29 ответов в этой теме

[Force of the North]

I have been reflecting recently about the Dragon Age lore.  I usually do this in times when I am feeling stressed in order to escape.  I keep trying to figure out what might happen based on what we know.  then it hit me we are like Jon Snow because we KNOW nothing.  Anything we hold as fact can be changed simple by the writers saying know you were lied to, the truth is this.  Even that truth can then be rewritten.

 

I hope this has all been part of the plan, but it also could be "hey lets rewrite this whole thing just for shock value."

 

So I guess I am writing this to ask what do we know for sure about this fictional world that, like the fade, can be changed by the will of dreamers.  

[Cute Nug]

We know red lyrium is dangerous cuz Meridith and Bartrand. You were lied to about red lyrium being dangerous unless you eat it repeatedly and don't want to be a red templar. It is fine to be around redickulously huge mountains of it no problem unless maybe you are Meridith and Bartrand.

 

We know mages are at risk and often become abominations if a game protagonist is around and needs stuff to kill. You were lied to about mages always being at risk of becoming abominations. Sometimes like recently they just stop happening no matter how stressed and threatened mages are. Must be the red lyrium.

 

We know the main schools of magic are Arcane, Primal, Creation, Spirit, and Entropy. You were lied to about schools of magic. Mages have the following magical ability groups: Spirit, Storm, Inferno, and Winter. Thanks red lyrium.

[straykat]

We know red lyrium is dangerous cuz Meridith and Bartrand. You were lied to about red lyrium being dangerous unless you eat it repeatedly and don't want to be a red templar. It is fine to be around redickulously huge mountains of it no problem unless maybe you are Meridith and Bartrand.

 

We know mages are at risk and often become abominations if a game protagonist is around and needs stuff to kill. You were lied to about mages always being at risk of becoming abominations. Sometimes like recently they just stop happening no matter how stressed and threatened mages are. Must be the red lyrium.

 

We know the main schools of magic are Arcane, Primal, Creation, Spirit, and Entropy. You were lied to about schools of magic. Mages have the following magical ability groups: Spirit, Storm, Inferno, and Winter. Thanks red lyrium.

 

Ugh. Those new spells schools are so lame. Freaking Diablo has more thought put into it.

 

Funnily...when I bought DAI, I tiptoed my character around the red lyrium at the Temple site.

[Cute Nug]

Ugh. Those new spells schools are so lame. Freaking Diablo has more thought put into it.

 

Funnily...when I bought DAI, I tiptoed my character around the red lyrium at the Temple site.

 

In DA2 I remember being worried about not getting rid of that small red lyrium shard that made Bartrand crazy. In DAI you pick up all the red lyrium shards you can to make corrupting runes.

 

They should have had a red lyrium class specialization for the Inquisitor.

[straykat]

In DA2 I remember being worried about not getting rid of that small red lyrium shard that made Bartrand crazy. In DAI you pick up all the red lyrium shards you can to make corrupting runes.

 

They should have had a red lyrium class specialization for the Inquisitor.

 

Yeah, that was a big concern of mine. It was tempting to get Varric a purple weapon or use Sandal's rune.. but it worried me. And now I know it amounts to squat.

 

I get the feeling they hired noob devs here, who care little and know less than the many of the series' fans. Either that or they're just stoned and have a bad habit of hand waving things and giggling about everything.

[Force of the North]

Yeah, that was a big concern of mine. It was tempting to get Varric a purple weapon or use Sandal's rune.. but it worried me. And now I know it amounts to squat.

 

I get the feeling they hired noob devs here, who care little and know less than the many of the series' fans. Either that or they're just stoned and have a bad habit of hand waving things and giggling about everything.

 

is it the Devs though or the writers?  Honestly they could be one in the same for all I know.

[straykat]

is it the Devs though or the writers?  Honestly they could be one in the same for all I know.

 

I have no clue.. I just get the feeling there's some clown on both ME and DA teams, who has veto power, and always reduces the quality.

 

I don't understand why writers would do it though.

[Illegitimus]

In DA2 I remember being worried about not getting rid of that small red lyrium shard that made Bartrand crazy. In DAI you pick up all the red lyrium shards you can to make corrupting runes.

 

They should have had a red lyrium class specialization for the Inquisitor.

 

To be fair, Bartrand's shard just finished the job started by going around with the big idol for a while.  

[Iadro]

This thread is incredible. Thank you, OP.

 

I especially like the magic thing. Part of why Inquistion will never be part of my personal canon. Building on that...

 

We know Templars are a real and present danger to rogue mages, because they can perform that most devastating ability, a Holy Smite, destroying their mana reserves, turning them into squishy, non-hazardous targets for safe retrieval and transportation. We know this is arguably the point of Templars, and why the Chantry bothered addicting loyal men and women to one of the most dangerous substances in Thedas. You were lied to about Templar abilities. Now, they are only marginally resistant to fire, frost, and shocking effects. Perhaps they have a higher tolerance to certain internet memes. Perhaps mages simply convulse into paroxyms of terror at the sight of a man in a dress.

 

(Curse you, red lyrium)

 

We know that Morrigan was brought up in a way that heavily resembles the real-life practices of child prostitution, and that Flemeth certainly can't be trusted. (Her talk with Leliana regarding their background in Origins banter, Flemeth outright lying when she said she couldn't help fight the Blight, among many other things) We know Flemeth is undoubtedly an antagonist. You were lied to because Flemeth is apparently Mythal, and Morrigan is wrong about everything ever. Even the whole fear for her life thing - such a silly, unfounded fear. Flemythal looks all saddened when she talks to Morrigan in the Fade. That's how you know she's all remorseful and stuff. 

 

(Has everyone forgotten that Flemeth, and Solas, for that matter, are lying liars who lie?)

 

We know that Ferelden has only recently escaped a century-long occupation of Orlais, and that the average Fereldan distrusts and fears anything remotely "foreign," which translates to "Orlesian" in practice. We know that Anora is a competent and intelligent leader, as the games repeatedly tell us, over and over, and that she was raised by the most rabidly anti-Orlesian Fereldan war veteran there ever was. You were lied to as Anora, if queen, happily parcels off Fereldan territory to Orlais, to the mages, to anyone really, as long as they ask nicely, it seems. She fails to secure any foreign alliances, fails to maintain border sovereignty, fails to take advantage of the Orlesian internal crisis by adding much needed lands to Fereldan's domain...

 

(Of course the last may not be entirely her fault, as the Breach is opened over Haven. This is something the writers decided, rather than having Corypheus sacrifice the Divine at Val Royeaux - the perfect city to hold peace talks given it's singular importance in Thedosian history as well as being the headquarters of the Chantry - not to mention the sheer drama and terror he would have evoked by destroying a city of that magnitude. Can you imagine? But apparently, the Powers-That-Be have decided that Ferelden will never be allowed to Grow Strong.)

[Treacherous J Slither]

Mmm yes. Some great posts in this thread.

Keep em coming.

[Lazarillo]

Yeah, this is a big part of why Inquisition turned me off to the "lost lore" aspect of the game. Saying "everything you know is a lie" is shocking and all, but it's not particularly meaningful. Not to mention how big of a disappointment it was with Flemeth...we learn her "true identity" but then find out that everything were told previously about that true identity was false. So she goes from being a mysterious old woman from history who we never really knew the truth about to being...a mysterious old woman from history who we never really knew the truth about.

[Daerog]

We know dwarves fear the sky, tend to live underground and are greatly tied to the Stone.

Now we know that there are dwarf sailors from another continent. However, few know about these people or any lands outside Thedas.

[Gervaise]

Here's another one for you.  We are told that the Dalish revere mages because they believe that all their people were once endowed with magic; therefore each person born to the clan that is a mage is one step closer to recovering their culture and remembering what it is to be true elves, a pre-requisite for the return of their gods.  Each leader of the community is a mage and this is so important to them that if one clan has lots of mages and another is lacking, they allow that clan to adopt one of their precious mage children.   The mages are at risk of possession but the Dalish are confident they can deal with the problem should it arise because it would just be another of many dangers from which their warriors need to protect them.   In any case, since the mages are not feared and treated with love by their families,  plus the Keepers guide them away from more dangerous forms of magic, there is far less likelihood of possession occurring in the first place.  

 

We were lied to about this belief of the Dalish.   They don't revere mages and it is inexplicable why they would want them leading the clans because they are so s**t scared of mages they won't have more than 3 in a clan at any one time because that is the maximum they feel their warriors can cope with or their Keeper is capable of training.   If there is no clan needing a mage or it is too long until the next Arlathaven, then the Keeper either tells the eldest mage to get lost and see the world (even though they think the human world is polluting) or they give the youngest one a pack and leave them in the forest to fend for themselves.      Apparently Rivain have hedge mages who lead the community and allow themselves to become deliberately possessed, the Avaar allow their mage children to be deliberately possessed by spirits in order to teach them and protect them from demons, but the Dalish are heavily influenced by the Chantry and thus has similar views to them about mages in their community and the risks they pose.

[ArcadiaGrey]

We were lied to about this belief of the Dalish.   They don't revere mages and it is inexplicable why they would want them leading the clans because they are so s**t scared of mages they won't have more than 3 in a clan at any one time because that is the maximum they feel their warriors can cope with or their Keeper is capable of training.   If there is no clan needing a mage or it is too long until the next Arlathaven, then the Keeper either tells the eldest mage to get lost and see the world (even though they think the human world is polluting) or they give the youngest one a pack and leave them in the forest to fend for themselves.      Apparently Rivain have hedge mages who lead the community and allow themselves to become deliberately possessed, the Avaar allow their mage children to be deliberately possessed by spirits in order to teach them and protect them from demons, but the Dalish are heavily influenced by the Chantry and thus has similar views to them about mages in their community and the risks they pose.

 

But in DAO and DA2 they say that they don't have more than a couple of mages as that's all the Chantry and Templars will tolerate.  More than that and they'll come take them to the Circle as they can't ignore the threat, but with just 2 they're willing to turn a blind eye as long as the Dalish move on.

[Gervaise]

If that was the case then why doesn't the clan just dump the child on the nearest Chantry steps?   I don't recall either DAO or DA2 saying that is why they restrict the number of mages; yes the Templars know the clans have mages but as long as they keep moving and don't cause trouble, they leave them alone.   In fact, so long as they keep moving the Templars would find it difficult to locate them anyway.    It is staying in one place for any length of time that is going to alert them to your presence.   If they should cross your path, then surely the mages would have been taught to keep their magic hidden, or disappear into the forest until the Templars leave?   Besides which, restricting the number of mages to avoid the attention of Templars is not the reason given for this action in DAI.   Whether Vivienne, Minaeve or Iron Bull, each person just says that it is a restriction the Dalish impose on themselves in order to control the mages.   Vivienne talks about it in the context of needing Templars to guard against the possibility of possessed mages and how it is a matter of survival to restrict the number of mages in the clan because of the danger they represent.   No option is given to refute this by saying, if your Templars didn't hound us so much, we wouldn't have to do it.   It is not done because of Templars but because of the mages themselves. 

 

You have to remember that these were people who preferred to fight rather than submit to Chantry rule.   These were people who preferred to go out into the wilds and endure a harsh existence surviving its perils rather than submit to the strictures of human culture.    It is not exactly difficult to keep clear of Chantry rule if you stay away from human settlements.    Lets face it, the Chasind and Avaar have been doing it for years and they aren't even nomads.    No, this was a deliberate insertion of a frankly illogical piece of lore to counter what people had constantly been saying on these boards; namely the Dalish manage perfectly well without Templars.    As I also point out, apparently the Avaar and Rivaini do as well.    The Chantry couldn't eradicate the Rivaini wise women from their communities even when they were in control of Rivain and yet they are in settled communities, so it would have been much easier for Templars to round them up.  Yet apparently the Dalish just roll over and give in?    No way.   "We are the last of the elvhanen and never again will we submit."   An empty declaration if they are willing to give up their children in that way.

[Merengues 1945]

I understand the red lyrium thingy because of gameplay, but overall the magic schools was a blunder... The skill trees of mages were severely limited making them absolutely boring to use since now is all button-smashing instead of planned combats and with only boring spells. And the absence of blood magic is just annoying.

 

Remember the days when your mage warden could put misdirection spells on the darkspawn rogues to keep them shooting at nothing while the death hex killed their commander slowly and crushing prison or mana clash made short work of the emissaries and shades? And calling the death cloud instead of relying on the stupid focus to release a decent AoE spell... Those were the days.

 

 

[shadowclasper]

We know red lyrium is dangerous cuz Meridith and Bartrand. You were lied to about red lyrium being dangerous unless you eat it repeatedly and don't want to be a red templar. It is fine to be around redickulously huge mountains of it no problem unless maybe you are Meridith and Bartrand.

 

We know mages are at risk and often become abominations if a game protagonist is around and needs stuff to kill. You were lied to about mages always being at risk of becoming abominations. Sometimes like recently they just stop happening no matter how stressed and threatened mages are. Must be the red lyrium.

 

We know the main schools of magic are Arcane, Primal, Creation, Spirit, and Entropy. You were lied to about schools of magic. Mages have the following magical ability groups: Spirit, Storm, Inferno, and Winter. Thanks red lyrium.

I'd like to point out that they were under PROLONGED exposure to the stuff, ingesting it is immediately dangerous in the same way that eating untreated darkspawn blood is immediately dangerous.

 

But Red Lyrium is just another expression of the

Spoiler

blight

. You can walk through blighted tunnels or lands for ages and probably avoid infection provided you don't directly expose yourself too it. Same deal with Red Lyrium. Also that Lyrium Idol was probably specially shaped in some way for maximum effect, like how runes and lyrium itself can be shaped to render SPECIFIC EFFECTS. Like Shaperate Memory crystals etc. And then there's the deal that maybe Bartrand ALWAYS intended to betray his brother for all of this stuff. We have no way of knowing if the Lyrium Idol actually screwed with his head the moment he touched it, or if he literally was planning on stabbing everyone in the back for his own gain and then just being exposed to the lyrium idol over a period of YEARS caused him to go nuts. Heck, the leading templar of Kirkwall sure as hell didn't need the Lyrium idol to be a complete jerk. It just pushed her over the edge into total monomania and paranoia that was already there.

 

Also, keep in mind, DAII was a freaking -story-. It was a tall tale told by Varric. He embellished a lot of it probably, like how many abominations you fought, how many foes, all that stuff. All of it is him telling a story, anything we got. Absolutely ANYTHING that happened in DAII is suspect because Varric was deliberately hiding stuff from Seeker Cassandra (and some of it he only tells when forced too point blank because Cassandra shoves proof of it happening in his face, such as the DLCs). He's an unreliable narrator who was telling a good story, not a factual history.

 

The abominations thing was happening all the time as far as I can recall, they just didn't make a new model for it. You fight abominations when you fight the grey wardens as I recall? Same deal. Just because it's not the focus of the story doesn't mean it's not happening.

 

I got nothing for the spell schools.

 

I don't think it's a case of lying or retcons. I think the writers get to futz around with their own lore too be honest. They get to shove things around, change them, make things different. Heck, I'm pretty sure I remember a lore entry about how the spell schools got reorganized into the new ones sometime between DAII and DA:I. Very few of these changes are made in a vacuum.

 

edit: On the dalish mage thing, that's been canon at least since DAII, and the reason they won't go and leave a child on the chantry steps is because they AVOID human towns or any place with a freaking chantry. As far as we can tell, the chantry doesn't build isolated monastaries as a rule. The Temple of Sacred Ashes was a massive exception to the rule. You don't have isolated, but fairly heavily occupied shrines, where you can easily sneak a group of dalish up to and drop the kid on them. The Dalish aren't going to go near any human settlement if they can help it (Remember how when they stuck around Kirkwall it was only when waaaay the hell away from any settlement? With a freaking mountain side between them and the city? Have we ever, ever, ever, ever seen a Dalish group anywhere NEAR a human settlement where an occupied chantry could be found? Of course not, because Dalish get blamed for everything and so they stick the heck away from human settlements where they could be mobbed to death or at the very least driven off.)

 

Further, if the Dalish dropped off a mage kid with a town, I give that kid 9 chances in 10 of being lynched immediately unless there are literally templars right there, and even if they are there, it's still only 1 chance in 2. Better to let the kid wander off, hopefully stumble into some human settlement, and get adopted that way before they're obviously dalish in any way so that the humans don't treat them like a freaking monster.

 

edit2: If any game is to be considered not part of someone's personal canon. It has to be the vast majority of DAII, which is far more suspect.

Сообщение изменено: shadowclasper, 06 Июнь 2016 - 12:12 .

[Gervaise]

I wasn't being entirely serious about the Chantry suggestion, although I consider a child would stand a better chance being dropped off at a Chantry than simply abandoned in the wild and hoping they will stumble onto a human village, but either way the child ends up being raised by humans.   Why would the Dalish want that?

 

The Chantrys aren't just in the big cities.   Redcliffe has one and in DAO that was said to be a community of only 200 people, which is why it is called a village.   Lothering was another village: only 500 people.    Easy enough to sneak in under cover of dark, drop the child on the doorstep, bang on the door and leave.   It would simply appear a elven orphan, nothing to suggest it is a Dalish since they don't get the vallaslin until later and in any case the Chantry would love to be able to display the child as being abandoned by the Dalish.    

 

Which is why, of course, the Dalish would never intend any child to end up being raised by humans.   They are abandoning the child in the wilds to die, apparently because that will salve their conscience in some way that they are giving them a chance but the reality is they are casting them adrift with no hope of a community to live in for the foreseeable future, even if by some miracle they do survive.   Essentially they are treating them like they are deformed, which is how even "civilised" societies like the Romans dealt with unwanted children.    So I'm not arguing with the fact that they might do this to an unwanted child but the fact that it is so at odds with their culture and beliefs to do it to a mage child.    You don't revere your ancestors as mages, wish to return to that time, teach that your gods will return when you remember what it is to be true elves and then abandon the members of your clan that most closely resemble that ideal.   It is stupid and illogical.

 

The only thing I recall concerning the lore in DA2 was that Merrill was gifted to the Sabrae clan because they had no mage children of their own.  The rule of 3 concerned at what point a clan considered they had enough of their own that they could spare one to be adopted elsewhere.   She also mentioned how Templars knew they had mages and that is why they had to keep moving.   Where did it say that they restricted their mage numbers to 3 because the Templars insisted on it?

[Treacherous J Slither]

I wasn't being entirely serious about the Chantry suggestion, although I consider a child would stand a better chance being dropped off at a Chantry than simply abandoned in the wild and hoping they will stumble onto a human village, but either way the child ends up being raised by humans. Why would the Dalish want that?

The Chantrys aren't just in the big cities. Redcliffe has one and in DAO that was said to be a community of only 200 people, which is why it is called a village. Lothering was another village: only 500 people. Easy enough to sneak in under cover of dark, drop the child on the doorstep, bang on the door and leave. It would simply appear a elven orphan, nothing to suggest it is a Dalish since they don't get the vallaslin until later and in any case the Chantry would love to be able to display the child as being abandoned by the Dalish.

Which is why, of course, the Dalish would never intend any child to end up being raised by humans. They are abandoning the child in the wilds to die, apparently because that will salve their conscience in some way that they are giving them a chance but the reality is they are casting them adrift with no hope of a community to live in for the foreseeable future, even if by some miracle they do survive. Essentially they are treating them like they are deformed, which is how even "civilised" societies like the Romans dealt with unwanted children. So I'm not arguing with the fact that they might do this to an unwanted child but the fact that it is so at odds with their culture and beliefs to do it to a mage child. You don't revere your ancestors as mages, wish to return to that time, teach that your gods will return when you remember what it is to be true elves and then abandon the members of your clan that most closely resemble that ideal. It is stupid and illogical.

The only thing I recall concerning the lore in DA2 was that Merrill was gifted to the Sabrae clan because they had no mage children of their own. The rule of 3 concerned at what point a clan considered they had enough of their own that they could spare one to be adopted elsewhere. She also mentioned how Templars knew they had mages and that is why they had to keep moving. Where did it say that they restricted their mage numbers to 3 because the Templars insisted on it?

Preach.

[Evil Asch]

The only explanation I can think of for the clear illogic of how Dalish mage children are treated is that the refugee mage in Haven that says she was abandoned was somehow mistaken or lied to and the Dalish (for some reason) either never bothered to correct her (since Vivienne seems very confident that this is a common practice among the Dalish) or the Dalish allow this myth to spread to protect themselves. An elf inquisitor doesn't exactly argue and while apparently taken off guard and disapproving of the apparent practice isn't shocked by it but does state his/her clan had other ways. We don't know what he/she meant by the other ways or what the other ways were meant to achieve.

In other words the Dalish may claim to the children they abandon that the reason is because of X in the case of the survivor / refugee in Haven they claimed it was because she was a mage (maybe it was because they didn't have enough resources and no nearby clans to assist or something along those lines).

I mean, it's weak but it might be a bit of a hand wave.

TL;DR Dalish lie about why they abandon children and allow the Shem to believe it's because they cast out mages when the magic number of 3 is reached. This is in part to reassure the Chantry that the Dalish are good little nomads keeping their mage quotient low. 

[Treacherous J Slither]

The only explanation I can think of for the clear illogic of how Dalish mage children are treated is that the refugee mage in Haven that says she was abandoned was somehow mistaken or lied to and the Dalish (for some reason) either never bothered to correct her (since Vivienne seems very confident that this is a common practice among the Dalish) or the Dalish allow this myth to spread to protect themselves. An elf inquisitor doesn't exactly argue and while apparently taken off guard and disapproving of the apparent practice isn't shocked by it but does state his/her clan had other ways. We don't know what he/she meant by the other ways or what the other ways were meant to achieve.

In other words the Dalish may claim to the children they abandon that the reason is because of X in the case of the survivor / refugee in Haven they claimed it was because she was a mage (maybe it was because they didn't have enough resources and no nearby clans to assist or something along those lines).

I mean, it's weak but it might be a bit of a hand wave.

TL;DR Dalish lie about why they abandon children and allow the Shem to believe it's because they cast out mages when the magic number of 3 is reached. This is in part to reassure the Chantry that the Dalish are good little nomads keeping their mage quotient low.

Whether they lie or not the fact remains that she was abandoned by her clan as a child. I can think of no legitimate reason within the lore to do such a thing. Unless of course she was possessed by a demon. Which she wasn't.

[Evil Asch]

Whether they lie or not the fact remains that she was abandoned by her clan as a child. I can think of no legitimate reason within the lore to do such a thing. Unless of course she was possessed by a demon. Which she wasn't.

 

Completely agreed but she never names her clan and we have no way to know where it was located except for probably Ferelden from her accent which leaves us with very limited information and a lot of assumptions. My point is more that we don't really know for sure *why* she was abandoned, after all she was a small child maybe they fed her the lie about being a mage so she would know to try to be careful around others / humans.

It does seem insane and could just be a screw up but it's at least possible that she was abandoned for other reasons (the clan was facing certain death / infected with a plague etc.) than just BOO HISSS MAAAAGE. It's not really likely but it's a hand wavy explanation for the moment.

[kimgoold]

How previous DA had specialist Mage Healers and now healing doesn't exist much like the Magic Schools of Creation, Entropy, etc. Apparently Wynne should take a hike as she conflicts with current Devs game Lore, but if we wait I'm sure it will change with the next bright spark who takes over.

[Treacherous J Slither]

Completely agreed but she never names her clan and we have no way to know where it was located except for probably Ferelden from her accent which leaves us with very limited information and a lot of assumptions. My point is more that we don't really know for sure *why* she was abandoned, after all she was a small child maybe they fed her the lie about being a mage so she would know to try to be careful around others / humans.

It does seem insane and could just be a screw up but it's at least possible that she was abandoned for other reasons (the clan was facing certain death / infected with a plague etc.) than just BOO HISSS MAAAAGE. It's not really likely but it's a hand wavy explanation for the moment.

A small child alone in the wilderness is a death sentence.

There is no legitimate reason to abandon a child to the wilderness. Unless you want that child to die.

If there was a plague or something and everyone had the disease but her I'm sure someone would have told her that was the case or she'd have seen it herself.

It's also possible that she's lying. Maybe she ran away on her own and at an older age. Maybe she got tired of living off the land and wanted the safety and security she felt the Circle could provide. Or she was exiled for doing something wrong and got nabbed by Templars. Who knows? We never meet anyone that corroborates her story so we don't know if she's telling the truth.

She could just be a Chantry propaganda mouthpiece whose job it is to discredit alternate systems of handling mages. She's a elven Circle mage that likes to hang out with lobotomized mages. Who knows what's running around in her head?

Personally I believe she should be ignored and everything she said should be forgotten.

[Gervaise]

Trouble is we have Dalish from the Chargers and Bull saying the same thing.    Mind you, it is possible that Dalish heard Minaeve's story and attached to her own so people wouldn't ask further questions about what she was doing away from her clan.     So her Keeper may well have told her to take a hike but it had to do with something other than the fact they had too many mages.   She had vallaslin so was definitely considered an adult by the time she left her clan.      The Dalish are known to banish clan members who are perceived a risk to the clan through their actions or refusal to obey the instructions of their elders, in particular the Keeper.    I am happy enough to see it that way but the reason I keep raising the issue is that I'm hoping the writers will ensure that it doesn't ever surface again in the future.    Should be safe enough next game as we are going to Tevinter and there are no Dalish there, not roaming around free anyway.