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Bioware's Favoritism Towards Andrastianism


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#276
straykat

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The ironic thing is that Andraste is modeled after Joan of Arc and most people don't really know the real Joan of Arc, preferring to simply think of her as a badass woman.

 

Source:- http://www.history.c...out-joan-of-arc

 

In other words, Joan of Arc is a mess that people assume to be a Saint. Just imagine the reaction if Andraste was revealed to be a mess that people simply assumed to be a prophet.

 

She could be ill, but still doesn't make her unremarkable. And I know I'm not most people. I own multiple books about her and she's probably my favorite saint. And she is a Saint. Are you even Catholic?

 

And being angry and temperamental is irrelevant. Christians aren't Buddhists. Even Jesus flipped the tables on people.



#277
Asha'bellanar

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The ironic thing is that Andraste is modeled after Joan of Arc and most people don't really know the real Joan of Arc

Suggest you look up Boudicca. Andraste is so much modelled on Boudicca, that "Andraste" is the name of the Iceni goddess of victory ("Andraste" is the Latin form of the Iceni name) that Boudicca was said to invoke in her war against the Romans (i.e., Tevinters).

 

There is some Joan of Arc in there, particularly the "being burnt at the stake" part, but that's really as far as it goes. Joan was Orlesian, err, French, and she was really young, and not married, and not the mother of anyone, whereas Andraste was married to a warlord and the mother of two daughters, just like Boudicca. I suppose you could say that the "hearing God tell you do stuff" part was more Joan than Boudicca, as well (she was doing it for vengeance, not because any goddess told her to, though she did invoke the goddess of victory).


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#278
straykat

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Suggest you look up Boudicca. Andraste is so much modelled on Boudicca, that "Andraste" is the name of the Iceni goddess of victory ("Andraste" is the Latin form of the Iceni name) that Boudicca was said to invoke in her war against the Romans.

 

There is some Joan of Arc in there, particularly the "being burnt at the stake" part, but that's really as far as it goes. Joan was Orlesian, err, French, and she was really young, and not married, and not the mother of anyone, whereas Andraste was married to a warlord and the mother of two daughters, just like Boudicca. I suppose you could say that the "hearing God tell you do stuff" part was more Joan than Boudicca, as well (she was doing it for vengeance, not because any goddess told her to, though she did invoke the goddess of victory).

 

Boudica plays a part too, but Gaider specifically said "What if Joan was Jesus?" That was his initial inspiration behind Andraste. 

 

Either way, Boudica is another remarkable person who didn't need to be Mythal or an OGB to pull off what she did. Heh. 


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#279
Asha'bellanar

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And being angry and temperamental is irrelevant. Christians aren't Buddhists. Even Jesus flipped the tables on people.

And cursed fig trees for not producing enough fruit, and yelled at religious leaders and told people off in a lot of ways. He was a right rabble rouser. :)


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#280
Seraphim24

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^ That kind of made more sense to me as well... Jeanne D'arc is kind of more chaotic and high intensity... kind of fitting the continental European thing. Whereas Gaider was always taking inspiration from like Celtic Britain/Ireland such and such (The Morrigan, and all that)

 

In fact, to be honest, I thought Andraste was almost supposed to be like Mary Magdalene or something, almost like a non-violent resistor personality.

 

Edit: Well in light of Straykat's comment, I think he was trying to merge the kind of not give a **** heroism of Joan with the kind of "purity" of a Jesus or Mary or someone.

 

And that ended up being Boudica, in spirit.

 

Joan of Arc was like the "Crazy in a good way" sort of personality, she's not really your garden variety "savior," unless you consider someone that aids a huge massive war of death and destruction as possibly heroic.

 

Andraste has way too much, down home, earthy energy (or at least as reflected in the codex) to truly qualify in that category for me, to be honest. I'm not saying that's bad, but yeah I found that Joan comparison slightly puzzling.


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#281
straykat

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^ That kind of made more sense to me as well... Jeanne D'arc is kind of more chaotic and high intensity... kind of fitting the continental European thing. Whereas Gaider was always taking inspiration from like Celtic Britain/Ireland such and such (The Morrigan, and all that)

 

In fact, to be honest, I thought Andraste was almost supposed to be like Mary Magdalene or something, almost like a non-violent resistor personality.

 

Edit: Well in light of Straykat's comment, I think he was trying to merge the kind of not give a **** heroism with the kind of "purity" of a Jesus or Mary or someone.

 

And that ended up being Boudica, in spirit.

 

Joan of Arc was like the "Crazy in a good way" sort of personality, she's not really your garden variety "savior," unless you consider someone that aids a huge massive war of death and destruction as possibly heroic.

 

Andraste has way too much, down home, earthy energy (or at least as reflected in the codex) to truly qualify in that category for me, to be honest.

 

I'll agree on that. :)


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#282
Bayonet Hipshot

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She could be ill, but still doesn't make her unremarkable. And I know I'm not most people. I own multiple books about her and she's probably my favorite saint. And she is a Saint. Are you even Catholic?

 

And being angry and temperamental is irrelevant. Christians aren't Buddhists. Even Jesus flipped the tables on people.

 

I'm an atheist.



#283
Xilizhra

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I'm Jewish. You have repeatedly said that there is nothing improper about the idea that elves have a moral obligation to breed with other elves to preserve the elven "race" because this is the only way to make more elves. This is exactly what white supremacists believe IRL. Your logic is that the only difference - the only reason these scumbags are wrong - is that it's a fact in DA that humans + elves = humans. That's just an endorsement of white supremacists. It's saying that the flaw in their view isn't their racism - it's that their racism isn't supported by evidence. That is rank insanity. Any group that goes out of their way to endorse a racial utopia, to treat an entire race of people as disease bearing pests, holds an awful view of virulent racism that echoes 1939. The Dalish demonize themselves by believing in racial essentialism.

Then blame Bioware for making racial essentialism a reality. Half-elven humans are debilitated by the Crossroads just like every other human; it is a fact, metaphysically speaking, that elves can only ever have two elven parents. And it's funny that you should attempt to Godwin the Dalish, as they (and the city elves!) have a desire to keep an arguably dwindling, definitely minority race actually alive that is utterly incompatible with Nazism or the like due to said race's total lack of power.

 

Also, the main thing that's bad about white supremacists is that they hurt people, which many Dalish don't do.


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#284
Solitaira

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Excuse me -- and please take this in the cheeky way it's intended -- Dragon Age is a goddamned game. It's fiction. No one compels anyone to play it. The lore, morality saga, in-game theism -- it's all make believe, concocted by people with only marginally fertile imaginations -- they aren't even top-notch writers in a more general sense.

 

In short, take a breath, go for a walk, quit taking it all so seriously. Mostly, quit taking yourselves so seriously. There's way too much real-life drama to turn a freaking game into something so serious.

 

Have a wonderful day.


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#285
Bayonet Hipshot

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Excuse me -- and please take this in the cheeky way it's intended -- Dragon Age is a goddamned game. It's fiction. No one compels anyone to play it. The lore, morality saga, in-game theism -- it's all make believe, concocted by people with only marginally fertile imaginations -- they aren't even top-notch writers in a more general sense.

 

In short, take a breath, go for a walk, quit taking it all so seriously. Mostly, quit taking yourselves so seriously. There's way too much real-life drama to turn a freaking game into something so serious.

 

Have a wonderful day.

 

Excuse me -- and please take this in the cheeky way it's intended -- BSN Dragon Age section is a goddamned sub-forum to discuss elements in Dragon Age games. That includes religions that different peoples within Dragon Age games might or might not practice. No one compels anyone to read any of the topics or replies posted here. The lore, morality saga, in-game theism -- it's all open to discussions and debate, and everyone of can participate in it -- even those who favor a particular group or a particular religion, regardless of the game writers capabilities.

 

In short, take a breath, go for a walk and quit concern trolling topics that trigger you or topics that make you uncomfortable or topics that do not interest you. Why don't you go and tell hardcore soccer and football fans off when they talk about football and tell them that there is too much real-life drama to turn a freaking game into something serious ? Oh that's right, its football/soccer. If you don't like what you see being written here, then don't read it and move on with your life.

 

Have a wonderful day.



#286
Elfyoth

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At no point did I treat it as "absurd" that the Dalish took some of their myths literally. I said there was no evidence they took them literally. I continue to think there is no evidence any measurable number of Dalish elves taken them literally.

I'm Jewish. You have repeatedly said that there is nothing improper about the idea that elves have a moral obligation to breed with other elves to preserve the elven "race" because this is the only way to make more elves. This is exactly what white supremacists believe IRL. Your logic is that the only difference - the only reason these scumbags are wrong - is that it's a fact in DA that humans + elves = humans. That's just an endorsement of white supremacists. It's saying that the flaw in their view isn't their racism - it's that their racism isn't supported by evidence. That is rank insanity. Any group that goes out of their way to endorse a racial utopia, to treat an entire race of people as disease bearing pests, holds an awful view of virulent racism that echoes 1939. The Dalish demonize themselves by believing in racial essentialism.




I am also jewish, the fact that elves can't have elven children with other races is more likely inspierd by the religeous law that says that a child of a non jewish nother and a jewish father will not be jewish.

I think that the elves were majorly inspired by the jewish people, native americans and the romani people(writing this from my Iphone on 2% left so sorry if it looks so bad)

#287
In Exile

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I agree with Lobselvith that the elven religion has been invalidated. Unlike Lobselvith, I think that's absolutely a good thing. Believing in the superiority of the ancient civilization was holding the elves back.


I don't see these being the same. The elvhen were a superior ancient civilisation. Solas actively believes in this point, for example. There's a difference between the deification of the past the Dalish engage in and the fact that relatively speaking the elvhen did have a magical empire of a kind that is incomprehensible to modern Thedas. I mean, despite all the love for him in the fanbase Solas is basically a racial supremacist.
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#288
In Exile

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Orana believed her life was was fine as a slave to Hadriana. That doesn't necessarily mean Hadriana wasn't a villain.


Sure, but it does mean that the Oriana didn't see Hadriana as a villain. Which is the point.

#289
straykat

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Excuse me -- and please take this in the cheeky way it's intended -- Dragon Age is a goddamned game. It's fiction. No one compels anyone to play it. The lore, morality saga, in-game theism -- it's all make believe, concocted by people with only marginally fertile imaginations -- they aren't even top-notch writers in a more general sense.

 

In short, take a breath, go for a walk, quit taking it all so seriously. Mostly, quit taking yourselves so seriously. There's way too much real-life drama to turn a freaking game into something so serious.

 

Have a wonderful day.

 

Listen to her! :P



#290
straykat

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I'm an atheist.

 

Good for you. My point is who are you to start declaring Saints now? She's a saint for a particular church. Not yours apparently.

 

Do you have a funny hat at least?



#291
Steelcan

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I don't see these being the same. The elvhen were a superior ancient civilisation. Solas actively believes in this point, for example. There's a difference between the deification of the past the Dalish engage in and the fact that relatively speaking the elvhen did have a magical empire of a kind that is incomprehensible to modern Thedas. I mean, despite all the love for him in the fanbase Solas is basically a racial supremacist.

I find it even more interesting how a subgroup of the Dragon Age fans seem to be perfectly ok with his supremacism as long as it goes along with their own ideas of how the Dragon Age universe should be ordered.

I wonder if he's given more slack because his views aren't put in explicitly racist ways, ie he's not calling humans intellectually or physically inferior and at least doesn't seem thrilled about his plans for genocide on a level even the Third Reich would call excessive.

#292
straykat

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I find it even more interesting how a subgroup of the Dragon Age fans seem to be perfectly ok with his supremacism as long as it goes along with their own ideas of how the Dragon Age universe should be ordered.

I wonder if he's given more slack because his views aren't put in explicitly racist ways, ie he's not calling humans intellectually or physically inferior and at least doesn't seem thrilled about his plans for genocide on a level even the Third Reich would call excessive.

 

I think Solas' real flaw is he just hates life, period.

 

Like all eggheads.. and people who sleep too much.

 

Cory to me is much more defined by his supremacist behavior.



#293
Sah291

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^ That kind of made more sense to me as well... Jeanne D'arc is kind of more chaotic and high intensity... kind of fitting the continental European thing. Whereas Gaider was always taking inspiration from like Celtic Britain/Ireland such and such (The Morrigan, and all that)
 
In fact, to be honest, I thought Andraste was almost supposed to be like Mary Magdalene or something, almost like a non-violent resistor personality.
 
Edit: Well in light of Straykat's comment, I think he was trying to merge the kind of not give a **** heroism of Joan with the kind of "purity" of a Jesus or Mary or someone.
 
And that ended up being Boudica, in spirit.
 
Joan of Arc was like the "Crazy in a good way" sort of personality, she's not really your garden variety "savior," unless you consider someone that aids a huge massive war of death and destruction as possibly heroic.
 
Andraste has way too much, down home, earthy energy (or at least as reflected in the codex) to truly qualify in that category for me, to be honest. I'm not saying that's bad, but yeah I found that Joan comparison slightly puzzling.

 

Yeah, I think all of those are valid interpretations. I think mainly the idea was they wanted to imagine what a religion based around a female hero/prophet figure would look like.

What we got was a more matriarchal southern Chantry, and a bigger emphasis on divine feminine themes... women identifying with being a 'bride' of the Maker and such, etc.

 

Excuse me -- and please take this in the cheeky way it's intended -- Dragon Age is a goddamned game. It's fiction. No one compels anyone to play it. The lore, morality saga, in-game theism -- it's all make believe, concocted by people with only marginally fertile imaginations -- they aren't even top-notch writers in a more general sense.
 
In short, take a breath, go for a walk, quit taking it all so seriously. Mostly, quit taking yourselves so seriously. There's way too much real-life drama to turn a freaking game into something so serious.
 
Have a wonderful day.


I really don't take the game that seriously.

My real life spiritual influences include Buddhism, Greco-Roman, Neo-Paganism, and Hermeticism... I was raised an atheist.... but I'm just a geek that likes to discuss this kind of stuff..a story can raise a lot of interesting questions and things to think about, that's all.
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#294
Sah291

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I find it even more interesting how a subgroup of the Dragon Age fans seem to be perfectly ok with his supremacism as long as it goes along with their own ideas of how the Dragon Age universe should be ordered.
I wonder if he's given more slack because his views aren't put in explicitly racist ways, ie he's not calling humans intellectually or physically inferior and at least doesn't seem thrilled about his plans for genocide on a level even the Third Reich would call excessive.


He's not given more slack...it's just that there is racism and cultural conflict everywhere in the game...only humans can be nobility or figures in the Chantry.. there's mages vesus templars, Qunari, Dwarves... it just isn't something only the elves are at fault for. It's a bigger issue than just that.

I also don't think it is supremacism in Solas' case. He is the person responsible for waging a slave rebellion and destroying his own civilization. He regrets it. But also, he's very obviously being set up to fail, so I don't see how that is glorification of such ideas. It's commentary on how misguided it is, and to show people are maybe not appreciating what they have or focusing on current problems.
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#295
Xilizhra

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I don't see these being the same. The elvhen were a superior ancient civilisation. Solas actively believes in this point, for example. There's a difference between the deification of the past the Dalish engage in and the fact that relatively speaking the elvhen did have a magical empire of a kind that is incomprehensible to modern Thedas. I mean, despite all the love for him in the fanbase Solas is basically a racial supremacist.

Do remember that the Dalish are not remotely alone in their racial policies. City elves do the exact same thing.


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#296
Gervaise

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I agree that some players do seem to have some disturbing ideas of the morality of people's actions in game but that isn't confined to Solas.   I was always profoundly disturbed by people applauding Anders' blowing up the Chantry and then trying to justify it by saying there was only Elthina and a couple of Templars affected by it anyway.   Still I'm sure they weren't going to go out and blow people up in real life, any more than those who seem to condone Solas are all white supremacists. 

 

The real problem is how writers deal with the issues and resolve the storyline.   Let us hope they don't make such a botch of it as they did with ME3.  

 

I think the Andraste/Joan of Arc idea was actually a rather good one.   I always liked her story and as Sister Petrine pointed out, the Chantry did try and make it look as though Andraste was all sweetness and light, playing down the violent aspects of her campaign, unless it became politically expedient to remember it because they wanted to call an Exalted March.     There were always hints that how the Chantry had interpreted her teaching and maintained her legacy might not be entirely as Andraste would have wished.   However. so long as we had limited knowledge about the growth of the Chantry and it was more in the background to events, as it was in DAO, it didn't really bother me that people in game didn't question it more.      The elves seemed to have a hard time of it but then it wasn't great for mages either, although at least they had reasonably descent living conditions.

 

DA2 became more problematic for me because what the Chantry taught was far more relevant to the plot and it did start to raise even more questions in my mind about the double standards with regard to how the Chantry treat the nobles compared with the peasant population.     It would have been nice to be able to take issue more with Chantry people on certain aspects of the Chant but then we had Anders banging on about it so much, even if some of his arguments were flawed, it at least meant someone was questioning things.

 

The problem with DAI is that your organisation and title is based off Chantry beliefs and the authorisation of the previous Divine.    As a result there is a lot more discussion of religion but no one ever really questions the core issue for me, which is does the Chantry really have anything to do with the historic Andraste and what she taught, except in name only?    I try to imagine how it would seem to my elf, who has been sent on a fact finding mission by his Keeper, and so makes a point of trying to find out as much as possible, including reading a copy of the Chant.   He also did all his background reading on the history as revealed in game and backed up in the source books.   Leaving aside his own race's particular issue with the Chantry, he finds it incomprehensible how people can maintain faith in an organisation that has such flimsy claims to legitimacy.   It is not about whether you believe or not in the Maker.   It is not about whether or not he believes Andraste was really divinely inspired.    It is that they don't seem to have any respect for the faith they claim to believe in.  And it is not as though people are unaware of what the Chant contains through being illiterate, because they chant the Chant constantly and are apparently meant to do so in full on a regular basis.   Also apparently keeping to what is taught is important because the Chantry teach that if you are wicked or unfaithful you will be damned to wander the Fade for eternity.

 

For example, according to the abridged Chant given in WoT2, there are 5 basic commandments of the Maker.   That doesn't seem much to have to adhere to but much of the time the only one they do, is:

1) You must believe in the Maker and no one else.   Still he would have thought more of Cassandra if she had outright called him a sinner for believing in the elf gods than simply asking him to accommodate the Maker into his pantheon.   He didn't have a problem with the Maker.   He'd always thought the Maker had a problem with him.   According to the Chant this is true.

 

2) Magic exists to serve man and never to rule over him.  Foul and corrupt are they who have taken his gift and turned it against his children.    From what he can tell this has always been open to interpretation.   However, he is rather confused when one Chantry sister tells him that the number one their faith is rooted in the principle that "Magic is a corrupting influence in the world", when the Chant clearly calls it the Maker's gift.   Then when he asks Mother Giselle about the issue she says that this may have been the case in the past but you have to see Andraste's words in the context of her time.   Excuse me, he thinks, where does Andraste come into this.   It is your organisation that says it is a corrupting influence, not Andraste.

 

3) All men are the work of our Maker's Hands from the lowest slaves to the highest kings.   Those who bring harm without provocation to the least of his children are hated and accursed by the Maker.   He notices that "without provocation" leaves a bit of elbow room but he does wonder how the Chantry can turn a blind eye to the training of Chevaliers that he has heard about, or the way servants can casually be killed in pursuit of the Game.  Also after learning the assassin spec, which does not automatically mean he intends going around killing people in cold blood, Leliana seems to be advocating him authorising the murder of some noble just so his wife can keep her money and titles and have the commoner she loves.   It seems to him that is murder pure and simple and yet she is a potential Divine.   Should she really be suggesting this?

 

4) Those who bear false witness and work to deceive others know this:  There is but one Truth.  All things are know to the Maker and He shall judge their lies.  

This was the point when he no longer had any respect for the Chantry or any of the major adherents he had contact with, apart from Cassandra who does seem to value the truth.   He has lost count of the number of times he was encouraged to lie about who he was and what really happened at the Conclave in order not to disturb the faithful.   Once again, there were numerous war table missions where Leliana, the potential Divine, suggested lying and deceiving people was the way to resolve the situation.   For example, in getting Red Crossing to accept the peace offering from the Dalish or getting the clan to shut up about the truth about Ameridan.    If people are so cavalier with the truth now, how can he be sure that anything in the Chant is genuine, when he knows that the Divines have taken bits out in the past  for political convenience or added bits in at the insistence of Drakon and claimed it is all the Maker's truth?

 

5) Thou shalt not steal.   It hardly matters whether they stick to this one or not but if he wanted to make a point, the Chantry and Orlais stole the Dales from the elves.   Normally when you conquer a people you just remove their leaders and they continue to live where they always did.   That's what they did with Ferelden but with the elves they rounded up the ordinary elves and sent them across Thedas to live in alienages, while they moved in humans to replace them.   Really though, by this point he just doesn't care any more.   He can't stomach the thought of actually serving this organisation as their tame peace keeper, so he disbands and goes back to his clan.   Their gods might not be up to much but the Dalish teach a moral code attached to their names that they adhere to and makes sense to him.  He'd rather have "faith" in that than the Chantry

 

Now what I would really like would be for the writers to acknowledge just how hypocritical the faith presented in DAI is.   I'd have liked for someone to have given me one concrete example when everyone in Thedas having the same belief in the Maker was unifying in a way they wouldn't have been without it.    Fighting the Darkspawn?   People were doing that when they still worshipped the old gods.   Fighting the Qun?   They'd have surely done that anyway and in any case, where is the solidarity with Tevinter, who do after all, believe in the Maker, unlike the Qun.    As for the other Exalted Marches against Tevinter and Starkhaven it is likely they'd have clubbed together against them anyway in the case of Starkhaven and was the march against Tevinter really unifying, given that, as I say, Tevinter believes in the Maker too?  The Exalted March on the Dales?  Well according to Giselle that wasn't a proper one anyway (in other words it was political). Having the same religion didn't stop Orlais invading Nevarra or Ferelden and there are numerous other instances where it seemed to make no difference whatsoever to world peace.    That is what was so annoying about DAI in terms of the way that religion was dealt with.    There is no one questioning the main belief system in Thedas even when it is obvious it is an illusion it is even a faith at all.


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#297
IHaveReturned1999

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The Chantry wants elves to be a lesser race and keeping the systematic oppression of everyone who's poor, disenfranchised, and anyone who has magic. I say screw the Chantry.
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#298
Pasquale1234

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Dwarven culture / beliefs have been briefly mentioned a couple of times in this thread, but I think it may be useful to examine them in a little more depth.

Dwarven society pays homage to 3 things:
1) The Stone - they honor this aspect of the physical world that surrounds and sustains their physical bodies.
2) The Ancestors - they honor those who came before them and built the Deep Roads, the Thaigs, and gave them the lives they know today.
3) The Paragons - they honor certain designated dwarves who have made extraordinary contributions to their communities.

DAO affords us the unique opportunity to actually meet 2 of these paragons - and we find that they are imperfect people who do / have also done some pretty awful things. These 2 (Caridin and Branka) directly oppose one another over Caridin's creation (The Anvil of the Void), and although they are given much authority in Orzammar's politics, neither of them gives a crap about which butt warms Orzammar's throne.

In short, they're just people. Masterfully skilled, talented, brilliant people perhaps - but by no means perfect or possessing of any particularly pure moral values. But dwarven citizens honor them all the same. Whether the Shaperate has much information about any of their possible misdeeds is both unknown and irrelevant. Each is remembered and honored for one particular thing, and that's enough for the dwarves.

It also serves as a precedent for raising other citizens to godlike status in the world of Thedas.

During the course of this discussion - and particularly ideas about what it means to be a 'traditional god' - I am reminded of the portrayal of the Greek Pantheon in the television series "Xena, the Warrior Princess". The gods and goddesses in the series were portrayed to be powerful and benevolent, but not particularly altruistic. At times, they could be petty, jealous, spiteful, egoistic meddlers in human affairs. And I guess that portrayal is in line with my personal take on what it means to be a 'traditional god'.

So I'm not entirely convinced that the Dalish view their gods / goddesses as being entirely altruistic, morally pure, 100% virtuous, divine beings - or that they take the stories passed down for millenia literally.
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#299
Jedi Master of Orion

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Sure, but it does mean that the Oriana didn't see Hadriana as a villain. Which is the point.

 

But she IS a villain. And SHOULD be seen as one. In this metaphor Orana is the slaves of the Evanruis, not the Dalish. But given the rebellion against them, there were clearly also slaves who had the perception of them that Fenris had of Hadriana. The Dalish would be more like Hawke or Merrill in this analogy, but even if they did inexplicably have a positive response to their gods being slavers instead of teachers, they'd be wrong to do so.



#300
LobselVith8

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I agree with Lobselvith that the elven religion has been invalidated. Unlike Lobselvith, I think that's absolutely a good thing. Believing in the superiority of the ancient civilization was holding the elves back.


My criticism was aimed at the how the Dalish religion is treated in contrast to the Andrastian religion. As to your post, it's not like finding out that the Creators aren't good or traditional gods will change much for the People; they are the subject of attacks because their religion is still criminalized (unless the developers decide that Leliana changes that as Divine, I suppose) and since they don't want to convert to the Andrastian faith these attacks will likely continue since they will remain a non-Andrastian group.

Being nomadic as a matter of survival only gives them time to survive from day to day, not build towards a future; their present day culture reflects their adaption to a nomadic lifestyle, which isn't likely to change much after finding out about the Creators.

Finding out about the Creators will certainly have ramifications regarding what they believe in. The Creators don't seem to be traditional gods. Gaider once said:

According to Dalish understanding, Elgar'nan and Mythal, the Father and the Mother, did not create the world. They were born of the world.


That fits with the references to Elgar'nan being born of the Sun and the land, and Mythal being born of the sea. Finding out the truth about the Creators should have serious ripple effects. Perhaps the Dalish will become an agnostic or atheist group, but their status as a non-Andrastian group will still be an issue for Andrastians.