5450 réponses à ce sujet

[mousestalker1]

It's one of those irregular conjugations:

 

I am honest.

You are blunt.

She is toxic.

 

Now you know...

[Elhanan]

You really need to let go of this idea that BioWare is going to descend from their Golden Throne in the Heavens and lift you up, the forums along with it, because you've spent some time defending them online and called people discussing BioWare in a less than perfect light as crying infants.
 
You, along with the rest of us Heretics, have been branded with the "Toxic" label for the crime of having a community that doesn't directly benefit BioWare's bottom line. BioWare is well within their rights to shut this place down, and have risked great criticism to make this decision. Respect that decision, instead of lashing out at fellow forumites and painting them with the broadest brush you have at your disposal, to try and prove your "loyalty" to BioWare. Ultimately you are contributing to the atmosphere you so decry.

Again, I hope for the best, but expect the worst. Saving the forums would be grand, but I doubt it will occur, esp given the overall tenor of this thread as an example.

As my reaction, I choose to remain a fan of Bioware games. I was disappointed with ME2 some yrs ago, but ME3 was an improvement, as was DAI for me. I have no intention of giving that up simply because of them closing the forums. How I choose to react should nor reflect how I am treated. I have gone through sim situations in both my work and social life before; nothing different now.

As for going down the drain together, I can live with that. But I do not have to act like part of the reason they chose to flush....

[Vroom Vroom]

It's not just a few fans, though. Not once you take into account all those people who scoured the threads for answers to 'help desk' type questions. Just because everybody doesn't post doesn't mean the forums aren't used. Maybe an archive costs money, but is it more money than additional help personnel or a new help library? I do not consider myself an avid poster, in fact, except for the last few days I consider myself about 65-70% lurker or browser, and much of that to find answers to questions.

 

 

Not very. Recently I decided to tweet a pre-announcement post, a short one. Took 18 tweets to get it all . . . I'm probably blocked now but I don't know for sure.

 

 

Color me clueless but I don't know what you mean by credentials. I'm assuming you don't mean my user name.

He/she means same password and username used in tandem or password and the same email as used on here together.

[QueenPurpleScrap]

He/she means same password and username used in tandem or password and the same email as used on here together.

Thank you.

[Hainkpe]

It's not just a few fans, though. Not once you take into account all those people who scoured the threads for answers to 'help desk' type questions. Just because everybody doesn't post doesn't mean the forums aren't used. Maybe an archive costs money, but is it more money than additional help personnel or a new help library? I do not consider myself an avid poster, in fact, except for the last few days I consider myself about 65-70% lurker or browser, and much of that to find answers to questions.

Will the casual user object as strongly as an avid user? Will the removed information impact their choice in buying Bioware products? Probably not. It's the avid users who are objecting strongly but what are those numbers? That's the question. How can those avid users make themselves heard? That's the conundrum. Sure they can flood the forum and object but in what way is that causin an impact? From the outside looking in, it's not. It's just complaining and whining. To a business like Bioware there's nothing to contend with to change their minds. It's just the "usual toxicity" of the forum. Nothing new.

[Elhanan]

Maybe, but that was only because DA only had one other game at that point. DA2 was routinely mocked on most enthusiast forums and news sites, as discussed earlier. 
 
However, ME3 was most decidedly not a minority. It was such a huge problem that sites like CNN and The New Yorker were covering it. It had media impressions from large publications worldwide. Some of the earliest polls had up to a million votes, with nearly-unanimous condemnation of the ending itself.

And yet those millions are not posting here. This forum represents a very small number of the overall community. So no matter which side is louder, it does not represent the overall gaming population.

And while DA2 is my least fave DA game in the series, I still rank it higher than many titles, and have hundreds of hrs in replays. And I played ME3 after the wailing over the endings, but am still content with them both; normal or Extended Cut.

[thedancingdruid]

Elhanan, only if one clicks on those threads, the ones whose sheer titles alone are indicative of the content that will be contained within.

I simply choose to ignore those threads, and instead focus on the positive ones.

My point is with the alternatives they are suggesting, these social media snapshot shops, it doesn't stop the negativity, it only exacerbates it. That is where all the Olympic stuff comes from, like Ralph Lauren's logo on the athletes' uniforms being bigger than the U.S. flag.

But then, I admit...I grew up in the sticks'n'stones generation, so what would I know about it.

What I do know is that woven amongst all these thread titles, here on the BSN, I found true masterpieces and I do not want to see them burn because a few people object to them for some reason.

I am an American and believe in the First Amendment, without restriction or censorship of any kind. At the same time, by believing in that principle, that fundamental constitutional right, I also, as an adult, carry the full responsibility and burden of where, and what, I decide to click.

[LPPrince]

I'm crying. I just got a warning point for discussing moderation in you've been given a warning thread.

 

Oh man. This is hilarious

 

 

My issue was fixed.

[Sah291]

The problem I have with the whole 'toxicity' thing is that word doesn't really mean anything. It no longer applies to just really obvious FUD, and troll behavior, like harassing or making threats to devs or other users, etc. But it means different things to everyone, and includes any sort of negativity or ideas people don't like or don't agree with. And that, in of itself, is becoming kind of toxic, IMO, as folks bludgeon each other with accusations of being toxic. I don't think that's healthy either.

I think any time you have a very large number of people, from all walks of life, gathering in a public space, you are inevitably going to encounter a few bad apples, or just people with wildly different views and opinions from your own. The only way to completely stop that is to stick only to closed or gated communities that heavily moderate membership. But the trade off there is a decline in diversity, and discouraging new people from joining.

That said, I can see how Bioware might find these forums harmful at times. Using myself as an example, I remember back when DA2 first came out. I visited the forums and saw mostly bad reviews here so I didn't stick around and didn't bother buying the game. I later came back and loved it, so I regret letting that influence me. But I can see how casual players might come here and be turned off from trying the new games, if there is so much negativity, and it looks bad from a marketing and PR standpoint coming from their own website (as opposed to third party sites).

I had thought the forum had mellowed out though, recently, and there are many great and wonderful threads and posters here, who truly don't deserve the 'toxic' label. So I would just say, not to take this forum closure too personally, and look forward to building a new community.

[BrandofTime]

Bioware has and does make great games. I've enjoyed all 3 Dragon Ages over the years. I hope that the shutting down of the forums doesn't mean that they will be absorbed by a large group and disbanded. I wonder if, at this point ME:A is their last game. My hopes for DA4 are going down with this announcement, I don't see it as really promising at this point.

[Hainkpe]

I am an American and believe in the First Amendment, without restriction or censorship of any kind. At the same time, by believing in that principle, that fundamental constitutional right, I also, as an adult, carry the full responsibility and burden of where I decide to click.

I'll probably open a can of worms but the application of the US Constitution First Amendment is a pet peeve of mine. As a US citizen under the First Amendment, the US Government cannot censor my freedom of speech. But. Bioware and thus EA is not the US Government, they're a corporation/company and they can restrict the rights of the users of their product. They can censor when users sign end user agreements in order to use the product. EA/Bioware owns this forum. It's their product. They can exercise their rights as it relates to their product.

[Elhanan]

Elhanan, only if one clicks on those threads, the ones whose sheer titles alone are indicative of the content that will be contained within.

I simply choose to ignore those threads, and instead focus on the positive ones.

My point is with the alternatives they are suggesting, these social media snapshot shops, it doesn't stop the negativity, it only exacerbates it. That is where all the Olympic stuff comes from, like Ralph Lauren's logo on the athletes uniforms being bigger than the U.S. flag.

But then, I admit...I grew up in the sticks'n'stones generation, so what would I know about it.

What I do know is that woven amongst all these thread titles, here on the BSN, I found true masterpieces and I do not want to see them burn because a few people object to them for some reason.

I am an American and believe in the First Amendment, without restriction or censorship of any kind. At the same time, by believing in that principle, that fundamental constitutional right, I also, as an adult, carry the full responsibility and burden of where I decide to click.

I also am American, but these forums are based in Canada, I believe. And I willingly chose to forgo my right to discuss politics and religion here to keep on message for games.

For myself, I will be losing thousands of pages of content concerning the DA series, ME series, Skyrim (in OT forum), etc. I hate it, but also hated losing posts made on other forums before BSN. I also believe Bioware is making an error in judgment, but it is their right to make it.

[CHRrOME]

Perhaps they should focus on making a game that does NOT anger the consumers who paid for said game... instead of squashing the criticism.

 

This would be like someone focusing on shutting down a YELP review site full of negative reviews of bad food rather than improving the food they deliver.

 

And if Bioware thinks this is bad, they really should take a look at what happens when social media, twitter, reddit, facebook, youtube turn against a company or product. The narrative is uncontrolled and extremely damaging.

 

I don't think Bioware realizes what they're signing themselves up to if their main channels of communication are social media.

 

You know what's funny? recently we saw what happens when things go out of control in youtube. Anyone here remember the Call of Duty fiascos? people will insta-dislike the trailers/videos as soon as they popped up. The ratio was about 5 to 1 negative.

The same happened to Creative Assembly and their Total War series with the pre-order fiasco. The videos where well done and everything, but people will continue to dislike everything they toss on youtube, related or not. And they calmed down just recently.

[Vroom Vroom]

Thank you.

No problem. As someone who admins a ProBoard forum, I'd like to say that as far as I know, anyone who admins on such boards cannot see a user's password, but we can see a user's Email Address and IP Address, so that's something for all to keep in mind when joining such forums (would still recommend a different password too, just in case).

[LPPrince]

My issue was fixed.

[Zeroth Angel]

Honestly at this point I consider the word 'Toxic' as much as a buzzword as edgy, pretentious, forced drama and the like.

 

I've seen a lot of places on the internet and the BSN is really not as toxic as some of the people at BW make it out to be.

[Zanderat]

I don't think that I have actually ever posted since the BSN forums.  But, ya.  It speaks volumes about the devs own opinion of ME:A.

 

edit: I just started another play through of DAO.  Where do I go?  STEAM forums?  Reddit?

[mrs_anomaly]

If you mean pointing out that many are acting out like crying infants, hissing cats, and foxes wanting high hanging grapes, then I guess I am. But ME:A as a pre-order is simply a fact; helps balance out those cries for cancellations.

If you cannot stand the fact that some of us are upset about our forums closing why are you even in here? 

 

Also choosing not to purchase further games from Bioware is a valid response to cumulative disappoints. 

 

Disagreeing with this forum closure and commenting about it in the wake of this decision is more than just "whining". I'm pretty sure that most of us in here are highly aware that nothing we say here is going to reverse the decision and I've only seen a few people who have crossed a line regarding remarks about this closure, ie, acting completely immaturely or saying something uncalled for. 

 

There have always been a few bad members of this forum- but they are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. 

 

If we want to pick apart the reasons, lament, comfort each other, walk down memory lane, raise our metaphorical fists in the air with anger (respectfully), opine and commiserate I see this as no "further proof" that our space be scorched off the Earth you dig?

[thedancingdruid]

Hainkpe...Point missing it. It's my principle, one that I, alone, for myself, live by. I certainly am not suggesting BioWare believe it or adhere to it or care anything about it. Just don't censor the many, for the few. Or can I not even hope for that?

Elhanan...I am well aware the management of this forum is in Edmonton.

Great mixing politics and religion immediately in with free speech. The Constitution has punctuation I believe.

I was here for the BioWare Social Network...closure, transfer, transmog, whatever you want to call it. Granted then BioWare at least attempted not to ruin all the history there by completely scrapping it, but they did manage to definitely shred it somewhat.

Here is hoping we do not repeat history.

As the British say...Cheers (Didn't want anyone to misinterpret that as American) and think I was drinking before noon, it is only a little past 11 a.m. where I am.

[AngryFrozenWater]

Honestly at this point I consider the word 'Toxic' as much as a buzzword as edgy, pretentious, forced drama and the like.

 

I've seen a lot of places on the internet and the BSN is really not as toxic as some of the people at BW make it out to be.

BW's marketing terms usually follow simple rules. Most positive terms actually mean something negative, like "innovation" = "dumbing down", "iconic" = "no follower customization", "foster conversation" = "silence", and "new spaces" = "muzzle". But "toxic" seems to be an exception. With that one it seems the other way around. It must mean "the truth". Otherwise I can't explain what it means. Are they afraid of the truth?

 

"The forums are toxic" then becomes "The forums are the truth". Makes sense, right?

 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Honestly at this point I consider the word 'Toxic' as much as a buzzword as edgy, pretentious, forced drama and the like.

 

I've seen a lot of places on the internet and the BSN is really not as toxic as some of the people at BW make it out to be.

It's really not. In terms of per capita "toxicity", social media, tumblr, reddit, i.e the sites BioWare wants to funnel us towards, are easily more toxic to the point of being radioactive cancer. It's just that the format of a forum implies equal exposure of opinion regardless of who you are. Which means that criticism or "toxicity" is more difficult to remove from view without strong moderation. With tumblr, you risk opening yourself to harassment if you are "toxic" and with reddit, "toxicity" is buried thanks to their upvote system and ridiculous formatting. Social media too, blockbots, so you can automatically silence people who are "toxic". And most of these measures are done independently, they are self moderating features.

 

Really, it isn't about toxicity in any genuine sense, it's about optics. I think that BioWare's lack of attention and care to cultivate a potentially powerful brand in the BSN should mean that they ought to destroy it. It's an eyesore for their branding. Their own official forums masterminded and drove the shitstorm that was the ME 3 endings. I'm not surprised BioWare is kicking this forum to the curb. They don't get money from it directly, and it's reputation as a cheerleading hub is ravaged.

[mrs_anomaly]

BW's marketing terms usually follow simple rules. Most positive terms actually mean something negative, like "innovation" = "dumbing down", "iconic" = "no follower customization", "foster conversation" = "silence", and "new spaces" = "muzzle". But "toxic" seems to be an exception. With that one it seems the other way around. It must mean "truth". Otherwise I can't explain what it means. Are they afraid of the truth?

*whispers doublespeak and skitters away*

[southp4wn]

i've never been active here, but i've found solutions for bugs and problems in these forums, as well as some great mods. lock it down if you must, but please don't CLOSE these places down. they contain so much valuable work. i've been directed here by ea's support several times, they're lost without the forums too. fans figure stuff out devs can't be bothered with. you're really throwing away a resource. yes it would cost to keep the servers running, but you wouldn't have to worry about moderators or anything else. keep the portals read-only if nothing else. please.

 

please.

[Vroom Vroom]

It's really not. In terms of per capita "toxicity", social media, tumblr, reddit, i.e the sites BioWare wants to funnel us towards, are easily more toxic to the point of being radioactive cancer. It's just that the format of a forum implies equal exposure of opinion regardless of who you are. Which means that criticism or "toxicity" is more difficult to remove from view without strong moderation. With tumblr, you risk opening yourself to harassment if you are "toxic" and with reddit, "toxicity" is buried thanks to their upvote system and ridiculous formatting. Social media too, blockbots, so you can automatically silence people who are "toxic". And most of these measures are done independently, they are self moderating features.

 

Really, it isn't about toxicity in any genuine sense, it's about optics. I think that BioWare's lack of attention and care to cultivate a potentially powerful brand in the BSN should mean that they ought to destroy it. It's an eyesore for their branding. Their own official forums masterminded and drove the shitstorm that was the ME 3 endings. I'm not surprised BioWare is kicking this forum to the curb. They don't get money from it directly, and it's reputation as a cheerleading hub is ravaged.

We're the worst cheerleaders ever 

[Teddie Sage]

I will look into doing something like this.

Thank you very much. If we can salvage the community and move it elsewhere, then it won't be a huge loss.