19 odpowiedzi w tym temacie

[HikariWS]

I just finished my first playthrou, it was awesome! I became king and left to search for Morrigan. Just started the campain.

 

Paralel to that, I'm starting new playthrou. This time I want Alistair to be king and will romance Leliana, and don't wanna have a child again with Morrigan. I'll be forced to die I suppose. But I fear that will affect DA1 campains and future games. If I die, how will I do Morrigan campain, Awakening and future games?

 

Won't I be able to import my character? Or will he just ressurect? Can Alistair be king and die to archdemon?

[nightscrawl]

Alistair can be king and still die to the Archdemon. A portion of it depends on whether he is hardened or not. If he is NOT hardened, he takes the choice out of your hands and says, "I know I'll make a terrible king; this is the best king I can be," and sacrifices himself. I know this because this is what happened to me on my very first play. He was made king, not hardened, not a romance, and sacrificed himself regardless of dialogue options chosen; I did the final fight three or so times to try and change it. Alternately, you can also order him to sacrifice himself. I'm not entirely certain how this works if he is hardened and king versus still a grey warden.

 

If you want to die, but are unsure whether Alistair will automatically sacrifice himself, the surest way to have this happen will be to leave him at the Denerim gates during the final fight.

 

Awakening and the DLC allow you to play as your Warden. If they performed the Ultimate Sacrifice, they are simply not dead, that choice is reversed. They don't "come back to life" or anything like that, they're not a zombie, it's just as if it didn't happen. Also, importing your Warden, whether alive or dead, is the ONLY way to play DAA (and other DLC) with your same world state. If you want to have your Warden be dead and stay dead, you play as a generic Orlesian Warden and there is a default world state; your choices are not imported.

 

For DA2, the result is negligible. There will be a scene where King Alistair or Queen Anora appear, but that's all. It will go with your result from DAO, ignoring the fact that you played with your dead Warden in DAA. In that case, Alistair would be king (if you made him king) since your Warden is dead.

 

In DAI, because they have to account for the possibility of the Dark Ritual not being completed, the Old God Baby (Kieran) is not really that significant. Sure, there are specific cutscenes involving him, but his existence is not integral to the plot or world. It just can't be because there is the likelihood that he doesn't exist, including in Bioware's own default world state.

 

But either way, both Morrigan and Flemeth still appear in DAI, but their interaction is different depending on the existence of Kieran.

 

 

Don't forget that you MUST use the DA Keep to set your choices for DAI. You may import your DAO/2 characters, but that only takes their name, gender, origin, class, and the small portrait you see in the game. That is all. You must enter in your decisions by hand for those two games.

[Ghost Gal]

What nightscrawl said.

 

If you don't want to perform the Dark Ritual with Morrigan, you've got a few options:

 

1) If you want both your Warden and King Alistair to survive but just don't personally want be the one to make a baby with Morrigan, you can always have Alistair perform the ritual with her. That way, neither of you have to die and you don't have to be the one to sleep with Morrigan; your Warden can ride off into the sunset with Leliana, and Alistair can remain King.

 

2) If you want both your Warden and King Alistair to survive but just don't want to do the ritual period, then if you harden Alistair and have him agree to become King and enter an arranged marriage with Anora before the Landsmeet, then you can recruit Loghain to sacrifice to the Archdemon without getting Alistair so mad that he refuses to become king and goes off to become a wandering drunk. (If you recruit Loghain he always leaves your party in disgust, but if hardened and made to agreed to marry Anora before the Landsmeet he'll honor his agreement even though he's furious about the situation). That way, after you refuse Morrigan's ritual then you can just have Loghain sacrifice himself to the Archdemon, that way you'll survive the Blight and King Alistair will still lead Ferelden, even though he's still mad at you.

 

3) What nightscrawl said. You can die slaying the Archdemon by either hardening Alistair and convincing him you should be the one to do it, or leave him at the gate below. Or just let Alistair sacrifice himself.

 

Your Warden can still come back for the expansion and DLCs even if you died performing the ultimate sacrifice, but it's kind of silly since none of the characters acknowledge that you're supposed to be dead. If you don't import your character, then you have to use a new, generic Orlesian Warden with the "standard" worldstae, but your choices from the main game can't be imported. (Kind of ridiculous, in my opinion.)

 

King Alistair in future games: Since different worldstates have to account for so many player choices, they're not strictly that big a deal in the long run. If you make Alistair king, he only makes a quick cameo in Awakening, DA2, and DAI, and that's it. (Even if you don't personally like Anora, the country doesn't fall to chaos with her on the throne.)

 

Morrigan in future games: She still shows up in Witch Hunt and DAI, but her dialogue and character development changes based on whether you befriended her, romanced her, and/or gave her a kid. She's obviously much warmer if you befriended and/or romanced her. If you had a kid with her, obviously she's sweet because she had a child with the man she loves. If she got pregnant through other means (like Alistair performing the Dark Ritual for us Lady Wardens), she's still much warmer person because raising a child taught her so much.

 

We still don't know what Morrigan (and/or Flemeth) intends to do with the soul of the Old God, but so far nothing nefarious has happened. Since BioWare has to account for worldstates where Morrigan didn't do the ritual, I'm guessing it's not super plot-changing. But personally I LOVE Morrigan as a mother; she's grown so much as a person. To me, the kid with the Old God's soul is so interesting (you'll see when you get there), so I personally think the kid is worth his weight in gold. I have a hard time making a worldstate without him.

 

Finally, worldstates: You can directly upload DAO save files into DA2, but you can't upload any DAO or DA2 save files into DAI. For that, you have to use the Dragon Age Keep, where you personally hand-craft every DAO and DA2 worldstate to upload into DAI if you don't want to use DAI's default worldstate (female Dalish Warden who sacrificed herself to the Archdemon, for starters). It's not so bad since every quest comes with a "default" choice, so you just change it to suit your world worldstate as you go. The Keep also lets you make at least ten worldstates to upload into DAI, so you don't have to worry about having all your Wardens' saves on file in order to upload into DAI. No fuss, no muss.

[Akiza]

Nah you can make Alistair king if you wish and recruit Loghain than use him to kill the dragon.

[Akiza]

 

 

Morrigan in future games: She still shows up in Witch Hunt and DAI, but her dialogue and character development changes based on whether you befriended her, romanced her, and/or gave her a kid. She's obviously much warmer if you befriended and/or romanced her. If you had a kid with her, obviously she's sweet because she had a child with the man she loves. If she got pregnant through other means (like Alistair performing the Dark Ritual for us Lady Wardens), she's still much warmer person because raising a child taught her so much.

 

 

In DAI she is mostly the same and 95% of her dialogues and actions are the same regardless of what you did in DAO.

[Ghost Gal]

In DAI she is mostly the same and 95% of her dialogues and actions are the same regardless of what you did in DAO.

 

Really? I thought she came across as a little more aloof.

 

I'm always told Alistair is the same character whether you harden him or not and the only thing that's different is how he behaves at the Landsmeet, but by gum if he wasn't so much more suspicious, grumpy, and snippy to me. It had me crying, "I want the Alistair I love back!"

[Catilina]

A little addition to Morrigan, If the warden follow her through the Eluvian (DA:I) (Perhaps someone dont know this moment)

 

Spoiler

[German Soldier]

Choices in between games(DA keep) don't have a meaning since they are mostly nullified to reach the same outcome unless they were variables killer.

As for the witch i never did that experiment called the Dark ritual because i find disgusting the idea of  using a child as a lab rat.

I will not permit to use a child to save a dinosaur and then make him an imbecile again in DAI because of what happen.......

[Catilina]

 

Choices in between games(DA keep) don't have a meaning since they are mostly nullified to reach the same outcome unless they were variables killer.

As for the witch i never did that experiment called the Dark ritual because i find disgusting the idea of  using a child as a lab rat.

I will not permit to use a child to save a dinosaur and then make him an imbecile again in DAI because of what happen.......

 

I'm not surprised.

But fortunately my Surana (and Cousland) do not have so strong moral base than you.

[Akiza]

Really? I thought she came across as a little more aloof.

 

The only thing that change is the presence/absence and behaviour of the child there was nothing that the developers could have done to make significant the  difference,  as for Morrigan  regardless of what you did her behaviour  with the Inquisitor is the same.

[German Soldier]

I'm not surprised.
But fortunately my Surana (and Cousland) do not have so strong moral base than you.

Selflessness and virtues have never been a prerogative of the many.

[Deadly dwarf]

If you want to die, but are unsure whether Alistair will automatically sacrifice himself, the surest way to have this happen will be to leave him at the Denerim gates during the final fight.

 

 

That's what I did during my last full playthrough; I left Alistair with B Team while I went to do the US.  You get to talk to Alistair when you leave him behind, but there are no dialog options to say that it's for his own good.  (This annoyed me a bit...)  Interesting to hear that he might sacrifice himself against the PC's will.

 

 

Choices in between games(DA keep) don't have a meaning since they are mostly nullified to reach the same outcome unless they were variables killer.

As for the witch i never did that experiment called the Dark ritual because i find disgusting the idea of  using a child as a lab rat.

I will not permit to use a child to save a dinosaur and then make him an imbecile again in DAI because of what happen.......

 

 

I agree.  The DR is an insane gamble based on the word of a "Witch of the Wilds" who doesn't seem to care for anyone but herself and who clearly has ulterior motives for sticking with your team.  The DR is something the Grey Wardens would not approve of; you don't get to ask Riordan if it's okay for the obvious reason he would veto the plan.  I'm surprised there isn't some sort of official Grey Warden following the use of the DR.

[German Soldier]

 

I agree.  The DR is an insane gamble based on the word of a "Witch of the Wilds" who doesn't seem to care for anyone but herself and who clearly has ulterior motives for sticking with your team.  The DR is something the Grey Wardens would not approve of; you don't get to ask Riordan if it's okay for the obvious reason he would veto the plan.  I'm surprised there isn't some sort of official Grey Warden following the use of the DR.

At the moment of the proposal you have every reason to believe that Flemeth desire to possess the power of the old god and that's why she taught the ritual to her daughter  which is indeed from meta perspective  a correct supposition.

 

The problem here at least for me is not the inner dangers of this magical beast  which are many

(for example it can be transformed into an archdemon again by the taint if he was preserved) but the fact that these two women want to manipulate the natural mind of a child and his personality for their own ambitions and I'm not Ok with it.

 

In the DR world this poor child suffered from nightmares and was used twice once by the mother and the  second time by the grandmother with  two different rituals of blood magic which were only meant to use him like a doll none of this happen if the DR is refused.

 

Morrigan and Flemeth are to me immoral and repugnant persons and even if this may be put me at  odds with some members of the community  i find their wardens who agreed to use a child  in this way immoral as well i don 't consider those wardens as  equals to mine.

[Aren]

DA is a game with choices without consequences in between games since the developers prefer to nullify certain choices

(Leliana,Anders,Oghren death and nullified the DR) to be more in line with the standard world state of Bioware.

 

 

I agree.  The DR is an insane gamble based on the word of a "Witch of the Wilds" who doesn't seem to care for anyone but herself and who clearly has ulterior motives for sticking with your team.  The DR is something the Grey Wardens would not approve of; you don't get to ask Riordan if it's okay for the obvious reason he would veto the plan.  I'm surprised there isn't some sort of official Grey Warden following the use of the DR.

Is a gamble and is insane since you are toying with the world future for one single GW.

I don't even know how certain users in Bsn said that the DR is the most logical choice ever....it's picked most of the time only for desperation.

Logical imho is to use Loghain to kill the dragon and end of the story.

[HikariWS]

Alistair can be king and still die to the Archdemon. A portion of it depends on whether he is

Thanks a lot for the tip, I didn't know about that!

Awakening and the DLC allow you to play as your Warden. If they performed the Ultimate Sacrifice, they are simply not dead, that choice is reversed. They don't "come back to life" or anything like that, they're not a zombie, it's just as if it didn't happen. Also, importing your Warden, whether alive or dead, is the ONLY way to play DAA (and other DLC) with your same world state. If you want to have your Warden be dead and stay dead, you play as a generic Orlesian Warden and there is a default world state; your choices are not imported.

hmm I get it... that's neat, they should have come up with an alternative. But I think they tried their best to create multiple alternatives, and the end of some lines just don't fit the begining of others. So they have to choose either to not make a line available or just undo a previous choice.

That's clearly seen in the Human background. The story is good, I get engaged, all I want is to find my brother and avenge my family. But then Duncan just says "hell yeah your family issue is something, but The Blight is way more important, so just leave your brother scouting on the woods and go prepare for your Joining because you'll be the last warden alive!". Then there are some options related to the background here and there, but he never manages to have real action choices based on and exclusive to the background. His family issue is ignored and that's it.
 

For DA2, the result is negligible. There will be a scene where King Alistair or Queen Anora appear, but that's all. It will go with your result from DAO, ignoring the fact that you played with your dead Warden in DAA. In that case, Alistair would be king (if you made him king) since your Warden is dead.

So, DA2 isn't too much affected by DAO at all? That's sad. I've quickly read a spoiler saying that DAO's warden vanishes and is never seen again. So that seems to happen even if he becomes king (btw, in this scene you said, what happens if I'm king and never dies, which is my case?). Well if he died that's undertandable, and if he goes to whatever place with Morrigan that's also explainable.

I think DA writers just wanna have most freedom while developing a game and don't wanna be limited by previous games. That's good for them not being limited, but that's sad for the unsolved plots.
 

But either way, both Morrigan and Flemeth still appear in DAI, but their interaction is different depending on the existence of Kieran.

That's encouraging, I'm eager to see what will happen. Is it affected by if I let Flemeth live or if I killed her as dragon? I suppose not, because either way she's old and will need a new body anyway.
 
 

Don't forget that you MUST use the DA Keep to set your choices for DAI. You may import your DAO/2 characters, but that only takes their name, gender, origin, class, and the small portrait you see in the game. That is all. You must enter in your decisions by hand for those two games.

What's that? It asks me to sign in, I never heard of it.

[HikariWS]

Morrigan in future games: She still shows up in Witch Hunt and DAI, but her dialogue and character development changes based on whether you befriended her, romanced her, and/or gave her a kid. She's obviously much warmer if you befriended and/or romanced her. If you had a kid with her, obviously she's sweet because she had a child with the man she loves. If she got pregnant through other means (like Alistair performing the Dark Ritual for us Lady Wardens), she's still much warmer person because raising a child taught her so much.

We still don't know what Morrigan (and/or Flemeth) intends to do with the soul of the Old God, but so far nothing nefarious has happened. Since BioWare has to account for worldstates where Morrigan didn't do the ritual, I'm guessing it's not super plot-changing. But personally I LOVE Morrigan as a mother; she's grown so much as a person. To me, the kid with the Old God's soul is so interesting (you'll see when you get there), so I personally think the kid is worth his weight in gold. I have a hard time making a worldstate without him.

lol this is getting troubling for us, imagine for plot writers!

So, is Morrigan that different in personality if she didn't have a child? Maybe my 2nd playthrou I'll just let her without him, to see later how she gets.

But, what if there are many options to explore with the child? I won't be able to explore them if he doesn't exist. Oh noes.
 

Finally, worldstates: You can directly upload DAO save files into DA2, but you can't upload any DAO or DA2 save files into DAI. For that, you have to use the Dragon Age Keep, where you personally hand-craft every DAO and DA2 worldstate to upload into DAI if you don't want to use DAI's default worldstate (female Dalish Warden who sacrificed herself to the Archdemon, for starters). It's not so bad since every quest comes with a "default" choice, so you just change it to suit your world worldstate as you go. The Keep also lets you make at least ten worldstates to upload into DAI, so you don't have to worry about having all your Wardens' saves on file in order to upload into DAI. No fuss, no muss.

Wait, I didn't get it. So that Keep is used to make the choices that will affect DAI? And I can create up to 10 states? And without it I'll always start with default choices no matter what's in my saves?

Why was that done this way?

And what happens to Alistair if he doesn't become king and doesn't die? Will he be back?
Is there any tool for verifying a DAO/DAA save and change these choices?

[Domakir]

So, is Morrigan that different in personality if she didn't have a child? Maybe my 2nd playthrou I'll just let her without him, to see later how she gets.

But, what if there are many options to explore with the child? I won't be able to explore them if he doesn't exist. Oh noes.

Not really. She's only different when she talks about Kieran or the warden (if romanced) but she has the same personality with your inquisitor no matter if her son exists or not.

[Lunatica]

BioWare has a tendency to give you something and then take it away because it doesn't fit with their vision later on.

[Secret Rare]

Back in the summer of 2014 when i finished DAO i realized that most of the choices were nullified in that game even if i killed the warden it was resurrected.

[HikariWS]

Is there any tool to edit or at least view the worldstate of a save? DA1 and DA2

I'm playing Awakening. Anora arrived and I bowed to her, then she called me husband. That means it's working, I married her in Origins. But, if I'm king and she's my queen, why'd I bow to her? What kind of king bows to the queen??!