46 réponses à ce sujet

[themikefest]

Like I said, she takes after her mom. I'm sure Saren said similar things to her. 

The worst part is Shepard can't question her about the friend thing. I know my Shepard doesn't consider her to be a friend and never will

[straykat]

The worst part is Shepard can't question her about the friend thing. I know my Shepard doesn't consider her to be a friend and never will

 

I wish I had some advice

 

I kind of learned to accept it. Or outright embraced it on this current character. It'll probably be my last playthrough.

[Livi14]

Like I said, she takes after her mom. I'm sure Saren said similar things to her.

That really is a silly complaint. Carrying over every single dialogue choice is pretty much impossible. That's why no character remembers how you behaved & treated them in previous games.

[congokong]

Good to know that you discovered the objectively correct way to play the game. Silly me, I thought Mass Effect was about player choice, or something.

 

 

1. They don't have distaste for Shepard, they have distaste for Cerberus, a known Terrorist organisation. They distrust Shepard because 6 months ago he was working for them.
2. It would be even worse writing if they abandoned their principles and suddenly had no issue with Cerberus, or for some reason didn't think there was anything fishy about Shepard returning from the dead in their secret project. It sounds like you just wanted everyone in the game to think you are awesome and always right all of the time, but, well, that's not how it's going to be. Regaining Ash/Kaidan's trust is an important part of their character arcs, and it makes their romances far better, and far more realistic, than if they just adored you out of the gate - but that adoration is what you want, so you chose loyal-virginal-fangirl turned badass Liara.

First, Shepard is awesome and always right all of the time.

 

Second, it's this continued mistrust that puts a lot of people off about the VS. I mean, if you don't visit them in the hospital, they become nearly convinced you're a Cerberus terrorist ...even though Ashley couldn't be bothered to visit Shepard in those 6 months on earth ...or the fact that Shepard is looked at by the galaxy as their sole hope. Based on all the goodwill Shepard earns from ME2 to that Citadel coup confrontation in ME3, that distrust has become paranoia.

 

 

Quarians weren't necessarily bigoted. They knew the Geth better than anyone else, and we get to see how messed up the Geth are, as they weren't created as AI, but became AI through updates. They are at war. The Geth are not friendly. Nothing Tali does is unfair or bigoted in that regard.

 

Kelly is attracted to many species. That does not make her easy, and only disqualifies her as 'relationship material' if you have a weird hang up about that kind of thing.

An interesting observation is how fans seem to have no end of sympathy for the geth, but none for the quarians. Shepard can also fall into this behavior by scolding the quarians, for example, for wanting to retake their homeworld; including their defiance of Council treaties in doing so. It's easy to judge from a non-quarian's POV when you're not living in a suit your whole life in constant endangerment of dying. The quarians are desperate to retake their home. Killing the geth is secondary. If the geth weren't there, they'd likely not bother with them.

[congokong]

The worst part is Shepard can't question her about the friend thing. I know my Shepard doesn't consider her to be a friend and never will

Can't you? In LotSB, you can refuse her request to come up to the Normandy as a friend; requesting to keep your relationship professional. Also, during the Citadel meet-up, you can say "Let's keep this professional" when she refers to you as a friend.

[straykat]

That really is a silly complaint. Carrying over every single dialogue choice is pretty much impossible. That's why no character remembers how you behaved & treated them in previous games.

 

What's silly about it? I just meant that even if you're rude to her, she'll go out of her way to ingratiate herself. And ultimately try to direct Shepard to be a "symbol" for the galaxy. It's the same thing Benezia tried with Saren.. except she got indoctrinated.

 

And this is why I think Shadow Broker fits too. She's a controlling type of person. It's just Paragon, instead of Renegade control, like a TIM or an Aria.

[Livi14]

What's silly about it? I just meant that even if you're rude to her, she'll go out of her way to ingratiate herself. And ultimately try to direct Shepard to be a "symbol" for the galaxy. It's the same thing Benezia tried with Saren.. except she got indoctrinated.
 
And this is why I think Shadow Broker fits too. She's a controlling type of person. It's just Paragon, instead of Renegade control, like a TIM or an Aria.

Because there is no import flag for "Shepard was rude", and she's not the only character Shepard is assumed to be on moderately friendly terms with. You can be rude to everyone in ME1, and nobody remembers. Garrus always thinks he's your bro and "pulled Shepards ass out of the fire on Noveria, Feros and Ilos", even if you've never used him in ME1. Tali still reveres you even if you treated her like dirt in ME1. And so on.

[themikefest]

That really is a silly complaint. Carrying over every single dialogue choice is pretty much impossible. That's why no character remembers how you behaved & treated them in previous games.

Are you sure about that? If Liara is taken to Noveria, she hears her mother say little wing. In ME3, when she is talking to her father, she mentions that phrase whereas if not taken on Noveria she doesn't know about the phrase

 

Can't you? In LotSB, you can refuse her request to come up to the Normandy as a friend; requesting to keep your relationship professional. Also, during the Citadel meet-up, you can say "Let's keep this professional" when she refers to you as a friend.

 I want to ask her why she says friends especailly when she says "was I suppose to let my friend die, when there was hope that you could be saved". Two problems I have with that line". There is no friends and how do you save someone if they're already dead?

[straykat]

Because there is no import flag for "Shepard was rude", and she's not the only character Shepard is assumed to be on moderately friendly terms with. You can be rude to everyone in ME1, and nobody remembers. Garrus always thinks he's your bro and "pulled Shepards ass out of the fire on Noveria, Feros and Ilos", even if you've never used him in ME1. Tali still reveres you even if you treated her like dirt in ME1. And so on.

 

We weren't necessarily talking about imports though.. Mike is talking about ME1.. and the volcano line.

 

edit: Err.... or he was at first.

[congokong]

 I want to ask her why she says friends especailly when she says "was I suppose to let my friend die, when there was hope that you could be saved". Two problems I have with that line". There is no friends and how do you save someone if they're already dead?

Why does she? Because she's your stalker, that's why.

 

I never heard that line though. It sounds similar to one you get if you romanced her and initiated LotSB without her telling you about giving your corpse to Cerberus. Is that when, but a "friend" version?

 

To her, you're her friend. Sorry. If you don't like it, you shouldn't keep giving her signs that you are friends like "Any friend of yours is a friend of mine" and letting her put her spy crap in Miranda's old office. Haha.

 

I suppose it could be considered "saving" by bringing someone back to life; giving back years that otherwise would be lost. It's similar to saving someone from dying in the first place. It's a semantics issue.

[straykat]

Why does she? Because she's your stalker, that's why.

 

I never heard that line though. It sounds similar to one you get if you romanced her and initiated LotSB without her telling you about giving your corpse to Cerberus. Is that when, but a "friend" version?

 

To her, you're her friend. Sorry. If you don't like it, you shouldn't keep giving her signs that you are friends like "Any friend of yours is a friend of mine" and letting her put her spy crap in Miranda's old office. Haha.

 

I suppose it could be considered "saving" by bringing someone back to life; giving back years that otherwise would be lost. It's similar to saving someone from dying in the first place. It's a semantics issue.

 

I decided to embrace it.. I'm removed enough now from the series to not care. I romanced her in ME1, so it makes even more sense if she "saved" you.

 

But I won't romance her after this. It's a good reason to break up with her. It's weird. lol. Maybe it's OK to be friends in the third game.... but I doubt I'll let her do her creepy mind meld thing on Earth. Not that kind of friend.

[fdrty]

Second, it's this continued mistrust that puts a lot of people off about the VS. I mean, if you don't visit them in the hospital, they become nearly convinced you're a Cerberus terrorist ...even though Ashley couldn't be bothered to visit Shepard in those 6 months on earth ...or the fact that Shepard is looked at by the galaxy as their sole hope. Based on all the goodwill Shepard earns from ME2 to that Citadel coup confrontation in ME3, that distrust has become paranoia.

 

 

Well, if you don't visit them in the hospital, or attempt to reconnect with them and let them get to know you again, then assuming that Shep is a terrorist is a reasonable one to make. It's not paranoia. The cerberus coup should make you more wary of those who were affiliated with Cerberus, not less suspicious.

 

Someone being in hospital isn't the same as a war criminal under house arrest... Shep doesn't seem to get many visitors.

 

The galaxy might think Shep is a hero but they don't know him like Ash or Kaidan.

[DeathScepter]

Nevermind  nothing to add. other than Liara might be indoctrinated.

[themikefest]

Why does she? Because she's your stalker, that's why.

Unfortunately Shepard can't question her about that.
 

I never heard that line though. It sounds similar to one you get if you romanced her and initiated LotSB without her telling you about giving your corpse to Cerberus. Is that when, but a "friend" version?

If there is a romanced version, I don't know what it is. I don't romance the character.
 

To her, you're her friend. Sorry. If you don't like it, you shouldn't keep giving her signs that you are friends like "Any friend of yours is a friend of mine" and letting her put her spy crap in Miranda's old office. Haha.

Shepard does give her signs or in this case sign that there is no friendship to speak especially after Shepard tells her that he/she will throw her back in the volcano.

I would be curious to the answer she gives if Shepard was able to ask her who said it was ok to put that stuff in Miranda's office
 

I suppose it could be considered "saving" by bringing someone back to life; giving back years that otherwise would be lost. It's similar to saving someone from dying in the first place. It's a semantics issue.

Semantics or not, I don't agree with the line of dialogue.

[congokong]

Shepard does give her signs or in this case sign that there is no friendship to speak especially after Shepard tells her that he/she will throw her back in the volcano.

They just met then though. I'm ...sure their relationship blossomed in those few months between ME1 and ME2. Remember, Liara was on the ship the whole time.

 

 

I would be curious to the answer she gives if Shepard was able to ask her who said it was ok to put that stuff in Miranda's office
 

I'd like to ask Glyph where it got the notion that Liara was automatically invited to my Citadel party. Sounds a bit close to rebellion...

[congokong]

Well, if you don't visit them in the hospital, or attempt to reconnect with them and let them get to know you again, then assuming that Shep is a terrorist is a reasonable one to make. It's not paranoia. The cerberus coup should make you more wary of those who were affiliated with Cerberus, not less suspicious.

 

Someone being in hospital isn't the same as a war criminal under house arrest... Shep doesn't seem to get many visitors.

 

The galaxy might think Shep is a hero but they don't know him like Ash or Kaidan.

 

No, the idea is ridiculous. As Shepard can say to Ashley when she has negative trust in the standoff, Anderson doesn't reinstate people who are about to kill councilors. Believing that Shepard is some terrorist because  Cerberus brought them back to save the galaxy, and saved it again in Arrival, and again throughout ME3, dismissing all the news coverage of Shepard because they think they know them better (which they evidently don't), that Shepard's allies are in on it, yet not visiting them in the hospital being a deciding factor is paranoia.

 

Anderson wanted Ashley to visit. She refused. She created that barrier between them then and before on Horizon. No apologies to Shepard for Horizon, no thank you for saving her and the colonists. Only suspicion, and more of it on Mars; pushing a year since ME2. If I was Shepard, I wouldn't want to bother with her after that. Feeling that way should be no indicator to a rational person that I'm a terrorist. If the VS cannot get over the Cerberus thing and intentionally kept their distance from building a rapport before ME3 begins, it's on them, but believing Shepard is a terrorist because of it is not reasonable.

[themikefest]

They just met then though. I'm ...sure their relationship blossomed in those few months between ME1 and ME2. Remember, Liara was on the ship the whole time.

Doesn't matter if they just met. Remember Shepard is concentrating on stopping Saren not blossoming any relationship
 

[congokong]

Doesn't matter if they just met. Remember Shepard is concentrating on stopping Saren not blossoming any relationship
 

I said between ME1 and ME2. Saren is dead then.

[themikefest]

Well, if you don't visit them in the hospital, or attempt to reconnect with them and let them get to know you again, then assuming that Shep is a terrorist is a reasonable one to make. It's not paranoia. The cerberus coup should make you more wary of those who were affiliated with Cerberus, not less suspicious.

If Ashley/Kaidan assume Shepard is a terrorist, does that mean they're assuming the  squadmates and the crew on the Normandy are terrorists as well? All are helping Shepard deal with the reapers.

[themikefest]

I said between ME1 and ME2. Saren is dead then.

I'm saying that for between ME1 and ME2 as well. Why would my Shepard want to blossom any relationship with the asari?

[congokong]

I'm saying that for between ME1 and ME2 as well. Why would my Shepard want to blossom any relationship with the asari?

I was half-joking when I said that, you know. I also was pointing out that some time passed between that rather harsh line about the volcano and ME2. So, even if you tried role-playing Shepard to not like her, the writers had ample time in those few months for them to insinuate a positive relationship between the two; as much as you might wish otherwise. Obviously, the writers want Shepard to like Liara more than you do because she is automatically part of your squad in ME3, for example, without any option to refuse her or even bring up the issues you mentioned.

[line_genrou]

I had my third (or fourth) playthrough the trilogy and Liara is annoying the **** outta me. On my other playthroughs I didn't mind her, and I could pretend she was Shepards good friend. But that was before I played LOTSB...

 

Bioware pushes Liara soooo hard as LI or BFF. No, she is not my BFF. I don't care about her. She's boring. Get out of my face, Liara.

She was interesting in ME1 as archeologist caught in the midst of things. But imo they ruined her character in ME2. Don't even get me started on her breathy annoying ass voice. And you know what, you can't even avoid her, she is forced on you, so yeah, the annoyance just grows, otherwise I would just ignore her.

 

You can't even talk to her in ME1 that she blurts out that she's feeling an attraction between Shep and her. What?  I'm just asking how you are feeling after you just killed your mother!

 

Also, in ME3, I absolutely hate her how almost every scene or conversation I have with her, if I choose the top option it seems like I'm flirting or my line has a romantic connotation.