44 réponses à ce sujet

[Donquijote and 59 others]

The werewolves in the Brecilian forest...they are basically one hit kill enemy how is possible for the warden and the party to realistically be able to complete this quest?

[ThomasBlaine]

The werewolves in the Brecilian forest...they are basically one hit kill enemy how is possible for the warden and the party to realistically be able to complete this quest?

 

Perhaps better asked in the Combat, Strategy and Gameplay forum.

 

Personally, I found that Crowd Control is invaluable against them to avoid being overwhelmed to death. Freeze them, stun them, pommel them, whatever you have to to get them off your teammates. Aside from that I don't think them particularly difficult to fight.

[Jedi Comedian]

I always play on Easy 'cos I'm in it 4 the roleplay (not afraid of being called a *****, the actual ****** are the ones who are afraid of being called ****** lol), but even then you can have problems (Orzammar for example is a nightmare on ANY difficulty unless you have at the very least a healer or 2).

Which party selection do you have anyway Quijote?

[Donquijote and 59 others]

I meant in lore not in gameplay

Gameplay wise they are easy to beat but in lore these beasts should turn you into one of them as soon as they touch you with their jowls....

[Jedi Comedian]

these beasts should turn you into one of them as soon as they touch you with their jowls....

Hmmm true... wouldn't mind becoming a Werewarden lol.

[fchopin]

The werewolves in the Brecilian forest...they are basically one hit kill enemy how is possible for the warden and the party to realistically be able to complete this quest?

 

Come back when your level is higher and they will be easy.

[ThomasBlaine]

I meant in lore not in gameplay

Gameplay wise they are easy to beat but in lore these beasts should turn you into one of them as soon as they touch you with their jowls....

 

Hmm. For one thing, while they're big and powerful the werewolves aren't actually experienced warriors, and your party is. Dalish hunters aren't armed, armored or trained to fight particularly well in close combat, it's easy to imagine them being overwhelmed by the beasts, but the Warden has much more practice keeping an opponent physically at bay and assuming you fight with anything but daggers you have a huge reach advantage on claws. And on top of that the werewolves aren't wearing any armor themselves. And to be honest, their body structure alone is very inefficient and unbalanced. They might be good at lunges, but maneuvering and dodging would be pretty difficult in an all-out melee with those proportions.

 

The weres are dangerous and imposing, sure, but cautious, experienced and well-equipped fighters really should be able to take them.

[thats1evildude]

I meant in lore not in gameplay

Gameplay wise they are easy to beat but in lore these beasts should turn you into one of them as soon as they touch you with their jowls....

 

The curse takes a while to transform you.

[Donquijote and 59 others]

Hmm. For one thing, while they're big and powerful the werewolves aren't actually experienced warriors, and your party is. Dalish hunters aren't armed, armored or trained to fight particularly well in close combat, it's easy to imagine them being overwhelmed by the beasts, but the Warden has much more practice keeping an opponent physically at bay and assuming you fight with anything but daggers you have a huge reach advantage on claws. And on top of that the werewolves aren't wearing any armor themselves. And to be honest, their body structure alone is very inefficient and unbalanced. They might be good at lunges, but maneuvering and dodging would be pretty difficult in an all-out melee with those proportions.

 

The weres are dangerous and imposing, sure, but cautious, experienced and well-equipped fighters really should be able to take them.

Their body structures seem to make them stronger than mere mortals,plus they are maybe 30 werewolves against 4 persons

 

The curse takes a while to transform you.

Ok but still there are no ways to cure it if you are infected unless you find that white wolf in the forest and it debilitate the body at early stages.

These enemies are more poisonous than the darkpsawns

[ThomasBlaine]

Their body structures seem to make them stronger than mere mortals,plus they are maybe 30 werewolves against 4 persons

 

Ok but still there are no ways to cure it if you are infected unless you find that white wolf in the forest and it debilitate the body at early stages.

These enemies are more poisonous than the darkpsawns

 

Raw physical strength doesn't mean anything if the other guy can disable your unprotected hands from two feet further away than you can even reach him, your claws can't get through his armor in any case and you can't turn around quickly enough to track him because your spine is crooked like a sickle and isn't in line with your legs. The only time muscle strength really comes into it in a fight is when grappling, and again the lack of armor makes the werewolves too vulnerable to try that against an armored opponent with a melee weapon unless they can surprise and immobilize the target under their entire body-weight, which makes them even more stationary and vulnerable to flanking.

 

I get what you're saying, they're fearsome creatures, but their bodies are ill-conceived hybrids of two different products of evolution suited for very different things, which makes them awkward in action even ignoring their lack of proper training and equipment.

[Cz-99]

Lore-wise, my dwarf warden can take on 3 ancient dragons with one hand while wankin' with the other. So naturally, some anthros ain't **** to him.

 

Gameplay-wise, I can take down 3 ancient dragons with one hand while -

[Illegitimus]

I meant in lore not in gameplay

Gameplay wise they are easy to beat but in lore these beasts should turn you into one of them as soon as they touch you with their jowls....

 

Bah.  Not if you were wearing any kind of adequate armour.  The Dalish go around nearly naked.  A sword and board warriour could wade through werewolves like nobody's business.  

[Lunatica]

Bah.  Not if you were wearing any kind of adequate armour.  The Dalish go around nearly naked.  A sword and board warriour could wade through werewolves like nobody's business.  

Many Dalish were indeed infected by the curse.

I agree with Sten about the dubious action that the Dalish are taking their solution is to send you on your own into a magical forest known for illusions that trap the unwary inside forever - without a guide. And this forest is teeming with (what are essentially) one hit kill enemies, and again will not send anyone to help you. Your party would have to be the stupiest people on the planet to agree to such terms, and you have to wonder at the trustworthiness of people who would make such an outrageous demand. So basically, I wanted the option to just tell them to screw off. I'm not saying the whole quest should be able to be voided, but I would like your character to be able to voice opposition to such ridiculously selfish and unreasonable terms.

[ThomasBlaine]

This is why I always deck my rogues out in medium armor and my mages in leather at least. Including helmets. Aside from armor being invaluable in actual combat, it also minimizes a lot of the less obvious dangers the characters are subject to. Explosive magical doodads everywhere? Armor. Risk of being knocked into walls and such? Armor. Taking non-Wardens into the Deep Roads chock-full of darkspawn taint and and biting deepstalkers unlikely to know anything about dental hygine? A square inch of unnecessarily exposed skin would be suicide! Armor!

 

 

Many Dalish were indeed infected by the curse.

I agree with Sten about the dubious action that the Dalish are taking their solution is to send you on your own into a magical forest known for illusions that trap the unwary inside forever - without a guide. And this forest is teeming with (what are essentially) one hit kill enemies, and again will not send anyone to help you. Your party would have to be the stupiest people on the planet to agree to such terms, and you have to wonder at the trustworthiness of people who would make such an outrageous demand. So basically, I wanted the option to just tell them to screw off. I'm not saying the whole quest should be able to be voided, but I would like your character to be able to voice opposition to such ridiculously selfish and unreasonable terms.

 

Most quests are of this nature, really. Greagoir refusing to "risk" any more of his templars getting hurt doing their jobs by sending them with you to kill abominations. Bhelen sending you unassisted into the Deep Roads to hunt for Branka because his own scouts are, what, tired? Claustrophobic? Yes, of course. Teagan deciding that enough of his men have disappeared on the wild goose chase he sent them on that giving you an escort to at least maximize your chances of locating and retrieving the Ahes, or even your chances of survival, or even pocket money to feed yourself while underway is out of the question. Eamon sending you unaided into the Alienage to fight a whole army of Tevinter blood mages and their mercenaries.

 

And those are just the major ones. Everywhere people ask you to solve their problems for them at monumental risk to yourself for minor rewards if even that. At least Zathrian has the excuse of his people being uniquely unsuited for this task, not being close combatants and not having proper armor, while you and yours would be comparatively safe from the same risks. He should have volunteered either his own talents or his Second's as a mage though, as freezing and stunning spells are brilliant for controlling the werewolves' movements.

 

It all boils down to the Warden being really desperate for those allies, I guess. And it's why I have some sympathy for Morrigan thinking the Warden a bit of an idiot for actually doing all this. In real life there's not a single law in the world compelling someone to run into a burning building or attempt to confront a potential murderer to save someone else, even a child, because "lack of heroism" can't realistically be considered a crime or moral failing.

[GoldenGail3]

Not for me, they weren't. It took multiply hits to kill them.

[Dai Grepher]

If you actually bothered to stop and ask Zathrian about the symptoms, he tells you that it comes on slowly over the course of about one week. You will start sweating, vomiting, and you'll lose your temper easily. He tells you that if you start showing these symptoms then it should drive you even more to end the curse. Your motive will become more personal in that case.

However, I played the area so well that I was never even hit by the werewolves once. I roleplayed it this way intentionally. However, it was also the last area I played before the Landsmeet, which means I was indeed powered up significantly. The Bricilian Forest is actually intended to be one of the first areas you visit to gather allies.

I used Morrigan, Leliana, and Zevran (ironically). I had everyone use their various rooting abilities, as well as long range weapons. Then I would have my dual weapon warrior and Zevran run in and DPS the downed werewolves to death.

If you want more of an interesting fight, I suggest using Shale, Dog, and Morrigan. Shale can't be turned. Dog... probably can't be turned, though the curse might still be fatal as is said to be the case with the Halla. Morrigan can turn into a Flying Swarm. She could also Animate Dead skeletons, which can't be turned. Also, a Ranger can summon other animals to help, and no one cases what happens to them.

[German Soldier]

This is why I always deck my rogues out in medium armor and my mages in leather at least. Including helmets. Aside from armor being invaluable in actual combat, it also minimizes a lot of the less obvious dangers the characters are subject to. Explosive magical doodads everywhere? Armor. Risk of being knocked into walls and such? Armor. Taking non-Wardens into the Deep Roads chock-full of darkspawn taint and and biting deepstalkers unlikely to know anything about dental hygine? A square inch of unnecessarily exposed skin would be suicide! Armor!

 

 

 

Most quests are of this nature, really. Greagoir refusing to "risk" any more of his templars getting hurt doing their jobs by sending them with you to kill abominations. Bhelen sending you unassisted into the Deep Roads to hunt for Branka because his own scouts are, what, tired? Claustrophobic? Yes, of course. Teagan deciding that enough of his men have disappeared on the wild goose chase he sent them on that giving you an escort to at least maximize your chances of locating and retrieving the Ahes, or even your chances of survival, or even pocket money to feed yourself while underway is out of the question. Eamon sending you unaided into the Alienage to fight a whole army of Tevinter blood mages and their mercenaries.

 

And those are just the major ones. Everywhere people ask you to solve their problems for them at monumental risk to yourself for minor rewards if even that. At least Zathrian has the excuse of his people being uniquely unsuited for this task, not being close combatants and not having proper armor, while you and yours would be comparatively safe from the same risks. He should have volunteered either his own talents or his Second's as a mage though, as freezing and stunning spells are brilliant for controlling the werewolves' movements.

 

It all boils down to the Warden being really desperate for those allies, I guess. And it's why I have some sympathy for Morrigan thinking the Warden a bit of an idiot for actually doing all this. In real life there's not a single law in the world compelling someone to run into a burning building or attempt to confront a potential murderer to save someone else, even a child, because "lack of heroism" can't realistically be considered a crime or moral failing.

I don't think the warden is an idiot 

WIth the success of these missions the warden is gaining more power,money,items ,reputation prestige,status and even lands, at best you can say that the companions aren't gain anything.I really don't see any point in sympathizing with Morrigan Pov over this.

It is simply a job not an act of heroism or pity

[Lunatica]

I don't think the warden is an idiot for anything,for the success of these missions the warden is gaining more power,money,items ,reputation prestige and status, at best you can say that the companions aren't gain anything.

Indeed,is not that you aren't being offered rewards for the efforts most quests are rewarded and at the end stage the warden could be able to gain control over two Ferelden regions....

[ThomasBlaine]

 

I don't think the warden is an idiot 

WIth the success of these missions the warden is gaining more power,money,items ,reputation prestige,status and even lands, at best you can say that the companions aren't gain anything.I really don't see any point in sympathizing with Morrigan Pov over this.

It is simply a job not an act of heroism or pity

 

 

I just ended a playthrough at a good 1630 kills, hundreds of people and monsters and demons and several dragons. That's some "job". And I can't tell you how many quests I never completed because my Warden just wasn't eager enough to please to take such pointless risks.

 

The Warden is barely aware of any of their potential rewards when deciding to do something, and thowing yourself at armies of undead, psychopathic mind-controllers and mercenaries in four-man teams to save other people is heroic no matter what you're hoping to get out of it. And utterly insane if you don't want to die stupidly. A real person would have deserted Duncan and fled to the Free Marches before reaching Ostagar. To dismiss the Warden's actions in the game as just selfish routine and Morrigan as evil for not supporting it is beyond ridiculous.

 

Do you fancy yourself a superhero? If I came to your work with some guys to beat money out of one of your coworkers, would you try to run us off, get the details from them, somehow track us to our hideout where we had dozens more and "clear us out" ignoring any risk to yourself? No? How about for a Rolex?

[German Soldier]

I just ended a playthrough at a good 1630 kills, hundreds of people and monsters and demons and several dragons. That's some "job". And I can't tell you how many quests I never completed because my Warden just wasn't eager enough to please to take such pointless risks.

 

The Warden is barely aware of any of their potential rewards when deciding to do something, and thowing yourself at armies of undead, psychopathic mind-controllers and mercenaries in four-man teams to save other people is heroic no matter what you're hoping to get out of it. And utterly insane if you don't want to die stupidly. A real person would have deserted Duncan and fled to the Free Marches before reaching Ostagar. To dismiss the Warden's actions in the game as just selfish routine and Morrigan as evil for not supporting it is beyond ridiculous.

 

Do you fancy yourself a superhero? If I came to your work with some guys to beat some money out of one of your coworkers, would you try to run us off, get the details from them, somehow track us to our hideout where we had dozens more and "clear us out" ignoring any risk to yourself? No? How about for a Rolex?

In DAO i was a warden and i had a job that i wanted to do.

By real person you mean you because i would have remained, there were rewards to gain and there was a job that i wanted to do if you wish to call that attitude Super hero do as you please i don't care.

If mistress Morrigan didn't wanted to stay she had only to tell me and i would have kicked her out with no problems but her whining for the whole game at everything i did(especially Redcliffe) really pis***me off...

[Akiza]

 

In DAO i was a warden and i had a job that i wanted to do.

By real person you mean you because i would have remained, there were rewards to gain and there was a job that i wanted to do if you wish to call that attitude Super hero do as you please i don't care.

If mistress Morrigan didn't wanted to stay she had only to tell me and i would have kicked her out with no problems but her whining for the whole game at everything i did(especially Redcliffe) really pis***me off...

 

Well said Is a matter of choices.

 I wanted to stay in Ferelden to benefit from the opportunities arose by the chaos of the blight and try to climb the social ladder and i was free to do so.

I would like to point out that Ignacio did the same thing he remained in Ferelden to make profits thanks to the chaos spread by the blight...my warden is not that much different and i wouldn't call her super hero(I even killed Alistair and injuried Morrigan) she is pretty bloodthirsty...

[ThomasBlaine]

 

In DAO i was a warden and i had a job that i wanted to do.

By real person you mean you because i would have remained there were rewards to gain and there was a job that i wanted to do if you wish to call that attitude Super hero do as you please.

If mistress Morrigan didn't wanted to stay she had only to tell me and i would have kicked her out with no problems but her whining for the whole game at everything i did(especially Redcliffe) really pis***me off...

 

 

Modern firefighters are considered heroic despite getting paid, and what they do isn't anywhere near as dangerous as some of the things the Warden engages in that fall way outside the "job description" of a Grey Warden. And assuming that only you and Alistair can end the Blight, going around risking your lives for pocket change instead of focusing directly on the mission is downright irresponsible, aside from realistically being suicide.

 

What if one of scores of bandits got a lucky hit in and killed your Warden while in the process of doing the City Guard's job for them? Or one of the undead got under your guard while defending peasants in Redcliffe? Ferelden would be destroyed because you just couldn't say no to a plea for help. Unlike you, Morrigagn takes that possibility seriously, as would any real person under the same circumstances.

[Aren]

 

The Warden is barely aware of any of their potential rewards when deciding to do something, and thowing yourself at armies of undead, psychopathic mind-controllers and mercenaries in four-man teams to save other people is heroic no matter what you're hoping to get out of it. And utterly insane if you don't want to die stupidly. A real person would have deserted Duncan and fled to the Free Marches before reaching Ostagar. To dismiss the Warden's actions in the game as just selfish routine and Morrigan as evil for not supporting it is beyond ridiculous.

 

Do you fancy yourself a superhero? If I came to your work with some guys to beat money out of one of your coworkers, would you try to run us off, get the details from them, somehow track us to our hideout where we had dozens more and "clear us out" ignoring any risk to yourself? No? How about for a Rolex?

My choice would have been to remain and use the treaties to gather more powers and allies +bonus for the Human noble origin who had many reasons to stay.Going in the Free marches to end up in the dirt of some sewers like Anders really wasn't an  appealing prospective for my warden.

 

As for all those enemies to defeat they were an incentive to stay for me as my warden like to face powerful foes even at the cost of life he like to test himself in the most dangerous battles ,so  increase the chances to survive at the cost of a different life isn't something that would have attract him.

[ThomasBlaine]

 

My choice would have been to remain and use the treaties to gather more powers and allies +bonus for the Human noble origin who had many reasons to stay.Going in the Free marches to end up in the dirt of some sewers like Anders really wasn't an  appealing prospective for my warden.

 

As for all those enemies to defeat they were an incentive to stay for me as my warden like to face powerful foes even at the cost of life he like to test himself in the most dangerous battles ,so  increase the chances to survive at the cost of a different life isn't something that would have attract him.

 

 

Again, classic superhero thinking.

[German Soldier]

Modern fire fighters are considered heroic despite getting paid, and what they do isn't anywhere near as dangerous as some of the things the Warden engages in that fall way outside the "job description" of a Grey Warden. And assuming that only you and Alistair can end the Blight, going around risking your lives for pocket change instead of focusing directly on the mission is downright irresponsible, aside from realistically being suicide.

 

What if one of scores of bandits got a lucky hit in and killed your Warden while in the process of doing the City Guard's job for them? Or one of the undead got under your guard while defending peasants in Redcliffe? Ferelden would be destroyed because you just couldn't say no to a plea for help. Unlike you, Morrigagn takes that possibility seriously, as would any real person under the same circumstances.

People may call modern fire fighters as they please to me they are just soldiers with a paycheck and nothing more and of course what they do is equally dangerous if not more than what the wardens do saying how is  easy to being killed by firearms in a modern war.

 

Assuming that i can only end the blight yes what do you mean?That the wardens should sit doing nothing unless the Archdemon appear?

That wouldn't be a very intelligent strategy, If the warden die then it simply die when it was trying to save Ferelden instead of just flew in the free Marches..