I can hate DA:I and not be a bigot just in case people are wondering. I can appreciate DA:I's efforts at diversity, without liking a single element of the game except the original soundtrack (not its implementation, though) and the.....graphics.
I hate how DA:I "subtly" handles diversity (in addition to almost everything else), and I'm still not a bigot in case you are wondering.
...so you're basically asking for a simulator of perfect society where everyone is treated equally and where is no xeno/******/other-fobia, .
As much as it is a beautiful dream... where's the fun in that? I want flaws, bigotry and stupidity to be present. Not because I'm against women and minorities, but because I want to react to these issues.
They are. But it's not encouraging the player to act like an ****** to women and POC in real life - it just shows that these issues exist and that some people are simply ******.
I hate how DA:I "subtly" handles diversity (in addition to almost everything else), and I'm still not a bigot in case you are wondering.
Josephine is the most beautiful romance you've seen? What? It was totally boring.
And about that diversity... is your idea of diversity having every possible sexuality, race and gender within the same castle, that are all important characters? It was hamfisted and clearly pandering-- no it was terrible. Even Kotaku admits they were "Sugarcoating it", and normally Kotaku is part of the circlejerk.
I'm offended on behalf of people of different sexualities and skin-color than myself 
I hope we might get a game soon that has a female OR a black protagonist without drawing attention to itself by having every other minority or majority (whatever) represented alongside it. If you have that much "diversity" at the same time it suddenly feels more like homogenization.
Also, to use a great point a certain MrBtongue made, Witcher 3 is an example of diversity as opposed to tokenism: It makes gaming as a whole feel more diverse despite of having almost no black characters, because it "feels polish"; a country that has been historically very white and Witcher takes inspiration from Poland's slavically cultured history.
We don't need more pandering to blacks, asians or LGBT; we need more blacks, asians and LGBT AND women making games that represent themselves IMHO because then it won't feel forced or added for the sake of pleasing people.
Bioware's (and several other AAA devs') ideas about diversity is Anti-Art because Art is all about authenticity and honesty and there is nothing honest in the way multiple races and genders and sexualities are represented so hamfistedly in a game like DA:I. It's forced. Shoehorned and dishonest.
At least the most artistic merit it has is that it will be remembered as a biproduct of a time when people were desperate to seem like very generous and good in attempts to bring justice to all the mis- or underrepresented people in popular media. I just hope that soon this trend will calm down and we will start to see the effect of the awareness that's been created paying off as new and authentic pieces of art within gaming take shape that represents people of LGBT or racial minorities without being so aggressively handled.
Josephine the most beautiful romance I have ever experienced. Ever since Mass Effect I was reluctant to do romance as the sex scenes always make me feel uncomfortable. I always hoped that one day BioWare would write a romance where the peoples don't have sex. She is also a person of colour, an intelligent women with a great unerstanding of politics.
I agree with you on this part.
Wait, what?
Yeah im stumped too lol
Dragon Age: Inquisition proved to be one of the most endearing, thought provoking gaming experiences I've had in a long time. I find it hard to play any other game because of this.
The only BioWare games I have ever played are the Mass Effect trilogy.I wasn't interested in Dragon Age but I decided to give Inquisition a go and I am glad I did so.
Inquisition in my opinion is a symbol of a transitioning culture. Womens in the game are treated with much more respect in their representation as opposed to what we saw in Mass Effect, where an entire race was invented to appease sexists and misogynists. The one example of a genetically modified transhuman was shown to be but an artificial sex doll with a personality that revolved around insecurities about men, no thanks to her father.
This is crucial as we make the transition into a much more respectful, unified society. Other points I'd like to touch on is diversity. There is much thoughtfulness and artistry put into this game it is simply mindblowing. BioWare created a perfect balance between gameplay, plot and diverse character representation. By creating open but limited open worlds and reducing much of the plots for quests to codex entries allowed greater focus on the progressive and moral examples of the characters and the story. For instance, we have Vivienne. She is an intelligent circle mage who understands the importance of the circle and why it is necessary. She is also a person of color. To me this is a fantastic representation of a diverse characer.
Cassandra was also a high point. Finally a strong, down to earth realistic female charaacer, definied by her strong faith and her hardened exterior, prove to be much more complex as we learn she has an appreciation for romantic ideals.
Josephine the most beautiful romance I have ever experienced. Ever since Mass Effect I was reluctant to do romance as the sex scenes always make me feel uncomfortable. I always hoped that one day BioWare would write a romance where the peoples don't have sex. She is also a person of colour, an intelligent women with a great unerstanding of politics.
I also like how BioWare allowed us as player charactrs to give people second chances and redeem them as was the case with Blackwall. Everybody deserves a second chance and Blackwall understood the errors of his ways although he was secretive about his identity.
In a nutshell this is the direction BioWare should strive in. Condense gameplay but obvisly make it fun, while writing story and characters who are diverse. Give us great examples of accepting and understanding diffrent people. I'm not saying Dragon Age: Inquisition was perfect by the way. Because it isn't. Exaample is Sera. I don't understand why she was in this game not only did she not fit the Inquisition she did not fit the message that this game conveys. There are no place for bigots in this cultural shift we are experiencing. Some say that she was put in the game to appeal to these type of peoples and men with lesbian fantasies and I am of the opinion that this is wrong. Her transphobic attitude was utterly offensive and she isn't very mature. Lesbians deserve a much better representation in my opinion.
Overrall I hope the team working on Mass Effect Andromeda will take a leaft out of Dragon Age: Inquistion and use it as a building block to be better.
What have you been smoking? The Asari might be "blue babes" but that alone is not sexist, in fact the Asari are a role model for empowered female characters (they have no gender, but they can all give birth so we see them as female - females who do everything: From building roads, vehicles, to driving the sciences to raising kids: The Asari do it all, they are even the leaders of galactic society, so where you see sexism I see a female power fantasy (more or less - without calling it sexist!))...look at LIARA:
She's a scientist, she's badass with biotics, she's self-sufficient (she goes on remote digs more or less alone or with few people with her!)
Still, I agree that women have been sometimes used only for sex-appeal in games, but you've got to remember:
Most gamers are STILL male (despite a lot of women who play video-games, the core audience is and will probably always stay: MALE!)
I mean in sitcoms and soap operas it's the other way round (like in commercials!): Men are shown as blundering fools who need the guiding hand of a woman to even get by!
Also:
DA:I did a lot of things right, but it still played like a single-player-MMO (loads of filler/fetch-quests, respawning enemies (damned, that pissed me off!))
You cite VIVIENNE as enlightened? Damned, she's a close minded BIGOT IMHO (she likes mages locked up - as long as she's an exception and gets power out of it!)
I agree on Cassandra 
like her a lot!
Disagree on Josy, her romance is so cliché and she's so complicated (something that's also said about women...)
ps: Leave Miranda alone - she's no sex-doll (you are truly ignorant, aren't you? Did you even talk to Miri and really listen?)...you can dislike her, but bashing her for that is a blatant LIE!
pps: I am of the opinion that you are wrong - and close minded! Not to mention a bigot!
Also which unified society? Feminists try to put women on pedestals and MRAs and MGTOWs vilify all woman for it (and politicians enable those loud mouthed radical feminists (divorce courts - enough said IMHO))...I mean there's women who hate that feminsm puts them in the perpetual victim role and who fight against it (so if Feminism was so great: Why'd they fight it? - No, they've not been brainwashed by the "patriarchy" (utter BS, there isn't a patriarchy anymore, if there ever was in the first place!))
Note: I am not an MRA, I am not a MGTOW - I am just a person who'd love TOTAL equality and that means that women would have to sign up for the draft, would receive equal court sentences, divore, custody and alimony hearings wouldn't favour them so much etc. (oh and no more women only programs and such - it's boys/men who are the loosers in education ATM, who are most likely do be drop-outs, unemployed and homeless!)
Oh oh oh... i am not standing for that
Neither was the Turian who got added. She was quite lovely.
This be a good opportunity for BioWare to dazzle their audiences by cresting new diverse alien races too they already retconned an elabrated by featuring an androgynous asari but in addition to this they could add more androgynist type alien races.
The next step after featuring transgender characters in my opinion is to create races that non binary and otherkin could perhaps relate to as I feel it's important that people feel comfortable expressing they're identity an not everybody feels comfagtable in their own skin. Say for example some people feel more akin to canines and felines than human BioWare with the proper research into non binary identities could add a race and create charcaters accordingly that peoples can relate to.
Have you seen Hanar or the Keepers? I'm pretty positive they're non-binary. Or at least, they seemed like it.
There are other ways of telling story of conflicts Dragon Age Inquisition did this perfectly with the mage vs templar wars and there was enough bigotry with the wicked eyes wicked harts quest if you played amy race that wasn't human. It was done so in manner that didn't offend ethnic minorties as I said the only gripe I had was Sera expressing her transphobic views thankfy BioWare let us kick her out but I question why they put such charcarter in game in the first place.
In all the let's plays and femimist frequency vid I saw about the Witcher 3 I did not see one person of color everybody was white and the people acted disgustingly and immaturity with fart noise and so forth like Sera. On top of that I refuse to play such a disgusting false representation of man charcater. I'm an heteromantic asexual male and I respect women I can't relate to Geraldt.
Might wanna queue up the PoC [stats for] who actually live in Poland before questioning the lack of 'em in the game (the game isn't American or even Western European, for that matter).
Wait, what?
Yeah, someone hasn't seen the Mona Lisa before. The tricky little wench.
Wait, what?
That whole post just reeks of sophomore undergrad, honestly.
I can hate DA:I and not be a bigot just in case people are wondering. I can appreciate DA:I's efforts at diversity, without liking a single element of the game except the original soundtrack (not its implementation, though) and the.....graphics.
And what about Solas ?
Prolly gonna get blasted but…oh well…
DAI was indeed progressive in terms of gender. In terms of race…meh, not so much, but OK. Well done Bioware for making cool female characters that are more than just sex dolls.
HOWEVER…
DAI was utterly and completely boring. There was nothing at stake in terms of the CHARACTERS.
For me, a good RPG has something more than just a group of progressive folks. It has risk. It has CONSEQUENCES. It has gravitas.
And the DAI characters, while ‘progressive’, were a friggen snooze-fest. No one had strong opinions. No one was a jerk. Everyone was just so understanding (with the possible exception of Sera) that they were just…blah. Absolutely nothing was at stake in terms of your relationship with them.
No one walked out when I allied with the mages. Despite the fact that magic is supposed to be a super controversial thing in this world. No one came down on me for destroying the qunari alliance by saving my crew. Varric didn’t walk out one me even though I let his best friend die! My actions NEVER changed any of my relationships AT ALL. They all remained with me and they all lived.
Such noble folks. Yawn.
My first play through or ME1? I had to kill Wrex!! Why? I couldn’t talk him down and had to kill him. And I was DEVASTATED because I really liked Wrex and understood where he was coming from. That sucked. It had gravitas.
In ME1 you have to choose between 2 squadmates. Life or death. Someone does not get a happy ending. Gravitas.
My first run of ME2? Lost 2 squadmates because I risked the relay before finishing a few personal quests. I was so torn. I had to get to my captured people as soon as possible, but I knew there still some issues on the ship’s crew. But a decision had to be made and I made it. It was harsh, but it had to be done. Again, gravitas.
In ME3, my decisions decided the fate of an entire species? And I lost alliances to save the Krogan. Why? Because I loved Wrex and I felt that his death in ME1 should mean something. I wanted to make it up to him and his people. It had major feels!
And choosing between the Geth and the quarians? Synthetic versus organic? In my opinion, this was rich and complex. ..and a helluva lot better done than the mage versus templar stuff in DAI.
Yes, there was the nipple shirt of Jack, the never-ending butt-crack of Miranda, and the vagina of the sex-bot Edi. Those were bad. I agree. I agree with the sentiment that we should have more in depth characters who are more than sex objects or meatheads. By all means, be progressive. But please...don’t give me a cast of watered down characters to do it.
Some thoughts on this:
Things going for DAI:
Things going against DAI:
Implications for MEA:
Some thoughts on this:
Things going for DAI:
- Interesting stories, on the whole, some great characters
- The world was bigger, so lots to explore
- Combat worked well
- It looked great (except on last gen)
Things going against DAI:
- The Frostbite engine was brutal to customize, not entirely with success (particularly with PC controls)
- Procedural animations failed to match animated cutscenes
- As the animations were weak with side content, the weakness of that filler was exposed (particularly in the Hinterlands)
- Over-emphasis on power points and collectibles (bottles ! Shards ! Mosaics !!!!)
- Accommodating last gen held it back
Implications for MEA:
- BioWare have had a go working on their new toy (Frostbite). MEA should benefit from that learning.
- MEA should be able to learn from a more mature and complex approach to romance
- Some hard lessons should have been learned about 'filler'.
- In short, great that MEA is not the first 'next gen' game.
Yeah i agree
No this my first time on BSN I joined two days ago. The Witcher 3 is a disgusting game I don't understand why something so vile and bigotted could be so popular.
im pretty sure the witcher 3 is alot more then just "sexism"
What have you been smoking? The Asari might be "blue babes" but that alone is not sexist, in fact the Asari are a role model for empowered female characters (they have no gender, but they can all give birth so we see them as female - females who do everything: From building roads, vehicles, to driving the sciences to raising kids: The Asari do it all, they are even the leaders of galactic society, so where you see sexism I see a female power fantasy (more or less - without calling it sexist!))...look at LIARA:
She's a scientist, she's badass with biotics, she's self-sufficient (she goes on remote digs more or less alone or with few people with her!)
Still, I agree that women have been sometimes used only for sex-appeal in games, but you've got to remember:
Most gamers are STILL male (despite a lot of women who play video-games, the core audience is and will probably always stay: MALE!)
I mean in sitcoms and soap operas it's the other way round (like in commercials!): Men are shown as blundering fools who need the guiding hand of a woman to even get by!
Also:
DA:I did a lot of things right, but it still played like a single-player-MMO (loads of filler/fetch-quests, respawning enemies (damned, that pissed me off!))
You cite VIVIENNE as enlightened? Damned, she's a close minded BIGOT IMHO (she likes mages locked up - as long as she's an exception and gets power out of it!)
I agree on Cassandra
Disagree on Josy, her romance is so cliché and she's so complicated (something that's also said about women...)
ps: Leave Miranda alone - she's no sex-doll (you are truly ignorant, aren't you? Did you even talk to Miri and really listen?)...you can dislike her, but bashing her for that is a blatant LIE!
pps: I am of the opinion that you are wrong - and close minded! Not to mention a bigot!
Also which unified society? Feminists try to put women on pedestals and MRAs and MGTOWs vilify all woman for it (and politicians enable those loud mouthed radical feminists (divorce courts - enough said IMHO))...I mean there's women who hate that feminsm puts them in the perpetual victim role and who fight against it (so if Feminism was so great: Why'd they fight it? - No, they've not been brainwashed by the "patriarchy" (utter BS, there isn't a patriarchy anymore, if there ever was in the first place!))
Note: I am not an MRA, I am not a MGTOW - I am just a person who'd love TOTAL equality and that means that women would have to sign up for the draft, would receive equal court sentences, divore, custody and alimony hearings wouldn't favour them so much etc. (oh and no more women only programs and such - it's boys/men who are the loosers in education ATM, who are most likely do be drop-outs, unemployed and homeless!)
I enjoyed DAI as well. Good game
So did I, its funny how many people think its impossible that yeah many people love dragon age inquisition.
I liked the game BECAUSE I played dragon age origins and I knew all the characters and lore, I played the game six time and I intend to do it a seventh time.
im pretty sure the witcher 3 is alot more then just "sexism"
quick question: i dont think i would enjoy me 2 or 3 without playin the previous ones before... the same goes for dai? will i have a good time having not played origins and da2?
quick question: i dont think i would enjoy me 2 or 3 without playin the previous ones before... the same goes for dai? will i have a good time having not played origins and da2?
*complaining about TW3*
This thread is about DAI, but just in passing:
That's not to say that on youtube and some forums that TW3 was seen as a 'poster boy' for some bigoted gamers
which is a shame because that was not what the game was actually like.
I'm presuming you've never played the game as your views seem to be totally out of step with reality?
Retour en haut
