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[Qun00]

I must emphasize that I'm not asking whether it would be right, but if it is actually possible.

Do you believe that a hundred years from now, Andrastians will still speak of the time when the Maker showed mankind favor once more and had Andraste deliver his champion from death? Or will it be dismissed as a mistake?

While I'm at it, I'd like to know if you guys think the game did a good job at keeping it ambiguous or if the revelation at the Fade is unrefutable proof that it was wrong from the beginning.

[Gervaise]

It may depend on how you conducted yourself as the Herald, whether you acknowledged it and what action you took at the Exalted Council.    Also, if the world is still around in its present state in a hundred years.     Assuming that the crisis with Solas was overcome, then likely the Herald of Andraste will pass into folklore and be adopted by the Chantry.   After all there was a big hole in the sky that needed fixing and a nasty Ancient Magister was responsible.   Remember, also, that after you return from the Fade, everyone keeps telling you to keep quiet about the truth and let people continue to believe as before.  

 

So the story will probably end up with Andraste bestowing her favour on a human Herald, them using this to defeat the enemy, after which the Maker took back his gift (hence the loss of the arm) to indicate to the Herald that their task was done.     All praise the Maker for saving us! 

[Dai Grepher]

Nope. People will forget. They forgot by the time Trespasser took place.

[IllustriousT]

It is probable that the role of the Inquisitor, that is, the actual title, will be personified by ideals, dogmatic actions, and tales that the Chantry deems to be the most valuable and beneficial to their belief system.

 

The Inquisitor, Our Inquisitor, has no value.

 

Corypheus was defeated, the Breach is closed are the only important aspects of their time in that role. All other actions or inaction become irrelevant, lost in time. Left only by a shell of idolatry for the sake of Chantry growth in power. 

 

Andraste and Shartan are existing historical figures that deliver good testimony to how this will most likely turn out in the future. 

[Reznore57]

I think Divine Victoria got a new verse , so I'd say to put things in context the Herald will get something as well.

[Mistic]

It could happen, but only as long as it fits Chantry dogma. The idea that the absent Maker suddenly stopped being so absent to help Thedas goes against some basic Andrastian tenets. However, dogma can evolve too and even bend to adopt popular beliefs. For example, the insistence of them being "the Herald of Andraste" and not "the Herald of the Maker" would allow for some non-divine intercession: the technicality that it wasn't the Maker himself who did it, but Andraste. Not unlike the Visitations dogma in Tevinter.

 

In any case, it has to be an adoption that must be possible with either Divine. Justifying it with Leliana the Heterodox is easy, but not so much when Cassandra or Vivienne are in charge.

 

What I find very sure is that, if the event is remembered by the next generations, the Chantry will insist that the Inquisitor was a devout Andrastian even if the real Inquisitor was the most pagan or atheistic person in the world. Or even if they acknowledge that, they'll say that they converted before they died.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

Sure, if your "Herald" was a human Andrastian and, not a mage. Otherwise, nope - it will be expunged just as Shartan was.

[Iakus]

I think the Herald will be remembered. 

 

Possibly not exactly as he or she was, like Ameridan.  But remembered in some fashion.

[Dai Grepher]

It could happen, but only as long as it fits Chantry dogma. The idea that the absent Maker suddenly stopped being so absent to help Thedas goes against some basic Andrastian tenets. However, dogma can evolve too and even bend to adopt popular beliefs. For example, the insistence of them being "the Herald of Andraste" and not "the Herald of the Maker" would allow for some non-divine intercession: the technicality that it wasn't the Maker himself who did it, but Andraste. Not unlike the Visitations dogma in Tevinter.

I don't think it will come down to that. Some Inquisitors can have Josephine tell the truth about the Spirit in the Fade that was imitating Divine Justinia. So I think it will be based more on the faith of those who served the Inquisition, not the Inquisitor's faith, unless he was Andrastian.

In any case, it has to be an adoption that must be possible with either Divine. Justifying it with Leliana the Heterodox is easy, but not so much when Cassandra or Vivienne are in charge.

I think it's easy for both of them. Cassandra genuinely believes the Maker sent the Herald, and Vivienne may want to use it as propaganda regardless of what she believes.

What I find very sure is that, if the event is remembered by the next generations, the Chantry will insist that the Inquisitor was a devout Andrastian even if the real Inquisitor was the most pagan or atheistic person in the world. Or even if they acknowledge that, they'll say that they converted before they died.

Maybe, if they rewrite history, which I think would be a little more difficult with various nations all having their own accounts of what was said and done by the Inquisitor.

[straykat]

Probably.

 

And they'll look like the game cover on paintings.

[Mistic]

I don't think it will come down to that. Some Inquisitors can have Josephine tell the truth about the Spirit in the Fade that was imitating Divine Justinia. So I think it will be based more on the faith of those who served the Inquisition, not the Inquisitor's faith, unless he was Andrastian.

 

Exactly. The Inquisitor can reveal for anyone that wants to hear it that it was Divine Justinia who helped them. However, the rest still call them "Herald of Andraste". Mother Giselle even tries to justify it with symbolism. Never mind that the reason people called the Inquisitor "Herald of Andraste" for the first time was precisely because of that female figure. An obvious case of moving the goalposts.

 

Regardless, although the truth makes things easier for the Chantry (Josephine does say that telling the real story will placate them), Qun00's question was about "the Herald of Andraste" becoming a part of the Chantry's beliefs. That moniker still requires some tweaking to be acceptable by Chantry dogma.

 

I think it's easy for both of them. Cassandra genuinely believes the Maker sent the Herald, and Vivienne may want to use it as propaganda regardless of what she believes.

 

True, I didn't see it from that point of view. Especially in Vivienne's case, it's something I didn't even consider. Easier for Bioware to justify it, then.

 

Maybe, if they rewrite history, which I think would be a little more difficult with various nations all having their own accounts of what was said and done by the Inquisitor.

 

Indeed, but bear in mind that the Inquisitor was active especially in Orlais and Ferelden, heavily Southern Chantry territories. It's not as if there was reason to suspect no one wrote about Ameridan in his time (leader of the Inquisition, emperor Drakon's BFF, supporter of the Nevarran Accords) , and yet they managed to erase his magic, his special understanding of Andrastianism, him being an elf, his lover and even his lineage, to the point an Orlesian family claims to be descended from him. But maybe that was an extreme case.

 

However, erasing the Inquisitor's beliefs? Very, very easy. Not only we have real-world forgeries in that sense, but we see it happen in-game: no matter your PC's beliefs, everyone around them will insist they're the Herald of Andraste. Even after Adamant. And they're their people, some of them good friends, and they can witness everything the Inquisitor witnesses. If they can't stop interpreting the events according to their faith, what won't Chantry scholars do centuries later?

[straykat]

Despite the wonkiness, the title is actually seeming kind of appropriate in some cases. Especially with Solas now. You're like a loose cog screwing over gods and ancient evil plans. The last person who might've provided an "alternative" on this scale was Andraste herself. It's either crazy fortune or you really are Andraste's herald. And it's totally outside of Flemeth's scheming too, unlike Warden/Hawke.

[Reofeir]

Didn't Varric say something to that effect, stray? Just by the Inquisitor's actions and somehow survival of every single big event makes it seem like someone is guiding us. On how we'll be remembered I think most of us agree that it will be changed to fit the Chantry's view. Ameridan was "remembered", but only the bits they wanted to. Him being an elf and an mage simply vanished.

 

The events in DA4 will tell us exactly what will be written down in history, since Ameridan was forgotten after the war with the elves and the second blight causing chaos, but the story of our inquisitor will be remembered by only close friends. 

[straykat]

Didn't Varric say something to that effect, stray? Just by the Inquisitor's actions and somehow survival of every single big event makes it seem like someone is guiding us. On how we'll be remembered I think most of us agree that it will be changed to fit the Chantry's view. Ameridan was "remembered", but only the bits they wanted to. Him being an elf and an mage simply vanished.

 

The events in DA4 will tell us exactly what will be written down in history, since Ameridan was forgotten after the war with the elves and the second blight causing chaos, but the story of our inquisitor will be remembered by only close friends. 

 

One thing I like though is our "Herald" can change those as well... especially Divine Leli and the Shartan stuff. But I'm sure she'd make room for Ameridan too. So in effect, you're bringing the Chantry back to it's roots. Maybe Andraste would want that...whether you're guided or not

 

Nice avatar btw...that's who I want the Inquisitor to be remembered as. Not the game cover.

[myahele]

The little details might end up being lost and/or replace. But I think the "Herald of Andraste" would atleast be known as someone who close the Breach and defeated Corypheus - something that was experienced and known throughout Thedas.

 

We know that a historical figure's race and some actions can be altered, but the major actions such as closing the Breach can't be easily hidden/ fabricated I think.

[Big I]

The Chantry already has saints (I think they're called Anointed? or Exalted?). Archon Hessarian is one for both chantries, Orlesian and Tevinter. So I imagine if the Inquisitor is remembered it will be as one of them.

[Illegitimus]

Definitely.  Once the Inquisitor is safely dead, they will certainly be enshrined, with anything about them that doesn't fit the Chantry's agenda being gracefully occluded.  

[Qun00]

Definitely.  Once the Inquisitor is safely dead, they will certainly be enshrined, with anything about them that doesn't fit the Chantry's agenda being gracefully occluded.

Heh, safely dead.

[Qis]

500 years later The Herald of Andraste will become a God, and the legend say he/she sacrifice his/her hand to close the breach and sealed away demons...there will be a Temple with mysterious ash in his/her name...someone will use that ash to cure some noble who got poisoned

[Aren]

If it was an elf or a mage it will be dismissed as heretic if it was an human pro templar it will be praised with statues for the eternity.

[Wulfram]

I must emphasize that I'm not asking whether it would be right, but if it is actually possible.

Do you believe that a hundred years from now, Andrastians will still speak of the time when the Maker showed mankind favor once more and had Andraste deliver his champion from death? Or will it be dismissed as a mistake?

I don't think any of the potential Divines would work against the belief - whether for pragmatic reasons or their own beliefs - so its got a good chance of surviving as long as their reigns are reasonably long.
 

While I'm at it, I'd like to know if you guys think the game did a good job at keeping it ambiguous or if the revelation at the Fade is unrefutable proof that it was wrong from the beginning.

I never really felt much reason to believe, even before the fade revelations. There's just not much that says Andraste, beyond "a woman". Of course you can still attribute the events to providence if you want, but you can attribute basically anything to providence, and I never really felt a reason to do so for this specifically. Of course, that's probably my real world opinions leaking through.

[Dai Grepher]

I understand Mistic, it's just that Ameridan's case seems to be one of exception because that happened during a time when the Second Blight was occurring, and proper records weren't being kept. I'm sure many places and documents were also destroyed by the Blight. Also, its possible that Ameridan's life was whitewashed on purpose because of the situation with the elves. Perhaps only the Inquisition and Drakon knew the truth.

With the current events, there are scholars and historians everywhere. There is word of mouth. Current events are more easily recorded and shared. Even the Qunari will have made proper documentation, even if they later spin it in their own way. Few places were destroyed, and the Inquisitor helped many places recover. In that time, these actions would be well documented as well.

It's also possible that the "Herald" will be eclipsed by the events in DA4, either by the new protag, or by Solas, or maybe the (ex)Inquisitor will be blamed for not realizing Solas was an enemy.
 

And it's totally outside of Flemeth's scheming too, unlike Warden/Hawke.

Or is it? Muhuhaha

[Mistic]

With the current events, there are scholars and historians everywhere. There is word of mouth. Current events are more easily recorded and shared. Even the Qunari will have made proper documentation, even if they later spin it in their own way. Few places were destroyed, and the Inquisitor helped many places recover. In that time, these actions would be well documented as well.

 

That's right, but I wonder about the interpretation the scholars will make.

 

Given that propaganda was outside the Inquisitor's control until Skyhold and that they don't have the option to publicly oppose it until Adamant (and even then, we only have few chances to do that), plus all those companions that may write their own interpretation of the events (Varric's will probably be the most famous, and he believes the Inquisitor is the Herald), I fear that even the most honest scholar may make mistakes. Then add the less honest scholars and it can be a historiographical mess.

 

Or is it? Muhuhaha

 

True. Depending on our choices, Flemeth can hijack the Inquisitor more than whatever she did to the Warden or Hawke.

[Raizen10e]

I'd say yes. Even if you did everything in your power to claim otherwise, the Chantry could still on their own spin it to their own version. There's the theory that Andraste was a mage, and that the chantry has just "left out" that part or outright denied it, I could see the same thing happen to Our inquisitor. With how popular Varric's books are, I could see the inquisitor being added into the beliefs... The only real issue is the Inquisitor probably has to be dead first for that to happen... so no one can contest what they're saying (especially if their inquisitor insisted they weren't chosen) and then claim anyone with records detailing otherwise a heretic and enemy of the church...might even get an exalted march out of it.  

[Xerrai]

Ok so ruling out Solas's plan succeding, Flemeth shaking the heaven's to Thedas's detriment, the qunari invading and whatever the hell else wants to turn Thedas inside-out---i'd say that there is a dstinct possibility that a "Herald of Andraste" will be remembered in the Chant of Light.

 

But the real question is if the Herald in thier Chant is really the same Herald that we played during Inquisition. Some people may try to spread the truth (the Inquisitor's companions, the Inquisitor's family, the advisors), but by and large I expect the Chantry as a general whole will want to twist and spin the tale/identity of the Herlad to suit thier religous agenda.  

 

If the Inquisitor conforms to thier ideal view of a Chantry figure, then it will remain. If the Inquisitor has traits that deviate from that Chantry ideal however--that is when they are prone to changing thier own documents.

 

This means that out of all of the Inquisitors, a human adrastian will be the most likely to be legitimately remembered. A dwarven Inquisitor might be acceptable too so long as they abide by Andrastian principles. But a Dalish elf? A qunari of any religon? These are the things that the Chantry might do feel uncomfortable with portraying. 

 

The Chantry will likely do all it can to expunge or alter anything that doesn't abide by their ideal view. Perhaps not now, but even Divine Victoria and her legacy might not accomplish much in the long run. But later, when the influence of the Inquisition is all but reduced to a far away memory.

 

If these 'non-ideal persons' cannot be conveniently forgotten, then they will be struck from the canonical Chant (Shartan). If even that is not possible, or if the whims of history are different, then it is quite possible they will remain in historical records in name only--with a great deal about their race, beliefs and personality perverted to suit the Chantry's purpose (Ameridian).

 

For all of the good the Chantry can bring, it deals as much in fabricated propaganda as it does in charity and comfort. Not that I don't see a reason behind it--i'm sure more than a few people inside the Chant have engaged in gruesome or less-than-savory acts in their life (wars/rebellions tends to bring that about). Things that perhaps are indeed, better forgotten. But nowadays the Chantry is more concerned about consolidating its power and maintaining it thant they ever are about preserving the truth. Even in years past this has been the case to a certain degree.

 

Here's something to note though: unlike ages past, there is an institution with enough merit that might be able to preserve the 'real' Inquisitor in historical record. The University of Orlais might have enough independence from Chantry censure (or at least enough of it) to have a decent amount Inquisitor and his/her actions be preserved in their own historical documents. While not completely immune to the Chantry's antics, the University does seem to be at odds with them due to the University's more liberal approach to documentation and education.