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Oh, I forgot, Liara can die during the final approach, all squad members can (like for her, that's the only opportunity for James to die). So the only LGBT character safe from death is Samantha. And if the Normandy crashes or the Reapers win, she dies too (just like Joker, the straight character, who has plot armour most of the time).
So the ME3 whining is unwarranted too. No one there is safe.
Oh, I forgot, Liara can die during the final approach, all squad members can (like for her, that's the only opportunity for James to die). So the only LGBT character safe from death is Samantha. And if the Normandy crashes or the Reapers win, she dies too (just like Joker, the straight character, who has plot armour most of the time).
So the ME3 whining is unwarranted too. No one there is safe.
noone was said that they could not die in the end, noone
especially hero in Me3 will die no matter what so it is not make sense to say about that some of them can die in the end while we die too
about deaths and bad endings it was about DA representation of some minor characters who have not have any bad stuff
in ME about Liara and Traynor and Cortez it was about Citadel Dlc and moments with them
and this disscution for few pages was about forced companion/advisors and representation of some characters as their ignoring of our decision and not have any bad ending
Just to give an opinion: I started another try to play ME3 again and right off the bat there is Ashley looking like a typical tranny - manface with boobs. I wasn't too happy with this just because of the visuals, so my answer to the question by which this thread goes is a "no".
To be honest, there are many transgenders you wouldn't even know are transgender.
They shouldn't. There a tons of people that don't even care about the game. They don't have anything to say about it except what characters have sex with who and what "parts" that character happens to have.
Do away with all this garbage so people can appreciate the video game part of this video game and not try to cure social injustice. All the hard work the dev does on every aspect of the game and 50% or more of the "fans" want to talk about gender identity or nothing.
To be honest, there are many transgenders you wouldn't even know are transgender.
even with asians you can
Reaction
Height
Figure-Complection
Hands-Fingers
Legs-Feet
Face proportions
Smell
Voice
Adam's apple
They shouldn't. There a tons of people that don't even care about the game. They don't have anything to say about it except what characters have sex with who and what "parts" that character happens to have.
Do away with all this garbage so people can appreciate the video game part of this video game and not try to cure social injustice. All the hard work the dev does on every aspect of the game and 50% or more of the "fans" want to talk about gender identity or nothing.
That's become EA though, for better or worse. They definitely want to cure the industry.
noone was said that they could not die in the end, noone especially hero in Me3 who will die no matter what
about deaths and bad endings it was about DA representation of some minor characters who have not have any bad stuff
in ME about Liara and Traynor and Cortez it was about Citadel Dlc and moments with them
and this disscution for few pages was about forced companion/advisors and representation of some characters as their ignoring of our decision and not have any bad ending
You yourself said
"it is not only about killing-diying in a bad endings but a bad ending option itself what should be a reason of our actions or our not doing something"
If you don't get the galactic readiness high enough, Liara and Samantha will die. Also, Shepard can survive in one ending.
This discussion seem to be about whatever you think you can defend in a given moment. No, only companions. No, only DAI/ME3 companions. No romances, no important characters. Now it's only about DA.
You just want to kill LGBT characters, no amount of backtracking and convoluted explanation will hide your true intentions.
To be honest, there are many transgenders you wouldn't even know are transgender.
The vast majority seems somewhat easily recognizable, if you look long enough or just listen to the voice. Then there is the issue of the aging, because for example, MTF trannies get manlier with time just because of the natural processes in their body of a man, which is probably why there is said to be a lot of suicides among them. Showing asian trannies is a bit like cheating, though, because asians have often softer facial structures and often no hair apparently.
The one in the second picture is pretty hot, sadly will probably look like a man in a decade or two. Third is a *very* typical asian tranny. The face of the first is just "wrong". Not ugly, just wrong in a certain way, hard to describe.
IMO it's a terrible can of worms to be opened in ME.
even with asians you can
Reaction
Height
Figure-Complection
Hands-Fingers
Legs-Feet
Face proportions
Smell
Voice
Adam's apple
Almost all of them can be changed, yes even Adam's apple and voice. Asians both males and females are pretty short, so I'm not sure if you could tell. Asians are usually smaller than other races, even their hand size, their face is also less edgy, even between males and females. I like to draw portraits, so I can usually tell these differences between gender and people. It's not about Asians, it was just some pictures I pull up, but a lot of the time, you can never really be able to tell.
The vast majority seems somewhat easily recognizable, if you look long enough or just listen to the voice. Then there is the issue of the aging, because for example, MTF trannies get manlier with time just because of the natural processes in their body of a man, which is probably why there is said to be a lot of suicides among them. Showing asian trannies is a bit like cheating, though, because asians have often softer facial structures and often no hair apparently.
The one in the second picture is pretty hot, sadly will probably look like a man in a decade or two. Third is a *very* typical asian tranny. The face of the first is just "wrong". Not ugly, just wrong in a certain way, hard to describe.
IMO it's a terrible can of worms to be opened in ME.
The first doesn't look no difference than this
The third one looks like this
One of them is a transgender, have fun guess which one.
I have friends that look like the third one and has a long face as well, yes, they were born as females. I also have friends who were born as women but look like men, they have androgynous face. Are they transsexuals for looking like men? Strictly speaking, Asians don't age until they hit 40-50, but at that age, most people would start to lose their look, male or female, it's not just about females or males. My point is basically about don't judge a book by its cover. It's ok if you don't like to date transsexual, but assuming how transgender has to look a certain way is not true.
...
The first doesn't look no difference than this
The third one looks like this
One of them is a transgender, have fun guess which one.
I have friends that look like the third one and has a long face as well, yes, they were born as females. I also have friends who were born as women but look like men, they have androgynous face. Are they transsexuals for looking like men? Strictly speaking, Asians don't age until they hit 40-50, but at that age, most people would start to lose their look, male or female, it's not just about females or males. My point is basically about don't judge a book by its cover. It's ok if you don't like to date transsexual, but assuming how transgender has to look a certain way is not true.
The one on the second picture looks like a singer from SNSD(Yoona?), so i guess she's a girl 
The first is too small and washed out to see anything.
You keep posting asians, which is basically cheating as i said. To me, the vast majority of trannies i ever saw on the internet or IRL(which is few, yet shockingly unpleasant because literally men with boobs) causes the Uncanny Valley effect. It seems wrong, sometimes very off-putting. And then there is always the funny issue when if there would indeed be a transgender character, but suddenly some feminist players would take offense because the character would in some way "misrepresent women" or some trannies would feel not icluded for some reason, maybe claiming the character was unrealistically pretty or whatever. The fur fans might get on the train and demand representation, too 
Really, i think it's a bad idea to stuff a game that is focussed around sci-fi, with gender issues of humans, in the future, where everyone can be whatever sex they want to, probably.
You yourself said
"it is not only about killing-diying in a bad endings but a bad ending option itself what should be a reason of our actions or our not doing something"
If you don't get the galactic readiness high enough, Liara and Samantha will die. Also, Shepard can survive in one ending.
This discussion seem to be about whatever you think you can defend in a given moment. No, only companions. No, only DAI/ME3 companions. No romances, no important characters. Now it's only about DA.
You just want to kill LGBT characters, no amount of backtracking and convoluted explanation will hide your true intentions.
And where i was said that about ME3 heroes cant die in the end, nowhere
Do not make from my words more than i was said, and especially what i was not do
those was for any game where we could do a decidion and it was make sense, mostly DAO and ME2
facepalm
And how Branka, Isabella who i was send with Tome, Meriil, Anders, Caladrius, Danarius(most funny is how i was even ask on BSN to have him or Caladrius and not Dorian or Maevarjs), Brialla(ok you can not count her cos i not like her and would rather have any city elf who was not sleep with those who kill your parents and peoples) was alive in my canon if they are lgbt characters,
the only characters from all what i was killed and happened to be Lgbt characters was
DAO-Zevran(with other antivan crows), Lelianna(with Marjo and Orlais bards)
DA2- Fenris(actually i send him to Danarius)
DAI- Celine, Florianne?
Me1-Kaiden/Ashley, liara mother=)
Me2-Morinth, not run to save Kelly(i never romance her but she was best secretary than useless and impudent traynor) with Cerberous/Alliance guys?
Me3- Kaiden/Ashley, Legion?
maybe you kinda missed other things and real reasons why i kill or make worst life condition to some characters, or groups in DA or ME universe
In ME i actually not like mostly only Asari(exept Samara) and Alliance/Cerberous Humans
Just let the lovers at the end have a hug and look in each others' eyes with a smile filled with friendship and joy for their accomplishments. Let their conversation include some teasing about what they have gone through. Keep it simple: Push the close friendship story and keep the anatomy out of the game. Andromeda does not have to include all sexuality types, and people should not take such offense if their sexuality interests are not represented. This discussion is plainly ridiculous.
Only if they're fully fleshed out characters and not just billboards with big, bright letters saying "I'M TRANS!" like Krem in DAI. Krem was clearly BioWare/the DA team just being inclusive for the sake of being inclusive after embarrassing themselves with the trans elf prostitute in DA2.
I'm going to be the contrarian here and say by merely having a transgender character in the game, you can't really pull it off without doing exactly as Killroy described. This is what happened with Krem. First moment we're talking about Iron Bull's pectorals, the next moment I'm....asking Krem if she's a man or a woman? The hell?
Think about it. How would a transgender character be in a game without it coming across as a complete blindside during the romance or....having it define their character utterly? The former would just enrage would-be romanticizers. The latter is basically a matter of course because the entire character's existence is based on their gender identity.
How would you let people know a character is transgender in the game?
Pathfinder: "Oh, here's a new party member! Neat"
Transgender Party member: "Yes, I am glad to be part of this team. I'm transgender by the way."
Pathfinder: Well...okay, but I didn't really....ask you about.... that really has no relevance to us trying to fight our way out of this crossfire on Planet I Don't Give a Rat's Ass!
The character would be a walking non sequiter! For the record, I do not condone having a transgender in the game. It would just open the biggest can of worms. That is just how I feel about it.
The one on the second picture looks like a singer from SNSD(Yoona?), so i guess she's a girl
You keep posting asians, which is basically cheating as i said. To me, the vast majority of trannies i ever saw on the internet or IRL(which is few, yet shockingly unpleasant because literally men with boobs) causes the Uncanny Valley effect. It seems wrong, sometimes very off-putting. And then there is always the funny issue when if there would indeed be a transgender character, but suddenly some feminist players would take offense because the character would in some way "misrepresent women" or some trannies would feel not icluded for some reason, maybe claiming the character was unrealistically pretty or whatever. The fur fans might get on the train and demand representation, too
Really, i think it's a bad idea to stuff a game that is focussed around sci-fi, with gender issues of humans, in the future, where everyone can be whatever sex they want to, probably.
Compared it to female supermodel Gisele who has a way "harder" face than the one above.
There are non-Asian transgender women who are very attractive as well. It was just using Asians the second time to make the comparison to the first.
Are you talking about people would be offended if the transgender female characters look female instead of like male or something? That would be a ridiculous complaining about people would complain no matter what. Anyway, I have no problem with people don't want to romance a transgender person. That's perfectly understandable. I just don't agree that transgender have to look a certain ways. As you said, the majority of people don't look like those Asian transgender women I posted, but the majority of people also don't look like John Shepard, Kaidan, Miranda. It's all about wish fulfillment and characters in fiction are automatically attractive.
I'm not transgender nor claim to understand it in place of those who do and such, however, I came across this whilist reading something or the other and found it topical. I'm just copy-pasting wikipedia on "soulmate," so here is my wikipedia cite
"In his dialogue The Symposium, Plato has Aristophanes present a story about soulmates. Aristophanes states that humans originally had four arms, four legs, and a single head made of two faces. He continues that there were three genders: man, woman and the "Androgynous". Each with two sets of genitalia with the Androgynous having both male and female genitalia. The men were children of the sun, the women were children of the earth and the Androgynous were children of the moon, which was born of the sun and earth. It is said that humans had great strength at the time and threatened to conquer the gods. The gods were then faced with the prospect of destroying the humans with lightning as they had done with the Titans but then they would lose the tributes given to the gods by humans. Zeus developed a creative solution by splitting humans in half as punishment for humanity's pride and doubling the number of humans who would give tribute to the gods. These split humans were in utter misery to the point where they would not eat and would perish so Apollo had sewn them up and reconstituted their bodies with the navel being the only remnant harkening back to their original form. Each human would then only have one set of genitalia and would forever long for his/her other half; the other half of his/her soul. It is said that when the two find each other, there is an unspoken understanding of one another, that they feel unified and would lie with each other in unity and would know no greater joy than that.[3]"
I'm not transgender nor claim to understand it in place of those who do and such, however, I came across this whilist reading something or the other and found it topical. I'm just copy-pasting wikipedia on "soulmate s
So.
Using just, whatever I feel like, my sense is that older religions/perspectives essentially viewed the "male-female" divide as actually a malicious burden. The popular idea of a "soul mate" is actually a wedge designed to caused strife, since people, as they do now, essentialy rove around the universe thinking they need to complete themselves with someone or the other, with benefits accuring to a kind of "god" (or perhaps upper echelon of society) that profited from the fact that people wouldn't unite against them, or something along those lines.
Obviously, I'm not taking these things literally, but rather, the notion that the powerful beings were a combination of what Western society would later literally divide into "masculine" and/or "feminine" characteristics, and that it has profited off the notion that people must always be searching for the soul mate which has divided them.
So, I took transgenderism on some level to be an assertion that these philosophies of division and strife are basically crap (and I guess Plato might agree?), and a re-assertion of the "Androgynous," and that harsh abstract gender divisions are a limitation arbitrarily imposed during various periods of history, not least of which by the more recent Greek Pantheon (Zeus) who always seemed more jerkish than even just the earlier versions at any rate (Kronos, etc)
I don't as I say take everything super literally, 4 arms etc, or read too much into which person has what genitalia, but I can just for instance easily see people who are all male or all female physically also sharing what "Western civliizations " rather arbitrarily and artificially termed feminine or masculine characteristics, respectively, and bumping up against this norm of division, but since you can trace back that to an artificial division in the first place, you might as well just ignore it for the most part.
Me2-Morinth, not run to save Kelly(i never romance her but she was best secretary than useless and impudent traynor) with Cerberous/Alliance guys?
I don't want to dismiss Kelly, she was fine as the psicotherapist of my crew but... Traynor was an expert in telecommunications, she warned Shepard about Grissom Academy's abductions, she found the rogue Cerberus scientists, she EVEN found Cerberus location for frak's sake... and she beat Shepard at chess. So... why exactly you think she is useless? 
and impudent? what impudent means by the way? She takes a shower WITH HER UNDERWEAR ON!
Bonus track:
I'm going to be the contrarian here and say by merely having a transgender character in the game, you can't really pull it off without doing exactly as Killroy described. This is what happened with Krem. First moment we're talking about Iron Bull's pectorals, the next moment I'm....asking Krem if she's a man or a woman? The hell?
Krem - like the rest of the Chargers - isn't meant to be a standalone character. His entire role is to be part of the backdrop characterization of the IB. There is something to take issue with - essentially characters whose entire existence is just to provide a thematic backdrop to another character - but that actually has nothing to do with the gender identity.
I'm going to be the contrarian here and say by merely having a transgender character in the game, you can't really pull it off without doing exactly as Killroy described. This is what happened with Krem. First moment we're talking about Iron Bull's pectorals, the next moment I'm....asking Krem if she's a man or a woman? The hell?
Think about it. How would a transgender character be in a game without it coming across as a complete blindside during the romance or....having it define their character utterly? The former would just enrage would-be romanticizers. The latter is basically a matter of course because the entire character's existence is based on their gender identity.
How would you let people know a character is transgender in the game?
Pathfinder: "Oh, here's a new party member! Neat"
Transgender Party member: "Yes, I am glad to be part of this team. I'm transgender by the way."
Pathfinder: Well...okay, but I didn't really....ask you about.... that really has no relevance to us trying to fight our way out of this crossfire on Planet I Don't Give a Rat's Ass!
The character would be a walking non sequiter! For the record, I do not condone having a transgender in the game. It would just open the biggest can of worms. That is just how I feel about it.
I'll repeat the point I made a couple pages back; there's no need to have a trans character solely revolve around the fact that they're trans.
The segue into Krem's transness was definitely ham-handed; The Iron Bull has a tummy, definitely, but not enough going on in the pectoral area to warrant any comment about binding, and it's not tied very well to the preceding commentary so it feels like it comes out of nowhere. In broader terms, though, that's how you introduce a character's trans quality without making it the only point to focus on - people talk about themselves, or relate certain subjects back to themselves, all the time, regardless of gender, orientation, or anything else. At the moment, in North America definitely and I'm sure elsewhere, it's very common for trans people to self-censor anecdotes, or reframe them so they seem 'normal' when they're relayed, but there's no particular reason for that to be the case in the ME future.
Have a doctor or field medic who got into medicine because he appreciated skills of those who performed the gene therapy and modifications that allowed him to transition, and wants to be able to help others the way he was helped. Have a crew member who exchanges stories about her childhood casually mention something that happened when she was a little boy. Have a squaddie who offers a more nuanced interpretation of an alien species' gender expressions when the PC is interacting with them, because they're also intimately familiar with identifying outside a gender binary.
You can, of course, get into the more intrusive questions (Did you always know? Doesn't it bother you that she's a woman?), but there's really no need to. It doesn't need to be a PSA, but it doesn't have to be completely ignored, either. Even more heavy-handed info dumps can work out for certain characters, granting insight but not completely defining them. Joker's character was definitely shaped by his disability but it wasn't the only thing going on for him, even in the first game.
BioWare does have a tough time letting things play out more casually sometimes; the writers do seem to like their exposition and codex-entry conversations (I really didn't need to know that much about asari mating practices, Liara). And I guarantee that scenarios similar to the ones above would get some players pointing out the 'error' in dialogue (That one chick said something about growing up as a boy! Didn't the QA testers catch that?). Those aren't reasons not to try, though. It's usually only by trying and screwing up that we get better at doing stuff.
Alright, I think the conversation has been had. We're just starting to argue a variety of points not really related to the question, and it's getting a little salty in spots. It's really not going to get any more constructive from here.
As always, thanks for sharing your opinions and insights on the topic. This type of discussion is beneficial not only to development, but also to many of us reading and taking part. Keep being you, Biowarians BioWare Forumites you.
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