68 réponses à ce sujet

[Rosstoration]

Great, I came to this thread looking forward to ME: Andromeda, and now I'm more hyped for Cyberpunk 2077.

[Gwydden]

This is all just my opinion.

I get that, mate, but are you sure you're not engaging in at least a little bit of hyperbole? 

 

I don't know, but the way I've always seen it (and this is just my opinion) the word that perfectly captures the quality of the ME series is... okay. Sort of like the better Marvel movies, actually, — The Avengers or Guardians of the Galaxy, for example — in that it's fun popcorn that will keep you busy in an otherwise uneventful day, but still without anything remarkable or particularly memorable. Just a generic action adventure video game series. The story? The least you think about it the better it is, I guess. The combat? Not much of a fan of shooters, but I've played better.

 

Not trying to burst your bubble, or imply that you should give a flying fig for the opinion of a stranger on the Internet. Just pointing out that maybe, just maybe, you've set up rather unrealistic expectations for MEA. Myself, I fully expect it to be either 1. another fun but forgettable game, like the ones in the trilogy, or 2. a tedious slog through boring filler, a la DAI.

[78stonewobble]

I get that, mate, but are you sure you're not engaging in at least a little bit of hyperbole? 

 

I don't know, but the way I've always seen it (and this is just my opinion) the word that perfectly captures the quality of the ME series is... okay. Sort of like the better Marvel movies, actually, — The Avengers or Guardians of the Galaxy, for example — in that it's fun popcorn that will keep you busy in an otherwise uneventful day, but still without anything remarkable or particularly memorable. Just a generic action adventure video game series. The story? The least you think about it the better it is, I guess. The combat? Not much of a fan of shooters, but I've played better.

 

Not trying to burst your bubble, or imply that you should give a flying fig for the opinion of a stranger on the Internet. Just pointing out that maybe, just maybe, you've set up rather unrealistic expectations for MEA. Myself, I fully expect it to be either 1. another fun but forgettable game, like the ones in the trilogy, or 2. a tedious slog through boring filler, a la DAI.

 

I think there's certainly merit to the critique of combat and story, but I think that... combined with setting and characters, then the mass effect series is a pretty darn good combination, in my oppinion. Even if there are games that do parts of it better or even alot better. 

 

But personally I'm keeping my expectations low too... For now.. I won't promise I won't get superhyped closer to release . 

 

Overall tho... I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than unpleasantly disappointed. 

 

EDIT: In general I don't expect any games to be the game to end all other games for me... I mostly just expect to be entertained for so and so long. 

[Gwydden]

I think there's certainly merit to the critique of combat and story, but I think that... combined with setting and characters, then the mass effect series is a pretty darn good combination, in my oppinion. Even if there are games that do parts of it better or even alot better. 

 

But personally I'm keeping my expectations low too... For now.. I won't promise I won't get superhyped closer to release . 

 

Overall tho... I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than unpleasantly disappointed. 

 

EDIT: In general I don't expect any games to be the game to end all other games for me... I mostly just expect to be entertained for so and so long. 

Hmm. I don't consider setting and characters to be all that great either, but then there is a considerable degree of subjectivity to these sorts of considerations. But yes, that is sort of my approach. Is it possible MEA ends up being great? Sure, but I don't think that's likely. If it is, I'll be pleasantly surprise, which is better than setting up expectations that it will fall short of no matter what, in my opinion.

[Sartoz]

 Snip

And so I have hope that ME:A will at least equal the trilogy. 

Snip

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To Hope... but

With a focus on exploration? With combat mechanics redone from scratch to comply with the FB3 engine features/limitations? With combat mechanics having new elements while still providing "familiarity"? Can anyone decode Bio's meaning on this?

 

A strong main story, "live" characters and some decent quests are my baseline expectations from Bio. On romance, if Bio goes overboard, as in DA:I, then expect two-three good ones and the rest will be quest like (see Cassandra's romance).  Actually, if Bio stays true to form, expect at least four characters from the LGBT group (one of each).

 

Take Bio's statement that the focus is on exploration. What exactly would that entail? Aimless wandering with the Mako in different terrain? Look C the Mako... C the Mako wandering in the forest... C the Mako in the Grand Canyon! 

 

Will there be primary and/or secondary exploration missions? What is the purpose of a game whose focus is using the Mako?

 

Just asking. Also, my hope is that EA PLAY will answer some questions.

[Sanunes]

I have a hard time expecting anything from BioWare for they tend to alter their games a lot between releases, even if they are focusing on exploration I have my doubts it will be like the exploration in Dragon Age: Inquisition. Now if they developed games like Ubisoft I would be more likely to draw comparisons.

[AlleyD]

I reset my brand attachments to BioWare when the executives left and have no real expectations towards ME:A (this also means I have no real anxieties or dread about the game.

[78stonewobble]

Hmm. I don't consider setting and characters to be all that great either, but then there is a considerable degree of subjectivity to these sorts of considerations. But yes, that is sort of my approach. Is it possible MEA ends up being great? Sure, but I don't think that's likely. If it is, I'll be pleasantly surprise, which is better than setting up expectations that it will fall short of no matter what, in my opinion.

 

It's pretty much all subjective and rehashes. Personally I consider everything since the 15.000? year old cavepaintings rehashes... and strongly suspecting the person painting even those to have stolen them from somewhere else. 

 

I do know one game tho... that's worse off in regards to expectations... Halflife 3... Can't really blame valve for not wanting to open that can of worms, considering times have sailed the genre by in a sense. 

 

Tho just out of curiosity... Why the hell are you even here?  

 

I mean... Looking at the games I've played and being very gracious say that 70 percent are ok, over average, to acceptable to crappy.... and a whole 30 percent I think are good. I might only really visit websites and forums for a few of them and the majority of those would be the ones I find good. 

[78stonewobble]

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To Hope... but

With a focus on exploration? With combat mechanics redone from scratch to comply with the FB3 engine features/limitations? With combat mechanics having new elements while still providing "familiarity"? Can anyone decode Bio's meaning on this?

 

A strong main story, "live" characters and some decent quests are my baseline expectations from Bio. On romance, if Bio goes overboard, as in DA:I, then expect two-three good ones and the rest will be quest like (see Cassandra's romance).  Actually, if Bio stays true to form, expect at least four characters from the LGBT group (one of each).

 

Take Bio's statement that the focus is on exploration. What exactly would that entail? Aimless wandering with the Mako in different terrain? Look C the Mako... C the Mako wandering in the forest... C the Mako in the Grand Canyon! 

 

Will there be primary and/or secondary exploration missions? What is the purpose of a game whose focus is using the Mako?

 

Just asking. Also, my hope is that EA PLAY will answer some questions.

 

... 

 

Well I can't decode it for you... but I can tell you my hope. 

 

That the story is less of a ... save the world/galaxy thing, but more of story based around the difficulties of establishing a new life in a new and unexplored part of space. 

 

Finding raw materials and basic ressources, suitable land to settle, food, medicines... Defense against the "natives" ... 

 

Whether It will all be in an interesting form? I don't know... 

 

 

...

 

I could imagine something like:

A: Mission to find some ressource. 

B: Eg. establish a mine. 

C: Having to defend said mine against... wildlife... Or some new enemy type introduced. 

D: Repeats? Or on to some other ressource/thing you need...

[Gwydden]

It's pretty much all subjective and rehashes. Personally I consider everything since the 15.000? year old cavepaintings rehashes... and strongly suspecting the person painting even those to have stolen them from somewhere else. 

Originality is a non-issue for me. I am well aware that true innovation in terms of storytelling is pretty much a lost cause. There's nothing new under the sun and all that.

 

Tho just out of curiosity... Why the hell are you even here?

Well, I got into these forums because I really like DAO, and because there really aren't all that many companies who focus on producing story-driven RPGs. And I usually buy only half a dozen games per year at the most, although financial issues play into that as well. And since I'm picky in my tastes, mostly sticking to RPGs and strategy games, neither of those genres being very popular, even just "okay" becomes reason enough to follow a series.

 

I mean, my standards for storytelling in video games are way lower than for other mediums. If ME was a book, a movie, or a TV show I doubt I would have even bothered with it and, even if I did, I would have dropped it pretty quickly. Truth be told, the same is true of even DAO, which I consider to be the best Bioware game I've played.

 

Oh, and I'm lazy. I'm used to this place, and moving elsewhere sounds like a lot of work 

[Prince Enigmatic]

After multiple playthroughs, I realise I always come back for the characters and universe.

I was never particularly enamoured with the over-arching plot but the characters and locales along the way were an absolute treat to experience.

As long as Andromeda sticks to what Mass Effect does best, I'm sure we'll get a solid outing for the series.

 

I agree.

 

I probably haven't played enough story-driven games to make a more accurate comparison here, but for video game standards, I think the Mass Effect's stories, overarching plot, and sub-plots are pretty solid.

 

But it is definitely the characters and the Mass Effect universe in general that kick started my obsession with this series! Sometimes it's never the destination, it's the journey, and said journey with said characters was what made Mass Effect a great experience that keeps having me come back (and what will never make me part from my PS3, not until there is a ME remaster for the PS4 at least!)

 

My main hopes for ME:A are riding on having good, strong characters, and continuing to expand upon the Mass Effect universe. If the story is solid and gameplay fun, then that's a great added bonus.

 

In all honesty, I'd be happy with or without ME:A. The Mass Effect trilogy was good enough as a whole for me that I'm not chomping at the bit for a fourth entry, but I'm looking forward to another ME:A game all the same.

 

The games I am really anticipating with hope and dread? Probably Kingdom Hearts 3. Going on 12 years and counting.

 

I also want like mad The Last Of Us 2 and another BioShock from Ken Levine, more so than ME:A so... subjectivity. 

[JPVNG]

Mass Effect (the all trilogy) its an extraordinary game, for me ..the best. Story, playability, music...VA....i love the music of Mass Effect its just beautiful.

Fantastic games. I ll never forget the fun i had.

If MEA can make me feel like i am living the characters life, like the previous trilogy did, its already a winning game.

[vbibbi]

Off topic, but Witcher fails for me on three main counts. First, it is just FAR too open. It's quite easy to wander away from anywhere connected with the current quest or storyline, and have no way to realize it's happened. After a half hour passes with nothing remotely progress, I reload the last save and start again. A little bit of linearity, or some clue that you've wandered away, would be a good thing.
 
Second, the battle mechanics are terrible, compared to Mass Effect. And all those ingredients to collect for all those spells and such, it's just way to complicated and hard to keep track of. The mechanics of buying and selling and raising money and searching for stuff to pick up are too time consuming and contribute nothing to progress of the main story. Too much of it feels pointless. 
 
Third, when I got to the point I was wandering around the village looking for fights to win or barters to make or whatnot, so I could accumulate enough cash to pay for boat passage, so I could go to a place where I might find someone that might be helpful, and I realized that I had been doing that for hours, I shut it off and never played again.

  

I agree that I don't like TW3 combat very much, and I greatly prefer a party based game rather than a solo PC. But TBH I'm not sure how a player can move away from the main story sections without realizing it and then getting lost. There are map markers highlighted to show the next step in a quest. Exactly the same as DAI. Especially since there are fast travel points spaced out so you can return to main areas. And if the player goes off the beaten path, isn't that a sign of exploration and good open world build?

My prediction is that if you didn't like exploration in TW3 then you might not like MEA as it's advertised as another game focusing on exploration.

Originality is a non-issue for me. I am well aware that true innovation in terms of storytelling is pretty much a lost cause. There's nothing new under the sun and all that.
 

Well, I got into these forums because I really like DAO, and because there really aren't all that many companies who focus on producing story-driven RPGs. And I usually buy only half a dozen games per year at the most, although financial issues play into that as well. And since I'm picky in my tastes, mostly sticking to RPGs and strategy games, neither of those genres being very popular, even just "okay" becomes reason enough to follow a series.
 
I mean, my standards for storytelling in video games are way lower than for other mediums. If ME was a book, a movie, or a TV show I doubt I would have even bothered with it and, even if I did, I would have dropped it pretty quickly. Truth be told, the same is true of even DAO, which I consider to be the best Bioware game I've played.
 
Oh, and I'm lazy. I'm used to this place, and moving elsewhere sounds like a lot of work 

Hear hear! Going by the books based off of video games, story is not held to the same standards as other books. Even though I read all ME and DA books, it was more to learn about the game universes than because of good writing or well rounded characters and plots.

I still hope that the standards of quality increase for games, and it's why I don't just give Bioware a pass for making games with stories better than most. If I just accept that they've passed that low bar, I'm accepting that video games will never improve their stories and characters. And if Bioware is going to label their games as art, then they have to prove it to me.

[Spectr61]

I get that, mate, but are you sure you're not engaging in at least a little bit of hyperbole? 
 
I don't know, but the way I've always seen it (and this is just my opinion) the word that perfectly captures the quality of the ME series is... okay. Sort of like the better Marvel movies, actually, — The Avengers or Guardians of the Galaxy, for example — in that it's fun popcorn that will keep you busy in an otherwise uneventful day, but still without anything remarkable or particularly memorable. Just a generic action adventure video game series. The story? The least you think about it the better it is, I guess. The combat? Not much of a fan of shooters, but I've played better.
 
Not trying to burst your bubble, or imply that you should give a flying fig for the opinion of a stranger on the Internet. Just pointing out that maybe, just maybe, you've set up rather unrealistic expectations for MEA. Myself, I fully expect it to be either 1. another fun but forgettable game, like the ones in the trilogy, or 2. a tedious slog through boring filler, a la DAI.

Huh?

Just Okay? Certainly one's opinions are one's own, and justified from that perspective; but if the ME Triology is "okay", then what pray tell is "good" or, God forbid, "excellent"?

From my own perspective, I do not have experience with better, and agree with the multiple-sources of "best of" lists that consistently rank the individual titles of the trilogy highly, if not giving one of them (usually ME2) the highest slot.

Certainly not perfect, and room for improvement, which hopefully Andromeda accomplishes.

[Gwydden]

Huh?

Just Okay? Certainly one's opinions are one's own, and justified from that perspective; but if the ME Triology is "okay", then what pray tell is "good" or, God forbid, "excellent"?

I'm not sure it is a good idea for me to answer that question. In my experience, that tends to derail into arguments of the "but that game isn't as good as you say; this one's better!" type. Which can be enlightening and, I'll confess, even fun, but I'm not sure this thread would be the best place for it. But, against my best judgment, I will answer your question and hope we can all behave, myself included.

 

We're obviously talking RPGs, so I'll stick to that. A good game? DAO qualifies in my book. As for excellent, I'd nominate The Witcher series, especially the second one (I have yet to play the third one). But as anyone can see by going to the previous page, plenty of people around these parts disagree with me, so there you go.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not given to fanboyism or grandstanding about how this or that game is absolutely perfect and brilliant and genius and yadda, yadda, yadda. Those are words I prefer to avoid, and that is the exact kind of attitude I was criticizing when responding to the OP. No need to blow a game out of proportion; that leads to disappointment and unpleasant arguments upon release.

 

Certainly not perfect, and room for improvement, which hopefully Andromeda accomplishes.

I definitely want MEA to be an awesome game. I just don't think it will be, and prefer to keep my expectations low. As I said, I wouldn't mind a pleasant surprise. I don't think it will be a bad game either, just... okay. Which isn't a terrible thing to be, I would think.

[vbibbi]

Huh?

Just Okay? Certainly one's opinions are one's own, and justified from that perspective; but if the ME Triology is "okay", then what pray tell is "good" or, God forbid, "excellent"?

From my own perspective, I do not have experience with better, and agree with the multiple-sources of "best of" lists that consistently rank the individual titles of the trilogy highly, if not giving one of them (usually ME2) the highest slot.

Certainly not perfect, and room for improvement, which hopefully Andromeda accomplishes.

 

Unpopular opinion on any video game boards...but I'm going to be honest. Other than maybe Planescape: Torment and possibly a few adventure games (Longest Journey, Siberia) most games do not reach the "good" level I hope for. I love Bioware and all its games, but none of them would qualify for me as an "excellent" story. I just don't think video games are at the point where the writing is on par with other creative media.

[Gwydden]

Unpopular opinion on any video game boards...but I'm going to be honest. Other than maybe Planescape: Torment and possibly a few adventure games (Longest Journey, Siberia) most games do not reach the "good" level I hope for. I love Bioware and all its games, but none of them would qualify for me as an "excellent" story. I just don't think video games are at the point where the writing is on par with other creative media.

I think there's a difference between a "good game" and a "good story." The second one does help the latter, especially in an RPG, but it is not required per se if the game has good gameplay. I don't think the combat in any Bioware game (or even in The Witcher, for that matter) is all that fun, not enough to justify playing the game just for it. But take something like Age of Wonders III, for example. Great gameplay, but everything about the story? Generic and not at all interesting.

 

I tried playing Torment and gave up before exiting the first dungeon because I felt it had a very clunky interface that made it unplayable. That is a problem I tend to have with old games: I can stand the most pixelated graphics but give up when faced with annoying controls   But I played Longest Journey and I recall it was actually pretty good. Maybe getting the Dreamfall sequel is not a bad idea?

[vbibbi]

I think there's a difference between a "good game" and a "good story." The second one does help the latter, especially in an RPG, but it is not required per se if the game has good gameplay. I don't think the combat in any Bioware game (or even in The Witcher, for that matter) is all that fun, not enough to justify playing the game just for it. But take something like Age of Wonders III, for example. Great gameplay, but everything about the story? Generic and not at all interesting.

 

I tried playing Torment and gave up before exiting the first dungeon because I felt it had a very clunky interface that made it unplayable. That is a problem I tend to have with old games: I can stand the most pixelated graphics but give up when faced with annoying controls   But I played Longest Journey and I recall it was actually pretty good. Maybe getting the Dreamfall sequel is not a bad idea?

 

Blasphemer! PS:T is one of the best games ever. IMO of course. But my opinion is fact.

 

Honestly, I would highly suggest trying it again, I didn't find the controls that difficult but then it resembled BG and IWD controls for the most part.

 

I do recognize the difficulty in merging good stories with good games, but I'm not going to slack in criticism of a game because of this difficulty. So I can recognize that most Bioware games are good games, but many of them have lacking stories. I really want future Bioware games to be both good games and good (rational and believable) stories.

[Seraphim24]

The absurd thing that has been going on way too long is the emphasis on extremes.

 

The things (ultimately) drive everything in the universe are basically the things that are "best overall," an extreme thing is simply a form of being good in that aggregate picture.

 

People keep looking for the movie in the game or the game in the movie or something and it's like everyone just needs to relax and get over the fact that everything isn't always everything, and just accept things are for what they are.

 

Especially nowadays when people have taken the time to assiduously criticize just about everything in the universe, people are mostly left with no other choice than to consume things that are (metaphorically) riddled with bullets.

 

Pretty much everything that's been a best seller or been the chief driver of everything since 2010 or so for ex, has invariably failed someone's test on the internet of something or another.

 

It still doesn't really matter though most of the time because that person hasn't been able to offer something better in the "aggregate experience."

[Seraphim24]

Like for me "The Witcher" was better overall than some recent Bioware game or whatever, thus, it dictated playing preference. I have no way of knowing which minor bells and/or whistles and/or scraps were better done in the other versus the other because I'd rather just consume the "superior in the aggregate" experience.

 

Cyberpunk looks less interesting, maybe the pendulum will swing back, who knows.

 

It was also not a surprise to me afterwards that it would sell more as a consequence..

[Spectr61]

I'm not sure it is a good idea for me to answer that question. In my experience, that tends to derail into arguments of the "but that game isn't as good as you say; this one's better!" type. Which can be enlightening and, I'll confess, even fun, but I'm not sure this thread would be the best place for it. But, against my best judgment, I will answer your question and hope we can all behave, myself included.
 
We're obviously talking RPGs, so I'll stick to that. A good game? DAO qualifies in my book. As for excellent, I'd nominate The Witcher series, especially the second one (I have yet to play the third one). But as anyone can see by going to the previous page, plenty of people around these parts disagree with me, so there you go.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm not given to fanboyism or grandstanding about how this or that game is absolutely perfect and brilliant and genius and yadda, yadda, yadda. Those are words I prefer to avoid, and that is the exact kind of attitude I was criticizing when responding to the OP. No need to blow a game out of proportion; that leads to disappointment and unpleasant arguments upon release.
 

I definitely want MEA to be an awesome game. I just don't think it will be, and prefer to keep my expectations low. As I said, I wouldn't mind a pleasant surprise. I don't think it will be a bad game either, just... okay. Which isn't a terrible thing to be, I would think.

Good reply.

I've never played any of TW, so have no frame of reference for comparison there, less heresay.

I guess it reduces to one's level of optimism. Is the glass half full?

[78stonewobble]

Originality is a non-issue for me. I am well aware that true innovation in terms of storytelling is pretty much a lost cause. There's nothing new under the sun and all that.

 

Well, I got into these forums because I really like DAO, and because there really aren't all that many companies who focus on producing story-driven RPGs. And I usually buy only half a dozen games per year at the most, although financial issues play into that as well. And since I'm picky in my tastes, mostly sticking to RPGs and strategy games, neither of those genres being very popular, even just "okay" becomes reason enough to follow a series.

 

I mean, my standards for storytelling in video games are way lower than for other mediums. If ME was a book, a movie, or a TV show I doubt I would have even bothered with it and, even if I did, I would have dropped it pretty quickly. Truth be told, the same is true of even DAO, which I consider to be the best Bioware game I've played.

 

Oh, and I'm lazy. I'm used to this place, and moving elsewhere sounds like a lot of work 

 

Well, I were just curious.  

[78stonewobble]

I'm not sure it is a good idea for me to answer that question. In my experience, that tends to derail into arguments of the "but that game isn't as good as you say; this one's better!" type. Which can be enlightening and, I'll confess, even fun, but I'm not sure this thread would be the best place for it. But, against my best judgment, I will answer your question and hope we can all behave, myself included.

 

We're obviously talking RPGs, so I'll stick to that. A good game? DAO qualifies in my book. As for excellent, I'd nominate The Witcher series, especially the second one (I have yet to play the third one). But as anyone can see by going to the previous page, plenty of people around these parts disagree with me, so there you go.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not given to fanboyism or grandstanding about how this or that game is absolutely perfect and brilliant and genius and yadda, yadda, yadda. Those are words I prefer to avoid, and that is the exact kind of attitude I was criticizing when responding to the OP. No need to blow a game out of proportion; that leads to disappointment and unpleasant arguments upon release.

 

I definitely want MEA to be an awesome game. I just don't think it will be, and prefer to keep my expectations low. As I said, I wouldn't mind a pleasant surprise. I don't think it will be a bad game either, just... okay. Which isn't a terrible thing to be, I would think.

 

I rarely find a game "perfect" and I don't really think a game can be... But I think that some games can be brilliant in certain parts of it. Be it story, combat, gameplay, npc interactions, leveling, freedom or lack there of, setting, characters, attachment to characters and so on. 

 

And I totally agree that there are games that do alot of the "parts" better than the whole mass effect series, but in my oppinion and the reason I'm here, crossing my fingers for ME:A, is that I think the series did the combination of those parts, rather good. With especially high points in setting and attachment to characters. 

 

It's one of the few games that have managed to draw me and make me feel for the characters. There are many movies and books that don't even get that far with me.

 

But yeah... Hoping the best, fearing the mediocre or even worst. 

[JPVNG]

I' As for excellent, I'd nominate The Witcher series, especially the second one (I have yet to play the third one). 

 

I bought the Witcher from steam (the first) some months ago...returned it because the playability of the game was so bad but so bad i couldn't stand it. Asked for a refund.

With ME 1 although i had some trouble adapting to the shooting thing at first was completely different. Even today its a fun game to play.

That is why Mass Effect was good, it combined story with a very fair playability.

Because the game can even have a good story but if the mechanics are not ok and easy to adapt...it fails grabbing the players interest.

So i guess each one of us have a different interpretation of what excellent can be.

[Saladinbob1]

The Witcher 3 isn't without it's problems either though and suffers from an industry wide problem, one I really hope with the pushing back of the release date, Andromeda can avoid. That problem is basically developers biting off more than they can chew in the development time available to them. The Witcher 3 has unarguably the best writing during the first act of any video game ever released but it's widely regarded amongst its community that after that act, the writing simply falls off a cliff, with several characters being under developed.

 

Similarly ME3's ending smacked of Bioware simply running out of development time and rushing a half finished product out the door. Characters like Kai Leng where so underdeveloped that he in particular looked like he came straight out of a child's cartoon show. Hopefully it's a mistake they won't repeat with this game.