like if a Human Noble Origin was not played but Duncan asked us how we felt about being a Cousland or our family getting killed by Howe no way possible is reading going to be greater then or equal to a actual experience.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Not really washed up at all. Because you are saying you dont want the extra content is similar to me not wanting certain side quest in DA:I but you know what I did them and while I disliked doing them there is some people who may have enjoyed it so why would I cut out important because there are a few players who dislike it. Lets say DA:O cut out the origins because a few players did not like it the game would have had much less impact at certain moments. And reason I can claim the majority would have wanted Origins in DA:I is because not just causal players who played Origins missing them but it is very rare to find any player who would not want extra content in there game. If playing a 5-10 min map is a deal breaker for you then idk what to tell you but DA4 needs to have origins to introduce players to Tevinter. Why cut needed and wanted content for a 1-5% of fanbase who will play the game regardless. BUt by all means you can voice whatever you want because I surely will be voicing how origin stories help the series, DA2 can get a pass and DA:I is over with but DA4 can not give us as much blank state as they did in DAI

Except those side quests are optional. An origin would not be. It would be something you have to play through every single time. 

 

And no, they do not need to have origins to introduce players to Tevinter. There are many other ways the setting can be introduced than by having an origin story. 

[Abyss108]

Not really washed up at all. Because you are saying you dont want the extra content is similar to me not wanting certain side quest in DA:I but you know what I did them and while I disliked doing them there is some people who may have enjoyed it so why would I cut out important because there are a few players who dislike it. Lets say DA:O cut out the origins because a few players did not like it the game would have had much less impact at certain moments. And reason I can claim the majority would have wanted Origins in DA:I is because not just causal players who played Origins missing them but it is very rare to find any player who would not want extra content in there game. If playing a 5-10 min map is a deal breaker for you then idk what to tell you but DA4 needs to have origins to introduce players to Tevinter. Why cut needed and wanted content for a 1-5% of fanbase who will play the game regardless. BUt by all means you can voice whatever you want because I surely will be voicing how origin stories help the series, DA2 can get a pass and DA:I is over with but DA4 can not give us as much blank state as they did in DAI

 

I don't really have anything against Origins returning, as long as they were implemented in a much better way than they were, but this isn't about extra content. If Origins aren't included, the game won't have less content, - it will have extra content in other areas. 

 

I'd much rather get more reactive content to my character in the rest of the game, than a unique 1 hour chapter for my race at the start. The plot of Inquisition had much more of an effect on me than anything in Origins did.

[JadeDragon]

 

 

I don't really have anything against Origins returning, as long as they were implemented in a much better way than they were, but this isn't about extra content. If Origins aren't included, the game won't have less content, - it will have extra content in other areas. 

 

I'd much rather get more reactive content to my character in the rest of the game, than a unique 1 hour chapter for my race at the start. The plot of Inquisition had much more of an effect on me than anything in Origins did.

 

The only points that was truly reactive was Winter Palace which honestly was just the initial and really made no difference in the quest. A qunari may have started off with less approval but they could then gain the same amount of approval just as easy as a human not even a point or two less. The quest was not harder at all for a qunari. The elves as far as a non-human race had the most effective racial content with Arbor Wilds and extra if they were a mage. But Origins Races actually had more of a effect of certain plot points Dwarf Noble and The main quest for the dwarves is a example and When a human noble faces Arl Howe the dialogue content is also different. Other then that neither game really made a certain race get effected by the plot especially dwarves who had almost nothing compared to the dwarves in Origins who had either first and accounts on Carta issues or Noble issues. Inquisition was not anymore reactive to any other race then Origins was. Both games gave certain races there respective moments because if that was the case when was the plot reactive to your race besides your opening speech at skyhold or WInter Palace? And like I said before did we really need extra content in Inquisition to say we dont need origins? Was every quest in Hinterlands needed or Emerald Graves? Storm Coast? lets feel the darkspawn holes in the storm coast because if we dont they will appear on the map and fight the Blades, yet after we complete the quest darkspawn are still there proving the quest accomplished nothing but give us a reason to fight a old enemy did not make the map any easier or harder.

[nightscrawl]

ok but unless you decide to back trach which i personally hate doing, Du Lion and the Waste lets call them tier 3 zones are the hardest zones in the game level wise and  require playing through it to get all the shards even some shards in the dragon area. What use is the resistances if the main elemental enemy (The Dragons) are all dead by then. Realistically if you decide to finish everything possible in each zone before you leave All the dragons are dead and now you have a resistance to every element but for what to say you have it?

I've found that focusing only on the frost and fire is the most useful, since not as many enemies throw out lightning damage. So it is certainly possible to have the full resistance of frost and fire before fighting the higher level dragons.
 
 

But are we saying that Bioware specifically designed an entire map zone and the occulara zoom and find mechanics in order to provide vitaar, which is for one of four PC background options which was only added in an extra year of development, or elemental resistances? This is the argument?

Can we not be a little honest and say that the shards were added as a filler to expand gameplay time? And yes it can be argued to encourage map exploration, but that seems to be circular logic if people interested in exploring would explore regardless of picking up shards. And perhaps testing out the new jumping capability in Frostbite and how to incorporate that into quests.

From a game developer standpoint, Bioware knew that they couldn't include anything too significant in the temple since players would froth at the mouth if they had to collect dozens of shards in order to access important content. So they shot themselves in the foot by creating an entire zone built around a collection quest, knowing that the content in the final room, treasure or lore, could not be that relevant to the overall game or DA series.

It just seems like such bad resource management to me and a large departure from Bio's previous emphasis on using resources mostly for the narrative.

I think even Bioware would admit that it was filler content, but even filler can be designed with a goal in mind; to encourage exploration, to give players more things to do in each zone, and to give a nominal reward at the culmination of it. Do I think it was the best use of resources? No. But neither do I really mind its inclusion.

 

Ideally, there could have been some form of day/night cycle, whether it be Bethesda style or DA2 style...

OH! I love this idea! Imagine that, as the main missions progressed, all of the maps slowly cycled into night, similar to DA2. I realize that the higher level zones would be at a disadvantage in this case, but there would still be more variety.

[Lady Artifice]

I certainly would have preferred it. Getting to know my protagonist a little more outside of their role as Inquisitor would have done a lot to help me empathize with them more.

[AlanC9]

But this is why I honestly feel like is the real reason we have no Origin stories or follow up in DA:I with the race. It was a late addition and would have disrupted the established flow. If they planned on race selection day 1 I am sure the races would have been followed through much better. .

I don't see how that happens. If the cheap version of the feature --just one origin -- didn't make the cut, how does the more expensive version pass?

[AlanC9]

ok but unless you decide to back trach which i personally hate doing, Du Lion and the Waste lets call them tier 3 zones are the hardest zones in the game level wise and require playing through it to get all the shards even some shards in the dragon area. What use is the resistances if the main elemental enemy (The Dragons) are all dead by then. Realistically if you decide to finish everything possible in each zone before you leave All the dragons are dead and now you have a resistance to every element but for what to say you have it?

The game wasn't organized around doing everything in an area and then moving on to the next one for good. If you have a problem with that, well, sucks to be you, I guess.

And of course, there's DLC.

[Wulfram]

Well, wanting origins in DAI is the easy part. It's wanting enough other stuff cut in order to free up dev time for the origins that would be hard.

Well, if they could cut half the areas in DAI I don't think anyone would have really missed them.

[JadeDragon]

The game wasn't organized around doing everything in an area and then moving on to the next one for good. If you have a problem with that, well, sucks to be you, I guess.

And of course, there's DLC.

It was not. You still had to do wartable missions to get to certain parts of the map. But the point was about the shards which is pretty much one of the last things in order to explore the full map. Take Du Lion again for example you get the keep but still have to build the bridge to get to the dragons which is also were the last shards are if you already got the rest. So unless you want to skip the dragons just to get the shards then by all means do you