110 réponses à ce sujet

[Dai Grepher]

The source of information is from the game. Envy's Journal.  Something that was posted to you earlier.

But Envy's Dogma supports my theory, and does not confirm the wiki fan statement. Whoever wrote it simply posted an irrelevant reference.

Yes I do, because I played the game.  The writers had plenty of time to make Envy a part of the Mage story line and they chose not to, accept it.

I think they did make Envy part of the story involving Fiona, just in a subtle way. Fiona's hazy recollection, and the fact that Envy is found out to be able to impersonate anyone. "Finoa's" invite to Redcliffe. Envy's Dogma also implies that Lucius was observed from a third-party perspective in Val Royeaux.

As for your demand that the writers make Envy part of the mage storyline, that's simply an arbitrary standard. The writers aren't beholden to your wants. There simply was no involvement between the mages and Envy except for what would take place behind the scenes in the instances I stated in my theory. The mage and templar paths just aren't connected strongly enough for Envy to have any more involvement than what I theorized, which may be exactly what the writers intended.

There is something that went on behind the scenes with Alexius, Fiona, and Felix as well, but we don't get to see what. We can only theorize. Was Fiona helping Alexius heal Felix's condition with magic, or was she donating taint-cured blood for him? The game doesn't say, but we can theorize.

"Lucius Corin abandoned, hidden after taking his face, his armor, his templars. Easy as slipping into new skin."
 
This is from Envy's Dogma.

Yeah. I know what it states. It supports my argument.

abandoned
hidden
AFTER taking his face, his armor, his Templars.

Yes. AFTER. After taking his templars. Lucius didn't have the Val Royeaux templars until first going there to get them. At which point it would still be the real Lucius. He would also need to take them to Therinfal and give them instructions to wait there and to take red lyrium. Only then would Envy take over and oversee the corruption of the templars while Lucius went to Caer Oswin to trap Seekers.

So if you are correct about Envy observing rather than acting, then you also have to explain who Envy was observing that day.  Because apparently Lucius was abandoned and hidden away after apparently someone else took his face, armor, and Templars.

Lucius went into hiding at Caer Oswin after taking the Val Royeaux templars in Ser Barris' company to Therinfal Redoubt. Envy was observing Lucius as Fiona in Val Royeaux. Envy couldn't have taken Lucius' templars until the templars were gathered at Therinfal.

She was a SLAVE. That's kinda how the whole slave thing works. You have no choice but to do as you're told. She didn't sign herself and her mages for battle but she did sign away their rights. Which is why she couldn't just up and leave after finding out they would be expected to fight. She had nowhere to go and burned her bridges with Fereldan's ruler.  The mages had no choice but to fight that day.

But Dorian tells Bull in banter that most mages either fled or were killed. Only a portion chose to stay and fight for the Venatori. A slave is only a slave for as long as they are willing to submit to a master.

Neat headcanon. But it never happened.

I have always stated this is my theory, and perhaps not what actually happened in the storyline according to BioWare. However, it is possible that this is what happened in the story, and there is nothing that disproves it.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Well, see you all in another 50 pages as we argue against Grepher

[Dai Grepher]

No, BioWare was not clear regarding this plot, so it's all theoretical. Unlike the Viddasala issue in which BioWare clearly stated she was not authorized in her actions.

Awfully hypocritical of you to argue against what the game says in that case with your conspiracy theory about plausible deniability, and yet in this thread pretend that BioWare clearly stated something as fact leaving no room for alternate possibilities.

[thesuperdarkone2]

No, BioWare was not clear regarding this plot, so it's all theoretical. Unlike the Viddasala issue in which BioWare clearly stated she was not authorized in her actions.

Awfully hypocritical of you to argue against what the game says in that case with your conspiracy theory about plausible deniability, and yet in this thread pretend that BioWare clearly stated something as fact leaving no room for alternate possibilities.

Ah, still in denial I see

[Dai Grepher]

Triumvirate letter confirms it. Necro your thread if you disagree.

[thesuperdarkone2]

Triumvirate letter confirms it. Necro your thread if you disagree.

Ah yes, everyone knows the Qunari would always tell the truth and honestly tell the southern nobility that they literally just tried to murder them all and conquer their lands if this was an authorized operation.

 

After all, everyone knows the Qunari would never lie /s

[Hazegurl]

But Envy's Dogma supports my theory, and does not confirm the wiki fan statement. Whoever wrote it simply posted an irrelevant reference.

[Dai Grepher]

Ah yes, everyone knows the Qunari would always tell the truth and honestly tell the southern nobility that they literally just tried to murder them all and conquer their lands if this was an authorized operation.
 
After all, everyone knows the Qunari would never lie /s

And yet you think that just because Daniel states his belief that Envy masqueraded as Lucius in Val Royeaux, that automatically makes it a fact.

You have a double-standard. Either a character's statement proves a game plot true or it doesn't.

@Hazegurl Are you referring to yourself with that pic? I proved how Envy's Dogma backs me up. It said Lucius was hidden AFTER taking his templars. Lucius did not have the templars until AFTER Val Royeaux. So Envy did not take over Lucius' role until after Val Royeaux.

[fhs33721]

@Hazegurl Are you referring to yourself with that pic? I proved how Envy's Dogma backs me up. It said Lucius was hidden AFTER taking his templars. Lucius did not have the templars until AFTER Val Royeaux. So Envy did not take over Lucius' role until after Val Royeaux.

 

It said Lucius was hidden AFTER taking his templars. Lucius did not have the templars until AFTER Val Royeaux.

 

 Lucius did not have the templars until AFTER Val Royeaux.

 

 

 

Get out! Delete your BSN account and refrain from ever posting on the internet again, unless you want to continue to completely embarass yourself further.

Lucious had the command of the templars ever since Lambert died at the end of the Asunder novel. What kind of nonsense are you even fabricating right now?

[Dai Grepher]

No he didn't. There were templars all across Thedas. He had to actually move around and gather their support. He had to put word out that they should join his cause. He had to convince them. Many templars simply stayed in their own Circles (Hasmal, Ostwick), or joined the Chantry forces at Haven (Lisette), or quit (the one who left Cole in the dungeon), or went off into the Hinterlands to fight the more violent apostates.

I'm currently replaying through Therinfal, and there are letters from Lucius and Samson indicating that Envy didn't take over until Therinfal, which came after Lucius' appearance in Val Royeaux. I'll post it when I collect all the evidence.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

I had a really simple solution in game.  My Inquisitor just thought to himself "This s**t is weird" and went off to recruit the Templars instead.     He may not like the Chantry or the Templars but he had to admit they did know how to deal with strange magic (or so he had been told).   The intention was to close the Breach and then deal with the Magister but things didn't quite work out that way.   Best laid plans and all that.

 

Same here. I chose the Templar path and conscripted them for this exact reason.