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My thoughts on ME2 and hopes for the future. (Possible spoilers)


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#1
Aethelwulf1066

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So, I beat my first playthrough of ME2 just a few minutes ago. Came out with only one teammate death (Mordin. Pity...i'd have rather seen Miranda take a bullet...or Jack.). All I can say is that i've been blown away with the quality of this game. Such a huge improvement over the first. So after I beat it, I thought i'd give my opinions on what I liked and disliked about the game, as well as some thoughts on what I would like to see in ME3 (In case...maybe...some devs are listening? ;))

Likes:

- A streamlined combat experience. It feels much less clunky. I like how the firefights felt longer. I also liked how you couldn't just stand out in the open without consequences. In ME2, you have to take cover, or you'll be dead pretty damn quick. Makes the combat seem more realistic.

- Lack of an inventory system. I know most people hate this feature, but I thought it was great. I don't have to loot countless crap weapons, armor, ammo types, etc. ...and then sort through all of it later. A much needed improvement over the first game.

- Most of the new characters. With the exception of Jack and Miranda (Sadly, and coincidentally, both are the only Male romance options besides Tali.) I really liked all of the new characters on the Normandy. They're unique, funny, and for the most part, very believable. I seemed to form emotional connections with some of these characters, so much so, that as the final mission progressed, I was all but biting my fingernails. Poor Mordin...

- A sense of humor. "Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a **** in the galaxy." 'nuff said.

- I don't know about other people, but I felt the game was longer than the first ME. I felt that there was more to do, more places to explore. There is a drawback to this, which i'll refer to in a moment.

- I personally liked the 'streamlined' rpg elements. If I wanted a more hardcore RPG, i'd play one. God knows I have more than a few of those laying around on my hard drive.

- Legion. Best new character (Tali is the best character period. One of my favorite characters in all of Bioware's games.).

Dislikes:

- Jack and Miranda. I did not like either of them. And if given an option, i'd have shoved them both into an airlock and spaced them. Miranda was too cold and businesslike. I didn't even feel pity or sympathy for her like I could for other characters in the game. As for Jack...I got tired of teen angst when I left high school. She almost makes me think of those high school mall-goth kids that go to hot topic and complain about everything. She's so abrasive and whiny that I can't stand having any interaction with her. Just a personal opinion.

- The utter lack of weapon variety. You don't need an inventory system to have a wide variety of weapons. Since there's no multiples of any one thing, I don't see the hassle or problem of having more weapons. Each weapon class, minus any of the collectors/pre-order weapons only has 2-3 choices. It would be nice if Bioware could increase variety through DLC. I would pay for weapon packs.

- The utter lack of armor pieces. Again, something I personally believe should have been in the game. One of the things they kept talking about was the ability to customize Shepard's appearance. So why can I only find two other helmets, and only 1-2 different pieces for other parts of Shepard's armor. I kept seeing that awesome ninja/splinter-cell mask thing in the customization vids, only to find out that it was part of some Dr. Pepper promotion. I was a little disappointed in this. Also, the DLC armors should be made to mix and match as well. Most of the time I just wore the DLC armors, or wore mostly all N7 armor. Like weapons, it's something i'd really like to see in the dlc.

- I felt that most of your actions in ME1 had little to no impact on this game. And the only decisions that really seemed to have any effect were smaller decisions you made. Anderson's position in the council seems to make little difference (A little disappointed that he made only a very small appearance.), as does being a spectre ((Which, as the council puts it, more of a show, than anything else.)). Maybe ME1's actions and decisions will make more of an impact in ME3, once the whole reaper conflict hits end game. But, as for this game, it feels like it had minimal impact.

- Areas in general were very small. Even big hubs like Illium and Omega. While there were more of these places, and it felt like there was more to explore, individual areas felt very small.

- Shallow romaces. I had this problem with ME1 as well. It felt like romances weren't so much character development, as they were just a series of brief, shallow dialogues leading up to a sex scene. Only Tali's (And maybe because she's one of my favorite characters.) romance seemed to have some depth to it. It would have been nice to be able to explore the romantic relationship between your character and NPC past the run-up to the love scene.

- Everyone being able to die at the end. This isn't so much of a dislike as it is something that sort of bothers me. I like the idea, but at the same time, I don't think it's a good idea. It helps convey the desperation and danger of the situation, but it also makes me a little nervous about ME3. I would hate to see Shepard gone after growing with him through two games, as well as the loss of characters like Legion, Thane, Tali, Garrus, and Mordin in the third game. I can't imagine they'd wipe the slate completely clean, so I really hope Shepard and some of the fan favorites return for the next installment.

Thoughts on the future:

- Please, for the love of god, don't get rid of Shepard and introduce a brand new main character in the last installment! I don't know about anyone else, but i'd hate, at the final conflict, to play as some new character with a new backstory. I've grown with Shepard through two games. I think there's too much backstory with Shepard to lose him as the main character. The same goes with my two other favorite ME characters, Garrus and Tali. I'd hate to see them go, especially if they lived through the final mission in this game (The cameos of the other non-recruitable ME1 characters were disappointing. So if you're not going to make them recruitable, just scrap 'em in my opinion.). But...seeing as how everyone can die at the end of ME2, i'm starting to think that's exactly how it's going to happen. Makes me a little nervous about ME3. Though you have my full support in ensuring Ashley and Liara never make it back into the ME universe. Wiping the slate clean would take away alot of the immersiveness and connections you make to the ME universe.

- I'd like to seem more depth in romances. I'm not asking for a dating sim really, but allow us to explore the romances more. In DA:O you could give gifts (Although, that went for everybody, not just RIs.). I know romance isn't the main focus of this game, but it just feels so...gimmicky? You have one or two romantic dialogues, you hit the main mission and have the love scene, and then after that? Nothing. No new dialogue, no advancement, no anything. I guess that's just me though. It's like it was nothing more than a fling, than anything else.

- I'd like to see some type of space combat. Nothing would be cooler than taking control of the Normandy (2 or 3...maybe.) and busting a 23 kiliton mass acceleration cap in a reaper's ass. I could live without this feature, but I think it would add even more to the uniqueness of the ME games.

- Bigger battles. Maybe have Shepard (Or whoever you play as in ME3) and company join ground forces in large battles against their enemies. Possibilities for this could be helping the Quarians retake their homeworld from the geth, or helping the Alliance forces battle geth/collectors/whatever else the reapers bind to their will. It would help add to the epic nature of these games.

- Player housing. I know this borders on MMO territory, but I think it'd be a cool idea. The captain's cabin was cool in this game, but perhaps finding a home on a certain planet would give more room for customization.

- Two to three player co-op would be neat. It would probably only work if Shepard isn't playable in ME3, since having three shepards would be ridiculous. But if you're allowed to make your own completely new character, perhaps it would work.

- If Shepard is scrapped, let us choose a race for our character. I'd really like to play as a Turian, or a badass Quarian marine.

Anyways, I can't think of anything else at the moment. If anything else comes to mind, i'll add it to this post. I'm interested to hear everyone's opinions on the points I brought up. Though i'd like to ask people to refrain from trolling or being smartasses. I'd like to see an intelligent debate or discussion about all the things I mentioned.

Modifié par Aethelwulf1066, 28 janvier 2010 - 10:04 .


#2
Aethelwulf1066

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Also, I forgot to add something:



I hope Bioware intends to offer long-term DLC support for ME2. Alot of games that flaunt DLC as a feature, but few really support it. Most release one or two things for DLC, and the utterly forget about it. L4D1 is a perfect example of this. Since ME3 won't be around for a long while (Hopefully less than two years.), i'd like to see Bioware continue to add new content to this game. Perhaps offering DLC expansions that depict the events leading up to what happens in ME3 would be awesome.



Also, I keep hearing people say that Bioware stated there will be more games in the ME universe besides this trilogy. Can anyone confirm this is true?

#3
Hokochu

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You keep your Shepard in ME3. If he died you cannot import that save. Simple as that. I too am worried about the party members returning though.

#4
marshalleck

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I'm concerned about the possible deaths as well. If the ME1 love interests really were left out of ME2 for the purpose of saving them for ME3, then that means it's pretty much certain that Tali, Garrus, and everyone else from the current crew will be gone. And that's really going to be a shame, since Legion has so much potential which went untapped due to his 11th hour addition to the team. As disappointing as it will be, at least we'll have had some closure with Tali and Garrus.

I really hope they don't scrap all these characters, but I'm trying to accept that they're as good as gone. And we'll never get to see what Tali looks like under her mask.

But since it has been confirmed as of a few weeks ago that they are currently in the early stages of writing and development for ME3, now is the time to voice these concerns.

Modifié par marshalleck, 28 janvier 2010 - 10:14 .


#5
Foulpancake

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I agree with some of this.

Likes:

Pretty much agree on almost all counts, the did a fantastic job with streamlining the game, looks plays and sounds great. Dialogue is less awkward and i laughed my ass off a couple times.


Dislikes:

- Jack and Miranda. I did not like either of them. And if given an option, i'd have shoved them both into an airlock and spaced them. Miranda was too cold and businesslike. I didn't even feel pity or sympathy for her like I could for other characters in the game. As for Jack...I got tired of teen angst when I left high school. She almost makes me think of those high school mall-goth kids that go to hot topic and complain about everything. She's so abrasive and whiny that I can't stand having any interaction with her. Just a personal opinion.


I liked Miranda, not to mention for pixels she is insanely hot, but ya Jack was way to angsty high school kid, and ugly as sin to boot. Yick i never used it (thats not a she...lol)

Shallow romaces. I had this problem with ME1 as well. It felt like romances weren't so much character development, as they were just a series of brief, shallow dialogues leading up to a sex scene. Only Tali's (And maybe because she's one of my favorite characters.) romance seemed to have some depth to it. It would have been nice to be able to explore the romantic relationship between your character and NPC past the run-up to the love scene.


I agree on this part, having a little more depth to romances is nice, DA:O they were going in the right direction, its like they took a step back here, and having no same sex romance also seemed a step back and disappointed me alot, i'd pay for DLC to romance Miranda /highschoolcrushsigh

Everyone being able to die at the end. This isn't so much of a dislike as it is something that sort of bothers me. I like the idea, but at the same time, I don't think it's a good idea. It helps convey the desperation and danger of the situation, but it also makes me a little nervous about ME3. I would hate to see Shepard gone after growing with him through two games, as well as the loss of characters like Legion, Thane, Tali, Garrus, and Mordin in the third game. I can't imagine they'd wipe the slate completely clean, so I really hope Shepard and some of the fan favorites return for the next installment.


I love it, makes the story have more impact and honestly when i finally get my playthrough the way i like it, im going to have all the characters i dont like killed off (jack is going bye bye, aint decided who else) by sending them the wrong way. Oh and shepard dying isnt really an issue cuz ya know you can always...play again...and...not die... You know what they say "if at first you dont succed keep on sucking till you do succeed" or something like that

Thoughts on the future:

Please, for the love of god, don't get rid of Shepard and introduce a brand new main character in the last installment! I don't know about anyone else, but i'd hate, at the final conflict, to play as some new character with a new backstory. I've grown with Shepard through two games. I think there's too much backstory with Shepard to lose him as the main character. The same goes with my two other favorite ME characters, Garrus and Tali. I'd hate to see them go, especially if they lived through the final mission in this game (The cameos of the other non-recruitable ME1 characters were disappointing. So if you're not going to make them recruitable, just scrap 'em in my opinion.). But...seeing as how everyone can die at the end of ME2, i'm starting to think that's exactly how it's going to happen. Makes me a little nervous about ME3. Though you have my full support in ensuring Ashley and Liara never make it back into the ME universe. Wiping the slate clean would take away alot of the immersiveness and connections you make to the ME universe.



again lack of insight here is shocking...just dont use the save if shepard dies.../boggle

- I'd like to seem more depth in romances. I'm not asking for a dating sim really, but allow us to explore the romances more. In DA:O you could give gifts (Although, that went for everybody, not just RIs.). I know romance isn't the main focus of this game, but it just feels so...gimmicky? You have one or two romantic dialogues, you hit the main mission and have the love scene, and then after that? Nothing. No new dialogue, no advancement, no anything. I guess that's just me though. It's like it was nothing more than a fling, than anything else


seconded

- Player housing. I know this borders on MMO territory, but I think it'd be a cool idea. The captain's cabin was cool in this game, but perhaps finding a home on a certain planet would give more room for customization



wtf do you think the normandy is?

most of the rest of the thoughts on the future i disagree with needing like multiplayer and such as they i believe are uncessary. This is an epic story being told and some things have no part in that

#6
Aethelwulf1066

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marshalleck wrote...

I'm concerned about the possible deaths as well. If the ME1 love interests really were left out of ME2 for the purpose of saving them for ME3, then that means it's pretty much certain that Tali, Garrus, and everyone else from the current crew will be gone. And that's really going to be a shame, since Legion has so much potential which went untapped due to his 11th hour addition to the team. As disappointing as it will be, at least we'll have had some closure with Tali and Garrus.

I really hope they don't scrap all these characters, but I'm trying to accept that they're as good as gone. And we'll never get to see what Tali looks like under her mask.

But since it has been confirmed as of a few weeks ago that they are currently in the early stages of writing and development for ME3, now is the time to voice these concerns.


I totally agree with you. Hopefully the devs are paying attention to posts like this.

I just don't see the sense of dumping some of these characters, since there's been so much development and growth with them, that you just get rid of them. Of course, there's also the lore side to it, so you can't just make everything like you want it, because it'll conflict with the canon side of things. 

I'd really, really hate to see Legion go. Aside from Tali and Garrus, he's the best character in ME so far. I mean, you've seen and interacted with all the other races in ME, but a Geth? It's like the HK droid in the KOTOR series. Just plain awesome. Completely original. And I really do wish they'd have added him in much earlier in the game. You get him, and then almost right after that, you're at the last mission. Hopefully Bioware adds some DLC missions that flesh out his character and story more.

Regarding Kaiden/Ashley and Liara, I would like to see them disappear. Kaiden was boring (Like Jacob really. Nothing but filler.), Liara seemed a little to bland as well, and I despised Ashley's character (I mean really. As a racist...you'd think she'd be all for Cerberus. That whole Horizon scene really irked me.) because she's a bible thumping racist. I'd hate to see the better characters of ME disappear to make room for those lackluster characters.

I do think we will see some of the former team mates return though, depending on who lived/died. It wouldn't make sense to see them put so much effort into crafting these unique characters for ME2, only to have them gone. So much work for a one-game appearance? Hopefully not.

I am also glad to hear Shepard will be returning. Though i'm sure some people will be miffed that they won't be able to import an all KIA save to ME3. I'm not complaining though.

#7
Foulpancake

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I'm with you on Kaiden and Ashley, disliked em, i was hoping the renegade flashing thingy would appear and let me shoot ashley after i told her off...



dont you dare touch my Liara though, much like i think the game was intending to make me feel, im hurt by her indifference but still love her.

#8
mercenar1e

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Not sure how any of you liked Jack or Miranda.. best characters in Mass Effect 2 are Thane,Grunt & Mordin



Well.. not sure if they are going to read this thread but heres something i would like to see in ME3



Actually doing something on Earth..

#9
Atti Ito

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I completely disagree with your take on Jack. She has a right to be angsty, she went through the most brutal upbringing imaginable. She's not some cliche goth kid who hates her parents for no reason and shops at hot topic, she was terrorized, beaten, raped, and terrorized more. She's been killing people so long it doesn't even bother her anymore. Her childhood was nothing but one long torture session. I felt very sad for her....and really wished she was romancable for femsheps.

#10
Aethelwulf1066

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"I love it, makes the story have more impact and honestly when i finally
get my playthrough the way i like it, im going to have all the
characters i dont like killed off (jack is going bye bye, aint decided
who else) by sending them the wrong way. Oh and shepard dying isnt
really an issue cuz ya know you can always...play again...and...not
die... You know what they say "if at first you dont succed keep on
sucking till you do succeed" or something like that"

Like I said, it wasn't really a dislike. But if I had to choose a category, i'd pick dislike. It does well in conveying that sense of danger and excitement, so you won't hear any arguments from me on that. I'm also fully aware that I can reload and keep playing until I get the results I like. But that can...possibly...end...up as a pain in the ass after doing it so many times. As it is, I was perfectly happy with the outcome of my first playthrough. Only Mordin died, which is acceptable. What I mean, is that it makes me a little nervous in regards to ME3 and the direction they may be taking it in. As someone else said, Shepard will be returning, so that's good. Like the couple other people that have replied, i'm more worried about returning characters, and how this will affect ME3. As for that last sentence...was that really needed? Or perhaps i'm reading that in the wrong context.


"again lack of insight here is shocking...just dont use the save if shepard dies.../boggle"

/Sigh

Again, i'm fully aware of this. And I think you kind of missed the point.

"wtf do you think the normandy is?"

It's a ship. I acknowledged the captain's quarters. But the lack of customization and space was a minor letdown. It seemed like the devs and previews exageratted this feature, as well as the armor customization.

"most of the rest of the
thoughts on the future i disagree with needing like multiplayer and
such as they i believe are uncessary. This is an epic story being told
and some things have no part in that"

I didn't mean deathmatches or CTF when I said multi-player. I don't see any reason why co-op wouldn't be an interesting and fun feature. Though I will agree, it would be a difficult feature to implement.

"I'm with you on Kaiden and Ashley, disliked em, i was hoping the
renegade flashing thingy would appear and let me shoot ashley after i
told her off...

dont you dare touch my Liara though,
much like i think the game was intending to make me feel, im hurt by
her indifference but still love her."

Actually, I thought Liara's reaction to your sudden appearance after two years was the most genuine of all the returning characters from ME1. Garrus was kind of like "Oh, hey, Shepard. What's up?". Tali seemed confused at first, but ultimately seemed unaffected by your sudden reappearance. Ashley acted like she knew you were alive all along, and then went ahead and acted like a...eh, wench. I haven't encountered Wrex yet (First playthrough was without importing a ME1 save.), so I have no idea what his reaction is. Anderson's reaction wasn't believable either.

I was surprised that Liara had turned into such a cold blooded woman though. Completely against the person I thought she was. Seems like she's more like her mother than I thought.

#11
Guest_SwobyJ_*

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Not to get too deep into this, but Ashley isn't xenophobic, nor 'racist'. She IS however a 'country bumpkin' of the ME world, so her comments about the aliens were more out of bemusement and honest security concerns. (still had her die on Virmire)

#12
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Atti Ito wrote...

I completely disagree with your take on Jack. She has a right to be angsty, she went through the most brutal upbringing imaginable. She's not some cliche goth kid who hates her parents for no reason and shops at hot topic, she was terrorized, beaten, raped, and terrorized more. She's been killing people so long it doesn't even bother her anymore. Her childhood was nothing but one long torture session. I felt very sad for her....and really wished she was romancable for femsheps.


I'm not sure if that person even bothered doing either Miranda's or Jack's Loyalty missions. May have, but I don't think so. Jack's a real mental case, but eventually its not in a bad way..just in a sad way.

#13
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mercenar1e wrote...

Not sure how any of you liked Jack or Miranda.. best characters in Mass Effect 2 are Thane,Grunt & Mordin

Well.. not sure if they are going to read this thread but heres something i would like to see in ME3

Actually doing something on Earth..


I don't care if it would spoil me, but I'd love to know if the final battle is around Earth. OMG I would love it.

#14
Aethelwulf1066

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I played both loyalty missions. Which is probably the only reason they lived through my final mission. I don't like Bioware's interpretation of Jack. Some do, some don't. I don't. I thought it was perhaps a little too immature? 

Like whenever she called Miranda a "cheerleader". That irked me. I don't know how old they say she is. Maybe they mentioned it in the game, but I missed it? I can't find it on the ME wiki either. I'd say maybe 23...25 even? For her age, messed up or not, I would have expected her to be a little more mature in her actions and behaviour.  That doesn't mean she can't be a pyschopathic murderer, it just means she's a psychopathic murderer without sounding like she's 16.

I wouldn't expect anyone who went through that kind of crap to come out sane or stable either, but I didn't like the seemingly high school approach they took to it.

As for Miranda...well, I didn't like her personality. Probably because the connection I had with that character was chilled to ice by the time she warmed up, if that makes any sense. I disliked her cold demeanor so much, that by the time she warmed up (And my paragon accidentally stumbled into the first romantic dialogue with her.) that I had no problem shooting her down. With other characters in Bioware games, i've at leasted stopped to consider the option. I just blew Miranda out of the sky immediately.

But again, my opinions on the characters are purely personal.

Modifié par Aethelwulf1066, 28 janvier 2010 - 11:15 .


#15
Guest_Mucho_Nacho_*

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Aethelwulf1066 wrote...

Regarding Kaiden/Ashley and Liara, I would like to see them disappear.



"Disappear" as in "be blown up by a nuke" or simply "friends-zone cameos"? Frankly, I'd like the former option at this point. Not at the expense of replacing any of my squad-mates in ME 2, no, especially not Garrus and Tali (Trio Squad FOREVAR!). That'd crush my amusement factor and make me sad to have the people I trust and like go away. If Kaidan/Ashley and Liara were add-ons, though... I'd get a lot of ****s and giggles out of "making them disappear".  Image IPB
Loyalist Squadies for me, baby! Image IPB

Edit: Clarification.

Modifié par Mucho_Nacho, 28 janvier 2010 - 09:24 .


#16
Kyero

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Uh the armor system is 100 times better, instead of just Retextured. Garrus's armor looks way more epic than anything from ME1. so armor is 100 times better than ME1's same with weapons, just retexture and higher damage, atleast they give you diffrent types, such as powerful 1 shot Snipers and rapid/weaker sniper rifles.



the faster the weapon the easier it takes down shields, the slower the weapon the easier it is to take down armor.

#17
Sardoni

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I like how you didn't like Jack or Miranda.



The characters were all made to inspire emotion. You were inspired by emotional detachment. Hate is still an emotion ;)

#18
BiggieB

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Personally I really liked the depth to miranda aswell, in many ways she is as broken as jack, just different type of emotional damage. Once she warms up she is a cool cat. Oh yeah and after this game Ive got this thing for aussie chicks now. Is that wierd :D

#19
CynixV

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few of my complaints about the game would be the romance part it just seems to be a 1 nighter for every game which is all fine and everything but , I think the choice of ashley or liara in the first one if you were male shouldve carried a little more wait in the 2nd installment. at least in me3 maybe have who you picked at the end at your side and let you carry it farther then just a late night bang before we all go and die type thing.



The Ending Decision on the Collector base doesnt feel like it carries the same Weight as the Let the council die as the first one.



finally the lack of side missions there just arent that many to do compared to the first game but this game is definetly bigger in scope took me around 26 hours to finish it which is more then the 15 in the first.