125 réponses à ce sujet

[GoldenGail3]

Oh, well, lol.

[Catilina]

I don't understand why anyone would want to spend their time by romancing a bunch of files that aren't even able to deviate from their  patterns but maybe i'm just a different kind of player more attached to the multyplayer aspect of games.

It is a form of betrayal since there is a bond and a deception the outcome of killing people just aggravate it.

Because we dont have real life. Unlike you, who judge pixel characters.

[HiroVoid]

Any sane forum would need 4. Warnings don't do crap on this forum. I think the record is 21

Well, nobody will have to worry about it in a month.

[TheAtomicSurvivor]

Because we dont have real life. Unlike you, who judge pixel characters.

 

There's a quote I like

 

"Fiction reveals truths reality obscures" -Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

As much as you can simply claim they are pixelated characters, even broken down to their simplest parts. Fictional characters allow us the potential ability to break down social barriers and have conversations like this. They reveal things about our own personal human nature and open up doorways to analysis.

 

They may be pixelated, but they do have some truths to them.

[Lunatica]

Arshei want's to get banned... Very badly, it would seem.

Why anyone should be concerned to be banned from BsN?It's a platform that will soon cease to exist  there has never been a better timing at creating troll bait threads.

[KaiserShep]

Any sane forum would need 4. Warnings don't do crap on this forum. I think the record is 21

 

 

And here I was certain I'd be banned for my measly 7. 

[Akiza]

And here I was certain I'd be banned for my measly 7. 

I don't think the moderators have any interest at reducing the traffic in their own forum.

[Catilina]

I don't think the moderators have any interest at reducing the traffic in their own forum.

The Forum will be closed. I do not think it would be worthwhile to care about it.

[Inkvisiittori]

Anders interesting case because he is not alone, and never will be. He can't do anything against it. But in case of friendship romance Hawke agrees with him, so it is not difficult to accept his purpose and fight on his side,I think. I can see why it seems selfish, but I can understand if someone have a bigger purpose. 

I never done rival romance with him, but I think, he will die, if he need to fight against the mages, and  Hawke against his goals, because of Justice. Anders will fight for Hawke, and he remains loyal to him/her until his death. 

 

(I prefer the happy rebel couple version.)

 

 

Yeah, Justice is probably the biggest reason for Anders' single-minded obsession with mage freedom. I played mage Hawke who supported any efforts against the templars all the way through. She told him: "This is war. We cannot be weakened by our feelings." She was just as dedicated to the cause as Anders was and that's why he respected and loved her. Rivalry romance sounds kind of interesting too, though... Anders hated my pro-templar Hawke's guts and the feeling was mutual. I can't even imagine what the romance would be like. 

 

I wish they'd bring back the rivalry system.

 

That's very hypocrite considering that you like Solas romance.

 

 

No, it isn't. Despite some parallels I wouldn't compare Solas to Anders. Solas claims that the relationship "was selfish of me" and lets Lavellan go, because he loves her and doesn't want to put her through all the pain because of him. Anders doesn't and he involves Hawke in his plan no matter what she believes, making her a culprit to the Chantry's destruction. 

[PhroXenGold]

That's an unrealistic expectation to want your partner to have to change for your point of views. There needs to come a level between both parties to say, "Let's disagree to agree".

 

Because that comes with maturity.

 

It should not be the only expectation that I should be the only one to compromise my beliefs for someone, just as someone should not have to compromise my beliefs for someone. Now the Inquisitor could have compromised their beliefs for Sera, by having a third option

 

"How about I don't bring the topic up when you're around"

 

Which is reasonable, imo. When I was Aethist and dating my Christian girlfriend at the time, we just agreed we wouldn't bring up subjects about God. 

 

I don't think you quite get what I'm trying to get at in my post - again I agree with what your saying here. Both parties need to compromise. And yes, additional dialogue options would be nice. But with what we have in the game, in the case of Sera and the Inquisitor breaking up, neither party is willing to compromise. Sera won't compromise on her distrust of "elfiness" and the Inquisitor wont compromise on her Dalish identity. If people are saying that Sera doesn't truly love Inky because she won't change, then they must accept the corollary that the Inquisitor doesn't truly love Sera. If Sera is being childish for not being prepared to compromise, then so is the Inquisitor. Both parties are to blame.

[Inkvisiittori]

I don't think you quite get what I'm trying to get at in my post - again I agree with what your saying here. Both parties need to compromise. And yes, additional dialogue options would be nice. But with what we have in the game, in the case of Sera and the Inquisitor breaking up, neither party is willing to compromise. Sera won't compromise on her distrust of "elfiness" and the Inquisitor wont compromise on her Dalish identity. If people are saying that Sera doesn't truly love Inky because she won't change, then they must accept the corollary that the Inquisitor doesn't truly love Sera. If Sera is being childish for not being prepared to compromise, then so is the Inquisitor. Both parties are to blame.

 

So they love their ideas more than they love each other?

 

I don't see why either of them should compromise. If you truly believe in something you don't give up on it - not for love, not for anything. Some things are bigger than you or anything else. Maybe they just weren't meant to be.

 

But if someone does give up then it's the Inquisitor. You can say "okay Sera you're right I want to be with you so I will forsake my dalish heritage for you." That can happen. But Sera will never do the same for your sake. You can't make her change her mind or compromise. She is the one making demands - not Lavellan. Lavellan doesn't care if Sera believes in Andraste, but Sera can't accept Lavellan who believes in Mythal. This makes their relationship unequal when only one of them is making demands of the other. 

[PhroXenGold]

So they love their ideas more than they love each other?

 

I don't see why either of them should compromise. If you truly believe in something you don't give up on it - not for love, not for anything. Some things are bigger than you or anything else. Maybe they just weren't meant to be.

 

I tend to disagree there, but I know I'm probably in a minority given how often phrases like "stood by their principles" are used as compliments. As far as I'm concerned, being willing to compromise, being willing to accept that you're not necessarily right, being willing to see that others' opinions and beliefs can be just as valid as yours, is a mark of a great person. Sticking rigidly to one set of beliefs, one ideology, is a character flaw to me.

 

 

 

But if someone does give up then it's the Inquisitor. You can say "okay Sera you're right I want to be with you so I will forsake my dalish heritage for you." That can happen. But Sera will never do the same for your sake. You can't make her change her mind or compromise. She is the one making demands - not Lavellan. Lavellan doesn't care if Sera believes in Andraste, but Sera can't accept Lavellan who believes in Mythal. This makes their relationship unequal when only one of them is making demands of the other.

 

Yes, the Inquisitor can compromise, but an Inquisitor that chose to break up the relationship (which is what we're discussing here) doesn't do so. So if the relationship does break up both parties are equally to blame given that neither is prepared to compromise.

[Inkvisiittori]

I tend to disagree there, but I know I'm probably in a minority given how often phrases like "stood by their principles" are used as compliments. As far as I'm concerned, being willing to compromise, being willing to accept that you're not necessarily right, being willing to see that others' opinions and beliefs can be just as valid as yours, is a mark of a great person. Sticking rigidly to one set of beliefs, one ideology, is a character flaw to me.

 

If you're wrong yes of course you need to be able to see that and accept it. However, we are talking about religion and culture. I don't see why giving up your personal beliefs because someone else can't accept them is a good thing. Sera is not asking you to accept her opinions and beliefs as equal to your own - she is asking you to give up your own beliefs and culture or else she will leave you.

[PhroXenGold]

If you're wrong yes of course you need to be able to see that and accept it. However, we are talking about religion and culture. I don't see why giving up your personal beliefs because someone else can't accept them is a good thing. Sera is not asking you to accept her opinions and beliefs as equal to your own - she is asking you to give up your own beliefs and culture or else she will leave you.

 

And if you break up with her, you're effectively doing the same. You're saying you can't accept her if she doesn't change her opinions, that she needs to give up her beliefs and culture.

 

Both sides are in the wrong here. Inky is as bad as Sera. if they were sensible, they would realise that things like culture really aren't that important compared to the fact that they've got feelings for each other (hell they really shouldn't be important full stop, but too many people obsess over crap like that...). But, if the Inquisitor goes for the break up option, they don't. Both are unwilling to change.

[Inkvisiittori]

And if you break up with her, you're effectively doing the same. You're saying you can't accept her if she doesn't change her opinions, that she needs to give up her beliefs and culture.

 

Both sides are in the wrong here. Inky is as bad as Sera. if they were sensible, they would realise that things like culture really aren't that important compared to the fact that they've got feelings for each other (hell they really shouldn't be important full stop, but too many people obsess over crap like that...). But, if the Inquisitor goes for the break up option, they don't. Both are unwilling to change.

 

No. Inquisitor never demands that Sera must give up her religion and culture. Sera is the only one doing that. At best Inquisitor is asking that Sera should be more tolerant and accept that people believe in different things - nothing more. That is too much for Sera and that's why she breaks up with you (and can't even be your friend after that).

 

Like I already said some things are more important than personal feelings like duty you have for your country and people and sometimes you must make sacrifices for it. 

[TheAtomicSurvivor]

And if you break up with her, you're effectively doing the same. You're saying you can't accept her if she doesn't change her opinions, that she needs to give up her beliefs and culture.

 

Both sides are in the wrong here. Inky is as bad as Sera. if they were sensible, they would realise that things like culture really aren't that important compared to the fact that they've got feelings for each other (hell they really shouldn't be important full stop, but too many people obsess over crap like that...). But, if the Inquisitor goes for the break up option, they don't. Both are unwilling to change.

 

But that's not so easy to do.

 

You know that wouldn't fly today?

 

Go tell a Native American to give up their culture and beliefs right now. The very traditions and values they grew up with. See how well that goes. 

 

It's so dismissive.

 

It's not that the Inquisitor is unwilling to compromise. As said earlier, which you entirely missed my point, going with the Christian thing again

 

A girl you're dating is Christian and tells you

 

"You need to start believing in God or we cannot date"

 

The reasonable response which the Inquisitor already had given Sera before the two options is

 

"We can agree to disagree, but it's not so easy to start believing in something that I have valued my whole entire life"

 

That's a reasonable stance. It's disgusting. Emotionally manipulative to tell someone to shed all the values of their life. Dalish tradition isn't just religious, it's the cultural values someone grew up on.

 

I really want you to go tell some

 

Native American to believing in their culture because you don't agree with it, if they want to be involved with you

 

How about someone from Ireland?

 

How about someone from the UK?

 

Or Russia.

 

If you think that the Inquisitor is being irrational about letting go of a very important value system, than I suppose its okay in real life to tell someone to throw it away.

 

This isn't just the Inquisitor being some part of a club.

 

Like "I'm Dalish guys, I am so leet,"

 

No

 

-That's their childhood

-The places they grew up

-The things they were taught

-They're family

-The value system they were raised upon

 

Sure Maybe the Inquisitor doesn't need to speak all Elfy to Sera, but what Sera did.....is ****** poor. 

[PhroXenGold]

No. Inquisitor never demands that Sera must give up her religion and culture. Sera is the only one doing that. At best Inquisitor is asking that Sera should be more tolerant and accept that people believe different things - nothing more. That is too much for Sera and that's why she breaks up with you (and can't even be your friend after that).

 

 

And Sera's believes strongly that "elfiness" is a crock of **** and wants nothing to do with people who accept it. So by saying she should be more tolerant you are saying she has to give up on her core beliefs. Your saying her beliefs are wrong and she should change them to be more like yours. Which is exactly what you criticise her for.

 

 

Like I already said some things are more important than personal feelings like duty you have for your country and people and sometimes you must make sacrifices for it.

 

"Dulce et decoum est pro patria mori" and all that crap eh?

[TheAtomicSurvivor]

And Sera's believes strongly that "elfiness" is a crock of **** and wants nothing to do with people who accept it. So by saying she should be more tolerant you are saying she has to give up on her core beliefs. Your saying her beliefs are wrong and she should change them to be more like yours. Which is exactly what you criticise her for.

 

 

That's not asking her change. The refusal to be open minded is not a healthy personality trait to have. I am not saying its right or wrong, however. People grow.

 

We're actually going to use Cole to segway into this. I like how I can use the other characters as examples of Sera's immaturity. During Cole's personal quest he has the happen chance to be a human, "To Grow" or to "Stay Stuck"

 

People Grow. They develop and mature. No one is asking Sera to change what she believes, they are asking for her to be open minded and human. No one said Sera could not like Elves.

 

We said that she should be able to accept the Inquisitor for who they are. To **** all over the Inquisitor's personhood, is cruel. And not very sympathetic at all. 

 

Again here goes an example.

 

Some people feel personally attacked when we make fun of Americans. Because they grew up in America. Because being American is some kind of value or core of who someone is.

 

No one told Sera she doesn't have to believe in her thoughts, they said if she loves someone she has to respect them. You have to recognize other people's limitations.

 

The Inquisitor is already aware of Sera's limitations, but tried to respect Sera's limitations. While Sera understands those limitations and decides to push them and force someone else to change.

 

No one said Sera had to change what she believed, we asked for more tolerance.

 

Another quote I like

 

“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.”

Harlan Ellison

[Wulfram]

I don't think you quite get what I'm trying to get at in my post - again I agree with what your saying here. Both parties need to compromise. And yes, additional dialogue options would be nice. But with what we have in the game, in the case of Sera and the Inquisitor breaking up, neither party is willing to compromise. Sera won't compromise on her distrust of "elfiness" and the Inquisitor wont compromise on her Dalish identity. If people are saying that Sera doesn't truly love Inky because she won't change, then they must accept the corollary that the Inquisitor doesn't truly love Sera. If Sera is being childish for not being prepared to compromise, then so is the Inquisitor. Both parties are to blame.

The Inquisitor has compromised. They're living among Sera's people, not the Inquisitor's. They're accepting Sera's beliefs and even Sera's hostility towards the Inquisitor's people.

If the Inquisitor demanded that Sera agree to convert to following Dalish gods, join the Inquisitor's clan and get herself some Vallaslin, then there'd be a failure to compromise on both parties. But as it is, the Inquisitor has already moved to more than half way and Sera's not willing to offer anything in return.

[Catilina]

Yeah, Justice is probably the biggest reason for Anders' single-minded obsession with mage freedom. I played mage Hawke who supported any efforts against the templars all the way through. She told him: "This is war. We cannot be weakened by our feelings." She was just as dedicated to the cause as Anders was and that's why he respected and loved her. Rivalry romance sounds kind of interesting too, though... Anders hated my pro-templar Hawke's guts and the feeling was mutual. I can't even imagine what the romance would be like. 

 

I wish they'd bring back the rivalry system.

(I chosed the same answer. I think, this is the best, if your Hawke understand him, and accept his goals.)

 

For similar reasons, I do not like Andersen rival romance. (Rivalmance i not bad at all, because for example Fenris' situation is different because his anger against the mages does not mean his life, and not a "belief", a goal, only anger, from what he want to be free. Rivalmance with Fenris with pro-mage is acceptable and creditable, because Hawke dont need to work with the slave-traders and accept the slavery, and s/he can help Fenris. Simple I dont think, its working with Anders.)

[Dai Grepher]

Anora is the best romance of course!

My Cousland and Anora are in their 13th year of marriage at present. He's been gone a little while, but she's still faithful to him.

[Qun00]

And if you break up with her, you're effectively doing the same. You're saying you can't accept her if she doesn't change her opinions, that she needs to give up her beliefs and culture.

Both sides are in the wrong here. Inky is as bad as Sera. if they were sensible, they would realise that things like culture really aren't that important compared to the fact that they've got feelings for each other (hell they really shouldn't be important full stop, but too many people obsess over crap like that...). But, if the Inquisitor goes for the break up option, they don't. Both are unwilling to change.

You keep saying "both", but you only condemn the Inquisitor.

You don't think Sera needs to compromise. The Inquisitor is the one that actually should.

[TheAtomicSurvivor]

You keep saying "both", but you only condemn the Inquisitor.

You don't think Sera needs to compromise. The Inquisitor is the one that actually should.

 

Which is weird because there is a dialogue where the Inquisitor ask

 

"Wait, what you're breaking up with me? Can't we talk about this"

 

So it was clear the Inquisitor wanted to compromise with Sera

[Catilina]

You keep saying "both", but you only condemn the Inquisitor.

You don't think Sera needs to compromise. The Inquisitor is the one that actually should.

Neither of them should compromise. Clearly, therefore unfit to live together (probably due to the fault Sera).

[Patchwork]

Now I'm curious, BW had a lot of dialogue in Trespasser aimed at fixing things people complained about so does Sera have anything to say to for her ex if Lavellan refused to essentially stop being Dalish and they broke up?