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[SurelyForth]

I have no doubt that Wynne, at least, is hanging on to every word and repeating "I told you so, I told you so, I told you so," in her head.

[Sandtigress]

Cuddlezarro wrote...

Interesting. In any case my male Human Noble convinced them to get hitched before the landsmeet but after he kills Loghain she understandably wants nothing to do with him. I got the notion he could somehow be convinced to spare Loghain and marry Anora.

if by spare loghain you mean "have loghain join your party and alistair marry anora" you can Alistair will absolutely hate you for it(he pretty much explodes if you try to talk to him at eamons post landmeet and his post coronation dialogue is laced with so much venomous sarcasm it isnt even funny...) and you need to harden him but you need to convince him and anora to marry before the landsmeet

Actually, he forgave my city elf pretty fast and even said that he didn't want to let all of that get in the way of their friendship either.  And post-coronation, he admitted he was jealous she was leaving, wasn't mad anymore, and hoped they would see each other in the future (physically see each other, though who knows, maybe relationally see each other too!  It had been intended for her to be his mistress pre-Landsmeet, so who knows.)

[Nonvita]

Sandtigress wrote...

Actually, I don't think you even need to know what will happen (I admit I meta-game it a little bit) to not take Alistair along.  He says it himself - Riordan might end it, or either one of you could die before you ever reach the Archdemon.  But no one knows that you're going to get this nice little pause whre you get to decide who's going to kill the thing.  Most likely, someone just gets lucky and kills the thing.  So my PCs, if the dark ritual isn't done, don't take the chance on the future king risking himself and just leave him at the gates and trust to their own skills to get them to the Archdemon.

You'd *think* I'd have thought of that. But I was used to getting my way with high persuasion checks, so *of course* I'd be able to do it again with the sacrifice, right? *sigh*

ejoslin wrote...

Edit: When I play a HNF, she never wants to be married to Alistair or queen, but somehow it keeps on happening!
 There was actually a little part of me that was hoping he'd refuse at warm, so she could go off and marry Zevran instead!

I have the same problem with the Landsmeet. It's like, if I'm *able* to do something, I feel like I *have* to do it, regardless of whether I really want it or not. I end up with Alistair and Anora together this way, even though I really hate that you-know-what. But there's a persuasion check, so I feel like I have to do it!

And because HNs are the only ones who can become nobility, I just know I'd get to Landsmeet, ready to put Alistair up there by his lonesome, then find my finger accidentally "slipping" to the Queen dialogue... Darn persuasion and background checks, making my choices for me. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/pinched.png[/smilie]

Modifié par Nonvita, 04 février 2010 - 11:02 .

[Sandtigress]

Yeah, I often feel like if a persuasion check is there, I should use it too. I'm working to wean myself off of that, because you get some interesting/amusing dialogs if you don't. Like Alistair's "Just because I can...because I have...it doesn't mean I should have to do it!" splutter when you tell him you would sleep with Morrigan if you could. :-P I really enjoy that part.

[Cuddlezarro]

Actually, he forgave my city elf pretty fast and even said that he didn't want to let all of that get in the way of their friendship either. And post-coronation, he admitted he was jealous she was leaving, wasn't mad anymore, and hoped they would see each other in the future (physically see each other, though who knows, maybe relationally see each other too! It had been intended for her to be his mistress pre-Landsmeet, so who knows.)

I was a guy and he absolutely hated me

[Addai]

Book spoiler:



In The Calling, we find out that Duncan was made a Grey Warden by the woman whose fiance he had killed in a robbery attempt gone wrong. She later tells him in a fit of rage that she made him a GW to punish him, not reward him. Yet we all know that her "punishment" turned out well in the end. I am guessing Duncan never got around to telling Alistair about this, or else he might have seen the Loghain situation differently. It will make my HNF sad to have to acquiesce to Alistair and kill Loghain after all, but she's not going to counter her king's very first public policy move.

[ejoslin]

The dialog at the end in a spare-Loghain game can really be taken either way. The words are decent, but the tone is sarcastic. He is definitely cold and angry. I took it as hateful both times I did that ending, but I suppose you could take it as cordial. But if Loghain dies, wow, you have made Alistair's life a living hell, really. He's married to a woman he can't stand, and has to watch her set up the person he hated most in the world as a hero. It must make him extremely bitter.



Poor Alistair. He has so many horrible endings.

[SurelyForth]

When I spared Loghain I was at 100 Friendly (but we had been in love at one point) and he was venomous after every scenario (except for when I died, and Anora gave my eulogy which really irritated me).

[Sandtigress]

ejoslin wrote...

The dialog at the end in a spare-Loghain game can really be taken either way. The words are decent, but the tone is sarcastic. He is definitely cold and angry. I took it as hateful both times I did that ending, but I suppose you could take it as cordial. But if Loghain dies, wow, you have made Alistair's life a living hell, really. He's married to a woman he can't stand, and has to watch her set up the person he hated most in the world as a hero. It must make him extremely bitter.

Poor Alistair. He has so many horrible endings.

He really wasn't mad with my City elf - she point blank asked him if he was, he says he's not and that he hopes to see her again.  I suspect it had to do with the two choices of dialog that I made.  He was a bit sarcastic when he talked about her adoring public, but that was the only sarcasm I got, after he talks about being married to Anora who will remind him of her father every time he looks at her.  Boy, I felt bad after that line.  Sorry Alistair, I still love you!!!!

[Sabriana]

When Loghain is spared, and not fed to the archdemon, Alistair also says something in the line of. "Anora thinks she will rule, but she thinks wrong." It makes me believe that he intends to take the reigns out of her hands, and rule as a King himself.



@ SurelyForth

I wonder why we got different endings for a 'sacrificed Loghain' ending. He really was decent, and even admitted that he overreacted, and so forth. I don't remember if they were still at 100 friendly at the Landsmeet, but Alistair was in love with her at one point, before being let go in favor of Zevran.

[SurelyForth]

Sabriana wrote...

When Loghain is spared, and not fed to the archdemon, Alistair also says something in the line of. "Anora thinks she will rule, but she thinks wrong." It makes me believe that he intends to take the reigns out of her hands, and rule as a King himself.

@ SurelyForth
I wonder why we got different endings for a 'sacrificed Loghain' ending. He really was decent, and even admitted that he overreacted, and so forth. I don't remember if they were still at 100 friendly at the Landsmeet, but Alistair was in love with her at one point, before being let go in favor of Zevran.

He was glad that Loghain was dead, but the rest of the conversation he was not nice at all. It may be possible that I never hit Love, so that could have made a difference. 

[AnniLau]

ejoslin wrote...
 He's married to a woman he can't stand, and has to watch her set up the person he hated most in the world as a hero.

I had to redo the Archdemon fight when I sacrificed Loghain because I chose 'The Grey Wardens shouldn't be forgotten' as my boon and she was all "Yes! We'll build a monument to my father...oh, and those other people too." <_<

[sabreene]

I'm curious -- have many people changed the face of Zevran/Alistair, and did that have any effect on their gameplay decisions?

I've always liked Zevran's story and enjoyed the friendship, but have always gone with Alistair (what can I say, it's Alistair!!). But on my current playthrough, I'm finding that both the face morph for Zev (lightly modified) and the fact that I'm an elf this time have skewed things in Zev's favor.

Or maybe I just needed 3 playthroughs until Zev grew on me enough, and I got Alistair out of the system.

[SusanStoHelit]

sabreene wrote...

I'm curious -- have many people changed the face of Zevran/Alistair, and did that have any effect on their gameplay decisions?

I've always liked Zevran's story and enjoyed the friendship, but have always gone with Alistair (what can I say, it's Alistair!!). But on my current playthrough, I'm finding that both the face morph for Zev (lightly modified) and the fact that I'm an elf this time have skewed things in Zev's favor.

Or maybe I just needed 3 playthroughs until Zev grew on me enough, and I got Alistair out of the system.

I do have Zevran, Morrigan, and Leliana modified. Though I'm considering removing them. I just wanted to try them out. Zevran's is the only one I may keep, but it's not quite right either. My problem with his looks is purely superficial. Firstly, he's too short and slender for my taste - but no mod will fix that. Second, the rest of his appearance is fine, except his skin colour. That's the only thing I want to change - it looks like a really bad fake suntan. But none of the mods just change that. I currently have a mod that has made his skin tone more natural, but he has dark hair too. *sigh*

Anyway, the modding of characters does make a difference to me if I find that character physically unappealing in some way. And it applies to characters I'm not romancing too. I just don't like looking at characters that I see a lot, that I find unappealing. Not ugly, you understand. Some ugly characters are great to look at. But things like Zev's bad tan. Or that have clipping issues with hair or ears or beards.

For romances though, it really is far more about their dialogue, the voice acting, the way they behave ingame, and so on.

[ejoslin]

I sometimes mod, usually don't. The only reason I mod faces is it can give the game a different feeling. One of the funniest ones I ever put on was a more rugged Alistair. He looked like he was in his 30s, and that was fine until it came time for the tent scene. The facial expressions just looked hilarious on someone who looked so rugged.



I suppose it helps that I like the way all the characters look.

[maxernst]

Has anyone romanced Zevran as both male and female? Does it play out any differently?

[ejoslin]

Hmmm, I think everyone knows how easy it is to glitch Zevran's status to love when it's still adore. I just managed to do it to Alistair's. I've actually never seen that before. I guess he really liked our gossip session!

[ejoslin]

maxernst wrote...

Has anyone romanced Zevran as both male and female? Does it play out any differently?

I haven't done the male romance, but from comparing it with people who have, there are subtle differences, but it begins and ends the same way, and pretty much goes down the same path as well.  The dialogs have a different feel to them, but you'd expect that I think.

[Sresla]

The romance as a male plays out basically the same, although there's a dialogue choice that I doubt is offered to a female (shocker) where you question his attraction to you, as a man. Hm, maybe you do get that one as a female as well, because it does go back to him mentioning how he was raised by prostitutes and has an open mind towards anyone who might be interested in him, regardless of their sex.The lead in is probably different.



As to mods, not a chance. Zevran is attractive as is - I've looked at the mods to him, just to see what people did to him and most of them, in my opinion, are horribad. ASKs is probably the best of them, but I still wouldn't use it. I did play with the toolset though and see what he'd look like with a different tattoo.

[Sabriana]

I've never played a male before, but like Ejoslin said, the differences are not that great, except the wording in some of the dialogues. I don't think I can play a male all the way through. I get bored, I can't get into it for some reason. I never could. Sure, I missed out on some great games that way, but I rather look on the bright side. I saved a whole lot of money

I would like to find out more about the romance with a man, but information is a bit scarce about that in the forums



As for face mophs, I agree with Sresla. There are many nice ones, including Jenovan's, but the ones that appeal to me (and my PCs) the most is the default, and ASK's morph # 2_4. I just think that the Zevran character's look needs to show the hardships of his life.



As for Alistair, I tried the rugged dark-haired one too, and didn't even make it out of Ostagar before changing him back. The look was completely OOC to me.

[Flamewielder]

Reading a bit on Dwarven's practical promiscuity, I felt my DNF would see no problem in reconciling a political marriage with true love. I have not yet completed this particular playthrough yet, but I'll keep you posted on the results.



The combination I'm aiming for is for Alistair and Anora to marry, with her father redeeming himself killing the Archdemon, with the Warden surviving as a Living Paragon and heir to Harrowmont's throne. I'm planning on getting the Humans help in reclaining the lost thaigs, thus strenghtening Orzammar and Ferelden both.



I expect Anora, being her usual calculating, political self, won't mind my continued amorous liaison with Alistair too much. Being Harrowmont' heir, the Warden will be both Queen of Orzammar, a Living Paragon and the King of Ferelden's mistress; a political marriage in all but name, really... and I daresay it would allow plenty of romantic diplomacy between the sovereigns



Throw in a concurrent romance with Leliana for spice (yes, it IS possible, although probably unintended by the Devs) and you get a skilled bard to help Alistair and the Warden navigate the reefs of political intrigue.



I'd say the future looks pretty bright for Humans, Elves, Dwarves and our heroes... a clever Ferelden Queen, a charismatic Ferelden King, an open-minded Dwarven Queen and a devoted bard diplomat...

[ejoslin]

Removed spoiler.  Sorry.

Modifié par ejoslin, 06 février 2010 - 12:36 .

[Raiynsong]

well, I just finished my third play through. I was a city elf and started romances with Leli and Alistair but ended with Zevran. Killed Loghain, did the ritual, and had Alistair marry Anora (basically, Alistair pissed me off when he wanted me to end it with Zevran after I kissed Alistair O N C E . I mean, come on.... (lol)



Anyway, when Zevran first gave me the earring, I turned it down. I was going to accept it but he made it sound like it didn't mean anything, and after a whole game of him not saying what he really meant I got a little pissy, so I turned it down. Had a big drop in points, but he stayed in LOVE status. We killed Taliesin and he continued to stay with me. I got the lovely speech at Denerim gates. We kill the dragon, and I'm in end game. I told alistair I was going to go help rebuild the grey wardens. Zevran makes noises about leaving but I ask him to stay and he does, but then makes some crack about watching my back for assassins. In other words---- I GOT NO SECOND EARRING speech! What did I do wrong ? I mean, he is with me, he calls me Amora, but somehow he's still acting like he's a bodyguard rather than someone I'm with because I love him. I mean, horrid upbringing ok, but geez, Zevran.....



So, /rant off now (lol) what triggers the famed "second earring" speech ?

[Sabriana]

Refuse the earring the first time it's offered because you won't take it unless it means something

Next talk, pick the "I'm no wiser than you in that area."

Zevran will offer the earring again. The PC can now ask him if it's a proposal. If you want to find out what happens when she says "It's too much." save beforehand. He'll be torn apart by that choice.

After reloading, pick the "I wish it" choice, and voila, you're betrothed to a very sweet, loving, and loyal assassin.

[ejoslin]

What you must have picked was the "I do. And I feel the same way," which essentially ends that dialog. *grin* I ALWAYS pick the "maybe it would be better for you if we stopped," dialog and always get the second offer with either "I hope so," or "I'm no wiser than you." I actually think that the "I do. And I feel the same way," is a dialog bug, because it doesn't make sense that you wouldn't get the proposal with that answer as well.