78 réponses à ce sujet

[Newguy 3I3I]

 As I'm sure everyone's aware, the inclusion of limited ammunition in the form of ejectable heatsinks into Mass Effect 2 has stirred mixed feelings.  We know from Christina Norman that many systems were experimented with:

"We tried many approaches
- self-cooling weapons
- weapons that self-cool slowly but can be quickly cooled by ejecting a heat sink
- some weapons cooling, some weapons using the new heat sink system

In the end, the approach that worked the best was the heat sink system applied to all weapons.

I know this is a topic of endless debate on the forums (and probably will be forever) but I encourage everyone to give it a try for a few hours!"

Source: http://meforums.biow...forum=144&sp=45

Unfortunately I cannot find an applicable quotation, but I do remember one of the devs stating that the reason the current system was adopted over the others was it created a feeling of intensity in the game - giving the player limited ammunition added the extra incentive to "make every bullet count."

Now, with many people having given Mass Effect 2 and its new ammunition system a try, my question is this:  did it work?  Has a limited supply of ammunition increased the intensity of the experience?  Is it a positive effect?  Or is it simply annoying or distracting from the rest of the game?  Would the implementation of a different system (such as one of Christina's alternatives listed above) have been more effective?

Please keep all discussion civil!

[Vagivan]

allows players to use a variety of guns, rather than sticking to just one

[Lmaoboat]

I don't think the unspeakable levels of retcon they had to use to make this change is worth it. So not only is every gun in the galaxy been retrofitted with heat sinks, but doing so made them inferior?

[Bllasae]

So, basically ammo.

[loboME2]

Worrying about ammo doesn't increase the intensity of the game for me...



What did increase intensity for me, was that I was more easily killed as compared to ME1,

[Inarai]

Lmaoboat wrote...

I don't think the unspeakable levels of retcon they had to use to make this change is worth it. So not only is every gun in the galaxy been retrofitted with heat sinks, but doing so made them inferior?

Superior for a standard firefight (which won't likely last long enough for a weapons cooldown, regardless of how we as players tend to attack these things) - and it isn't a retcon.  It's just considered to be a new development in weapons tech.

[tommythetomcat]

loboME2 wrote...

Worrying about ammo doesn't increase the intensity of the game for me...

What did increase intensity for me, was that I was more easily killed as compared to ME1,

Subjective opinion, making sure my clip is full before I charge into battle keeps me in tune with the combat.  

[Veex]

I prefer it. Aiming and placing shots while using more than one weapon the entirety of the game makes for a fresher experience.

[Twitchmonkey]

I think that having a weak back-up gun with unlimited ammo would have been nice, but I think limiting ammo does increase intensity. It gets a bit annoying, but having to face down three enemies or a ehavy mech with just my biotics because I'm all out of ammo is intense.

[Lmaoboat]

Inarai wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

I don't think the unspeakable levels of retcon they had to use to make this change is worth it. So not only is every gun in the galaxy been retrofitted with heat sinks, but doing so made them inferior?

Superior for a standard firefight (which won't likely last long enough for a weapons cooldown, regardless of how we as players tend to attack these things) - and it isn't a retcon.  It's just considered to be a new development in weapons tech.

Execpt you can't fire the gun without heatsinks, so the guns mught as well just use ammo. There's so little diffrence between "heat sinks" and ammo, it's almost patronizing the way they try and explain it.

[DoctorPringles]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

I think that having a weak back-up gun with unlimited ammo would have been nice

Totally described SMG. I never run out of ammo with that thing.

[Twitchmonkey]

DoctorPringles wrote...

Totally described SMG. I never run out of ammo with that thing.

I wouldn't know about that as I've only played an adept, I guess that's the downside of playing a class without a weapon focus. I suppose you can get that as a bonus talent anyway.

[Lmaoboat]

I think the problem is now little ammo guns hold when you can get pinned down at the same spot for quite a while.

[Vagivan]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

DoctorPringles wrote...

Totally described SMG. I never run out of ammo with that thing.

I wouldn't know about that as I've only played an adept, I guess that's the downside of playing a class without a weapon focus. I suppose you can get that as a bonus talent anyway.

adepts have SMGs...

[tommythetomcat]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

DoctorPringles wrote...

Totally described SMG. I never run out of ammo with that thing.

I wouldn't know about that as I've only played an adept, I guess that's the downside of playing a class without a weapon focus. I suppose you can get that as a bonus talent anyway.

Uhhh Adepts have SMGs, and for that matter can use eventually any other weapon of their choosing.  My adept rocks an assault rifle to burn through shields.

[Twitchmonkey]

tommythetomcat wrote...
Uhhh Adepts have SMGs, and for that matter can use eventually any other weapon of their choosing.  My adept rocks an assault rifle to burn through shields.

Hmm, I have my machine pistol, but no SMG, maybe I just haven't picked up one I can use yet. Ammo on the machine pistol is certainly quite limited considering how fast it burns through it.

[V72]

The system didn't work too well, in my opinion. It didn't add too much intensity to the game because you can hold a great deal of ammunition. My assault rifle is incredible on it's own and with 400+ rounds I'm set for close to medium range. Then I've got the sniper that holds around 50 shots, so that isn't much of limitation either.

If they had cut it down even more, where every bullet really was designed to count, it would make the battles a lot more intense, but also more frustrating because you can't take down a mech due to ammo. As opposed to Dead Space, where a huge majority of it's scary atmosphere came from being almost dead with very little ammo. I think the whole idea they had for Mass Effect 2 didn't work out as well as they planned because they had such a variety of things to kill. Again, mechs. You have to be able to hold a lot of ammo to take those out.

Overall I'm completely neutral to the situation because I've only found myself running out of ammo for the pistal and shotgun, which aren't used that often by me.

[grumpymooselion]

Inarai wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

I don't think the unspeakable levels of retcon they had to use to make this change is worth it. So not only is every gun in the galaxy been retrofitted with heat sinks, but doing so made them inferior?

Superior for a standard firefight (which won't likely last long enough for a weapons cooldown, regardless of how we as players tend to attack these things) - and it isn't a retcon.  It's just considered to be a new development in weapons tech.

That's a naive point of view. It's not a new development, it's a new step backward in terms of lore.

In terms of gameplay, I had a lot of fun with the new thermal clips.

In terms of story, going from guns that you'll "NEVER" run out of ammo for, to guns that, eventually, you won't be able to use if they run out . . . that's a big step back. Even the cooldowns on the old weapons were minimal - something any ME1 player can tell you because you could mod them to have almost infinite fire.

From a purely story point of view, they literally went from something that never ran out, to something finite, something exhaustable.

[Jack Shaftoe21]

The funny thing is your squadmates don't run out of ammo and neither do the enemies. So why do the enemies need all those thermal clips, they leave behind after they die. anyway then? I know, because otherwise you would have been screwed.

[tommythetomcat]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

tommythetomcat wrote...
Uhhh Adepts have SMGs, and for that matter can use eventually any other weapon of their choosing.  My adept rocks an assault rifle to burn through shields.

Hmm, I have my machine pistol, but no SMG, maybe I just haven't picked up one I can use yet. Ammo on the machine pistol is certainly quite limited considering how fast it burns through it.

That is an SMG, and yes it sucks(at least as far as I'm concerned). Go save Tali and get the Tempest SMG i have 754 rounds with it fully upgraded and the ammo increase armor piece.

[DoctorPringles]

Twitchmonkey wrote...

tommythetomcat wrote...
Uhhh Adepts have SMGs, and for that matter can use eventually any other weapon of their choosing.  My adept rocks an assault rifle to burn through shields.

Hmm, I have my machine pistol, but no SMG, maybe I just haven't picked up one I can use yet. Ammo on the machine pistol is certainly quite limited considering how fast it burns through it.

Once you get the next upgraded version, the ammo doubles, and then you'll get upgrades to increase that further. Trust me, you'll be fine.

[Grand_Commander13]

The ammo is a total non-issue. It encouraged me to switch to the SMG as my mainline weapon pretty early in the game (rather than having to worry a bit about heat sinks I never do) but that's fine as Bioware didn't make SMGs as inaccurate as some developers seem to think they ought to be...



I'd like to add right now that the new development can be an improvement if you take the codex at its word. Yes, I know that in ME1 gameplay heat was never an issue beyond the very early levels, but in the first game you could easily take out hordes of enemies without the benefit of cover and biotics worked flawlessly regardless of an enemy's armor or kinetic barriers. I've only seen one person even mention that, but it seems like half the boards wants to talk about the heat sink retcon.

[grumpymooselion]

Jack Shaftoe21 wrote...

The funny thing is your squadmates don't run out of ammo and neither do the enemies. So why do the enemies need all those thermal clips, they leave behind after they die. anyway then? I know, because otherwise you would have been screwed.

If you really want to be left scratching your head, think about the Enemies that use Heavy Weapons and never run out of Ammo.

[Bigeyez]

I'm glad they went with a standard ammo system. The unlimited ammo from the first game make combat seriously dull. All you had to do was slap frictionless materials onto your guns and you could just hold down the trigger until everything died.

[tommythetomcat]

Grand_Commander13 wrote...

The ammo is a total non-issue. It encouraged me to switch to the SMG as my mainline weapon pretty early in the game (rather than having to worry a bit about heat sinks I never do) but that's fine as Bioware didn't make SMGs as inaccurate as some developers seem to think they ought to be...

I'd like to add right now that the new development can be an improvement if you take the codex at its word. Yes, I know that in ME1 gameplay heat was never an issue beyond the very early levels, but in the first game you could easily take out hordes of enemies without the benefit of cover and biotics worked flawlessly regardless of an enemy's armor or kinetic barriers. I've only seen one person even mention that, but it seems like half the boards wants to talk about the heat sink retcon.

Quoting for effect.