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The Indoctrination Theory: Mark IV


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#1
masster blaster

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       To ensure that this topic is stated as is, this topic is about the literal interpretation about ( The Indoctrination Theory) that may have happened at the end of ME3. Though three years have past and we are now entering to ME:A many questions still remain about what will be the overall bases of this game will be other than what has been mentioned/leaked. I brought up this topic again for it is unknown what the story line other than generic plot given, and many mysteries about when did the ark leave. Prior to it we have no idea if any Reapers are still alive or even affected by the endings. Nor do we know the fate of what happens in the Milky way given how ME:A can change what might have happened at the end of ME3 for all we know.

 

     I say this because the Stargazer was talking to the child on an unknown planet in the distant future. It is plausible that due to loss of communication from the Milky Way the crew of the ark ship gathered the only information they received and played out what might have happened. Hence the child saying "Did that all really happen" Which can convey that when the old man said " We'll some of the records were lost in time" could mean ME3 endings do not automatically mean it all happened. To also note this means Bioware has a clear way to continue the story of ME1-3 yet start fresh with a new character only to find out what really happened.

 

    Moreover because of that I believe that Shepard could have been under going an indoctrination attempt and that it could be possible to get some clues in ME:A if there is any. In the mean time speculating about this on ME:A seems appropriate considering how it could possibility tie into ME:A. Not saying  Shepard will be playable no but a clue to what could have happened and possible the N7 soldier under the mask that is causing trouble in the new galaxy or a hidden enemy.

 

  *The Following findings are meant to highlight things from the Mass Effect series that can give incite to what might be expected that can happen towards Shepard/ the Milky Way galaxy in that could be hinted throughout ME:A*

 

(All credit goes to Restrider)   I) Indoctrination in general :

          1.   Regarding IT, Shepard is in the process of indoctrination and the outcome is decided by the final decision taken.
          2.   The concept of indoctrination is a crucial part throughout the trilogy and nothing new to the player (link 1 and 2).
          3.   Rana Thanoptis is an example of how subtle and slow indoctrination can be.
          4.   Shepard was knocked out for two days by a Reaper artifact that indoctrinated an entire facility.
          5.   Logs on the derelict Reaper and in Arrival (link) illustrate the reactions of victims of indoctrination.
          6.   Paul Grayson's indoctrination show its effects on someone's mind.
          7.   Harbinger's smacktalk (link 1 and 2).

 
       II) The Breath Scene :

          1.   London rubble (link 1 and 2).
          2.   Mako in the background.
          3.   Citadel explosion (link 1 and 2).


    III) The Dreams :
         
          1.   Dream sequences and post-beam sequence share the same game mechanics.
          2.   Reality-nonreality transition after beam shot (post-beam, dreams, Geth Consensus).
          3.   Oily shadows and whispering.
          4.   Nightmares are mentioned in the Arrival by subjects being indoctrinated.
          5.   Chambers and Asari having PTSD as comparison between PTSD & Shepard's dreams.


    IV) Leviathan :

          1.   Harbinger/the Reapers perfected enthrallment to indoctrination.
          2.   Enthrallment uses memories of its victim.
          3.   Similarities between Leviathan end and decision chamber.
          4.   Zap sound as a sign to enter/leave virtual reality (link 1 and 2).


     V) The Choices :

          1.   Shepard on his knees happened only during/after some mind control.
          2.   The Guardian is aligned to the Reapers.
          3.   Control and Synthesis being supported by indoctrinated characters.
          4.   A swap in the colours (TIM = ParagonAnderson = Renegade).
          5.   Huskification during Control/Synthesis vs. Shepard gaining strength while shooting the tubes.
          6.   Guardian losing it when you refuse ("SO BE IT!").
          7.   Decision chamber looks like a dialogue wheel from an aerial view.
          8.   Decision chamber resembling beam scenery (link 1 and 2).
          9.   Ambiguous end dialogue (Control/Synthesis).
        10.   Slide shows in Control/Synthesis/Destroy illustrate future possibilities, not facts that already happened.
        11.   Soldiers in Destroy fighting fiercely while in Control/Synthesis they are losing (note: no cheering in Synthesis).


    VI) The Kid :

         1.   Moves from one roof to another during an invasion (all links).
         2.   It can open a door that is marked as locked.
         3.   It survives a blast from a Reaper laser.
         4.   It is not seen by anyone else.
         5.   There always are warning symbols around it.
         6.   It disappears without making any noise.
         7.   It does not behave like a normal kid ("You cannot save me!").
         8.   The Guardian has the same form as the kid.


   VII) Anderson & TIM :

         1.   How did Anderson follow Shepard?
         2.   How can Anderson reach the control first?
         3.   Why did no one else follow Anderson?
         4.   From where did TIM shows up?
         5.   TIM's scars are only present at the end of the game.
         6.   Anderson may be addressing Shepard ("They are controlling you!").
         7.   Shepard is dominated by TIM and thus through him by the Reapers.
         8.   Anderson and Shepard have wounds at the same place (link 1 and 2).
         9.   Reaper horn played in the background (at 1/2 speed).
       10.   The EMS requirements depend on Anderson's fate in the confrontation with TIM.


  VIII) The Guardian :

         1.   It has the same shape as the kid ( thus an extraction of Shepard's memories).
         2.   It speaks with femshep's and maleshep's voice.
         3.   Harbinger's line in the MP trailer (link 1 and 2).
         4.   The Guardian is a liar regardless of the interpretation of the endings.


    IX) The Beam Run :

        1.   Harbinger is pin-pointing everyone and everything but Shepard.
        2.   Harbinger does not destroy the Normandy.
        3.   Shepard survives a blast that should one-shot Makos and Gunships.
        4.   Harbinger just leaves.


     X) The Citadel :

        1.   The Citadel resembles events of the past.
        2.   You can find Coats dead on the Citadel.

 

 

*All of this can play out into many categories to which anything can be possible. With things presented above it may have been such intended in a way that could transition to ME:A but in a role that isn't the center focus of what ME:A is planning but a plot for a later use*

 

Now I am not saying that Shepard will remain indoctrinated or is no. However on a possibility that Shepard could have been with that in mind. Shepard could be fighting it and the end choice you pick can determine how far Shepard can be salvaged; as in if Shepard can be saved. This doesn't automatically mean everything was lost or invalidate love interest no, but we have no idea how far the reach of the Reapers is. Thus creating a loop hole within the time-frame if the the crucible is a plot device for the Reapers to reach ME:A for they would assume that is where they would go.

 

It would be a passing on the torch moment about Shepard is done fighting and that the new protagonist will take up the last days of the war only it will uncover a bigger threat that even the Reapers have kept hidden. Plus Leviathans as the new villains could be a possibility for they want to control again and what better way to remain safe from the reapers than send some leviathans if there are more than the three shown to ME:A

 

Also for more information go too http://www.masseffec...ination.com/ .

or http://w11.zetaboard...opic/7698722/1/


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#2
capn233

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It is unlikely indoctrination hypothesis will make it into MEA.


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#3
masster blaster

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It is unlikely indoctrination hypothesis will make it into MEA.

Most likely yet doesn't hurt to try and make sense of ME:A seeing how there is much riding on this game.



#4
Jedi Comedian

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I always headcanon the Indocrination Theory when playing ME3: the Control and Synthesis Endings make a lot of sense that way (if John chooses Destroy, it's one final act of rebellion against the Reapers and his indoctrination). I'd also dare to say the Catalyst doesn't have the child's form, it is the other way around: the kid Shepard sees is a product of his indoctrination as like you said only him seems to see him.

I have an interesting theory about the dreams: since they show Shepard and the kid burning it could be a warning against the Destroy option, as Reapers are necessary for humanity's advancement, so if the Reapers (child/Catalyst) burn, mankind (Shepard) burns with it.

With that being said, IMHO Andromeda is most likely not going to address much about the endings.

#5
rapscallioness

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You know, as much as I enjoy the ideas of legend/myth vs truth/reality--and I really enjoy those types of things-I just don't think BW is gonna do anything that complicated.

 

I think they're just going to run for the border and try and start completely fresh because it's the easier route for them.


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#6
masster blaster

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You know, as much as I enjoy the ideas of legend/myth vs truth/reality--and I really enjoy those types of things-I just don't think BW is gonna do anything that complicated.

 

I think they're just going to run for the border and try and start completely fresh because it's the easier route for them.

More than likely yet i see no harm in bringing this up for anything can be possible though who know. Much is being spent into ME:A so for now theory's/speculation is all we got right now.



#7
masster blaster

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I always headcanon the Indocrination Theory when playing ME3: the Control and Synthesis Endings make a lot of sense that way (if John chooses Destroy, it's one final act of rebellion against the Reapers and his indoctrination). I'd also dare to say the Catalyst doesn't have the child's form, it is the other way around: the kid Shepard sees is a product of his indoctrination as like you said only him seems to see him.

I have an intetesting theory about the dreams: since they show Shepard and the kid burning it could be a warning against the Destroy option, as Reapers are necessary for humanity's advancement, so if the Reapers (child/Catalyst) burn, mankind (Shepard) burns with it.

Indeed. That is always the great thing about. Many ways to think about it and how each thing can be viewed as.



#8
PCThug

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I also headcanon the indoctrination theory but I'd be very surprised to ever see it brought up in future games.



#9
AlanC9

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Prediction before reading: this is gonna be hilarious.

Edit: no, I was wrong; it's just sad.
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#10
masster blaster

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I also headcanon the indoctrination theory but I'd be very surprised to ever see it brought up in future games.

Indeed.



#11
Pearl (rip bioware)

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Most likely yet doesn't hurt to try and make sense of ME:A seeing how there is much riding on this game.


You see, in order to make sense of something, we first have to know what it is. Otherwise we analyze the thing we want it to be, rather than what it actually is.
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#12
Dalinne

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Wow, this is a very thorough OP  :o

I always liked the Indoctrination Theory. However, I don't think IT will have an impact on Andromeda.

Good work tho


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#13
masster blaster

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You see, in order to make sense of something, we first have to know what it is. Otherwise we analyze the thing we want it to be, rather than what it actually is.

That can go both ways. To think you know it only to find out it wasn't it or vise versa. Things can be viewed as what is believed from other peoples prospective and findings as it has always been and usually the majority is the one that "declares" what is true or not set by society.



#14
rapscallioness

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More than likely yet i see no harm in bringing this up for anything can be possible though who know. Much is being spent into ME:A so for now theory's/speculation is all we got right now.

 

True enough.



#15
masster blaster

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Wow, this is a very thorough OP  :o

I always liked the Indoctrination Theory. However, I don't think IT will have an impact on Andromeda.

Good work tho

That is why you just speculate and thank you. :) However it's been a working progress for everyone that has worked on finding something to support the theory itself and possible implementations bioware could have intended.



#16
AlanC9

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The majority determines truth? An IT guy really shouldn't make that argument.
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#17
masster blaster

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True enough.

yeah.



#18
Draining Dragon

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no
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#19
wolfsite

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Let it go - Let it go.  It's just a game you know.

 

Let it go - Let it go.  IT will never be part of the official flow.

 

Let it go - let it........ **** it I'm getting beer.


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#20
fizzypop

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What happened in ME3 really happened. It was that bad. While indoctrination sounds cool the writers were not smart enough to come up with it. We just need to let it go...man.


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#21
masster blaster

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no

okay.



#22
ZipZap2000

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*Sculls Ryncol*


Ok, I'm ready.

What's his argument? I couldn't read through that wall of antiquated butthurt.
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#23
Jeremiah12LGeek

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Still more interesting than the real ending.

 

Still not the real ending.


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#24
Quarian Master Race

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Stopped reading at "Indoctrination Theory".

Adding a convoluted and explicitly non canon tinfoil hat conspiricy theory doesn't make the dumpster fire that was ME3 SP any less retarded. Quite the opposite in fact, which is an amazing achievement in and of itself given how bad the plot already was.
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#25
The Dystopian Hound

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How about we avoid having this conversation. The indoc theory is false. End of story.