164 replies to this topic

[The dead fish]

There was definitely an active attempt to make the female characters in DA:I as desexualised as possible. It's even referenced in game, when Iron Bull congratulates Cassandra on wearing practical armor and not boobplate. Which is hilarious considering Bull goes into battle half naked.

 

I think the goal was to make the female characters who are supposed to be warriors, to look like warriors, to be as desexualised as possible. It can only make sense. That's why you have this result with Cassandra. It already happened in DAII with Aveline, and other characters like Meredith. Which was welcome if you want to take seriously the female characters into that role as much as their male counterpart. Leliana looks totally credible as a spy too. Morrigan is sexualized with her outfit during the adventure. The outfit of Sera still shows the curves of her body even if lightly armored. 

 

As far as I remember, Vivienne was quite sexualized. She had a sexy outfit showing skin, she was as feminine as a woman could be. Look at her fingers, beautiful nails. 

 

I agree for Iron Bull though. This comment was stupid coming from him. 

[CronoDragoon]

Yeah that is a bit strange. Gone from coloured people, go forward 50 years, to people of colour. Where's the logic in that?

 

It's not a matter of logic but history. "Colored person or people" is a phrase that was specifically used towards black people in the United States during the Civil Rights era, often not favorably. Meanwhile, "people of color" is not often used in a derogatory manner and moreover refers to anyone who isn't white, not just African-Americans.

 

So while it's a bit confusing, it's not really hard to understand why one is offensive and another isn't. The former was used offensively in the past, the other wasn't. The reason the NAACP hasn't changed their name is because they think the acronym is engrained enough in the tradition of the United States that they feel it would do more harm than good to change it at this point.

 

So really this is just about how arbitrary meaning and connotation of language can be, but just because it's arbitrary doesn't mean it's not important.

[PunchFaceReporter]

It's not a matter of logic but history. "Colored person or people" is a phrase that was specifically used towards black people in the United States during the Civil Rights era, often not favorably. Meanwhile, "people of color" is not often used in a derogatory manner and moreover refers to anyone who isn't white, not just African-Americans.
 
So while it's a bit confusing, it's not really hard to understand why one is offensive and another isn't. The former was used offensively in the past, the other wasn't. The reason the NAACP hasn't changed their name is because they think the acronym is engrained enough in the tradition of the United States that they feel it would do more harm than good to change it at this point.
 
So really this is just about how arbitrary meaning and connotation of language can be, but just because it's arbitrary doesn't mean it's not important.

Still a bit weird though. Why group anyone who isn't white together? They're their own people too.

[CronoDragoon]

Still a bit weird though. Why group anyone who isn't white together? They're their own people too.

 

Because depending on the subject it can make sense to have those groupings, especially when it comes to entertainment. For example, if you're looking for more racial diversity in video game protagonists, but don't specifically have a horse in any particular ethnicity, you might say you'd like to see more people of color, instead of just listing out every one. Similarly, if you're talking about social or business issues and want to highlight how there might be some disparity (such as pay or job opportunities or attitudes) between whites vs. everyone else, you'd want some way to group the latter. Non-whites can kind of work except the language is inherently suggestive that white is the default, which is an implication you probably don't intend.

[The dead fish]

Still a bit weird though. Why group anyone who isn't white together? They're their own people too.

 

Well, I'm not american, but It's called. " National Association for the advancement of colored people. " In the end they are all minorities in the United States. Despite their differences, they have the same powerful common interest. They fight for the right of social, economical,  political equality for all of them, as much as it happens for the majority. Obviously they " are stronger together "  and their common goal is to eradicate discrimination against people of color no matter where they come from and who they are. 

 

It's a bit like the lgbt. Lesbians, gay, trans fight together for the gobal advancement of each of them. Not the same orientations, but basically the same fight. So they group together, instead any of them fighting alone.

[Gothfather]

That's the question that really matters, because we are the ones putting food on the table for Bioware. Not the other way around. They literally cannot afford to alienate us......because without "us" there is no Bioware.

 

Andromeda needs to be miles above the original trilogy in terms of content fidelity. It's also a brand new chapter in more ways than one.

 

On the technical side of things, ME1 might've been a cumbersome little mess but it left a significant lasting impression on the majority of players, that's why the sequels sold as much as they did. If ME1 was trash and was shunned by players, there might not have been a ME2/3.

 

Now they're REALLY trying to convince us to basically forget the original trilogy because its events don't matter anymore where Andromeda is concerned. They're in fact putting more pressure on themselves than we are on them, because to completely overshadow the trilogy in that way, they'll have to pay close attention to feedback pertaining to what was done wrong in the first place.

 

How much exploration sucked in ME1 and how it was non-existent in the sequels, the steadily-worsening dialogue as we went from ME1 to 2 and 3, the embarrassingly high number of bugs plaguing ME3's Campaign mode (the only mode that really matters)......I can go on like this all day. All those examples just scream laziness.

 

Andromeda needs to be "da bomb" and NOT bomb.

 

This is such utter BS. This is typical self entitled gamer BS at its worse.

 

Bioware doesn't owe you sh!t. You don't put food on their tables, they do by their hard work. Stop over inflating your own importance....

 

"But we buy the games if we don't buy the games they fail as a company." 

 

OH for FRAK SAKE get over yourself. This is true for EVERYONE and it is meaningless in the way you are caging it. We all produce a product or generate a service that someone 'buys' be it via customers or employers paying for our service. We all rely on someone seeing value in what we can or do produce be it product or service. SO FRAKING WHAT? Should I kowtow to my employer because without my employer I wouldn't have a job? NO! I provide my service and so long as i do so honestly that is all I am required to do my employer can choose to retain my services or let me go within the confines of the labour laws. I don't owe them a thing.

 

Bioware should tell fans like yourself to go take a long walk off a short pier. If you don't like ME3 then don't fraking buy ME:A stop this nonsense that just because you didn't like a product that you somehow magically get validation in forcing bioware to do what you want. I don't get to tell McDonald's because I hate their burgers they MUST make the burger the way I want them to. I only get to exercise my choice of buying or not buying. And then Bioware or McDonald's can choose to react to that IF THEY SO PLEASE. They are not obligated to do so at all. In fact McDonald's hasn't reacted to my not buying their food your decades at all. Bioware doesn't have to do jack sh!t to get your approval you are not as important as you pretend to be.

 

Either buy the game or don't no one cares but you. And you not buying the game or buying the game isn't singularly important. So long as Bioware sells enough games for it to be profitable they have done their job, because entertainment media is SUBJECTIVE. So your fraking opinion isn't objective just because it is yours. Gamers are a diverse group who like mutually exclusive things from each other which means some fans are ALWAYS upset. So WHAT?

 

I have no plans to buy ME:A until I see reviews from reviewers I trust but this is my bloody default position on games. The reason is that entertainment media is subjective so there is no guarantee I will like something or not. I fraking hate anime so I don't buy or watch it and who the hell cares. It is entrainment media which means if I don't like something that isn't a value statement on the media it is just media I don't like. Games are the same. Don't like the last instalment then don't buy the next one stop acting like you are OWED something because you didn't subjectively like entertainment.

 

Talk about self entitled with an over inflated sense of your own worth.

[Gothfather]

double post

[Gothfather]

Honestly, when I saw that pic, my first thought was "where can I get one of those mugs?".

 

That is my reaction too. I don't understand the persecution some of my fellow white males feel. I find it funny because it is like an elephant being afraid of a mouse.

[Hadeedak]

People are just so sensitive.

 

Someone else is allowed to have a differing opinion from you without being wrong or a bad person or even stupid. Heck, they can even voice their opinion, as long as I'm allowed to share mine, too.

 

I'm not really annoyed with Bioware, and won't be until their press release changes from focusing on their games to passive-aggressive snipes at everyone else's games and the people who play them.

[The dead fish]

That is my reaction too. I don't understand the persecution some of my fellow white males feel. I find it funny because it is like an elephant being afraid of a mouse.

 

What I find embarassing, it's that white female hetero don't feel that much insecure. You almost never see women complaining about that. When it's about diversity and inclusiveness you can count massively on their support. From the white male hetero, on internet  they massively complain, they accuse, and they like playing victims. And their are soooo angry and sooo sensitive about everything ! That's what i find disappointing. it's always the same group. i've been on many sites, and yes, it's always the same group. Hostile. 

 

I'm a male, I didn't feel offended when there was a mug about the " male tears " I didn't think it was funny, but at the same time, I wouldn't suddenly scream that it's sexist, that as a male, i feel persecuted lol. The outrage from some male gamers on this forum was hillarious. 

[Gorwath-F]

I am annoyed with BioWare. So much I wouldn't call myself a fan. More like an abused former spouse, who sometimes shows up to yell how awful BioWare turned out over the last couple of years, while being shouted down and having my eyes scratched out by BioWare's current spouses who have not suffered enough abuse.

[SnakeCode]

So is racism bad? Or only specific instances of it? Would you laugh had the mug read "POC Tears" or something similar? I'm guessing not.

[The dead fish]

So is racism bad? Or only specific instances of it? Would you laugh had the mug read "POC Tears" or something similar? I'm guessing not.

 

Please give the context of that. Without even knowing anything, i'm pretty sure that it was about those who complained about diversity. 

 

I remember Patrick Weeks who mocked the straight guys, didn't mean he was heterophobe. It was just a funny joke targeting those who complained about lgbt stuff being in dragon age inquisition. As a straight guy, didn't feel offended. 

 

Why would you need a poc tears ? As if there would be a lack of white characters. It just has no basis for a comparison.

[SnakeCode]

And they knew they were all straight white males how? Because they're the bogeyman that every "progressive" looks under their bed for at night? Or did they just assume because they're prejudiced?

[fdrty]

Edit - my bad. Misread a post above. 

[Furisco]

Yep, this thread has gone to ****.

[Cyonan]

I remember Patrick Weeks who mocked the straight guys

 

Did Patrick just assume my gender and sexual orientation?

[Draining Dragon]

Yep, this thread has gone to ****.

Nuke the whole site from orbit.

It's the only way to be sure.

[Furisco]

I like how people just love to create divisions between our spieces. There's always someone talking about "straight white male" or "****** black female" ffs.

 

I think some people like to show how much they hate racism but they are the ones creating those divisions and are part of the problem themselves.

 

Black, White, Hetero, ******, Trans = All those people said they hated what Bioware did in DAI with the inclusion of those romances.

Black, White, Hetero, ******, Trans = All those people loved what Bioware did in DAI with the inclusion of those romances.

 

You need to understand that bad or racist people exists independent of color or gender.

 

Now stop bringing this subject to every damn thread.

 

Edit: For some reason "homosexual" was censored.

[SnakeCode]

I like how people just love to create divisions between our spieces. There's always someone talking about "straight white male" or "****** black female" ffs.

 

I think some people like to show how much they hate racism but they are the ones creating those divisions and are part of the problem themselves.

 

Black, White, Hetero, ******, Trans = All those people said they hated what Bioware did in DAI with the inclusion of those romances.

Black, White, Hetero, ******, Trans = All those people loved what Bioware did in DAI with the inclusion of those romances.

 

You need to understand that bad or racist people exists independent of color or gender.

 

Now stop bringing this subject to every damn thread.

 

Edit: For some reason "homosexual" was censored.

 

But muh narrative!

[Kroitz]

Nuke the whole site from orbit.

It's the only way to be sure.

 

Joke is on you, I started the countdown 12 minutes ag-

 

Spoiler

[The dead fish]

And they knew they were all straight white males how? Because they're the bogeyman that every "progressive" looks under their bed for at night? Or did they just assume because they're prejudiced?

 

Like i said, people are talking in this thread without anyone telling the context. It's hard to figure out anything. It almost comes out from nowhere. I didn't learn anything about this story and apparently not many folks either. It's not about all, it's about plenty of them. Yes plenty of them, and they are predominant. i'm just not seeing the controversy by just admitting the truth.  No one is evil, it's just a trend that was noticed. But I'm willing to admit that the devs might be a bit prejudiced too. Like I said in other threads, I don't like this habit that Bioware has to mock a group of people in their convention, whether they are white, straight, or male or whatever. I don't think it's funny, I don't think it's clever,  but honestly I don't see the point in overreacting over such ridiculous thing. Do not forget that these words are meant for people who attend the convention, not for those on the forum. It's mostly for fun, not meant to be serious and people know it. Most devs are straight white males, they aren't going to be racist and heterophobes and sexist against themself. It's just ridiculous. Manveir work with them, and obviously not a single one of his mates took offense for obvious reasons. 

 

80% of my friends are white, they made some jokes about black people, did i get angry ? No. i laughed. because I knew it was for fun and meant to be a joke; I know their feelings. And the same for me. Even my girlfriend who is white make some bad jokes about black people ! And Vice verça. 

 

I'm sometime myself even very critical about black people, for example when many of them seem  to like the idea to shame other black people,  over their choices, especially who they choose as their girlfriend ( wow man you are betraying our sista ), what kind of music they listen,  with this weird scrutiny that some of us have, i like sometime self-deprecating about how dumb we can be sometime, that doesn't mean I'm racist against black people, my own skin color. OO

 

Personally I think people are being way too much oversensitive for not much. 

 

I'd also prefer Bioware to work on inclusiveness while remaining silent. Jut focus on your work, do what you want. 

[AlanC9]

Yep, this thread has gone to ****.

Time to start pouring gasoline on it, I guess.

[straykat]

Most devs are straight white males, they aren't going to be racist and heterophobes and sexist against themself.

 

 

Yeah, they will. It's the phenomenon of white (and now white male) guilt. If you're told to feel bad about everything (even things you didn't do) or you're called privileged just for being born, then some people appease by playing along. Especially if your opponents are aggressive or even scary, and you just want a calm atmosphere. It's habitual at this point.

 

It takes non-white guys, or gay guys, or something to slap these dudes across the head and start feeling better about themselves.

[AlanC9]

Or they just feel that straight white males donning the "victim" mantle is both kind of sad and kind of hilarious, like some of us in this thread. Those beliefs would produce similar behaviors, wouldn't they?