10 réponses à ce sujet

[UpUpAway95]

I'm looking to start a new playthrough of ME3 with a ME2 Shepard who is romancing Tali.  I am also toying with changing his class and am curious what you might consider to be the most compatible class of Shepard to go with Tali on most missions and particularly on the last mission on Earth.  I would also be thankful for some build suggestions for Shepard and Tali to make them most effective together.  I am planning to play on Insanity difficulty.

 

(Sorry, I can't post this in a more specific section since it is my son who purchased the game and he already has the membership to this site attached to his profile... which apparently restricts me to posting in the General Discussion sections only)

[Taki17]

Shepard: probably a soldier, as you need someone to complement Tali's fragileness as she is mainly in support role in combat. If Shepard is the main tank and gunman in the group, he'll need to be durable and deal a lot of damage with guns.

 

For durability, level up Fitness to increase shield recharge and health.

 

For weapon damage, level up Combat Mastery to increase weapon damage. There is one upgrade (squadmate weapon damage vs headshot damage), I'd say take headshot damage as most of your party members will be using their abilities more anyway, but if you are not good with headshots, the squadmate weapon damage is worth considering. Whatever floats your boat

 

Frag grenade is a powerful ability, level it up at least to level 3, then it's your choice - go for damage or radius (I prefer radius), pick capacity upgrade, and choose shield overload only if you are not planning to take Energy Drain as a bonus power, as a soldier lacks effective anti-shield ablities.

 

Concussive shot is another really useful ability, as it can detonate combos primed by other characters. Be sure to pick its AOE upgrade, works wonders on canon fodder enemies.

 

Adrenaline rush is only worth considering if you are using mainly full automatic weapons or snipers. It has a nice upgrade that grants you briefly high damage resistance.

 

As for the ammo powers, use them as you see fit, it might be worth investing a few points in each type of ammo. Incinedary and Disruptor are nice as they provide anti-armor and shield cabalities, but other abilites do them better.

 

For equipment, I'd say take a full auto assault rifle (Avenger, Lancer, etc.), a heavy pistol like the Carnifex and a shotgun that deals good damage (Eviscerator).

 

Tali: she's going to be combat support, so build her accordingly.

 

Her unique ability, Quarian Engineer gives her better recharge times and stonger powers, be sure to choose those upgrades.

 

One of the best powers she has is Energy Drain, that can deplete enemy shields, detonate tech combos and refill her own shields in the process. When upgrading, choose upgrades that add radius.

 

Combat Drone can be a useful ally on the battlefield, as it can distract enemies, setting them up for a nice AOE attack, but it is rarely worth upgrading past level 3, as it is quicker to spawn a new drone than keep the old alive. Plus, it deals little damage.

 

Defense Drone is pretty useless, unless upgraded to level 6, where it can knock down enemies with a 30% chance that approach Tali, which might help keeping her alive.

 

Sabotage is only really useful during the Quarian-Geth story arc, but you might consider keeping it as it can help against Cerberus turrets. In that case, level 3 should be enough for everything.

 

As party members are not affected by weapon weight, give her the biggest, meanest heavy pistol you can find (Carnifex should be good) and a powerful shotgun that is not the big, powerful, single shot krogan shotgun which's name I've forgotten (the one Grunt used in ME2).

 

With this setup, Shepard can prime targets with incinedary ammo which Tali can detonate with energy drain.

[General TSAR]

As party members are not affected by weapon weight, give her the biggest, meanest heavy pistol you can find (Carnifex should be good) and a powerful shotgun that is not the big, powerful, single shot krogan shotgun which's name I've forgotten (the one Grunt used in ME2).

Claymore.

 

But agreed, don't give her the BFG that only holds a round. Instead, give her the Geth Plasma shotgun.

[UpUpAway95]

Thanks guys!... will keep him as a soldier then (which is what he was in ME2).

[Quarian Master Race]

Soldier should work fine. I take Tali as a squadmate most of the time after I get her in ME3. She works best with classes that she can combo off of, and who can take advantage of the Tech Vulnerability spec in Sabotage with Fire Explosions and Tech Bursts( Sabotage is one of the most broken abilities in SP with its 100% damage increase to tech powers and combos), so generally Engineer, Infiltrator, Soldier, and somewhat Sentinel. She can detonate Soldier's ammo powers (and concussive shot, with the proper spec) on shields or synthetics, and you can detonate her Energy Drain (which has a fast cooldown for a squadmate ability) and Sabotage (the most powerful tech combo in the game) on all defense types with your Concussive Shot and Grenades for tech bursts, which decimate groups of mook level units over a wide AOE. The former ability gives Tali shields and Damage Reduction to help her surviviablity to boot. My playstyle generally keeps Energy Drain as her hotkeyed ability (against Reapers it's switched to Sabotage). I spam it (preferably at shieded enemies) everytime it's off cooldown and then detonate it with either Shepard's combat/tech powers or a squadmates. It has a significantly shorter cooldown than the Overload used by other tech squadmates, meaning you can get more tech bursts over a shorter period of time.

She has poor synergy with adepts, vanguards and biotic focussed teammates ( for max effectiveness your 3rd squadmate should be someone like Garrus, Ashley or EDI). Best build is to max her passives (focus on power recharge speed, but ignore the drone cooldown spec as you'll rarely use them anyway), Energy drain (give her the 40% DR spec at rank 6 to make her a shotgun toting mini-tank), and Sabotage (always take Tech Vulnerability, as it is highly useful vs all factions, not just geth). Combat Drone got a severe nerf from ME2 and is only situationally useful. Defense Drone is almost pointless with how the AI is programmed to just find hardcover and sit in it.

For weapons, the Wraith with Smart Choke is unquestionably best for any shotgun equipped squadmate, because they can't reload cancel the Claymore (though it's still reasonably effective),their AI derps around with the Crusader (only fires one shot before ducking back into cover for a very long time like a sniper rifle), and charge weapons like Graal/GPS (they constantly miss due to projectile travel time, and never use charge shots properly). They generally don't get close enough to effectively use the Raider, Piranha or Reegar even with the Smart choke on the former two. Don't equip her pistol in combat, because squadmates are garbage with most of the best ones (Arc Pistol, Talon, Suppressor, Paladin). Always equip Smart Choke mod, as otherwise shotty squadmates tend not to get close enough to do much damage.

As for Armor, the best one is the second set (dark blue/black and gold one) that gives her 25% faster power recharge. The From Ashes set can be useful against Reapers where she may be relying on her weapon more due to the lack of Shields. I wouldn't use the default set, as she has no powers that do high direct (i.e. non combo based) damage, so it provides little benefit.

[UpUpAway95]

Soldier should work fine. I take Tali as a squadmate most of the time after I get her in ME3. She works best with classes that she can combo off of, and who can take advantage of the Tech Vulnerability spec in Sabotage with Fire Explosions and Tech Bursts( Sabotage is one of the most broken abilities in SP with its 100% damage increase to tech powers and combos), so generally Engineer, Infiltrator, Soldier, and somewhat Sentinel. She can detonate Soldier's ammo powers (and concussive shot, with the proper spec) on shields or synthetics, and you can detonate her Energy Drain (which has a fast cooldown for a squadmate ability) and Sabotage (the most powerful tech combo in the game) on all defense types with your Concussive Shot and Grenades for tech bursts, which decimate groups of mook level units over a wide AOE. The former ability gives Tali shields and Damage Reduction to help her surviviablity to boot. My playstyle generally keeps Energy Drain as her hotkeyed ability (against Reapers it's switched to Sabotage). I spam it (preferably at shieded enemies) everytime it's off cooldown and then detonate it with either Shepard's combat/tech powers or a squadmates. It has a significantly shorter cooldown than the Overload used by other tech squadmates, meaning you can get more tech bursts over a shorter period of time.

She has poor synergy with adepts, vanguards and biotic focussed teammates ( for max effectiveness your 3rd squadmate should be someone like Garrus, Ashley or EDI). Best build is to max her passives (focus on power recharge speed, but ignore the drone cooldown spec as you'll rarely use them anyway), Energy drain (give her the 40% DR spec at rank 6 to make her a shotgun toting mini-tank), and Sabotage (always take Tech Vulnerability, as it is highly useful vs all factions, not just geth). Combat Drone got a severe nerf from ME2 and is only situationally useful. Defense Drone is almost pointless with how the AI is programmed to just find hardcover and sit in it.

For weapons, the Wraith with Smart Choke is unquestionably best for any shotgun equipped squadmate, because they can't reload cancel the Claymore (though it's still reasonably effective),their AI derps around with the Crusader (only fires one shot before ducking back into cover for a very long time like a sniper rifle), and charge weapons like Graal/GPS (they constantly miss due to projectile travel time, and never use charge shots properly). They generally don't get close enough to use the Raider, Piranha or Reegar even with the Smart choke on the former two. Don't equip her pistol, squadmates are garbage with most of the best ones (Arc Pistol, Talon, Suppressor, Paladin).

As for Armor, the best one is the second set (dark blue/black and gold one) that gives her 25% faster power recharge. The From Ashes set can be useful against Reapers where she may be relying on her weapon more due to the lack of Shields. I wouldn't use the default set, as she has no powers that do high direct (i.e. non combo) damage, so it provides little benefit.

 

Thank you for the detailed post... it should really help me a lot.  The battle I'm most concerned about getting through (when I do get that far along) is the one with all the banshees at the very end.  I generally can't seem to get banshee barriers to come down fast enough with a tech-based squad and I usually wind up getting mauled by them... and with romancing Tali, I will want to have her along for that last battle.  I strongly suspect it's something to do with setting up tech bursts that I'm just not getting right when a barrier is involved.  Any additional hints?  Thanks again QMR!

[Quarian Master Race]

Thank you for the detailed post... it should really help me a lot.  The battle I'm most concerned about getting through (when I do get that far along) is the one with all the banshees at the very end.  I generally can't seem to get banshee barriers to come down fast enough with a tech-based squad and I usually wind up getting mauled by them... and with romancing Tali, I will want to have her along for that last battle.  I strongly suspect it's something to do with setting up tech bursts that I'm just not getting right when a barrier is involved.  Any additional hints?  Thanks again QMR!

The best way to take down banshee barriers with Tali in the squad is to combo Tech Bursts off of her Sabotage. Tech Bursts already have an inherent 2x damage multiplier vs Shields and Barriers, and Sabotage with the proper rank 6 spec will increase that damage by another 100%. The Tech Vulnerabilty effect lasts for all tech powers/combos within 10 seconds too, and since unlike biotic explosions Tech bursts have no cooldowns, you can just keep repriming and detonating them over and over in a very short period. This is easy to do by priming with the Soldier's Disruptor Ammo and concussive shot/grenades (though due note that ammo based combos aren't quite as strong as rank 6+6 primer-detonator power based ones). Bringing Garrus/EDI/Kaidan (overload), or Ashley (also disruptor ammo/ amplified concussive shot) gives you another source of primers and detonators. 

Another thing of note is that the element of Sabotage that primes for its own tech bursts is actually the "backfire" effect, which takes place 1.5 seconds after the power hits. Tech Vulnerability for all other tech powers, on the other hand, applies immediately upon cast.

In my experience on Insanity, Banshee barriers only last a couple seconds under such an onslaught. They should quite soon stop warping at that point and go into their ranged attack mode where they throw warps. At this point, they'll block powers directly targeted at them by Shepard with their Hand of Denial, so use only squadmate powers, indirectly target her with grenades (i.e. make sure the red targeting box isn't on her and use the AOE to hit her) and order your squadmates to attack whichever one you are focus firing on (ordering them to attack a specific target increases their weapon damage by 200% IIRC). There's also a Hydra Missile launcher in the room in the back left corner of the area, that is generally good for dealing with most of the armor/health of one Banshee (difficulty dependant) provided you get most of the projectiles to hit her.

Another tactic: if the weapon you are carrying has around a combined 1.5m of cover piercing distance (from innate piercing like on the Widow, Black Widow, Javelin, Crusader, Amour Piercing Ammo, Piercing mods, High Velocity Barrels etc), you can take advantage of a bug vs the Banshee to get double hits with each shot and thus do much more damage. This happens when she brings up the Hand of Denial, and you shoot at her midsection, doing damage when you hit the power blocking "bubble" and also the banshee herself. This takes them down extremely fast with a powerful weapon once the Barrier is down. 

Also, don't be afraid to kite. If the Banshees are overrunning you, fall back, circle the map and continue to damage them until they stop teleporting. Unfortunately, squadmate AI isn't that great at avoiding them, so either order them to move to a different position before the banshee gets near or bring lots of medigel (as far as I can remember squadmates are merely incapacitated by her grab, not killed, and can be immediately revived).

As soon as the missiles are ready, you should be activating Adrenaline Rush (for the movement speed and shields/damage reduction) and making a beeline for the console. Enemies spawn indefinitely until you do, so there's no real point in continuing to fight them unless they're in your way (Marauders are actually the greater threat at this point than the Banshees).

[UpUpAway95]

The best way to take down banshee barriers with Tali in the squad is to combo Tech Bursts off of her Sabotage. Tech Bursts already have an inherent 2x damage multiplier vs Shields and Barriers, and Sabotage with the proper rank 6 spec will increase that damage by another 100%. The Tech Vulnerabilty effect lasts for all tech powers/combos within 10 seconds too, and since unlike biotic explosions Tech bursts have no cooldowns, you can just keep repriming and detonating them over and over in a very short period. This is easy to do by priming with the Soldier's Disruptor Ammo and concussive shot/grenades (though due note that ammo based combos aren't quite as strong as rank 6+6 primer-detonator power based ones). Bringing Garrus/EDI/Kaidan (overload), or Ashley (also disruptor ammo/ amplified concussive shot) gives you another source of primers and detonators. 

Another thing of note is that the element of Sabotage that primes for its own tech bursts is actually the "backfire" effect, which takes place 1.5 seconds after the power hits. Tech Vulnerability for all other tech powers, on the other hand, applies immediately upon cast.

In my experience on Insanity, Banshee barriers only last a couple seconds under such an onslaught. They should quite soon stop warping at that point and go into their ranged attack mode where they throw warps. At this point, they'll block powers directly targeted at them by Shepard with their Hand of Denial, so use only squadmate powers, indirectly target her with grenades (i.e. make sure the red targeting box isn't on her and use the AOE to hit her) and order your squadmates to attack whichever one you are focus firing on (ordering them to attack a specific target increases their weapon damage by 200% IIRC). There's also a Hydra Missile launcher in the room in the back left corner of the area, that is generally good for dealing with most of the armor/health of one Banshee (difficulty dependant) provided you get most of the projectiles to hit her.

Another tactic: if the weapon you are carrying has around a combined 1.5m of cover piercing distance (from innate piercing like on the Widow, Black Widow, Javelin, Crusader, Amour Piercing Ammo, Piercing mods, High Velocity Barrels etc), you can take advantage of a bug vs the Banshee to get double hits with each shot and thus do much more damage. This happens when she brings up the Hand of Denial, and you shoot at her midsection, doing damage when you hit the power blocking "bubble" and also the banshee herself. This takes them down extremely fast with a powerful weapon once the Barrier is down. 

Also, don't be afraid to kite. If the Banshees are overrunning you, fall back, circle the map and continue to damage them until they stop teleporting. Unfortunately, squadmate AI isn't that great at avoiding them, so either order them to move to a different position before the banshee gets near or bring lots of medigel (as far as I can remember squadmates are merely incapacitated by her grab, not killed, and can be immediately revived).

As soon as the missiles are ready, you should be activating Adrenaline Rush (for the movement speed and shields/damage reduction) and making a beeline for the console. Enemies spawn indefinitely until you do, so there's no real point in continuing to fight them unless they're in your way (Marauders are actually the greater threat at this point than the Banshees).

 

Thank you!  This is going to be really helpful for all my playthroughs... not just this one with Tali.  I've never really considered that there were differences in banshee vulnerability during different phases of their attacks.  There is still just so much for me to learn about this game.

[DuskWanderer]

Tali is generally very good against synthetic-type enemies, and her shield drain power can be comboed with the right skills. Her drones can be useful in distracting foes. On Insanity, I find getting an enemy focused somewhere else for a second really gives you an advantage.

 

The skills mentioned in these posts are fine. If I may, though, Kaidan is a good choice to take with Tali (spec him for tech bursts), as is EDI. 

[Quibii]

I'm still dusting off my Mass Effect knowledge, so apologies in advance if something is suboptimal or incorrect. 

I'd agree with most people on their reasonings for playing as a Soldier. It might also be worth mentioning that Sentinel could also be worthwhile. Tech Armor provides a similar degree of bulkiness to the Soldier, and unlike the Soldier, the Sentinel can keep it on permanently. It might not work out so well in ME2 (Would probably need someone like Grunt, Zaeed, Jack, ect to make up for the high focus on tech and lack of a real "tank",) however once you hit ME3 it might not be so bad. Another reason I bring up the Sentinel is because of the possible potential for easier tech explosions. I'm not sure how vital or useless or what have you they are on Insanity, but a Sentinel coupled with Tali could make them much easier. Then you have Warp for the armored opponents, Overload/Energy Drain for shields and barriers, and the rest is relatively straightforward. 

Once again, the Tech Armor keeps your squad from being completely glass-cannon, and the little dash of biotics means you can be just that little bit more flexible with your second squad member. 

[TheN7Penguin]

Engineer...

 

Many booms happen. Also fits well with Tali romance because, you know, they can discuss the inner workings of the ships together (although that literally never happens, they CAN).