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[KotorEffect3]

Since the other thread had people bickering about social justice I thought we should have a thread actually discussing DAI as a game and how MEA as a game can take pointers from it or avoid some it's pitfalls.  Once again I want this thread to be about the actual games and not an argument about social justice.  I don't care where you stand on it but keep your social justice opinion out of this thread.  I will  now paste what I said in the other thread.

 

I think there are both pointers MEA can take from DAI as well as pitfalls DAI made that MEA should avoid.  In this sense I am glad that the DA team was the first  bioware team to get a crack at the frostbite engine.  The ME team benefits from seeing what was done and what the feedback was.  Pitfalls to be avoided would be things like how sidequests were designed and how filler content was used to pad the game out.  Things I liked were the creative level design (something I expect MEA to surpass DAI in), the keep system in which we captured keeps and used them as mini hubs for the inquisition.  I can see a similar thing working well in MEA in which maybe we construct and hold bases on different planets.  I actually enjoyed the war table and while it wasn't perfect I liked tinkering with the different scenarios from it,  Now while it wasn't perfect I liked the idea of it because it allowed us to see the bigger picture of what we were doing.  Now I don't expect Ryder to have the same level authority that the Inquisitor had but I believe as the story progresses we will have more pull and influence in the expedition and as planets and resources are gained we will need to manage in a similar way the Inquisitor managed the inquisition.  For example I can see us sending out diplomatic envoys to secure trade agreements or military alliances with non hostile species or sending out military forces to hold or even gain new colonial assets.

 

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[Addictress]

What DAI did well:
Graphics, pretty landscapes (respect the artists)
Music, but the music was rarely heard and didn't help create an immersive atmosphere
Solas, but his role and lore reveal were already planned a long time ago.


Literally nothing else. Not the war table, not the main plot, not the dialogue, not the writing, no tactics, bugged combat, nothing.

[Xilizhra]

Literally nothing else. Not the war table, not the main plot, not the dialogue, not the writing, no tactics, bugged combat, nothing.

Might you elaborate on that?

[Addictress]

Might you elaborate on that?

I've ranted about these things so much in other threads. You'll never be convinced no matter how thoroughly and logically I list the endless problems.

I exist and I'm not alone. To say this was the most disappointing game is an understatement. I felt betrayed. I also feel it an injustice ME3, a great game in my opinion, received more ridicule and hate than this game.

[Xilizhra]

I've ranted about these things so much in other threads. You'll never be convinced no matter how thoroughly and logically I list the endless problems.

I exist and I'm not alone. To say this was the most disappointing game is an understatement. I felt betrayed. I also feel it an injustice ME3, a great game in my opinion, received more ridicule and hate than this game.

Oddly, I've never seen any of said threads. I might agree with you in some areas.

[Beerfish]

If we don't have shard hunting in MEA then no sale for me.

[SofaJockey]

DAI was my favourite game of 2014 - I invested over 1,000 hours into it.

That's not to say it didn't have its faults, but what game doesn't?

 

I'm optimistic about MEA building upon (some of) that formula.

 

2 pitfalls to avoid:

• The side content needs to be more immersive/relevant.
• Procedural animation needs to actually work.

[Arcian]

OP, telling people not to bicker about something is an implicit invitation for people to bicker about something.

[fizzypop]

What DAI did well:
Graphics, pretty landscapes (respect the artists)
Music, but the music was rarely heard and didn't help create an immersive atmosphere
Solas, but his role and lore reveal were already planned a long time ago.


Literally nothing else. Not the war table, not the main plot, not the dialogue, not the writing, no tactics, bugged combat, nothing.

Though I would add companions to this. I felt DAI really did a great job with companions and the romance department. The interactions were believable. Too bad the rest of the story was so lackluster.

[Han Shot First]

The main thing is just not to prioritize open world exploration over the characters populating the world. DA:I's main failing was that it was trying to be Skyrim. Side characters were treated like an afterthought and the storytelling shifted away from encounters with interesting characters to finding notes and books scattered about. The open world maps may have been beautiful, but they were also lacking in interesting or immersive content.

[fizzypop]

OP, telling people not to bicker about something is an implicit invitation for people to bicker about something.

I had to try really hard not to say "but what about the male privilege that Gaf so obviously throws around?"

[lynroy]

If we don't have shard hunting in MEA then no sale for me.

No shards? PREORDER CANCELLED!

[The Elder King]

I've ranted about these things so much in other threads. You'll never be convinced no matter how thoroughly and logically I list the endless problems.
I exist and I'm not alone. To say this was the most disappointing game is an understatement. I felt betrayed. I also feel it an injustice ME3, a great game in my opinion, received more ridicule and hate than this game.

Some people might not be convinced because you have different opinions on the game's plot, story, characters, gameplay, etc. Though there are people who enjoyed the game and share some of your criticism.
As for ME3, evidently more people think DAI is better (or not as much bad) then ME3.

[Iakus]

I actually liked the War Table missions.  They were an opportunity to expand the story beyond what the Inquisitor personally witnesses.  Letting us make more far-reaching choices without devoting too many zots to it.

 

Could it have been done better?  Sure.  But the concept is sound

[dreamgazer]

If we don't have shard hunting in MEA then no sale for me.

I'm betting that we'll be locating insignias and medallions and writings again.

But oh, yeah, that's right, this was new to Inquisition and all.

[dreamgazer]

I actually liked the War Table missions.  They were an opportunity to expand the story beyond what the Inquisitor personally witnesses.  Letting us make more far-reaching choices without devoting too many zots to it.
 
Could it have been done better?  Sure.  But the concept is sound

It was essentially a tabletop game in a cRPG that mimics a tabletop game. I enjoyed it.

[In Exile]

The main thing is just not to prioritize open world exploration over the characters populating the world. DA:I's main failing was that it was trying to be Skyrim. Side characters were treated like an afterthought and the storytelling shifted away from encounters with interesting characters to finding notes and books scattered about. The open world maps may have been beautiful, but they were also lacking in interesting or immersive content.

When you say populating the world, do you mean literally the issued they had with having characters on screen or that not very many NPCs talk?

[The Elder King]

When you say populating the world, do you mean literally the issued they had with having characters on screen or that not very many NPCs talk?

I think both things are needed.

[Gramorla]

I like DA:I: It cured me from my urge to complet a game 100%, because... too many sidequests and buggy items that stuck in walls etc ^^

 

and i really liked the dialogues with the companions. I prefer the ME franchaise.. but DA:I was still a enjoyable game

[Iakus]

Other things DAI did well:

 

Armor that looked like ARMOR!

Minimal stripperiffic outfits, and the option to equip something else instead

Story gave us ideas to think about rather than telling us what to think.

Tone icons for certain reactions

 

Things to avoid:

 

Boring, non-immersive side quests

Dull, overly specialized talent trees (please don't give us an entire tree just for cryo ammo!)

Don't try to nudge people into doing MP by offering SP rewards for it without providing a SP path to the same reward.

[fizzypop]

I actually liked the War Table missions.  They were an opportunity to expand the story beyond what the Inquisitor personally witnesses.  Letting us make more far-reaching choices without devoting too many zots to it.

 

Could it have been done better?  Sure.  But the concept is sound

God no it was the worst part of DAI. I could just ignore it and have been just as happy as if I had done any of it. You never see the results so it really doesn't matter. You have to spend real time hours dedicated to doing a mission that means nothing for the story and could have just disappeared into the nether no one would have noticed. No way of doing it while not in your home base means you waste time going back and forth just to finish up a non-existent mission before you actually do the story you want to do. Take the missions on the war table and put those hours towards more story content.

[Addictress]

Though I would add companions to this. I felt DAI really did a great job with companions and the romance department. The interactions were believable. Too bad the rest of the story was so lackluster.

I don't even think the companions were good. They didn't have any real motivations apart from the inquisition, nor did they really have any strong reasons to be a part of the inquisition. Dorian was good but I felt his side missions were not that great, and if you didn't choose In Hushed Whispers, you didn't really get to see what makes him tick, except as an info dump when you talked to him in the Skyhold library. Which is like saying 50% of the game gives you no true character development for Dorian. Iron Bull was completely different from any other Qunari we've ever met. It basically spat in the face of the world-building of the previous games. What, give him a bro personality and a bro Freddie Prince Jr voice just 'cause he's big? Although he struggles with the Qun, he is still fresh from the Qun and should act like other Qunari or behave like them - and if you want to slowly develop the Qunari into a more diverse nation, which is a respectable goal, then start out with a familiar position and then through that have him take measured steps into something more unique. Otherwise it's just a jarring and reckless break. Sera was.... uh.... literally none of her cache is revealed or seen to contribute to their efforts, and besides the cache, we fight some dudes in some random area and then one supposed 'noble' is standing there talking about some land squabble we never see. None of that scene really demonstrates what exactly she is doing. It doesn't really come together until Solas speaks about her overall strategy in party banters - that she is upsetting nobility (not to replace, but just to keep them on their toes). She is supposed to be helping the little people, except we never see those little people, or her helping them. And on and on.

[Han Shot First]

I actually liked the War Table missions.  They were an opportunity to expand the story beyond what the Inquisitor personally witnesses.  Letting us make more far-reaching choices without devoting too many zots to it.
 
Could it have been done better?  Sure.  But the concept is sound

This.

The war table is DA:I's Mako. Good concept, poor execution, I'd rather see it improved than discarded entirely.

[Iakus]

I'm betting that we'll be locating insignias and medallions and writings again.

But oh, yeah, that's right, this was new to Inquisition and all.

Given the who "exploration" and "colonization" thing, I'm betting something more along the lines of blue crystals and vespine gas 

[The Elder King]

God no it was the worst part of DAI. I could just ignore it and have been just as happy as if I had done any of it. You never see the results so it really doesn't matter. You have to spend real time hours dedicated to doing a mission that means nothing for the story and could have just disappeared into the nether no one would have noticed. No way of doing it while not in your home base means you waste time going back and forth just to finish up a non-existent mission before you actually do the story you want to do. Take the missions on the war table and put those hours towards more story content.

I don't think you'd get that much zots from the war table missione for making a lot of story content. Like the non-cinematic dialogues, they are made to expand the game's content without using too many resources.