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[In Exile]

Bioware need to look at their older games to find interesting quests. I haven't played much of their oldest stuff, but I know that middle-aged BW games like kotor had good side quests. Even ME1 had the citadel ones like 'I remember me' and 'Old, unhappy, far-off things' to add some nice stories to Shepard's family history.
Hell, even some of the 'go in a generic base and kill the mercs' had interesting little conversations and role-playing opportunities. For example, the Corporal Toombs, Major Kyle confrontations and the Elanos Haliat nuke quest.

The ME1 UNW quests are no different than the DIA garbage quests, except ME1 also recycled the environment. The only thing DAI didn't do was use the cutscene camera (and had more quests). Major Kyle and Elanos weren't just side quests - they were background quests like I Remember Me so they had higher production values. They're like zone quests more.

They also split their quests in a way they normally don't to make it look like they have more quests. The Crossroads is a really good example.

KOTOR didn't have better designed quests - it just hid the fetch and kill quest aspect better, and very rarely used the find x#s of y garbage fetch quest.

[In Exile]

Bioware fans still going strong!

Honestly I think Bioware is plenty capable of making interesting side stories like in SWTOR base game, I think sometimes they just get lazy or something and stuff disappears.. if they want to get the most value and biggest impact they can't settle for just kind of doing that "main story drive" they go for, instead it should feel immersive and fleshed out.

They didn't do that in DA:I, they just copy-pasted a Skyrim experience, TW3 didn't, and it shows in the gap in sales.

No one talks about Jedi X in the Jedi consular path (as I encountered yesterday) in the forums but honestly those experiences (and random side codex entries) are often just as interesting as the main story.

Like Sylvius the pre-Baldur's Gate sequences in Baldur's Gate I thought were some of the immersive and engaging sequences you found in gaming anywhere.

But that pre BG stuff is exactly the same garbage quest design they used in DAI. Don't take it from me - take it from Sylvius who praises DAI for how closely it tracks BG1.

[Seraphim24]

The ME1 UNW quests are no different than the DIA garbage quests, except ME1 also recycled the environment. The only thing DAI didn't do was use the cutscene camera (and had more quests). Major Kyle and Elanos weren't just side quests - they were background quests like I Remember Me so they had higher production values. They're like zone quests more.

They also split their quests in a way they normally don't to make it look like they have more quests. The Crossroads is a really good example.

KOTOR didn't have better designed quests - it just hid the fetch and kill quest aspect better, and very rarely used the find x#s of y garbage fetch quest.

 

Well it's not always about the nature of the quests (fetch or not), simply the fact that like BG1 had this bigger world to kind of not know where you are going adds to immersion. Even if you don't explore it the fact that it's there makes it more interesting.

 

It's the same in SWTOR, the types of quests aren't always super different, but the style and presence and how their presented changes the experience. Plus they aren't all fetch you know there's scan, find it when you are there, plus they had the dual campaign structure (class and zone simultaneously)

 

It's more than just quests too, in SWTOR you have more variety in companions, more variety in the side to play on (it's pretty hard to play evil in BG but you could do it).

 

Imagine if DA:I had "class quests" alongside the main story I bet you those would of been really popular. TW3 had something like that with the "Witcher contracts" which formed a coherent second train of progression to just treat on it's own grounds.

[dreamgazer]

The ME1 UNW quests are no different than the DIA garbage quests, except ME1 also recycled the environment.

 

Ding, ding, ding. 

[Seraphim24]

I mean honestly i thought the Galactic Starfighter was pretty well done in SWTOR, a totally random side thing. I mean you don't see the people jumping out to say how great these side things are because I don't know they probably aren't as super talkative as the story focused people but there ya go.

[LPPrince]

Hi Reddit Witcher community!

 

Join in pls

[vbibbi]

So i'm assuming most of the stuff in Inquisition fell flat as well then? You need 'Asunder' to really understand Cole or his back story. You need 'The Masked Empire' to know anything about the Wicked Eyes and Wicked Hearts quest line. As well as anything about Celene, Gaspard and Briala besides their names. Also the Imshael and de Chevin stuff. You need DA2 (and it's DLC) to know anything about the plot, Hawke and the main antagonist of the game.

 

BioWare is one of the main offenders of making you play past games and indulging in the EE to understand what the hell is going on.

 

To be fair, I think Bioware only fell into this in DAI. I think games prior to that did not rely on the EE, they just used to EE to augment parts of the games.

 

They are not significant characters in Inquisition, otherwise there is extensive information about all the important characters. The codex helps a lot as well.

 

In beginning of Witcher 3 game you have no idea who Ciri is therefore 70% of the game is you chasing someone you don't know, with more characters greeting you warmly and again you have no idea who they are. I had to ragequit and go back and play previous witcher games.

 

I would argue that Cole, Celene/Briala/Gaspard are significant characters in the game. It's not like there are actually tons of characters to choose from.

 

Now I'm imagining the Reaper destroyer chasing Shepard and bellowing THERE ARE NO STRINGS ON MEEEEEEEE!!!!

 

I ran out of likes, so you get a LOL

 

The ME1 UNW quests are no different than the DIA garbage quests, except ME1 also recycled the environment. The only thing DAI didn't do was use the cutscene camera (and had more quests). Major Kyle and Elanos weren't just side quests - they were background quests like I Remember Me so they had higher production values. They're like zone quests more.

They also split their quests in a way they normally don't to make it look like they have more quests. The Crossroads is a really good example.

KOTOR didn't have better designed quests - it just hid the fetch and kill quest aspect better, and very rarely used the find x#s of y garbage fetch quest.

 

Not all of them, no, but a lot of the side quests I thought had lots of dialogue choices and varying choices and outcomes. The meat of the side quests has remained consistent, but the level of care in varying the presentation was better in previous games. Most side quests in DAI had no variation in PC options or outcome and there was minimal dialogue. And that was for side quests that even involved speaking to a person rather than just going from note to hidden cache.

[panzerwzh]

Eskel & lambert save the day!

 

If MEA has 80% of the writing and quest design quality if TW3, I would totally pre-order it.

[skarbonke]

how can you people fall for this bait thread

[vbibbi]

how can you people fall for this bait thread

No one has been responding to the ideas in the OP since the first few pages. The thread took on a life of its own.

[dreamgazer]

how can you people fall for this bait thread

 

Most of the people in here, the ones that made this thread 48 pages, didn't. 

[Mihura]

Hi Reddit Witcher community!

 

Join in pls

 

A topic in the Witcher Reddit about a post in the Bioware forum, discussing The Witcher in ME:A.
 
"Yeah, but they have magical powers. It's not your typical grrrrl power fantasy nonsense where regular women constantly outsmart men (who in reality built the entire world) and embarrass them with their superiority. I can suspend disbelief for magic wielding sorceresses. Outside of the sorcerers, every woman is basically a dumb peasant."

I love how people complain about the depravity that is BSN with the SJW games but do, exactly the same thing with different concepts. That topic made me laugh as much as this one. Both communities are quite out of touch, especially when it comes to comum sense.

[LPPrince]

A topic in the Witcher Reddit about a post in the Bioware forum, discussing The Witcher in ME:A.
 
"Yeah, but they have magical powers. It's not your typical grrrrl power fantasy nonsense where regular women constantly outsmart men (who in reality built the entire world) and embarrass them with their superiority. I can suspend disbelief for magic wielding sorceresses. Outside of the sorcerers, every woman is basically a dumb peasant."

I love how people complain about the depravity that is BSN with the SJW games but do, exactly the same thing with different concepts. That topic made me laugh as much as this one. Both communities are quite out of touch, especially when it comes to comum sense.

 

 

I wouldn't let one person define a whole community. Though there are loads in both who I'm sure are *shakes head*

[Mihura]

I wouldn't let one person define a whole community. Though there are loads in both who I'm sure are *shakes head*

 

When I talk about communities, is more about people that self identify with the game, to a point of being defensive. 

Overall there are only three of four really good grounded posts, with actually facts from both games. And being a past client of The Witcher forums, I can say that is not even the worst of it. It is not comum to see unbiased people on both side.

 

[LPPrince]

When I talk about communities, is more about people that self identify with the game, to a point of defende it with laughable arguments. 

Overall there are only three of four really good grounded posts, with actually facts from both games. And being a past client of The Witcher forums, I can say that is not even the worst of it. It is not comum to see unbiased people on both side.

 

 

 

I try to be, though I'm sure every individual has some bias to their opinions. Even when trying to be unbiased.

[Mihura]

I try to be, though I'm sure every individual has some bias to their opinions. Even when trying to be unbiased.

 

True, well let us say then seeing the good and the bad, in each game, without extremes.

[LPPrince]

True, well let us say then seeing the good and the bad, in each game, without extremes.

 

 

Fair enough.